- 16
- England
Feels like a step back rather then a jump forward. I'll buy it when the price drop kicks in £50 is too much
Gran Turismo Sport: General Discussion
- Thread starter Formidable
- 47,132 comments
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Someone got rumbled, its as if there are no means to disprove ones claims!
- 789
- QLD
@freedom1104 You have misunderstood what I wrote, clearly I do not know if they would implement triple screen support from NEO, all I said is that at over 4 Tflops it has more than enough power to run them.
I guess everyone has forgotten that in the Team VVV video interview Kaz previously said "we could have called it Gran Turismo 7, at this stage I think either name would work." And in the Gamespot interview more recently "we actually could have called it 7 and the reason why we decided to go with Sport instead is because the major focus of this title is that we are starting this new Sport mode that is going to change the racing world and if you consider the Gran tursmo 1 thpugh 6 as the first era or first genration of Gran Turismo, starting from Sport we are really entering this new era and thats why when I really considered it, it seemed better to call it Gran Turismo Sport... and we could have easily called it 7, it has all the features, it has the size of a full size game and when people have asked me over and over again the same question, I went back and thought about it, I could have called it 7, it would have been easier to do so but that was the reasoning behind the name of the title."
So answer this, when he says "we could have called it Gran Turismo 7, at this stage I think either name would work." can the name GT7 work if they actually plan on bringing out another GT7 after this? He keeps saying we could have called it GT7 and he says at this point either name works for this title, how can GT7 work for this title if they are planing on bringing out another game called GT7 and how can he bring out another game with all the features of this game but more features returned from the previous generation that is now ended if he doesn't want this game to be considered a prologue? But if you read my posts I have shown the logical reasoning why it is best not to have the dropped career mode in the same game that has the new online career that is Sport mode and since Sport is a planned feature in future releases that old offline career mode would be detrimental to return to any game with the Sport mode. In addition cars that do not fit into defined racing classes then also have no place in the Sports games. However I am sure we will see many cars added over time but each car will be balanced
Actually worse than hired, invested. These are guys that are invested in the game and make more money the better the game does so Ben Collins telling you the PCARS is the most accurate is no more reliable than Kaz telling you GTS is the best.
Can you please tell me which title I am missing in the progression.
- Gran Turismo
- Gran Turismo 2
- Gran Turismo 3 A spec
- Gran Turismo 4
- Gran Turismo 5
- Gran Turismo 6
- Gran Turismo Sport
No they can't and wont, they must and will respond to the market and market their game accordingly and a name is something they will think about even more now that Kaz has seen the response to this name although it has worked out in their favour being a topic of discussion. As I have pointed out but you clearly don't wish to accept that if they release a title called 7 after this that places this either in between 6 and 7 or as a separate title to the numbered series. They have made it clear this is the next title in the series and not a separate series. They have also made it clear that this is a full release, in a moment I will point out where they actually chose the name sport instead of 7 for this title and that Kaz said either Sport or 7 would work as a name for this title. But if they release 7 after this then people will declare this a Prologue and once again declare Kaz as dishonest when he said it is not. But as you can see below this title is clearly 7, those who can't see it simply don't want to see it because they are hoping 7 will come and bring the features they want.
I guess everyone has forgotten that in the Team VVV video interview Kaz previously said "we could have called it Gran Turismo 7, at this stage I think either name would work." And in the Gamespot interview more recently "we actually could have called it 7 and the reason why we decided to go with Sport instead is because the major focus of this title is that we are starting this new Sport mode that is going to change the racing world and if you consider the Gran tursmo 1 thpugh 6 as the first era or first genration of Gran Turismo, starting from Sport we are really entering this new era and thats why when I really considered it, it seemed better to call it Gran Turismo Sport... and we could have easily called it 7, it has all the features, it has the size of a full size game and when people have asked me over and over again the same question, I went back and thought about it, I could have called it 7, it would have been easier to do so but that was the reasoning behind the name of the title."
