GT7 Daily Race Discussion

[newmedia_dev]

Well, I finally drove a Daily B race today - I drove one yesterday and didn't fare too well, to say the least. I discovered four things this morning:

1. The winning time was 6:44. Compare that to the 10-minute-plus times of last week. Seriously PD? You couldn't have added at least one more lap, which would have made the time something like 8:25? or even another lap, which would have had the time a little over the 10 minute mark? My math may be off, but 6:44 compared to 10 minutes is just insulting. What the ding-dang-diddly is wrong with you guys??
2. To give credit where credit is due, at least they fixed the end-of-race timer. Of course, they were the ones who broke it several months ago and took this long to fix it, but hey, at least they did fix it. Until they break it again next update.
3. I'm slightly more comfortable on this track than I was yesterday (but only slightly).
4. Apparently I'm not the only one who's struggling with this track, judging by the fact that I didn't drive very well, and still managed to move up two places.

I start P8, ended P6. I fended off someone who was catching up on the last lap by - wait for it - driving faster. No other way to say it really, I just decided he wasn't going to catch me, and I focused more on my lines.

Never been a fan of the 911, but I need the torque and speed, so for now the 911 is the car for me. Still looking for something better, though.

I imagine as it was set for a 6 lap race and they changed it last min to 4 is that PD are trying to push sport players to race Sophy so they can learn from it. The races this week are a bit odd in that they favour the streamers and have been levelling out the 155/WRX peeps who over achieved.

This is probably one of the most technical tracks in the world to go fast and I have to admit I'm not good at it. Wasn't good at it in super Monaco GP and not good at it now.

 

[RacingGrandpa]

Or the RCZ, Sure if memory correct. Gtsport the fwd dominated more than the 4wd's in Gt7. Became bit boring.

If the tire multiply is high enough the FF needs to pit one more time.

 

[KosmoKazi]

Been a good few weeks, at DTG, DTS, and now Race C at Lago Maggiore. I always loved that track in either direction, on the full layout, anyway, and I learned to love Gr2 cars after struggling with them earlier in my GT Sport career.

But even as PD and the game giveth, the racing gods taketh. I earned my way back into A+ rating, mid-week during the DTS races, having gone about 199/200 through the CoD and placing in the top 5 almost every race (even got a win... my first in a top split, I think). But just as before, as soon as I earned it, a run of incredibly bad luck on and off the track tripped me back under the A/A+ line:

1) Got careened off by a tank-slapper on lap 1, race ruined (a guy who races as clean as anyone, just pushed himself off course in T1 and then collected me, even as I tried to give space)
2) My TV, which hadn't done so in a year, randomly turned off again during a race, and because of the HDMI link, also turned the PS5 off... race destroyed.
3) As we were heading to the grid, my power flickered off because it's windy here and the power company in Michigan is terribly inept at maintenance... race nuked.

And just like that... back to A and the buffer points taken from my account as I dropped below the line.

The thing is, in NA, the top split is so often such a wide range, that the risk/reward ratio for racing is tipped against you: a podium may be worth about 300-400 DR points while any punting or disconnect or disaster such as the above means you lose over a 1000. So it's so hard to punch through the bubble at the A/A+ line. Once I get to 54/55k I think I'll be comfortable and solidly stay in that group.

When I race in a grid full of A+ drivers, I've been top 5 and many times top 3... but these things keep happening and it's 3 steps forward and then two back. Then two more back. I'll have to keep grinding, but I think once I get to about 53-54k DR I'm going to go back to only using the main account for the Series races and just play on the alternate like I did on GTS. I don't really like that, but it's just too frustrating to keep having this kind of luck. I want to run in the higher DR races for the Series/Cup races and get the higher points, as well as compete against this drivers more often. I've been happy to hold my own in the Dailies against a lot of them, but I want to be there in the other races, too.

Not all bad, though, I did collect another win today in Race C, but only thanks to a really fast driver ill-advisedly trying a H/M/M two-stopper and gifting me the track position, which I converted to a win. It's so much better to run in clean air at LM in Gr2 cars...

 

[GrumpyOldMan]

I just did a bunch of Q runs, and a couple of times after I saved my best lap, then loaded it as a ghost, the ghost wouldn't show up. I had to exit Q and come back in, then the ghost would appear.

(On the off chance that it's more complicated, here's what I actually did: I exited Q and went to Showcase, and viewed the fastest lap replay. When I saw it was good, I went back into Q, loaded it as a ghost, and it worked fine.)

