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Because Kaz's connection to Automobiles in general is very different to whomever directed Turn 10's latest offering...
[Gran Turismo 5 @ E3 2010] (SEE POST 1!: New Vids, Pics, Interviews!)
- Thread starter SrRd RacinG
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GTjazzabrandy
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I never said they weren't.
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- RedSuinit
Moderators, lock thread, erase all posts except for the first, then unlock thread, and make a post to bring it back to the front page when E3 is less than two weeks away.
Thank you,
All of us with any sense of why this thread was created, and hate the fact that it has become a useless spam fest.
Thank you,
All of us with any sense of why this thread was created, and hate the fact that it has become a useless spam fest.
GTjazzabrandy
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SrRd RacinG
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- SrRd-RacinG
The entire GT5 forum is now a wasteland. All we need is some juicy E3 chatter and the senseless debates will cease.
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- GTP_Nismo
Not really. They don't really contribute to the game, IMO.
GTjazzabrandy
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To be blunt, I disagree.
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- RedSuinit
Ok, I can't help myself.
Then you have completely missed Kaz's vision. He wants to instill in people a knowledge, and appreciation of both, vehicle HISTORY, and vehicle ENTHUSIASM. His games have always been about car ENTHUSIASM and HISTORY. Those are the two integral parts of what Gran Turismo are in the eyes of Kaz, and in all honesty many users on these forums. If you go back and read through interviews where someone actually asks, "Why did you make Gran Turismo, and what are you trying to accomplish with it?" He would tell them that he hopes to make car enthusiasm live on forever, and to show the history of the automobile in order to help instill that enthusiasm into a younger generation. Some of the ways he accomplishes this is through amazingly detailed car models, tracks, and through a realistic physics engine in order to simulate driving (somewhat) realistically. Because these are ways that people relate to cars, by looking at them, and driving them. Hence the reason Gran Turismo is a game, and not just a car encyclopedia.
This is an undeniable fact, and THIS is why the cars you deem "have no way to contribute to the game" are there. History and the instillment of enthusiasm in people. SO therefore these vehicles contribute in a very large way to the game, and to the vision of car enthusiasm (Kazunori's purpose in GT as a whole).
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Right on dude.
The motor carriage actually gave me the most enjoyment out of any car in GT4, precisely because it didn't have any power (needed tricky techniques to get up hills). To say the first ever car isn't worthy of including in a playable car encyclopedia is indeed fairly widely missing the point.
Maybe somewhat confusingly, PD do tend to include mostly fast cars and the sportier variant of more basic models, but that doesn't mean all cars in the game should have to be so. These sportier models are usually more fondly remembered and exciting, they stand out in automotive history for pushing engineering/technology and often looking lovely. I like to think PD will one day include all historically important/interesting cars regardless of performance.
Back to waiting for E3...
GTjazzabrandy
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I agree with the above posts.
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- GTP_Nismo
Am I supposed to read that?
I'm glad Kaz has a vision. However, I'm paying money to enjoy a game the way I want to enjoy it. Having a 1900 benz wooden box that is in no way similar to the modern car, doesn't make me like cars or wooden boxes any more than I already do. Please, don't try to teach me how I should play GT or what I should get out of it.
Thanks for wasting both our times telling me my opinion is wrong.
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Your opinion is NOT wrong, you have every right to enjoy the GT-brand however you see fit. Yet the undeniable truth is that some look at GT and see an awesome game, while others look at GT and experience it as an extension of their love for the automobile and racing. What I'm trying to say is that there are two camps of people here: those who just want a great game and those who like to look at the car models for 20 minutes and read up on their history 
It's fine if you want a great game, but perhaps you'll join my camp in the near future?
It's fine if you want a great game, but perhaps you'll join my camp in the near future?
TokyoDrift
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If GT5 ships with what is essentialy a Wiki on every single car and manufacturer in the game, detailing all of the facts, figures, specifications, history, and even potential future, then I'll accept it is some form of encyclopedia of cars, at least in part. If not, it's just a racing game that has a wide variety of cars spanning many decades, designed by a man that has a passion for cars and attention to detail, thus allowing people to stare at detailed car models for 20 minutes.
While I fully accept that different people approach the game differently, and that's cool, to me that doesn't really change what it is.
1. This one, until closer to E3.
2. The General Discussion thread. Nothing in there is unique to that thread, and for such a popular game (OK, news is thin right now), a general thread doesn't really work.
While I fully accept that different people approach the game differently, and that's cool, to me that doesn't really change what it is.
Two threads around here are useless:
1. This one, until closer to E3.
2. The General Discussion thread. Nothing in there is unique to that thread, and for such a popular game (OK, news is thin right now), a general thread doesn't really work.
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TokyoDrift
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Deleted due to double post, sorry.
