Gran Turismo 7: Class/PP System discussion

[ThePotatoKing]

The lack of new classes may suggest that Polyphony plans to use a combination of the existing class system and the PP system. Basically within those classes there could be performance levels, e.g. in Gr.3 you have the 500-530 pp group and the 530-600 group ( i know the numbers may be off, im throwing them out there as an example).

I dont see any other way PD could put an old Alfa Romeo DTM car up against modern GT4 cars.

 

[MIE1992]

The lack of new classes may suggest that Polyphony plans to use a combination of the existing class system and the PP system. Basically within those classes there could be performance levels, e.g. in Gr.3 you have the 500-530 pp group and the 530-600 group (I know the numbers may be off, I'm throwing them out there as an example).

I don't see any other way PD could put an old Alfa Romeo DTM car up against modern GT4 cars.

What I'd do, is have the majority of events limit players to a selection of cars within a class, such as the daily races in GT Sport that only allowed players to use the Group C cars within Gr.1. Ideally, this would incentivize players to use as wide of a variety of cars as possible, with only events like those in the Manufacturers Series offering players a glimpse at what an entire class may offer.

I'd potentially model most races off of campaign event regulations, from both within GT7 and from those that aren't in GT7 but may be from prior games' campaigns. In this regard, I had some ideas for new campaign events that I'd like to see in GT7 - such as an event for Group C racers - but I digress.

 

[05XR8]

The lack of new classes may suggest that Polyphony plans to use a combination of the existing class system and the PP system. Basically within those classes there could be performance levels, e.g. in Gr.3 you have the 500-530 pp group and the 530-600 group ( i know the numbers may be off, im throwing them out there as an example).

I dont see any other way PD could put an old Alfa Romeo DTM car up against modern GT4 cars.

PD still put old GT1 cars in Gr.3 and an old one make car in Gr.4. I can’t see them separating these cars in a sub group. Not saying such ranges are impossible, but still seeing the Gr.4 4WD WRX in the trailer, the 155 is probably it’s closest rival(like the Gr.4 Evo and Gr.4 Atenza).
I’d like to know how PD group these cars concretely, but it’s like they still place cars the way they want. As in, just program to make it fit, regardless of real world performance data.

 

[MIE1992]

PD still put old GT1 cars in Gr.3 and an old one make car in Gr.4. I can’t see them separating these cars in a sub group. Not saying such ranges are impossible, but still seeing the Gr.4 4WD WRX in the trailer, the 155 is probably it’s closest rival(like the Gr.4 Evo and Gr.4 Atenza).
I’d like to know how PD group these cars concretely, but it’s like they still place cars the way they want. As in, just program to make it fit, regardless of real world performance data.

I kind of like it, personally. And keep in mind that it's both mid-90s and late-00s GT1 cars that've been put into Gr.3, so we still don't know where late-90s GT1 cars like the Mercedes-Benz CLK-LM will be placed. I highly doubt that cars like those will go into Gr.3. In fact, I could definitely see them going into Gr.1, as some of these late-90s GT1 cars would race in prototype classes, like the Toyota GT-One and the Panoz Esperante GTR-1. (I'd personally like to see a few more late-00s GT1 cars get added to Gr.3, like the Saleen S7R and the Maserati MC12.)

I also wouldn't necessarily form sub-groups as much as I'd simply have more events that limit the car selection, like I mentioned in my previous post in this thread.

EDIT: Speaking of Gr.3, I also wouldn't mind seeing more GT2/GTE cars added, especially now that GTE is basically dead. I know we're getting the Ford GT LM based on the 2017 Ford GT, but I'd also love to see the M8 GTE, too. That's before we get into more GT3 cars like the McLaren 720S or the Maserati GranTurismo.

 

[05XR8]

I suspect we’ll see the CLK in Gr.1. Only in that the Bugatti VGT may be like a GT1 or hyper car(before hyper car became a thing). We can see it was out of its league in GT Sport. Yet, PD just placed it there. Might have fit better in Gr.3(can’t recall if the Bugatti VGT is 4WD) and been a Manu contender. Maybe the deal between Bugatti and PD were to make it a showcase car, in the highest Group of that game(besides the nod to the Chiron). I don’t know.

 

[tankuroded]

I suspect we’ll see the CLK in Gr.1. Only in that the Bugatti VGT may be like a GT1 or hyper car(before hyper car became a thing). We can see it was out of its league in GT Sport. Yet, PD just placed it there. Might have fit better in Gr.3(can’t recall if the Bugatti VGT is 4WD) and been a Manu contender. Maybe the deal between Bugatti and PD were to make it a showcase car, in the highest Group of that game(besides the nod to the Chiron). I don’t know.

The Bugatti VGT has references to Le Mans in it's advertising, so I always thought it was a "hypercar" racer meant for top-flight prototype racing (as sports car racing "fans" who can't move on from loophole-era GT1 had always wanted) from day one.