So answer this, when he says "we could have called it Gran Turismo 7, at this stage I think either name would work." can the name GT7 work if they actually plan on bringing out another GT7 after this? He keeps saying we could have called it GT7 and he says at this point either name works for this title, how can GT7 work for this title if they are planing on bringing out another game called GT7 and how can he bring out another game with all the features of this game but more features returned from the previous generation that is now ended if he doesn't want this game to be considered a prologue? But if you read my posts I have shown the logical reasoning why it is best not to have the dropped career mode in the same game that has the new online career that is Sport mode and since Sport is a planned feature in future releases that old offline career mode would be detrimental to return to any game with the Sport mode. In addition cars that do not fit into defined racing classes then also have no place in the Sports games. However I am sure we will see many cars added over time but each car will be balanced
Actually worse than hired, invested. These are guys that are invested in the game and make more money the better the game does so Ben Collins telling you the PCARS is the most accurate is no more reliable than Kaz telling you GTS is the best.
- 40,896
Linky
Linky
Tell me more about your Wikipedia page. Tell me more about your page link to... um... every Gran Turismo title sold in Australia. It's really fascinating how Sony's marketing for previous games in the series is okay for you to ignore when convenient for you.
Your head being stuck in your ass isn't "the market."
Who the hell are you to dictate to others that they can't think that the next title might go back to the traditional numbering scheme if it goes back to the traditional gameplay? We've all read the same PR. You're not enlightening anyone by typing up college thesis that just repeats the PR blindly with your own spin on it as if it is the one true interpretation of interview answers or whatever.
More importantly, who the hell are you to dictate how Sony will be required to title and advertise the next game that PD make after GT Sport when GT Sport hasn't even come out?
Look at all those market failures, with their inconsistent sequel titling.
Yeah, no one is impressed with your ability to write entire essays that say very little other than how foolish it can be to adhere so blindly to prerelease marketing material.
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- 789
- QLD
@Tornado 
Yes no doubt you are a funny guy
But the end of the post is the best when instead of accepting that Kaz has set it straight weeks ago you try to deflect by saying I write too much, don't read it if you don't wish to, all I did was point out that Kaz himself has made it clear that this is GT7 and they just chose to name it something different for the reason he provided.
Yes no doubt you are a funny guy But the end of the post is the best when instead of accepting that Kaz has set it straight weeks ago you try to deflect by saying I write too much, don't read it if you don't wish to, all I did was point out that Kaz himself has made it clear that this is GT7 and they just chose to name it something different for the reason he provided.
- 40,896
You mean like he did back in 2009 when he stressed that Gran Turismo PSP was a full fledged Gran Turismo title, and Sony marketed it as a full fledged Gran Turismo title, and he briefly threw the entire might of his development team behind it and refused to let any other developer help just like if it was a full fledged Gran Turismo title; then gave it the same name as the original 1997 game and followed it up by calling the numerically 6th full fledged Gran Turismo title "Gran Turismo 5" anyway?
Good heavens, the logic!
If I had to guess, by this point no one actually is.
Brend
Premium
- 11,772
- Scotland
- GTSophy-Lapos
- ClassicBrend
...or perhaps he doesn't want to outright say "If you want Gran Turismo 7, this game isn't for you" and isolate a huge amount of the potential buyer-base.@Tornado
But the end of the post is the best when instead of accepting that Kaz has set it straight weeks ago you try to deflect by saying I write too much, don't read it if you don't wish to, all I did was point out that Kaz himself has made it clear that this is GT7 and they just chose to name it something different for the reason he provided.
The mass market will see "Gran Turismo..." and before they even read the final part of the title, it's purchased. Heck there were people who didn't understand that the prologues weren't full titles.
- 397
- Croatia
- GTEFGHA
@Tornado
But the end of the post is the best when instead of accepting that Kaz has set it straight weeks ago you try to deflect by saying I write too much, don't read it if you don't wish to, all I did was point out that Kaz himself has made it clear that this is GT7 and they just chose to name it something different for the reason he provided.
"When I think about it we could have called GTS GT7 because the game is so big"
You see, don't take this statement too seriously, that's just a generic term he uses for every interview...
It's obvius that GTS is online esports focused type of game. I mean come on the game has no carreer mode. They can't sell this as GT7
- 14,436
- Los Angeles, CA
- Lma_robot
- lImaRobotl
Not that it matters to me, but all that sounds like is a way to try to tote up the game and to take away everyones attention from the fact that, content wise, it seems more a long the line of a prologue type title. There where was obvious outcry about that, so, to me, it just sounds like marketing speak rather than outright fact about the game.