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Agreed, it doens't change what the product is, yet the way we approach it is substanially different and THAT makes the experience one can derive from GT very different. That's all there is to it I guess.
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1. Agree.
2. Over 10,000 posts, and a great deal of information which has never been made into it's own thread would disagree.
TokyoDrift
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Exactly, 10,000 posts...what kind of thread is that to search through and follow?! I mean sure, if you do follow that thread all the time, then you can keep up, but most people tend to look out for new topics. The fact that people can post in a "catch all" area means that a lot of stuff ends up buried. The more popular an area, the more rapidly it fills up, and the more useless it becomes. Just my opinion!
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A history of the automobile is great. Here's hoping that we don't get 20 variations of the same model.
TokyoDrift
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You won't get 20 variations of the Skyline that's for sure, you'll get 30
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- RedSuinit
Am I supposed to read that?
I'm glad Kaz has a vision. However, I'm paying money to enjoy a game the way I want to enjoy it. Having a 1900 benz wooden box that is in no way similar to the modern car, doesn't make me like cars or wooden boxes any more than I already do. Please, don't try to teach me how I should play GT or what I should get out of it.
Thanks for wasting both our times telling me my opinion is wrong.
Glad you added the dunce cap, you need it. My point was never about how YOU should play the game, it was about Kaz's point for making the game. Everything was relative to Kazunori's vision, not your playing style. I don't care if it changes your opinion, I was just being informative. Nothing in my post says "You should take things this way, and play the game like this." now does it? No, it doesn't. It is simply a look at why Kaz put those vehicles into the game, and how they therefore play a role in his vision of what GT is. It doesn't matter if your opinion matches up with his or not, that's not the point. Quit thinking you matter, and just get over it.
TokyoDrift
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Just to add something to the discussion, there is something essentially different between Kazunori Yamauchi and other game developers, and Gran Turismo and other games. Kazunori sensei loves cars, and has set out to produce a game which is a celebration of all things automotive. When interviewed, he invariably comes around to discussing motorsports and cars with as much or more enthusiasm as he does his latest game. While other developers might attend auto events, Kaz participates in them. He experiences them in ways very few of us can, and he wants Gran Turismo to encapsulate the essence of this experience.
He wants us to understand that just like a noteworthy author, musician or figure from history, cars have a history behind them that make them what they are. He wants you to understand that there's something organic about a car, that there's a gestalt which is the culmination to the sum of its parts, but more. He invites you to investigate and explore the internals and understand what it is that makes a car what it is, and how tinkering makes it different. How modifying it makes it a bit more your own car. How if it doesn't perform the way you want, how to adjust it through settings or mods to make it perform. He wants you to understand that each car has a legacy of ancestors which are worth experiencing in their own right, that participating in a certain period of history is awesome. That cars are awesome, no matter where along the timeline you grab a car from. That in each period of automotive history, something fantastic was happening.
I've stated from time to time that I've come to understand that Gran Turismo is like a gift to us from the Master. I've asked if there's a game like Gran Turismo, that is a celebration of all things automotive. Well, if Gran Turismo isn't that game, the game doesn't exist.
And now for this:
He wants us to understand that just like a noteworthy author, musician or figure from history, cars have a history behind them that make them what they are. He wants you to understand that there's something organic about a car, that there's a gestalt which is the culmination to the sum of its parts, but more. He invites you to investigate and explore the internals and understand what it is that makes a car what it is, and how tinkering makes it different. How modifying it makes it a bit more your own car. How if it doesn't perform the way you want, how to adjust it through settings or mods to make it perform. He wants you to understand that each car has a legacy of ancestors which are worth experiencing in their own right, that participating in a certain period of history is awesome. That cars are awesome, no matter where along the timeline you grab a car from. That in each period of automotive history, something fantastic was happening.
I've stated from time to time that I've come to understand that Gran Turismo is like a gift to us from the Master. I've asked if there's a game like Gran Turismo, that is a celebration of all things automotive. Well, if Gran Turismo isn't that game, the game doesn't exist.
And now for this:
Completely unnecessary. You have always been able to enjoy Gran Turismo any way you want. If there's a prototype from 1890 included, or 30 Skylines, they don't have any effect on how you enjoy GT. Any outrage at any matter like that is really quite silly. Well, I will grant you that the last thing I'd want as a gift car at the end of a grueling endurance race be an ancient relic that struggles to get past 30mph, but that's another issue.Am I supposed to read that?
I'm glad Kaz has a vision. However, I'm paying money to enjoy a game the way I want to enjoy it. Having a 1900 benz wooden box that is in no way similar to the modern car, doesn't make me like cars or wooden boxes any more than I already do. Please, don't try to teach me how I should play GT or what I should get out of it.
Thanks for wasting both our times telling me my opinion is wrong.
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