GT5 Latest News & Discussion

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Anyway moving on I found that any of the list there is any toscana road course,this hasn't been confirm but we have seen it in the 458 Italia tribute:

In 0:33 and 1:48 you can see a road course with the toscana backgrounds,of course is not the stelvio pass but I saw this road in:

video starts at 0:32 (sorry for the quality)

Its backgrounds are pretty similar to the backgrounds on the trailer,this is obviously old but no one had a look into the original/real live road so maybe we are seeing here another new(secret)track that could be based on this:

Its the Targa Florio circuit which seems like an "italian" nurburgring and is fairly similar with the top gear video so it seems that maybe we are getting a bit of it as a rally or road course.

I think a toscana road course was expected for a while ever since that 458 video came out. What I'm still REALLY hoping would be the Stelvio Pass. I got my girl friend into top gear and she loved that episode, and when I told her it MIGHT be in GT5 she got excited. Too awesome.
 
I really can't see how anyone could watch that video and interpret it as '40mins of Forza fanboys talking'.

I actually think they made some very fair comments, and I would agree, I see both Forza and GT as 'semi-sim'.
 
About the simraceway episode:

It seems like we are getting a lot of interest in a game that is not even main topic on the web page and forums,it also seems like they care too much about sells and less about the game itself, in a personal point of view it seems like simracing make this kind of videos to get more audience by the controversy,since no side have a definitive word(GT5 hasn't come out) and they only thing to review in a full complete aspect is Forza(or fortxa,fortza,forxa,fozzaZZZZZ,whatever) they will stick to the game that is already out,but yet again all controversy on E3 Gran Turismo and the after match of it has become a main topic that they saw can be exploited,Is my opinion of this review and to be fair doesn't concern to the topic that we discuss about,that is Gran Turismo.

As an aside note they don't mention the features in each game because in each sequel little improvements were made and they don't really look at the list of features deeply enough, which shows the real critical aspects of the game itself.

And in a personal note I want to add that the review of Forza doesn't mention that all the extra and cool cars has to be buy,to that they are around 10 car packs at cost 400 per pack which makes the game 50 USD+ than the basic Forza motorsport game, which makes more profit but is not fair because the whole spect III update for jp was free,and those were like 30 cars for the cost of not so hat is my opinion about Forza in the pricing section.
 
One thing I have noticed about the physics for both games (FM&GT), is that some cars handle "well" (or as I would expect), but others simply handle like crap (most of those cars being AWD). I personally think the EVO X/ STi are the worst aggressors of this. For the life of me I can never get either car to oversteer without pulling the ebrake, which I am sorry is not realistic. All they do is understeer. RWD seem to suffer from either too much or too little oversteer. I really hope GT5 and FM4 resolve this.
 
Have you clicked on it? Guess you will be directed to it's trailers.
It will never be a download game, way too big.

but, then what is it doing on the DL Game area? Maybe they're just promoting it. I mean, yeah, if you had a 20GB PS3, you'd need to a get a new one before downloading it, but, you never know. But, maybe it's more like GTAIV where you had to download an update for it before you play it.
 
One thing I have noticed about the physics for both games (FM&GT), is that some cars handle "well" (or as I would expect), but others simply handle like crap (most of those cars being AWD). I personally think the EVO X/ STi are the worst aggressors of this. For the life of me I can never get either car to oversteer without pulling the ebrake, which I am sorry is not realistic. All they do is understeer. RWD seem to suffer from either too much or too little oversteer. I really hope GT5 and FM4 resolve this.

It's not that easy to make the tail slide out on either of those cars. They are AWD so of course they tend to understeer, that's how AWD works. All the stability aids like S-AYC are there to keep the car in check.
 
watch the top gear with the evo and sti, they drive nothing like they do in gt5p or fm3.

I bet they weren't driving them on racing tires :sly:

But seriously, fitting your cars with N3s or S1s completely transforms them. The grip of R tires is too high.
 