I'm constantly amazed and disappointed at how many of these kinds of bugs PD introduces so often. I'm a retired developer, and I'm guessing their coders are not following best practices, when it comes to writing code. I'd be surprised if they're even using automated testing procedures. But if they are, someone needs to test the test scripts better.

On the positive side, I discovered that there's definitely an advantage to being seeded P13 - you can only lose 2 or 3 of places max!

What time ya running Grumpy? I just jumped in over lunch with 4 cars, there's more time in each but this is where I am............

McLaren: 1.41.6 (bailed early as speed just isn't there)
Lancer: 1.41.3 \ Optimal 40.8. Felt good, definite alternative at this track
Beetle: 1.41.1 \ Optimal 40.8. Felt excellent, really suited to this track. Probably a touch more speed in it than the Lancer
RSR: 1.40.6 \ Bailed early as I ran out of time but man, nothing comes close

1:41.012 in the 911, which I'm starting to like more and more. I tried the RSR once, but maybe I'll try it again.

As stated above I have never raced at Catalunya but feel a 40.3 or so would be competitive in middle DR-A rooms as a qualy time?

40.3 would have put you P10 in my last race. I'm a DR-A at about 20% (at the time of my last race). Hate to bear that bad news.

This is a very, very technical track, it required a lot of patience and as soon as you push too hard you lose time. You never really wring the car's neck here, you need to be very precise.

Very true.

I'd love to ghost my best lap from one car over another. Like say I set a 41.2 in the beetle then use that ghost as I run the RSR to see where the time is.

You can do that, absolutely. When you save your best lap times, you can choose a ghost from any of them.

And just like that... back to A and the buffer points taken from my account as I dropped below the line.

Just goes to show that the same holds true for every level. You try hard to get to the next level, then you can lose it due to almost no fault of your own. Whether you're a C who just got to B, or B who just got to A (me). I know it's harder going from A to A+, well, to stay there anyway, because the competition is much harder and the margin for error gets smaller and smaller.

A lesson for all of us. Be happy where you are. It only gets harder as you move up the DR ladder!

 

[Nebuc72]

1:41.012 in the 911, which I'm starting to like more and more. I tried the RSR once, but maybe I'll try it again.

I believe it got a BoP buff, so it should be a tad more competitive now than it used to be.

 

[NevilleNobody]

Gee our DR has converged, I have lost 70% of my A bar, I was within a half pixel of A+ but Seaside killed me and I am well below half a bar now.

 

[newmedia_dev]

I just did a bunch of Q runs, and a couple of times after I saved my best lap, then loaded it as a ghost, the ghost wouldn't show up. I had to exit Q and come back in, then the ghost would appear.

(On the off chance that it's more complicated, here's what I actually did: I exited Q and went to Showcase, and viewed the fastest lap replay. When I saw it was good, I went back into Q, loaded it as a ghost, and it worked fine.)

I'm constantly amazed and disappointed at how many of these kinds of bugs PD introduces so often. I'm a retired developer, and I'm guessing their coders are not following best practices, when it comes to writing code. I'd be surprised if they're even using automated testing procedures. But if they are, someone needs to test the test scripts better.

On the positive side, I discovered that there's definitely an advantage to being seeded P13 - you can only lose 2 or 3 of places max!

1:41.012 in the 911, which I'm starting to like more and more. I tried the RSR once, but maybe I'll try it again.

40.3 would have put you P10 in my last race. I'm a DR-A at about 20% (at the time of my last race). Hate to bear that bad news.

Very true.

You can do that, absolutely. When you save your best lap times, you can choose a ghost from any of them.

Just goes to show that the same holds true for every level. You try hard to get to the next level, then you can lose it due to almost no fault of your own. Whether you're a C who just got to B, or B who just got to A (me). I know it's harder going from A to A+, well, to stay there anyway, because the competition is much harder and the margin for error gets smaller and smaller.

A lesson for all of us. Be happy where you are. It only gets harder as you move up the DR ladder!

As a previous developer you'd get that stability on a AAA game that's just launched what is arguably the most important update (VR properly) in their careers that loading of replays or other nuance is somewhat low down the list of things that need fixing.

As a previous developer you'd know rolling out globally a server intensive multi platform (PS4/PS5 game) across multiple territories and data centres would be nerve racking whilst implementing the best AI racing we've ever seen test bed.....

Sure the the replay bugs are annoying but you prioritise a backlog on the things infront of you....not the 300k players who actively do the part of the game they down play and engineered behind an effort wall...

