GT4 WRS Week 49 : "Swiss swinging"

[shockwaveracing]

why the hell would u be using =10 percent power, u will never beat my times with that setting. dumbo

j/k

coz i am not as good a rally driver as you, i have done bugger all rallying before this challenge and it takes a while to learn... damn aliens, sounds like trouble's starting...

 

[holl01]

wrong...

more power means more straighline speed, which basically gets u oodles of time, and also the more power, the more speed u can carry in the slides as u have more energy in the rear wheels to power through the corners. DUMBO

 

[Tedehur]

wrong...

more power means more straighline speed, which basically gets u oodles of time, and also the more power, the more speed u can carry in the slides as u have more energy in the rear wheels to power through the corners. DUMBO

True for the straight lines, but IMO not in the corners, where the power needs to be balanced by countersteering so that the car keeps going towards the good direction while sliding sideways. If you have too much power, the countersteering can't be efficient enough and the car spins.

 

[Casio]

wrong...

more power means more straighline speed, which basically gets u oodles of time, and also the more power, the more speed u can carry in the slides as u have more energy in the rear wheels to power through the corners. DUMBO

Listen here Dumbo.

You can all the energy you want in the rear wheels. If it's too powerful it's just going to spin the wheels and create an awful lot of smoke. It's the same principle of a locked brake but in reverse. When your brakes are locked you are no longer converting kenetic energy to heat by friction. Same applies to over-powered spinning rear wheels but visa versa.

Since you have less power, you can reach the point where 100% throttle does not spin the wheels earlier, so you arn't wasting all that power kicking up dirt.

That said, if you have some amount of throttle control it shouldn't really matter.

 

[Luxy]

True for the straight lines, but IMO not in the corners, where the power needs to be balanced by countersteering so that the car keeps going towards the good direction while sliding sideways. If you have too much power, the countersteering can't be efficient enough and the car spins.

That's where throttle control comes in Best of both worlds 👍

 

[Small_Fryz]

That's where throttle control comes in Best of both worlds 👍

Thats when the "big" boys come in.

I personally have no trouble with throttle control, i just cant rally... period.

I have no idea of lines and how to drive the track

I think i will just sit on the fence and be in awe of how you guys set such fast times! 👍

 

[holl01]

i didnt do any throttle control in my lap, either it was 100 percent gas or brake. so indeed the more powerful the car is set too, the faster it will be, as it will have more drive out of the low rev drifts, so hence, more exit speed. very silly argument, obviously if u have more hp in a car, weather it is rally, or tarmac, u will be faster...substantially faster.

 

[fasj6418]

i think the point is that some of us started driving the car with less power just to get used to.

last night i ran for 15 minutes just before going to bed. so i started with -20 hp and plus 10 weight. not for fast laps or anything, just to get a feel for the car. this week was the first time i enter a dirt track since week 9 of the WRS... and i know a lot of guys are in the same boat. so, its just to get use to, not trying to be faster than +20 and -10

 

[shockwaveracing]

i didnt do any throttle control in my lap, either it was 100 percent gas or brake. so indeed the more powerful the car is set too, the faster it will be, as it will have more drive out of the low rev drifts, so hence, more exit speed. very silly argument, obviously if u have more hp in a car, weather it is rally, or tarmac, u will be faster...substantially faster.

techniquely you are wrong as proved by one S. Loeb last year at the WRC Oz, a gravel rally if i am not mistaken, gravel inherently has to be driven in an understeering fashion to get the quickest times, whilst having crateloads of power may be good, it also results in a lot of oversteer, which SLOWS you down (in real life) whilst understeering through the corners proved to be significantly faster for Loeb so he did just that (even though he didn't like it) and probably would have won if that tree hadn't have jumped out onto the road...

were you expecting me to beat your times anywayz? if you were then you were sadly mistaken.

i never asked for your opinion so put a sock in it... the recent amounts of negativity towards myself is a little perturbing to say the least, and i am not quite sure as to what your motives are for it?

i have no illusions of grandeur, i do realise that you are most likely one of the quickest people to have ever raced GT4 (on a REAL road would be an entirely different matter) so keeping up with you is sign of how quick someone can be when they give it a crack...

and this is a whole lot harder with the DFP than the DS2... ***wishing i had a DS2 controller right now***

oh and seeing how i have put in just over an hour on this challenge with "only 10%hp" i think i am doing quite well so Far Cough!!!

