Gran Turismo Sport: General Discussion

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Guys, check out Gran turismo's page, I entered by accident, and I found this

upload_2016-5-31_2-13-35.png


looks fishy
 
Having 19 tracks really doesn't sound too bad. Here are the 13 remaining tracks I predict will be included:
  1. Fuji
  2. Suzuka
  3. Circuit de la Sarthe
  4. Monza
  5. Laguna Seca
  6. Spa
  7. Silverstone
  8. Bathurst
  9. Red Bull Ring
  10. Seattle
  11. Circuit of The Americas
  12. Interlagos
  13. Catalunya
 
Just my thought on GT Sports so far.

From what i saw on Youtube, i don't really understand all that bashing.
Especially for a game that is not finished yet.

Graphics
Game looks visually promizing even at this stage.
Never have been disappointed with GT's lighting or car modeling, so we can expect a lot of tuning from PD to make everything looks perfect.

Physics
Can't say much about physics for now.

Sounds
They really have to fix sounds because another series of vacuum cleaners will totally ruin the experience..
They really need to change that tire skid sound...
Seems like they totally ignored the fans feedback?

Can't wait to see more casual driving, drifting or rally tho.
Let's wait and see!
 
So just quickly going back to the weather thing, seems pretty simple.

Limited hardware on console means you have a choice - 60fps or nice FX. Both? Impossible.

VR needs 60fps or you will be sick as a sailor, so PD had to ditch FX.

Eurogamer just waded in on the 'no-dynamic-weather' PD-bashing, citing PCars and DC as great examples. Well, DC is 30fps, and Pcars has under-par graphics (on PS4) and ditched the 60fps. Forza, the other example, has rock-solid 60fps by ditching the weather. I don't understand the criticism, and I'm trying hard not to be an egit fanboy here.
 
Simple really, PD/Kaz design specification and requirement are not the same as some member here expected ( some wanted ultra realistic physics, some wanted dynamic weather no matter what, some wanted more cars/tracks, some wanted FIA realistic career, some wanted RE3 sounds, etc ) None of those apparently included in the design spec and requirement of GTS development :)

Chameleon
PD: Hey guys! Want to make a completely over the top awesome fantasy car for a bunch of fans to enjoy?
Lamborghini: EEhhh were not really into that sort of thing.

Seriously what happened?
Click to expand...


Lamborghini couldn't devote time and energy to make one ? It was there and still there in GT6 VGT section.
 
jm79
Well, DC is 30fps, and Pcars has under-par graphics (on PS4) and ditched the 60fps. Forza, the other example, has rock-solid 60fps by ditching the weather. I don't understand the criticism, and I'm trying hard not to be an egit fanboy here.
Click to expand...

I've never heard so much BS about Project Cars in this forum before this thread:



Under-par graphics on PS4? Take a look... Also PCars is 90% of the time between 55-60fps, not like it's ages away, and i'm talking about 24+cars on track with variable weather and time passing...

I know people love GT and this is a GT-based webpage, but spreading misconceptions and lies about other games is silly.

EDIT: this is an Online Race, just an example of how "bad it looks"
 
azidahaka
I've never heard so much BS about Project Cars in this forum before this thread:



Under-par graphics on PS4? Take a look... Also PCars is 90% of the time between 55-60fps, not like it's ages away, and i'm talking about 24+cars on track with variable weather and time passing...

I know people love GT and this is a GT-based webpage, but spreading misconceptions and lies about other games is silly.

EDIT: this is an Online Race, just an example of how "bad it looks"
Click to expand...



14789132.jpg


I don't think PCars looks great, I own it, I've played it a lot, that's just, like, my opinion, man. And it doesn't matter how much you claim it dips, it still dips, so it dropped consistent 60fps.

Aside from that, and more importantly, my point was that we can't have everything on a console, all the racing games on console so far have proved that.

I don't mind that. And it's good to know what PD's aims are with GTS.
 
SlipZtrEm
Also, didn't PD count reverse layouts as separate ribbons in GT6? If they do, does that mean even the original circuits won't be run in reverse in GT Sport? That'd be a huge shock.
Click to expand...

It wouldn't be totally unprecedented, as Tourist Trophy cut out the reverse tracks as well for whatever reason.
 