 

[RacingGrandpa]

I believe it got a BoP buff, so it should be a tad more competitive now than it used to be.

It didn't

 

[Leon Kowalski]

I tried some Q laps at Barcelona with MR cars, the Huracan and the Audi R8. Surprisingly I was faster with the latter, but still far from anything competitive (1:40:5). Both were fun to drive, but... difficult. Apart from always struggling at Barcelona anyways, how do you guys get these cars around the slower corners without frequently spinning or at least overrotating unexpectedly? Always a bit of throttle?

 

[Nebuc72]

It didn't

You sure?



Yeah nevermind I'm an idiot. I read RSR as R.S.01.
Oopsy. It turns out I infact, was the unsure one.

 

[Chris30]

Cool, first time I've raced on a dirt track in sport mode, been playing it for a full year now so I'm accustomed to how the rules/regulations are. Now it is more risky hitting the wall cause the paved roads offer more stability to the car, dirt roads don't. It's mainly sliding here.

 

[KosmoKazi]

For sure, @GrumpyOldMan the war zone at the B/A cut line was also very similar to the one at A/A+. It’s natural the way the system is designed that drivers are clustered there for a number of reasons. I remember well l, feeling the same frustration as I tried to get to A from the B range. And never thought I’d get to A at one point. So it is good perspective in that regard as well… that if you put in the effort and learn along the way, you can get better and more competitive. Some faster and easier than others, but I think it’s a really good system overall, for motivating people to try to improve.

 

[D Quick]

So even with something as hard-wired in our brains as riding a bike is, our brains can make those kinds of changes. So it'll happen for you with the pedal too, I'm sure.

I hope you're right. It's mostly the light touch braking I get wrong. I feel like I'm either slamming it or doing nothing.

Backing off and trail braking isn't to bad but getting it started is jarring.

 

[CmdrParabolus]

Had a tough go of it today. Had some weird spins in Race B at the hairpin, wasn't even on throttle. In hindsight I turned the wheel too much, but it cost me many races lol. So I switched over to race C, and that didn't fair too well. Got one top 6 race but that course is too fast to reliably count on other drivers to maintain lines / speed. Switched back to Race B and took a race or two to get used to mediums again lol.

My SR must have gotten affected cuz it put me with trash drivers who punted me off the pole on first turn. Finished with a clean race though so hopefully gets me away from those Hulligans!

Lost about 20% DR, which is a bummer but could be worse! Will try again later tonight or tomorrow

 

[GrumpyOldMan]

As a previous developer you'd get that stability on a AAA game that's just launched what is arguably the most important update (VR properly) in their careers that loading of replays or other nuance is somewhat low down the list of things that need fixing.

I'm not talking about fixing broken things - I'm talking about making sure you don't break something that already works.

That's why you have automated testing and good test scripts. They do the work for you, and find bugs without you really having to expend any extra effort (other than writing the test scripts, which isn't a small task, but that's why you have a testing team). It's the entire point of unit testing, integration testing, etc. It allows the developers to focus on implementing all the new cool stuff without worrying about breaking existing functionality.

But let's table this discussion because this thread isn't the place for it.

 

[Andy M]

Race C, oh my goodness. I don't have much experience with GR2 Cars, so that is fun. The track is just long enough and varied in skills needed to be a good challenge for me this week. WTF I can't see in the twilight IRL, now I have to drive by braille in the sim world. haha.

 

[Stilva]

So, Racing against GT Sophy does feel like driving actual humans on the track. Complete with crazy lunges from the Purple AI car. I've only done the first two tracks so far and beaten 3 of 4 levels. No chance I beat the AI in the 1v1 mode. You would need to run a perfect race and my skills are not up to par to pull that off.

I also ran a few laps at the new Grand Valley track and I had a tough time with it. It might be due to the fact I haven't raced at Grand Valley since who knows when and I'm a bit rusty. It's a tight track and I foresee maximum carnage come the eventual first daily race there and the GTWS event tomorrow.

 

[GrumpyOldMan]

If you wanna see how small the differences can be between a leaderboard driver, and me, check this out. Even going frame-by-frame, the differences are really subtle. Well, I guess they're subtle, I'm not really sure. And I'd appreciate your help. I feel like there's a fundamental principle hiding here that would really make a difference if I could understand it.

I put together a video showing one of the leaders side-by-side with me in the first couple of turns at Catalunya. I show it normal speed, then 1/2 speed, then 1/4 speed.

Going into the second turn, we're only 1 or 2 mph difference. He manages to get 10 mph ahead of me after the second turn. In the 1/2 speed and 1/4 speed clips, I freeze-frame going into the second turn so you can see what I mean.