Again, not something I'm terribly concerned with, because a bump in quality over quantity is definitely needed.
- 1,984
- Barcelona
- mannjonusa
Quakebass
Premium
- 1,906
- Washington
- quakebass
GT Sport is currently pushing the boundaries of what a single standard PS4's hardware can do on a single screen, so by default you'd need 3x the power to render at the same resolution and fidelity on three times as many screens. The leaked specs were boasting around 2.25x the power, so by default it wouldn't be enough. Most developers wouldn't want to suddenly have to work with 3/4 the power they originally had, which is what would happen if they go for triple screen builds for Neo, according to leaked specs.
Edit: Forgot about GT PSP.
But even if that wasn't the case, GT Sport doesn't need to be titled "GT7" to be the 7th game in the series. GT Sport is a break from the traditional GT formula, having a cut-down and focused car and track list, every car to be balanced for competitiveness in one or some of PD's racing specs. As far as I've understood, there won't be any classic cars or even machinery much older than the mid-2000's, no NASCAR, karts, open wheelers, Super GT, or any other touring car specs like DTM. The career will be focused on these newly-created specs, and won't have a lot of "special" events like Goodwood or lunar missions, at least not in the same format we're used to. There's going to be a lot more time spent on racecraft than the traditional Sunday cups and garage building.
It's a spin off, and isn't going to be same type or size of game as a traditionally-numbered entry, but that doesn't mean it isn't a full game, nor does it not make it the 7th full game PD has made - it's simply not the 7th game made under the traditional formula. The next game will (presumptively) be called GT7, because it will be returning to that formula - an expansive and diverse car and track list, and career based on building your garage, with races structured to compliment and exemplify the car list. It's just like Forza Motorsport vs. Forza Horizon, only handled by a single developer. I'm not sure why you're struggling to understand this.
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- 1,984
- Barcelona
- mannjonusa
Apart from the '(presumptively)', that's quite the assertive statement. A couple of things:
1: How on earth is Forza Horizon being compared to GT Sport here? Horizon is a different dev, in a different country, and a totally different game.
2: How are you so confident about GT7 appearing in the form you mention?
- 14,436
- Los Angeles, CA
- Lma_robot
- lImaRobotl
Because GTS is supposedly a spin-off, it is much like how Horizon is a spin-off of the Motorsports name. Except it will be handled by one Developer, instead. I'm sure that's all @Quakebass is saying with the comparison.
- 1,984
- Barcelona
- mannjonusa
Fair, but I don't think I've heard this language being used by PD, Kaz, Sony, etc...
It's a fan fantasy from the old-school GT-RPG types. And don't get me wrong, I loved that stuff too, and I want some offline events/career added, but I like the way this is going. Some things change. It's all good.
- 35,492
- Addison,Texas
- GTP_RACECAR
Two things:
- "Young Hamilton" has a name: Nicolas. Try remembering that
- You do realize both of these guys were payed by SMS, right? Are you another person that instantly buys into "Its so realistic" sales pitch every driver that's payed by the developer says?
That's the second I've heard about Billy Madison this week. Who the world is this?
Not related to Gran Turismo Sport much but i would like to share this... What if Scape Mode was done back in the PS2 Era?
But it also bring a question, how does GTS car models fits with the real world environment? Is it good or will it feel out of place like above image (but not that out of place). Also does that means there won't be 3D photo locations anymore? With some life in it just like GT5 Photo Travel where you see random NPC's and cars moving around.
But it also bring a question, how does GTS car models fits with the real world environment? Is it good or will it feel out of place like above image (but not that out of place). Also does that means there won't be 3D photo locations anymore? With some life in it just like GT5 Photo Travel where you see random NPC's and cars moving around.
- 789
- QLD
I missed those words, perhaps you can show me where they were, what I saw instead was you and another article misinterpreting and misrepresenting words he said by adding their own words to create a context that wasn't there. I'm guessing you don't understand how if you exclude the words of that article and only take the words Kaz said using their actual meanings it doesn't actually confirm your point and is very open to interpretation. I would bet those words were chosen very carefully. It is also clear that Kaz understands English because in interviews I have seen Kaz answer English questions, cut off his interpreter and even correct his interpreter in English.