TRGTspecialist
Looking at the driver profile screen there's a couple of things that puzzle me:

IMG_1269.jpg


1. The fact that a driver has both a "level" rating and a "class" rating. I'm not sure why these measures are there separately and wonder what different purposes they serve.

2. Anyone got any ideas what the "458" number below the number of credits could represent? The symbol beside it is pretty ambiguous but what worries me is it looks like a stack of coins...........they wouldn't dare consider putting in a 2nd "premium" form of currency in would they?
Click to expand...
Regarding this image.

I'm not sure what the '24,600' number refers to, but I do know that the symbol next to it is for the 'GT Store'.

i13KvKrapK0aJ8E_zpseu5lifpu.jpg


For GT6 there is nothing other than Credits to purchase, but the Store is there to " Purchase and download additional content (DLC)".

Again, I don't know what these numbers mean.
Perhaps this player has a balance of 24,600 remaining to spend in the GT Store?
And a measly 468 in-game Credits (which seems very low, so I'm a little lost there).

*Edit
I notice the same symbol is used for the 'Millionare' Achievements section.
So perhaps everything I just said about the GT Store is rubbish. :P
 
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Project CARS has one major graphical flow, it uses different LOD models for every car, so in a replay your car transforms to be in more detail as it approaches the camera, it's not subtle at all and ruins the replays for me.
 
Tassie_tiger
Regarding this image.

I'm not sure what the '24,600' number refers to, but I do know that the symbol next to it is for the 'GT Store'.

i13KvKrapK0aJ8E_zpseu5lifpu.jpg


For GT6 there is nothing other than Credits to purchase, but the Store is there to " Purchase and download additional content (DLC)".

Again, I don't know what these numbers mean.
Perhaps this player has a balance of 24,600 remaining to spend in the GT Store?
And a measly 468 in-game Credits (which seems very low, so I'm a little lost there).

*Edit
I notice the same symbol is used for the 'Millionare' Achievements section.
So perhaps everything I just said about the GT Store is rubbish. :P
Click to expand...

You should also notice that the same symbol is use for the amount of CR (top right in GT6)
 
All I need in GTS or any next GT game is working suspension, aero and tire model that reflect real life, something that old game like LFS has done :

lfs_00000009.jpg


These aspects may not be in PD/Kaz design specification, Kaz may specify simpler models on aero, tire and suspension to fit within company design requirements for GT as Sony racing game system seller. I believe PD/Kaz could have aimed for more refined/realistic simulation if they wished to, but they did not, looking at the competitor like pcars and AC while GTS still firmly on old physics formula from PSX/PS2 days ( simpler simulation that can be played by kids to adults )

If PD decided to follow what Pcars and AC did with physics, we would have seen it by now, there's no stopping for PD to do it, they have the money, and all the talents needed are there as long as the money is good :) It's not like NASA grade simulation anyway, there's nothing really special or ultra rare to get a realistic physics engine running ( something like ISImotor ) It just need someone to start the project ( design requirement and specification ), get the required manpower and money.
 
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Ridox2JZGTE
Could you please elaborate on the Nismo GTR ? How did you come up with RWD impression and is it 40% front : 60% rear weight that you wrote ? Which tire you drove the car on ?
Click to expand...

azeeza
The GTR Nismo GT3 is a RWD in real life
Click to expand...

Ridox2JZGTE
Was he talking about the road car or the race car ? :confused:
Click to expand...

Sorry for the late Response. Haven't expected so much reaction on my Review which I have wrote very fast bevor going to sleep.

I was talking about the Road car. I know the GT3 Nismo GTR is has RWD but the road car still has AWD.

To you @Ridox2JZGTE: I came up with that Impression, because even after "Flugplatz" at the "Schwedenkreuz" the car was oversteering eventhough it's nearly a straightline and I wouldn't expect an AWD to lose controll while Accelerating at a very fast Corners. Especially after Hearing how stable and balanced the Nismo GT-R feels like while driving fast. Of course I haven't driven one in reallife so I can't really judge if it's accurate or not but still it didn't feeled right.
And I had to be nearly as careful as driving the RWD Aston Martin when it came to braking and accelerating. So i only feeled a Little bit of a difference while working with my feet.

Positiv is that you can't just hammer down the acceleration and brake pedal. In GTS you really have to be more sensitive.