I know I don't take the first corner exactly like he does, but I'm pretty close. And I have assists turned on, and he doesn't. The difference may well be the assists, but I have a feeling there's more to it.

Anyway, if you have the patience, let me know what you think.

 

[Andy M]

If you wanna see how small the differences can be between a leaderboard driver, and me, check this out. Even going frame-by-frame, the differences are really subtle. Well, I guess they're subtle, I'm not really sure. And I'd appreciate your help. I feel like there's a fundamental principle hiding here that would really make a difference if I could understand it.

I put together a video showing one of the leaders side-by-side with me in the first couple of turns at Catalunya. I show it normal speed, then 1/2 speed, then 1/4 speed.

Going into the second turn, we're only 1 or 2 mph difference. He manages to get 10 mph ahead of me after the second turn. In the 1/2 speed and 1/4 speed clips, I freeze-frame going into the second turn so you can see what I mean.

I know I don't take the first corner exactly like he does, but I'm pretty close. And I have assists turned on, and he doesn't. The difference may well be the assists, but I have a feeling there's more to it.

Anyway, if you have the patience, let me know what you think.

Wow, impressive work with the side by side video at different playback speeds. I'm sure you noticed entering the turn the leader's speed is less than yours. Last week at DT Seaside I "discovered" that if I entered the eses in sector 2 at a lower speed I would be able to close the distance to the cars in front of me (faster on the exit and carrying speed into the straight). I don't know if this is the fundamental principal you are looking for...

 

[KosmoKazi]

So, Racing against GT Sophy does feel like driving actual humans on the track. Complete with crazy lunges from the Purple AI car. I've only done the first two tracks so far and beaten 3 of 4 levels. No chance I beat the AI in the 1v1 mode. You would need to run a perfect race and my skills are not up to par to pull that off.

I also ran a few laps at the new Grand Valley track and I had a tough time with it. It might be due to the fact I haven't raced at Grand Valley since who knows when and I'm a bit rusty. It's a tight track and I foresee maximum carnage come the eventual first daily race there and the GTWS event tomorrow.

It is interesting to race the AI. I purposely put the AI drivers in positions to see how they responded, and there is a much more human-like behavior. They will risk contact to make a pass, for one thing.

I only did a few races, I'm saving the lot of them for practicing in VR! Really intrigued to see how that goes, after mine is delivered today. I'm glad they offered these new types of races at the same time as the VR2 launch, to give us another playground to use to adapt and enjoy them with.

Wow, impressive work with the side by side video at different playback speeds. I'm sure you noticed entering the turn the leader's speed is less than yours. Last week at DT Seaside I "discovered" that if I entered the eses in sector 2 at a lower speed I would be able to close the distance to the cars in front of me (faster on the exit and carrying speed into the straight). I don't know if this is the fundamental principal you are looking for...

Absolutely, the game really prioritizes 'slow-in/fast-out' and especially where the cars are on the traction limit through longer apexes. T1 at Barcelona is a great example, because if you nail the first turn, you also have all of the long right-hander after to parlay into another chunk. A good vs bad turn-in at T1 seems to be about 0.3-0.4 difference for me, by the time I finish T3.

 

[aguia]

The reason I wanted daily rally races had to do with this... I do the 5 laps in 7.35mt ( 7.33 my best) and second place (A, A+) finishes 15, 20 seconds later, or more,,, for me was the best Big Update ))

 

[hboandslow]

If you wanna see how small the differences can be between a leaderboard driver, and me, check this out. Even going frame-by-frame, the differences are really subtle. Well, I guess they're subtle, I'm not really sure. And I'd appreciate your help. I feel like there's a fundamental principle hiding here that would really make a difference if I could understand it.

I put together a video showing one of the leaders side-by-side with me in the first couple of turns at Catalunya. I show it normal speed, then 1/2 speed, then 1/4 speed.

Going into the second turn, we're only 1 or 2 mph difference. He manages to get 10 mph ahead of me after the second turn. In the 1/2 speed and 1/4 speed clips, I freeze-frame going into the second turn so you can see what I mean.

I know I don't take the first corner exactly like he does, but I'm pretty close. And I have assists turned on, and he doesn't. The difference may well be the assists, but I have a feeling there's more to it.

Anyway, if you have the patience, let me know what you think.

I might be wrong (and certainly no expert) but maybe look at the throttle input, looks a bit like they are smoothly/consistently on the throttle earlier? as well as entering slower. I am a noob though!