And in a personal note I want to add that the review of Forza doesn't mention that all the extra and cool cars has to be buy,to that they are around 10 car packs at cost 400 per pack which makes the game 50 USD+ than the basic Forza motorsport game, which makes more profit but is not fair because the whole spect III update for jp was free,and those were like 30 cars for the cost of not so hat is my opinion about Forza in the pricing section.

I'm pretty sure they mentioned almost everything costs money. Whatever was free, there was one thing I think, they said it.

watch the top gear with the evo and sti, they drive nothing like they do in gt5p or fm3.

You're basing the handling of those cars off TG?
 
I really can't see how anyone could watch that video and interpret it as '40mins of Forza fanboys talking'.

I actually think they made some very fair comments, and I would agree, I see both Forza and GT as 'semi-sim'.

As much as I hope GT improves, I doubt it will. I still have hope, however, and will enjoy the game regardless. Of course.

I really can't stand that 5 foot nothing twerp, but I've got to agree with alot of what those dudes have to say regarding racing games.
 
One thing I have noticed about the physics for both games (FM&GT), is that some cars handle "well" (or as I would expect), but others simply handle like crap (most of those cars being AWD). I personally think the EVO X/ STi are the worst aggressors of this. For the life of me I can never get either car to oversteer without pulling the ebrake, which I am sorry is not realistic. All they do is understeer. RWD seem to suffer from either too much or too little oversteer. I really hope GT5 and FM4 resolve this.



watch the top gear with the evo and sti, they drive nothing like they do in gt5p or fm3.

Yeah, If you had watched the E3 video, you would see the subaru impreza and the lancer evo (Both AWD, both representing one of the top gear segments of the video) battling it out on a turn- sliding.

Plus, Did you play the TT demo?
The 370 kicked out as if it were made of foam.. Very improved (Although not absolutely perfect) from previous titles.

You're basing the handling of those cars off TG?

..... Why wouldn't he? Its real life, A computer can't necessarily simulate something better than the real thing, so I don't see whats wrong with it.
 
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It seems in cokcpit view driver takes of he's hand from the wheel when shifting with paddles. It seems more complicated to do animation for that than normal motion for just using fingers. Do you think this will bother you? Following video is from main page and cockpit ciew driving starts at 2:20.

Enzo has fixed paddles, they don't turn with the wheel
 
I'm not sure that GT5 will be a hardcore sim like iRacing, rFactor or GTR2. Only time will tell. The only thing I have seen/tested was the trial that was wheel only to get a good time. That could indicate that the professional physics is made for wheel users and the standard is for pad users making GT5 both a game and a sim.
I know this topic usually causes a small ruckus among the PC fans, at least as big a one as with Forza, but it's another good point of comparison.

I can't comment on iRacing, and my brief fight with rFactor was tainted by my struggle to find the options scattered through a poorly designed user interface. But GTR I'm familiar with. I sincerely doubt that Gran Turismo will ever be as deep as it is, but then it's insanely technical. What other sim lets you adjust your radiator cap?? :lol:

But that doesn't mean Gran Turismo can't get very close. You already have access to a staggering range of technical and mechanical adjustments in GT4, even to adjusting the weight balance of the car. Kaz hints that this is going to be taken even further in GT5, which probably puts it well within the realm of many PC sims, especially if the user can adjust the car differently for each side, front and rear as with NASCAR race cars.

Physics wise, the Time Trial demo was very close in feel to GTR and Live For Speed. And from remarks made by other PC sim journalists, it sounds like they were quite impressed with the GT5 E3 demos, so it's well within the realm of possibility that with GT5, we could have an actual sim level game to compete with the serious sims.

I'll have to watch that ISR video tomorrow, it's too close to bedtime, in fact should be tucked in already...
 
..... Why wouldn't he? Its real life, A computer can't necessarily simulate something better than the real thing, so I don't see whats wrong with it.

? There's no 1st hand involvement on his part. It's actually pretty dumb in my opinion to say the game's physics are bad because he saw someone on tv doing powerslides in the same cars without a problem.
 
It seems odd at around 24min into the video, when the SRT reviewer/announcer was talking about Forza's sales, he quoted FM3's sale as being double that of FM2. It's widely known that FM2 sold close to 4 million copies when FM3 was released. Instead of the 8 million copies implied, someone on GTP's Forza forum put the FM3's sales at just below 3 million copies. That's a huge difference and I actually put the question out on SRT Youtube page but not getting any answer so far.
 