You are still deflecting, clearly you don't want to accept what Kaz actually said.
There was more, you are picking out that part because it fits your reply, when you read the rest of the quotes they do not.
Perhaps, as long as you ignore everything else he has said, so perhaps not. He has made it clear, some people just don't want to accept it.
This is GT7, just not in name.
Actually this is what Kaz said they already did and called Gran Turismo Sport in that same interview I quoted. He said they went back and looked at GT1 and Gran Turismo Sport was inspired by it, he said something to the effect of Gran Turismo Sport being innovative on the same level as GT1.
Of course in future titles there is nothing to stop them adding more content or features which could be inspired by features of older titles but it is pretty clear the content in this game is deliberate and this is considered by them (and by me) to be a fully featured release. And as I have mentioned already an offline career mode that is similar to the old one would be detrimental to a Sport title, for an offline career to work in a Sport game you would need it to be very different and greatly improved but even then an offline mode runs the risk of cannibalising the online Sport mode so it is still potentially detrimental in a Sport title and extremely risky unless the online Motorsport is already well established and not at risk from that competition of what may seem a more accessible way to play the game. No matter what in my opinion an offline career in the same game as a Sport game will prevent some people from trying and potentially falling in love with online racing. And that is what is brilliant about GT Sport, PD have created a game that will introduce a legion of new people to the thrill that is real racing online against real people in a way that can help them fully realise that thrill as a real Motorsport, this is going to start the path of many new sim racers.
I'm guessing you are not a PC gamer because that isn't how it works.
Anyway we were talking about a previous post I made and earlier I mentioned that at over 4 Tflops it fits between the GTX 970 and GTX 980 which is more than enough to run triple monitors, keep in mind when we are talking about that 4 Tflops they are referring to the GPU processing ability. We have also heard the NEO will have an improved CPU and memory and at the moment we don't know anything about the bottlenecks GTS might be facing or if it is even facing any. Because people are speculating based on a terrible graphical analysis of unfinished title. Unfinished means unoptimised and any FPS we see now is very unlikely to be not representative of the final product so when I see GTS running so well already that is awesome. Another way to look at it is 3 months ago when DX11 was still in bets on iRacing, iRacing ran like a turd. It was a stuttery mess, it would freeze constantly and there were multiple running threads of complaints and although everyone tried to help improve the situation only marginal improvements could be found and there were a lot of people who just gave up trying, it was pretty horrible. Fast forward 3 months and all I can say is wow, now that the game is more optimised it runs incredibly, you can now run much higher settings with incredible frame rates and even if you lock your frame rates at 60 it is still smooth but at higher frame rates with super sampling it is just glorious and silky smooth, I'm not exaggerating when I say it is by far the most enjoyable sim racing and gaming experience I have ever had.
No it is a prologue, a lesser version of GT5.
But Kaz has said that it could be called either GT7 or GT Sport but he chose to call it GT7 instead of Sport because he wanted the focus to be on the new direction and it isn't a break in the series, break just isn't the right word because Kaz has said it is actually a new direction or the start of a new era where the old era ended with GT6.
It isn't a spin off, it is a change in direction for the series. It really isn't hard to follow, 1 through to 6 was the first era of GT and GTS is the start of the new era, the old era is over, we are in a new era. If they refer to 1 to 6 as the first era and refer to this as the new era then that implies there will be sequels to Sport but they wont bring back the old era. If bringing back the old was their intention then they wouldn't use words like era or generation they would use words like series. Instead they have implied in everything they have said that this game is the next step in the series, that the series has now changed and that this is the future of the series. Of course that doesn't mean they can't bring back elements but I have explained repeatedly why they probably wouldn't want to bring back the main feature some people want. On the other hand the car and track numbers for this release will grow after release and they have also made that clear but like you said the cars they release will need to fit into defined classes and be balanced against the cars in those classes.
Source? The reason I don't understand this is because it is the opposite of what they have said, there is no basis for this being true other than it is what some people want to believe. Those people don't want to accept what has been said with some ignoring statements they don't like and others simply claiming that none of it is accurate because it is just marketing speak and the truth will be different to what we are being told.
Source with Kaz saying this please?
