God and his so called fairy tales

[Red Eye Racer]

You were being sarcastic and you know it.

 

[DGB454]

Based on your explination of what makes us special then I see no reason to believe we are special.

 

[milefile]

Originally posted by DGB454
Well if they keep evolving then so will the ape or dolphins have technology. Nah...we aren't special.

One bias I hear all the time is the assumption that humans are "more evolved". There is no reason to see evolution as a linear race to technology. Being special, as we humans are, doesn't mean we're better. Dolphins could be better for all I know, unless they have a similar bias that says evolution is a linear race to fins.

 

[Red Eye Racer]

oh christ.

I've been saying we're not special the whole thread

edit,.. you cant pretend to agree with me and be a christian at the same time,.. it's hypicritical on your part concerning this 'special conversation'.

 

[milefile]

Originally posted by Red Eye Racer
So that makes us better than the animals, on a spiritual level? Nah.

This is inestimable. We can choose to believe things, though.

 

[DGB454]

Originally posted by Red Eye Racer
oh christ.

I've been saying we're not special the whole thread

edit,.. you cant pretend to agree with me and be a christian at the same time,.. it's hypicritical on your part concerning this 'special conversation'.

Huh? That was clear as mud.

 

[Red Eye Racer]

Originally posted by milefile
This is inestimable. We can choose to believe things, though.

Yeah,.. but only things we introduce to ourselves. We obviously cant make a dog believe what we're saying because the cant comprehend our thought process'.

And of course we cant prove that animals DONT believe things because we dont know what their saying.

 

[Red Eye Racer]

Originally posted by DGB454
Huh? That was clear as mud.

K,.. hows this,... buy agreeing with me, your abandoning the the words of the bible.

Animals dont have souls says the bible.

IMO, if there is such thing as a soul, and we have one, all other lioving things have them too,.. making us no more special than them.

 

[DGB454]

Originally posted by milefile
One bias I hear all the time is the assumption that humans are "more evolved". There is no reason to see evolution as a linear race to technology. Being special, as we humans are, doesn't mean we're better. Dolphins could be better for all I know, unless they have a similar bias that says evolution is a linear race to fins.

I don't believe evolution is a linear race or that it even occured in a totally linear fashion.

So what makes us special other than we think we are then?

 

[DGB454]

Originally posted by Red Eye Racer
K,.. hows this,... buy agreeing with me, your abandoning the the words of the bible.

Animals dont have souls says the bible.

IMO, if there is such thing as a soul, and we have one, all other lioving things have them too,.. making us no more special than them.

Then we aren't special.

 

[sn00pie]

Originally posted by DGB454
Then please explain where I'm misinterpeting.

I don't really have a big problem with the whole evolution thing. What I think is amusing is when people who don't believe in God try to make some distinction between man and beast. Other than our minds are a little more developed there is hardly any difference. So I guess we are simply beast. No better than the monkeys in the trees flinging crap at each other or the crow droping wallnuts infront of cars to crack the shell.

Seperating man from "beast" is a religious stereotype -- where did "...when people who don't believe in God try to..." come from?

 

[Red Eye Racer]

Originally posted by DGB454
Then we aren't special.

How can you say that with a clear christian concience? Oh yeah,.. thats right,... Jesus forgives you of all your sins cause you believe. Why dont you just kill me and get it over with,.. I'll be in hell and you can still have your one way ticket to the promise land?

Or maybe your just being sarcastic......

 

[DGB454]

Originally posted by sn00pie
Seperating man from "beast" is a religious stereotype -- where did "...when people who don't believe in God try to..." come from?

Really? What made it a religious stereotype? I have been hearing alot of non religious people on this thread saying "we are special"

I am saying based on thier explination of how we are special then I have no reason to believe we are special.

 

[Red Eye Racer]

Originally posted by DGB454


I am saying based on thier explination of how we are special then I have no reason to believe we are special.

Dang,.. if you sarcasm gets any thicker you might end up convincing yourself theres no GOD

 

[DGB454]

Originally posted by Red Eye Racer
How can you say that with a clear christian concience? Oh yeah,.. thats right,... Jesus forgives you of all your sins cause you believe. Why dont you just kill me and get it over with,.. I'll be in hell and you can still have your one way ticket to the promise land?

Or maybe your just being sarcastic......

Hey. I'm not saying anything that goes against Christianity. You're just not listening.

 

[milefile]

I was going to address the similarities and differences between humans and other animals in another post, only to delete that part because it seemed off topic. When I posted I saw that the new topic was animals, so I'll give it a go now.

I do believe animals have emotions. I arrived at this through owning pets, and through some other observations. My dog holds grudges, feels fear, joy, jealousy, and I believe love, too. I can only believe this by observing her behavior. I can't see how else it could be interpreted. And why else would one want a pet to begin with? A plant would do just fine.