Also every time under heavy braking the back stepped out and I was drifting. You could always catch the car and still drive fast but I don't think the Nismo GT-R is handling like that in reallife while braking.
It really feeled like the weight Distribution is at 40:60.
Also fast steering movements made the car lose the rear a Little.

It was quiet a nervous ride but very enjoyable. I drove without any assistences. No TCS, no racing line, no Auto Transmission, nothing. Only ABS was on at its lowest rate, as the real car has ABS aswell.

The other cars actually felt pretty good. It was only the Nismo GT-R which was not like you expect. Especially after talking to some People at the Nürburgring who have driven it.

I don't know which compound of tires it had but I had Sports tires (Other than in GT6 you couldn't see at the HUD which type of sports tyres you were on.)

Btw. I actually liked the graphics. They are an improvement over Gt6 and looked even more like reallife. But it's something you expect when coming to a new-gen Console.

But the very heavy flickering of the textures destroyed the Immersion and the Feeling while driving. I noticed that it was especially flickering when there were trackparts with a lot of shadow and light mixes (which is seen at the Nürburgring). Shadows were flickering, trees were flickering and also the grass. My girlfriend already questioned why they publish this beta and let People test when they can't handle the flickering of Textures.
 
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Chameleon
You think that will stop the complaining? Nothing can stop the complaining.
Click to expand...

Yeah I know that, but there is complaining and then irrational bitching. So you just gotta decide which is which, I mean in my thought I don't really get the entire hype up of a "official FIA sanctioned game". Like you can do both, or is their some contractual obligation that certain people know about that hasn't been openly expressed, that says they can only use tracks the FIA deems proper? Cause if so then GT7 is going to be a bust when an actual expanded game is released...unless this is just meant to be the FIA hardcore racer and GT is meant to be more driver.
 
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Ridox2JZGTE
If PD decided to follow what Pcars and AC did with physics, we would have seen it by now, there's no stopping for PD to do it, they have the money, and all the talents needed are there as long as the money is good :) It's not like NASA grade simulation anyway, there's nothing really special or ultra rare to get a realistic physics engine running ( something like ISImotor ) It just need someone to start the project ( design requirement and specification ), get the required manpower and money.
Click to expand...
If it's so easy to create realistic physics why is it that ISI motor games, iRacing, Project Cars and Assetto Corsa all feel different when driving and sim racing fans rank them differently in terms of simulation quality?
 
SlipZtrEm
It's why I'm hoping GT7 is only a year removed from Sport. Four years into PS4's lifetime is pushing the limits of what's an acceptable wait for a more traditional GT game, for me. I never expected all of the tracks from GT6 to return, since some of them were in dire need of updating, but 19 tracks feels a little light. I'm more surprised by the number of variations: at the absolute best, we're looking at 8 tracks that have more than one ribbon available. Seven really, since we've already seen Brands Hatch Indy.

So, my guess for the 19 that will be available at launch:
  1. Brands Hatch (GP + Indy)
  2. Nurburgring (Nordschleife + GP + N24)
  3. Willow Springs
  4. Dirt Track (2 layouts is my guess)
  5. Northern Isle
  6. Tokyo Expressway (2 layouts is my guess)
  7. Yas Marina (GP) - Hosted GT Academy. I'd be shocked if it's not included.
  8. Midfield - It was just rebuilt. It'd be a huge waste to drop it so quickly.
  9. Silverstone (GP + Intl + Ntl) - New to GT6, GTA host.
  10. Daytona (Road Course) - Since I'm doubting NASCAR's inclusion, just the road course will do.
  11. Laguna Seca - The longest-running real circuit in GT history.
  12. Circuit de la Sarthe (Full Modern Circuit) - I don't see them skipping this.
  13. Spa Francorchamps - Ditto.
  14. Bathurst - Double ditto.
  15. Suzuka (GP) - Triple ditto.
  16. Grand Valley Speedway (Full + East) - Polyphony's original original track.
  17. Apricot Hill - Another track that was just recently rebuilt.
  18. Autopolis - *cough cough*
  19. Red Bull Ring - Another that's been built for the series recently.
That's a tough list, since it doesn't leave much for them to unveil in the coming months that's genuinely new. It could also be way off, and a whole lot of those could be cut, but they seem pretty core to me, other than maybe Daytona. And that's ignoring that the GT trinity (Grand Valley, Deep Forest, and Trial Mountain) is already chopped up here. :(