(Also if you ask, both versions are 4WD and there is also an unused name plate for a Gr.3 version of the car.)

 

[05XR8]

The Bugatti VGT has references to Le Mans in it's advertising, so I always thought it was a "hypercar" racer meant for top-flight prototype racing (as sports car racing "fans" who can't move on from loophole-era GT1 had always wanted) from day one.

(Also if you ask, both versions are 4WD and there is also an unused name plate for a Gr.3 version of the car.)

Ah, okay. Maybe we do see a Gr.3 car in GT7.

 

[Jump_Ace]

Here's a small project I 'should' be working on when GT7 drops; A PP Car Ranking Sheet. You can check it out here:


It's just a list of car specs and some rankings within a given PP, drivetrain and overall. One sheet tab for Race Cars and another for Street Cars. So far I'm just grabbing the specs of cars featured in the trailers.


Jerome

 

[GBalao888]

Ah, okay. Maybe we do see a Gr.3 car in GT7.

Either they add another variant of the VGT to race in Gr. 3, or they make a Veyron/Chiron Gr. 3. This way, in GT7 we could have two potential new manufacturers for the FIA GTC Manufacturers' Series, in this case, both Bugatti and Genesis.

 

[br1x]

As seen in the new trailer the CLK-LM is in Group 2, so I guess that means now new classes whatsoever...

 

[FloridaFanGT]

PD needs to put more effort into their race car class structure. It'll hurt the racing and the BOP if we don't have proper classes. There needs to be subdivisions at the very least, but I don't see that happening.

 

[nissimp]

the alpine didn't say group x, so maybe they're getting rid of it for some vintage cars?

 

[br1x]

the alpine didn't say group x, so maybe they're getting rid of it for some vintage cars?

I'd say they removed group x alltogether since the VGT and road cars don't have any groups either. So they will probably include more PP races where you can use these.

 

[05XR8]

PD have always jumbled everything together. Even with only six cars on track. They ain’t gonna stop now.

 

[br1x]

PD have always jumbled everything together. Even with only six cars on track. They ain’t gonna stop now.

But that was when they had only offline racing without any BoP, now they have online modes with Groups and BoP so just do it right and not half-assed like that.

 

[05XR8]

But that was when they had only offline racing without any BoP, now they have online modes with Groups and BoP so just do it right and not half-assed like that.

You’re preaching to the choir.

Group 3 are the bread & butter since GT Sport. It’s the most balanced Group. They placed the 2008 cars with the 2016. Biggest red flag. Then, we see the R33 and A80 GT500 cars racing a DTM car(which, it seems due to car list, is now a Gr.4 car). Another red flag.
An N300 X-Bow R that couldn’t be beat. Detuneable Ferrari F50 and Ford GT40 for FIA competition esport racing.
We ALL want PD to do it right for once. They’re just not going to. I’ve accepted this fact.

 

[Magog]

The class system was garbage. It had no use in single player.

 

[snowgt]

The class system was garbage. It had no use in single player.

Don't you have more payout when using a lower class car?

This could simply be extended to PP...

 

[Ja636]

I’m curious as to see how they implement the PP system with the classes. Obviously Gr.1-4 + B will work fine but, how about the N-Class?

Oh, and don’t get me started on Gr.X......

It doesn’t seem like cars are able to be modified into gr classes but in online mode there is technically open class racing.

 

[rex1825]

In my opinion, they have BoP as a system to balance one group globally, at least this is how it was working in GTS... and PP is back as it was in previous GT (GT5 and GT6) sort of, since PP is calculated on the fly, I see nice potential in it. As Kaz said, PP is calculated in background with AI driving "realtime" on a test track, it would be nice if it could be calculated per track, as it would give much closer racing in groups like LMP/GT500/GT3/GT4 etc... as you all know, some cars are much stronger on certain tracks in GTS, PP and this new system for balancing could solve that...

 

[indycarmarc]

I concur with a reworked Class system. Too many different types of race cars, too few categories to place them in.

There's just no way a '97 GT500 car (Castrol Supra) could keep up with a '16 GT500 car (au RC F). No amount of BoP or suspension tuning can balance the difference in aero between those two cars. Two completely different sets of regulations, despite both being labeled as GT500. The GT500 Supra could work AT BEST in Gr.3, but even then it might struggle. As for the F1 GTR long tail, it could work in Gr.3 since the older F1 GTR is already there, and it also competed in the GT500 class back then.

But still, I do think that GT1 cars and older Super GT cars should have their own separate classes. I do wonder what's preventing PD from creating more classes, like Gr.5 or Gr.6 or Gr.7 and so on. Super GT GT500 can be divided into 3 subclasses, with S5 as a label. S5-1 can be for the '16 RC F, S5-2 for the '08 SC430, and S5-3 for the '97 Supra.

The Gr.1 should be vintage separate....