Not long ago I watched a documentary about Killer Whales. They were about to eat some Sea Lions. Both of these mammals are pretty intelligent compared to humans. One of the Sea Lions was intelligent enough to know that inside the boat meant safety, and was desperately trying to jump into it, but it was too high. I hated watching this panic-stricken creature try in vain to save itself, knowing full well what was coming: the crushing jaws of a Killer Whale. The Sea Lion felt afraid. The boat left, in the name of "not interfering".

Animals don't need to believe anything. They only need to know. But the difference between faith and knowledge is slight. For instance, my dog knows I will come home later. I come home at the same time every day. If I do not come home one day, she will know something is wrong. Will she worry? Will she feel afraid for me? I don't know. But I can choose to believe she would and nobody could tell me I'm wrong. Only language can reveal such details.

 

[sn00pie]

Originally posted by DGB454
Really? What made it a religious stereotype? I have been hearing alot of non religious people on this thread saying "we are special"

I am saying based on thier explination of how we are special then I have no reason to believe we are special.

Isn't part of the creationist theory not willing to accept that apes are descendants of man?

This whole "we are special" debate is very much subjective and not worth having.

 

[Red Eye Racer]

Originally posted by milefile
I was going to address the similarities and differences between humans and other animals in another post, only to delete that part because it seemed off topic. When I posted I saw that the new topic was animals, so I'll give it a go now.

I do believe animals have emotions. I arrived at this through owning pets, and through some other observations. My dog holds grudges, feels fear, joy, jealousy, and I believe love, too. I can only believe this by observing her behavior. I can't see how else it could be interpreted. And why else would one want a pet to begin with? A plant would do just fine.

Not long ago I watched a documentary about Killer Whales. They were about to eat some Sea Lions. Both of these mammals are pretty intelligent compared to humans. One of the Sea Lions was intelligent enough to know that inside the boat meant safety, and was desperately trying to jump into it, but it was too high. I hated watching this panic-stricken creature try in vain to save itself, knowing full well what was coming: the crushing jaws of a Killer Whale. The Sea Lion felt afraid. The boat left, in the name of "not interfering".

Animals don't need to believe anything. They only need to know. But the difference between faith and knowledge is slight. For instance, my dog knows I will come home later. I come home at the same time every day. If I do not come home one day, she will know something is wrong. Will she worry? Will she feel afraid for me? I don't know. But I can choose to believe she would and nobody could tell me I'm wrong. Only language can reveal such details.

So you would agree that animals have "a soul". Correct?

 

[milefile]

"Soul" is a word I try to avoid.

 

[Red Eye Racer]

Originally posted by milefile
"Soul" is a word I try to avoid.

I know,. I thought twice about even using it,.. but what is a better discription for an individual animal that can comprehend what is going on around it?

 

[sn00pie]

Originally posted by Red Eye Racer
So you would agree that animals have "a soul". Correct?

Define soul. I think that's way too abstract a term.

 

[DGB454]

Originally posted by sn00pie
Isn't part of the creationist theory not willing to accept that apes are descendants of man?

This whole "we are special" debate is very much subjective and not worth having.

You are refering to young earth creationist. Not all Christians are YECs.


I think it is worth having to a point.

I believe we are very special. Not for the reasons I have been hearing though.

 

[milefile]

.

I know,. I thought twice about even using it,.. but what is a better discription for an individual animal that can comprehend what is going on around it?

Consciousness. But there are obviously levels of consciousness. These can be observed just within the human species, let alone across species.

 

[Red Eye Racer]

Originally posted by sn00pie
Define soul. I think that's way too abstract a term.

The only way to do that is determine why the bible says animals dont have one.

 

[sn00pie]

Originally posted by Red Eye Racer
I know,. I thought twice about even using it,.. but what is a better discription for an individual animal that can comprehend what is going on around it?

An animal with a thalamus.

 

[Red Eye Racer]

I starting to confuse myself with that soul word,.. WTF am I thinking? DAMN SOUL! Quit thinking! All my soul does is give me a headache,...

 

[DGB454]

Your misinterpretation of things is just laughable. Do you have any sense for biology whatsoever?

I can't seem to see how this applies to me anymore.

 

[DGB454]

dblpost.sorry

 

[Red Eye Racer]

With this final statement, Im done with this topic:

God and his so called fairy tales

Dont blame GOD, it's not his/her fault. It's the self-richous butt-hole who plays GOD, who in turn says GOD cant be blamed, it's your own fault.

The more you start realizing that it's not what you believe, but how you believe, the less you'll have to contemplate whats going to happen when you die.

True closure isn't knowing that you'll goto heaven and be there with your loved ones for eterninty,... true closure is knowing that you have the balls to accept your fate even though you dont know what it is,.... not to try and make fate for yourself, determining your own fate, is hypocritical in itself,... fate happens, there's no control.

 

[DGB454]

I am glad you got that off your chest.