 

[Laurence5905]

You can all the energy you want in the rear wheels. If it's too powerful it's just going to spin the wheels and create an awful lot of smoke. It's the same principle of a locked brake but in reverse. When your brakes are locked you are no longer converting kenetic energy to heat by friction. Same applies to over-powered spinning rear wheels but visa versa.

Actually, from a physics standpoint, that's not entirely true... When your brakes are locked, you ARE still coverting kinetic energy into heat. The difference is that you're sliding the wheels across the ground, instead of the contact patch of the wheel being in non-sliding contact with the ground. When the contact-patch of the wheel is sliding, rather than not sliding, you're using its "dynamic coefficient" of friction rather than its "static coefficient." The dynamic coefficient is always less than the static one, thus you get less energy converted from kinetic to heat, but you still have some conversion taking place -- otherwise you'd never stop...

Same thing with the rear wheels -- once they've broken loose, you're using the dynamic coefficient rather than the static coefficient. Less energy is applied to the forward motion of the car, but you still have SOME energy being applied to the forward motion of the car. And, the faster those wheels spin, the more is applied towards forward motion. Of course, faster-spinning wheels make the car more difficult to control, and make it more difficult to "hook up" again, in order to regain the static coefficient of friction. But during the time when the friction between the wheels and the ground is not static, a faster-spinning wheel means more forward motion.

 

[MisterWeary]

Board Updated

But position 2 on the list could well be me soon, just getting my lap verified before I get too confident, if it's clean I beat my old lap by 1.2 seconds...and that includes a 0.5 loss (compared to my best split) at T1!!! Why have I taken so long to get into rallying!!!

Oh and as for this taking a car into a race with less power than you're allowed?!? Makes no sense to me but each to their own 👍

 

[holl01]

techniquely you are wrong as proved by one S. Loeb last year at the WRC Oz, a gravel rally if i am not mistaken, gravel inherently has to be driven in an understeering fashion to get the quickest times, whilst having crateloads of power may be good, it also results in a lot of oversteer, which SLOWS you down (in real life) whilst understeering through the corners proved to be significantly faster for Loeb so he did just that (even though he didn't like it) and probably would have won if that tree hadn't have jumped out onto the road...

were you expecting me to beat your times anywayz? if you were then you were sadly mistaken.

i never asked for your opinion so put a sock in it... the recent amounts of negativity towards myself is a little perturbing to say the least, and i am not quite sure as to what your motives are for it?

gt4 isnt a real life simulator, and the rallying in gt4 is horrendously inaccurate and fake. and no i wasnt expecting u to beat my times, but i was a little preplexed why a decent driver like urselve would be using anything but the fullest power available, well seeing as how u dont have a ds2 to use, that explains alot

i was only ever j/k, u stupid idiot!

 

[Tedehur]

 

[shockwaveracing]

gt4 isnt a real life simulator, and the rallying in gt4 is horrendously inaccurate and fake. and no i wasnt expecting u to beat my times, but i was a little preplexed why a decent driver like urselve would be using anything but the fullest power available, well seeing as how u dont have a ds2 to use, that explains alot

i was only ever j/k, u stupid idiot!

lol

well i gave it a crack at full power the first day and had a big sook at it, so i am building myself up to it... so i will see what u can get by the end of this challenge, ya chump!

 

[Thirdeye]

I used full power, and the lowest weight possible for this, and used only 100% accel and braking for the most part (I feathered the pedals a little around the first sweeper after the hills though). I've ran a few laps that were a good second or more better than my final clean time, though... I hate GT4 rally though, because it seems like consistency is so tough.

 

[Thirdeye]

Sholy Hit, Thirdeye! That's some seriously impressive T2-T3ing! Wish I could find your line!

Thanks I found it all seems to rely on the hairpin after the wooden bridge that'll make or break your entire lap time, come into it so that you aren't spinning your wheels as much as to ensure more traction on the exit, as exit speed is crucial for that particular turn. For instance, if you floor it through the entire turn, I found that you just seem to slide further and further towards the wall while never really picking up enough traction to catch my ghost. If you enter it closer to the fence, while at a lower entrance speed, you can accelerate faster out of the turn (I know it's probably common knowledge, but it might help someone I hope!) Also, I used Automatic Transmission, as I found it was easier for me to control the speed of the car over the hills and concentrate more on the laps. *Edit* Oh, and for those wondering, shouting every obscenity in the book at the TV doesn't seem to help your times much! I found that out with practice

 

[Luxy]

0'26.5 (25.8)
0'47.1 (46.6)
1'06.3 (1'06.1)

And 1.3 off at the line Still looking to knock more off in the next session ...