Nothing big to announce, but InsideSimRacing made a quick mention of GT and how it's not a sim, and neither is Forza.
They said in first segement that t10 made a great sim but in last part they say that forza and GT are not sims because you can not drive in pits. No words about things that matter like steering aid or high grip on normal tyres. Yes thay said that these games are not sims in numerous of reasons but they do not care to mention them WHY!? If they do not tell e.g t10 what is wrong, they won't fix it. Maybe the F3 vs GT5 shootout gives us some answers other than driving in pits :)
 
They said in first segement that t10 made a great sim but in last part they say that forza and GT are not sims because you can not drive in pits. No words about things that matter like steering aid or high grip on normal tyres. Yes thay said that these games are not sims in numerous of reasons but they do not care to mention them WHY!? If they do not tell e.g t10 what is wrong, they won't fix it. Maybe the F3 vs GT5 shootout gives us some answers other than driving in pits :)

I guess I can sort of agree with that.
However, GT isn't called the professional racing and pit crew simulator.
It simulates driving, not everything else.
 
One thing I have noticed about the physics for both games (FM&GT), is that some cars handle "well" (or as I would expect), but others simply handle like crap (most of those cars being AWD). I personally think the EVO X/ STi are the worst aggressors of this. For the life of me I can never get either car to oversteer without pulling the ebrake, which I am sorry is not realistic. All they do is understeer. RWD seem to suffer from either too much or too little oversteer. I really hope GT5 and FM4 resolve this.

Hmm thats weird the AWD for me can oversteer easily specially the STI Spec C. The evo 10 grips like crazy though the Evo 9 get pretty loose also.
 
I really can't see how anyone could watch that video and interpret it as '40mins of Forza fanboys talking'.

I actually think they made some very fair comments, and I would agree, I see both Forza and GT as 'semi-sim'.

As a sim thought, GT5P & the GT Academy demo are far better than Forza 3.

As a game... well, we'll see when GT5 comes out. Forza 3 has a lot to offer and GT5 needs to be quite a jump from GT4 to retain it's status as the leading racing franchise on console.

Enzo has fixed paddles, they don't turn with the wheel

Not to mention the fact the animation has to compensate for the possibility that the user will turn the wheel whilst changing gear. In a demo shown much earlier this year (On the old Nurburgring... CES was it?) they showed a Nissan GTR on the 'Ring, and it showed the wheel spoke-things phasing through the hand during the shifting animation. For that reason, the hand needs to be fully removed from the wheel so it can move freely. Obviously in real life you know when you are going to shift. The game needs to predict when you shift and to be realistic, it can't, so they have to compensate somehow, otherwise you get a really glitchy looking animation.
 
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Not to mention the fact the animation has to compensate for the possibility that the user will turn the wheel whilst changing gear. In a demo shown much earlier this year (On the old Nurburgring... CES was it?) they showed a Nissan GTR on the 'Ring, and it showed the wheel spoke-things phasing through the hand during the shifting animation. For that reason, the hand needs to be fully removed from the wheel so it can move freely. Obviously in real life you know when you are going to shift. The game needs to predict when you shift and to be realistic, it can't, so they have to compensate somehow, otherwise you get a really glitchy looking animation.

There is still the problem of the hand remaining on the gear lever for way too long. The hand moves out to shift and just lingers there for absolutely no reason whatsoever. I don't so much mind the hand moving off the wheel, but it's just a complete distraction to have the hand just staying there. If it went back right after the shift, it would be fine. I don't get why they don't just reduce the time the hand spends off the wheel by at least a full second or so (it has to go back sometime so why not earlier than later?). As for downshifting, maybe if you're braking they could keep the hand there until you lift off the brake, but otherwise move the hand back.
 