Also, didn't PD count reverse layouts as separate ribbons in GT6? If they do, does that mean even the original circuits won't be run in reverse in GT Sport? That'd be a huge shock.
Click to expand...
I agree with your list. Except Autopolis. Looking at the picture now, it only looks like a Track Path Editor track. If I was to make a list I'd replace it with High Speed Ring. 👍
 
Johnnypenso
If it's so easy to create realistic physics why is it that ISI motor games, iRacing, Project Cars and Assetto Corsa all feel different when driving and sim racing fans rank them differently in terms of simulation quality?
Click to expand...
Recreating the real world physics is very hard,but making the GT Sport physics realistic/close enough to compete with iRacing, Project Cars and Assetto Corsa should not be so hard for one of the biggest/richest game developers on the market.
 
Johnnypenso
If it's so easy to create realistic physics why is it that ISI motor games, iRacing, Project Cars and Assetto Corsa all feel different when driving and sim racing fans rank them differently in terms of simulation quality?
Click to expand...

Oh, Johnny, no one said it's easy, why do you always make a conclusion to make someone looks wrong and then make yourself looks better ? How many physics engine that are the considered the best in racing game genre ? Iracing, Pcars, AC, and Rfactor, I''ll take those 4 for example, and how many funds each costs to make ? Tens of millions of dollars ? Not likely, AC was made by 12 people ? These physics engine were made, not because they are easy or hard, they were made because someone started it with such vision, took the risk, with how niche the market will be. If one company owner decides to make a racing game with similar to more realistic simulation physics than those 4, it definitely possible, as long as the fund is available, it's not like the human resources to build a physics engine is like a ultra rare mining commodity.

Let's say this man is Kaz the Wizard, he studied and make a design specification based on these 4 physics engine, taking the best part of each of them and try to build something new. From engine simulation, chassis dynamics, tire model, suspension, aero, drivetrain, sounds etc. How much details and how intricate they are being simulated will be dependent on how the project leader wants it ( Kaz Wizard ), and he goes for the best combination of current market sim, then added more. He would start recruiting people for each field of simulation, give them as much resources and data needed ( from car and tire manufacturer to whatever middleware, licenses or software needed, the crew wanted, they go it ). Kaz has connection with Nissan, BMW, Toyota, Benz, KW, Yokohama, for once, the Wizard actually used his connection and funds for good. Let's say 4 to 5 years of engine development ( 3 may be suffice ) using 50-80 experts in physics, modelling, programming, 10-20 millions dollar spent on simulation engine alone. If Kaz did all this, from GT5 days, we would have something similar to AC/PCars/Iracing in physics simulation, a perfect base for future life cycle of the GT games, future proof for at least 2 - 4 console generation may be even possible.

But, no, Kaz and Sony decides such simulation level would be overkill, it would probably reduce the sales of the games, no such console games existed yet in that time ( 2010-2014 ) and market research would have been likely suggest simpler simulation is best.
Pcars came out in 2015, boom, pretty nice sales number, PD might be swayed a bit, but it's too late, GTS coming in 2016 :lol:

In short, any dev could aim high, the problem is the risk and the management decision. SMS took huge gamble with Pcars, but they did it. AC/Kunos is next with console port, will this gamble will return profit ? We'll see. If these 2 indeed find success and do make great sales with sequels, PD/Kaz might follow suit, otherwise, from all I can see, PD/Kaz is taking safer bet.
 
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super_gt
Recreating the real world physics is very hard,but making the GT Sport physics realistic/close enough to compete with iRacing, Project Cars and Assetto Corsa should not be so hard for one of the biggest/richest game developers on the market.
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That's the thing, I'm not sure that PD will ever pursue physics to that level. Games like AC and Iracing are harcore sims, they prioritise physics to the extent that little concern is given towards content quantity and features because they are aiming to acheive quality over everything else. The GT games are considerably more casual, which is fine, it has different aims, but the absolute accuracy of the handling is less important to it than those other games as a result, and it becomes more about balancing the physics out with car count and features etc.

Maybe they do intend to go after AC level physics, but if they do I will be surprised to be honest.
 

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