 

[MisterWeary]

Ooooooh....Cyril just verified my lap for me and I was all ready to post my splits as the second fastest lap overall and damn if Luxy didn't just slide in front of me Nice lap man, here are my 3rd place splits

T1: 0'26.356
T2: 0'47.321
T3: 1'06.690

And a pretty nice finish even if I do say so myself (despite coming within millimetres of the wall). My T1 is pretty crap though considering I've seen a 25.8 so another 0.5 is possible but unlikely for me 👍

 

[Jump_Ace]

Just started today and about 15min in I have a oh so slightly dirty 1:07.723 T3 time, best track on earth IMO and yes I know I"m the only one who thinks so
No more progress after an hour now...bummer, keep having close calls but when I push the cars this hard that tends to happen I guess..my time is gonna be cut short for the JGTC series

Jerome

 

[jmgyro]

Not enough turns on this track to be that fun. Don't really like the very fast turns where it all depends on a few things that will make your whole time. I think the funnest rally I've tried was Peugeot 206 Rally Car @ Grand Canyon. Was doing some 2.27's with a lot more on there. Crazy control on that car.

 

[holl01]

good call there jymbro, the longer the track, the more enjoyable it is, thats why the nurb is the best track int he game, and the grand canyon is the best rally track in the game. we should do more nurb races!

 

[Thirdeye]

I liked the combo, I just never liked GT4's rallying...

 

[Luxy]

Ooooooh....Cyril just verified my lap for me and I was all ready to post my splits as the second fastest lap overall and damn if Luxy didn't just slide in front of me Nice lap man, here are my 3rd place splits

T1: 0'26.356
T2: 0'47.321
T3: 1'06.690

And a pretty nice finish even if I do say so myself (despite coming within millimetres of the wall). My T1 is pretty crap though considering I've seen a 25.8 so another 0.5 is possible but unlikely for me 👍

Nice lap yourself 👍 If your last sector is decent, you'll have me at the line. My last sector was crap, I turned into the S-bend too late, and had to brake a bit to make it. I had another dirty lap with the same T3 that was 0.800 faster ... but I'm not done yet

@holl & jmgyro: don't forget Chamonix, it's a pretty epic track, too (and everyone but me hates it!)

 

[MisterWeary]

...If your last sector is decent, you'll have me at the line............but I'm not done yet

I hear ya, I hate peaking early on cos people just leapfrog me at the end, I'm gonna keep trying though and see if I can get another few tenths 👍

 

[homie montana]

got some clean splits in right now:

T1 26.791
T2 50.548
T3 1'11.481

think I can do better though 👍

 

[shockwaveracing]

on full power now, this thing is killing me, but i finally got some splits i was happy with, dropped 0.4 between T3-Finish, which prevented me from hitting my target time but happy otherwise

T1: 26.680 (seen 26.3)
T2: 47.426 (lost 0.3 in here nearly spinning it on the damn wood)
T3: 1'07.047

would like to see 1'06.5 by the end of this challenge at T3... got plenty of time with the missus out of my hands for the night (god bless ladies night to give us a fellas some free time )

 

[Smallhorses]

(god bless ladies night to give us a fellas some free time )

Not that I'll gain anything, other than sore nads by this, but can I just say, oh feck, aye to that!!!!! She'll know what I'm talkin' about and my nads'll feel the effects tomorrow!!!!!!!

 

[shockwaveracing]

Not that I'll gain anything, other than sore nads by this, but can I just say, oh feck, aye to that!!!!! She'll know what I'm talkin' about and my nads'll feel the effects tomorrow!!!!!!!

quick run and hide under the sofa... she'll never think to look there...

 

[holl01]

spent about 1 hour trying it with the dfp, no feedback (cord pulled out) and managed to do a fluke T3 of 1'05.918 but could never match the last sector though and subsequaently l9ost 1 second, haha, i switched it off and i will probably not touch gt4 for about a week, ta ta til then

 

[ROB 256R]

Wasn't going to run this week but boredom got the better of me so i did a little 30 min session and got these:

0'27.317
0'49.978
1'09.837

The combo wasn't as bad as i thought it was. But i had to use DS2. Submitting the time from these. 👍 See you next week.