One thing I have noticed about the physics for both games (FM&GT), is that some cars handle "well" (or as I would expect), but others simply handle like crap (most of those cars being AWD). I personally think the EVO X/ STi are the worst aggressors of this. For the life of me I can never get either car to oversteer without pulling the ebrake, which I am sorry is not realistic. All they do is understeer. RWD seem to suffer from either too much or too little oversteer. I really hope GT5 and FM4 resolve this.

Ease up on the gas :)
Slow in, fast out is the order of the day with 4WD cars.
Due to the extra torque on the front tyres, 4WD will always understeer a little.

Even FR cars will as well, due to the weight of the engine, and weight shift to the rear when accelerating

I found in Prologue, you can use less grippy tyres on the rear with a GT-R, which does cause it some oversteer, but just floor it out of a turn, and that neutalises it due to the rearward weight shift, and the understeer on the front end
 
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I am not going to BS you, I have not driven an STI or EVO, but I have driven a WRX. It was possible to get that car to kick its rear out. Hell its possible to get my 02 Outback to slide. I am not saying that the EVO X and STi don't slide in GT5p or FM3, I am saying they don't have enough oversteer and the oversteer they do have is takes too much effort to apply. Also yeah I obviously saw the E3 trailer, which had the STi and EVO sliding around, which looked promising. The EVO X FQ 360 was able to do 4 wheel donuts around/drifts around the STI. Try doing that in GT5p (add the power in the tune menu), its impossible (without N tires).
 
If you compare the 350z in Prologue, to the 370z in the GT Academy time trial demo, you will see there is a big difference in the physics model. It allows the rear end of the cars to step out properly (If you play both you'll see what I mean - Although if you didn't play the TT demo then it might be difficult lol). But the Rear wheel cars in GT5P stepped out like they were on a pivot and the front end moved in as the rear moved out, which isn't exactly realistic, the rear end loses grip and it the energy/torque/power (Whatever you want to call it) going through the wheels pushes the back end sideways, when the front end will still grip. This was the case in the Time Trial demo. If this works for all cars it should allow you to get the back end out on some 4WD/AWD cars too (Though you'll have to push it harder than RWD cars).

Forza 3 does it right, but the grip levels are exaggerated so it takes a little more throttle to get the wheels spinning on most cars (And it's far too easy to correct, the wheels regain grip too quickly when the throttle is lifted). I'm not sure about 4WD/AWD cars in that game, i've only driven one of them, the R8 (Which has a 2/3 rear bias, not really a good comparison).
 
Can we get back to the actual game?
I cant wait to drive around Gambon ,cutting the corner and nearly rolling my chevrolet lacetti !! :)
 
If you compare the 350z in Prologue, to the 370z in the GT Academy time trial demo, you will see there is a big difference in the physics model. It allows the rear end of the cars to step out properly (If you play both you'll see what I mean - Although if you didn't play the TT demo then it might be difficult lol). But the Rear wheel cars in GT5P stepped out like they were on a pivot and the front end moved in as the rear moved out, which isn't exactly realistic, the rear end loses grip and it the energy/torque/power (Whatever you want to call it) going through the wheels pushes the back end sideways, when the front end will still grip. This was the case in the Time Trial demo. If this works for all cars it should allow you to get the back end out on some 4WD/AWD cars too (Though you'll have to push it harder than RWD cars).

Forza 3 does it right, but the grip levels are exaggerated so it takes a little more throttle to get the wheels spinning on most cars (And it's far too easy to correct, the wheels regain grip too quickly when the throttle is lifted). I'm not sure about 4WD/AWD cars in that game, i've only driven one of them, the R8 (Which has a 2/3 rear bias, not really a good comparison).

that is more or less what I said a few pages back and had some guy come back and make comments on things from my age and my sex life haha... but I did find with F3 you can chuck a car into a corner at much greater speeds than you can in GT5p... as if F3s physics were more like GT5p standard physics than leaning to more sim like... dont get me wrong (like someone did) I love forza... I wouldnt have bought a 360 or it if I didnt... but as for a more rewarding driving experience Im with GT... roll on November

Can we get back to the actual game?
I cant wait to drive around Gambon ,cutting the corner and nearly rolling my chevrolet lacetti !! :)

will you lift on the follow through?
 
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