- 40,896
Oh. You mean like literally every post you've made about what the pre-release marketing for GT Sport means for the future of the entire franchise. Gotcha.
*yawn*
You linked a Wikipedia page in your argument about what constitutes a full Gran Turismo game as proof that there had only been seven. You linked a page that was simply a list of every Gran Turismo or related game publicly released in a single region; hilariously being quite a bit more than seven.
I quoted what Kaz actually said about a game you were ignoring. I quoted what the Gran Turismo website actually said about a game you were ignoring.
You insisted that Sony would be incapable of numbering the next Gran Turismo game as 7 because it wouldn't actually be the seventh game (again, not that GT Sport is the seventh game anyway according to the people who actually made them).
I posted half a dozen game franchises with numbered sequels that aren't even close to the number the game actually was.
You want to pick and choose which information you actually care to interpret as ironclad proof of your assumptions, fine. Get back to everyone here when your posts have some substance to them beyond pure wordcount.
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- 1,984
- Barcelona
- mannjonusa
Yeah I see where you're coming from. It makes sense, what with their history of prologues and whatnot, and their consistent GT RPG model since day zero. But the key thing for me, is that you say, 'the same thing, but just one studio, instead of two', as if it's a minor difference, but it's totally fundamental. People think of Horizon as a spin-off because it has (fairly) literally been spun-off to another dev, and doesn't really resemble FM other than it has cars in it, leaving Turn10 to focus on what they always do.
The same is not happening at PD. They are a large studio, but they are not treating GTS as a 'spin-off', it just doesn't make logistical or marketing sense.
We're all guessing here though, I guess
- 1,743
- Aussie
- Tassie_tiger
Any chance of a source with Kaz saying it isn't a spin-off?
I did ask politely before, and I'm genuinely interested in that because I too have watched all the interviews and must have missed it.
But anyway,
'pushing the direction of motorsport'
'esport'
'FIA'
'promoting the new Sport Mode'
These are the reasons Kaz has put forward for calling it GT Sport.
And that all seems fair to me.
He can call it what he wants.
But that's not to say the next one has to be similarly orientated.
GT has a winning formula.
People like to have a ridiculous choice of what car they will buy next.
People like to build 1000HP GT-R's.
I don't see PD completely walking away from a format which has served them so well for so long.
In my opinion I don't see that format fitting into pre-determined BoP'd class racing.
And so should that format return, it's almost inevitable it will be called GT7.
I did ask politely before, and I'm genuinely interested in that because I too have watched all the interviews and must have missed it.
But anyway,
'pushing the direction of motorsport'
'esport'
'FIA'
'promoting the new Sport Mode'
These are the reasons Kaz has put forward for calling it GT Sport.
And that all seems fair to me.
He can call it what he wants.
But that's not to say the next one has to be similarly orientated.
GT has a winning formula.
People like to have a ridiculous choice of what car they will buy next.
People like to build 1000HP GT-R's.
I don't see PD completely walking away from a format which has served them so well for so long.
In my opinion I don't see that format fitting into pre-determined BoP'd class racing.
And so should that format return, it's almost inevitable it will be called GT7.
- 14,436
- Los Angeles, CA
- Lma_robot
- lImaRobotl
There is none, it is a general consensus. I was just reiterating @Quakebass' point.
Either way, its not really too off to be able to assume that, considering the change in focus in comparison to the main titles. I know they're trying to push away from that notion, but it's easy to make the assumption.
Quakebass
Premium
- 1,906
- Washington
- quakebass
Yeah I see where you're coming from. It makes sense, what with their history of prologues and whatnot, and their consistent GT RPG model since day zero. But the key thing for me, is that you say, 'the same thing, but just one studio, instead of two', as if it's a minor difference, but it's totally fundamental. People think of Horizon as a spin-off because it has (fairly) literally been spun-off to another dev, and doesn't really resemble FM other than it has cars in it, leaving Turn10 to focus on what they always do.
The same is not happening at PD. They are a large studio, but they are not treating GTS as a 'spin-off', it just doesn't make logistical or marketing sense.
We're all guessing here though, I guess
The double-dev dynamic is a factor, but it really only affects how quickly a game comes out. The two studios share assets and a myriad of other systems, the main differing factor is the game engine and map(s) used - and that's the only thing that really gets facilitated with two devs. The engine is a different engine, but it isn't drastically different, you still recognize it as a forza product, and is still therefore a forza game. PG is another studio, but because of the partnership, it's really an extension of T10 when the development of the Horizon series comes into the discussion. Because of sheer manpower of combined teams, a game comes out every year, but in truth it's really two studios pumping out two projects in staggered two-year cycles.
Horizon is still a spinoff of Forza Motorsport, but has its own separate arm/studio to cover it. The difference between them and PD is that the "spinoff" game is still being covered by the same studio, and therefore doesn't receive the staggering strategy that T10 is able to do. Additionally, this GT "spinoff" doesn't really require a massively different development style when it comes down to the physics engine and asset-building - it's still real world cars and real world tracks, and an engine aiming to simulate reality as best it can (as opposed to Horizon's attempt to be realistic but making sacrifices to bump the fun factor). Pretty much anything built in/for Sport can be used in another GT game, but how the assets are optimized and allocated (for example, balancing cars for spec series and Esport) is what makes the game unique from the traditional numbers.
You are correct that I or no one else can truly know what will come after sport, but it's very logical to assume a future traditionally-numbered game will play out similarly to the past games with similar naming conventions; "GT Sport 2" would probably play out similarly to GT Sport, etc.
- 1,321
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- dacc10
Well this topic escalated quickly.
GTSport is a spin-off, the way they priced it, shows exactly that (still 10€ cheaper than the "normal" GT's). It's a more focused game, with less content, but with the improvement of the graphics, lighting and physics, like we are used to with every new iteration of the numbered series.
Other things that support this as a spin off, the lack of tuning like we are used to in previous titles (mentioned in one of the latest interviews, where they mention that there won't be 1000hp GT-Rs as an example), and for example, lack of classic road and racecars. PD, wouldn't dare to completely forget those, in favor of just modern cars... after all, they also love classics.
In this we won't have the same level of tuning, the same variety of cars and tracks and a full campaign.
And this is where the next game comes (probably GT7). Keeping all the cars and tracks already modeled, the same lighting (maybe improved a bit if there's need for it) and the same physics (also improved if there's need for that too). The rest, is just adding content, cars, tracks, tuning, campaign, improvements to the online mode and AI. GTSport and it's "mechanics" will stay pretty much the same (if it's good, why change it?), so all they need to give us, is content.
GTSport is a spin-off, the way they priced it, shows exactly that (still 10€ cheaper than the "normal" GT's). It's a more focused game, with less content, but with the improvement of the graphics, lighting and physics, like we are used to with every new iteration of the numbered series.
Other things that support this as a spin off, the lack of tuning like we are used to in previous titles (mentioned in one of the latest interviews, where they mention that there won't be 1000hp GT-Rs as an example), and for example, lack of classic road and racecars. PD, wouldn't dare to completely forget those, in favor of just modern cars... after all, they also love classics.
In this we won't have the same level of tuning, the same variety of cars and tracks and a full campaign.
And this is where the next game comes (probably GT7). Keeping all the cars and tracks already modeled, the same lighting (maybe improved a bit if there's need for it) and the same physics (also improved if there's need for that too). The rest, is just adding content, cars, tracks, tuning, campaign, improvements to the online mode and AI. GTSport and it's "mechanics" will stay pretty much the same (if it's good, why change it?), so all they need to give us, is content.
Palestinian
(Banned)
- 77
- United Kingdom
@nasanu @Tired Tyres it don't matter who they work for, or if money changed hands. There doing something right in life for money to be changing hands. And in this case there expert input is of financial benifit to themselves. SMS paid for such input and that's logical. So there input is as I have said earlier more valid then either of your. So back to my original point !
You can answer with your wallet by not purchasing SMS games and that's fine's... You win and every bodies happy
You can answer with your wallet by not purchasing SMS games and that's fine's... You win and every bodies happy
- 1,984
- Barcelona
- mannjonusa
But 'content' is handled differently now to how it used to be.
The days of a game at retail shipping with 1000+ cars are over.
Thinking you'll get a new release called GT7 with that tonne of content at GTS quality, is not just wishful thinking, it's madness
Why not just add that content to GTS in bits and pieces?
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