 

[TechnoIsLove]

Did some qualy laps to see if I notice any changes since the update but GT-R seems same as before, so no idea.. 🤣

On the hand, it's a week early, but thanks PD 😂🎉

 

[Leon Kowalski]

Anyway, if you have the patience, let me know what you think.

Great video, very instructional. The leader brakes a bit harder, so at one point he is almost ten mph slower than you. But by that time he has already straightened out for the next acceleration and hits the throttle, while you are coasting for a moment. On the apex of the second turn (left hander), your speeds are the same, but he is already in full acceleration for a second the moment you are able to hit it.

Man, i wish I could implement that insight into my actual driving... 😆

 

[GrumpyOldMan]

Wow, impressive work with the side by side video at different playback speeds. I'm sure you noticed entering the turn the leader's speed is less than yours. Last week at DT Seaside I "discovered" that if I entered the eses in sector 2 at a lower speed I would be able to close the distance to the cars in front of me (faster on the exit and carrying speed into the straight). I don't know if this is the fundamental principal you are looking for...

Thanks for the compliment! I love video editing.

I'll take a look at my speed - I know exactly what you're talking about. It's this mind-boggling concept that sometimes slower is faster.

I might be wrong (and certainly no expert) but maybe look at the throttle input, looks a bit like they are smoothly/consistently on the throttle earlier? as well as entering slower. I am a noob though!

I'll look at that, thanks! And I don't care if you're a noob or an expert - it's always nice when people help. We can all learn together.

Great video, very instructional. The leader brakes a bit harder, so at one point he is almost ten mph slower than you. But by that time he has already straightened out for the next acceleration and hits the throttle, while you are coasting for a moment. On the apex of the second turn (left hander), your speeds are the same, but he is already in full acceleration for a second the moment you are able to hit it.

It really is eye-opening, isn't it? Such small differences for such big gains. And thanks for that observation - it may well be the key. I'll check it out.

 

[NevilleNobody]

If you wanna see how small the differences can be between a leaderboard driver, and me, check this out. Even going frame-by-frame, the differences are really subtle. Well, I guess they're subtle, I'm not really sure. And I'd appreciate your help. I feel like there's a fundamental principle hiding here that would really make a difference if I could understand it.

I put together a video showing one of the leaders side-by-side with me in the first couple of turns at Catalunya. I show it normal speed, then 1/2 speed, then 1/4 speed.

Going into the second turn, we're only 1 or 2 mph difference. He manages to get 10 mph ahead of me after the second turn. In the 1/2 speed and 1/4 speed clips, I freeze-frame going into the second turn so you can see what I mean.

I know I don't take the first corner exactly like he does, but I'm pretty close. And I have assists turned on, and he doesn't. The difference may well be the assists, but I have a feeling there's more to it.

Anyway, if you have the patience, let me know what you think.

Mate you know what I am going to say. TC is absolutely KILLING your exits. YOu're apexing at similar speeds, on the throttle at similar times on exit but TC is killing your power. There's no need to run TC with the 911, the back end sticks hard. Take this opportunity to go without it. I understand the need with cars that are not planted but the RSR is properly planted.

Look at the throttle indicator, his is smooth on exit, yours is flickering because power is cutting in and out.

ANyways, last night was the most abysmal level of driver behavior I have seen in years. I am no longer in top splits due to my DR and it's a COMPLETE fiasco out there. Really disappointed in the pushing, shoving and blatant nerfing off. It was terrible, I am out for this week, will do some lobbies or finish some track experiences. My pace in the Beetle is pretty good, qualifying top 5 and able to runt here, but just utter rubbish.

 

[GrumpyOldMan]

Mate you know what I am going to say. TC is absolutely KILLING your exits. YOu're apexing at similar speeds, on the throttle at similar times on exit but TC is killing your power. There's no need to run TC with the 911, the back end sticks hard. Take this opportunity to go without it. I understand the need with cars that are not planted but the RSR is properly planted.

Look at the throttle indicator, his is smooth on exit, yours is flickering because power is cutting in and out.

Thanks - I'll give it a shot.

 

[Leon Kowalski]

Mate you know what I am going to say. TC is absolutely KILLING your exits.

Well observed. That might be the reason for the impression of "waiting" for the moment of acceleration.

 

[GrumpyOldMan]

Mate you know what I am going to say. TC is absolutely KILLING your exits. YOu're apexing at similar speeds, on the throttle at similar times on exit but TC is killing your power. There's no need to run TC with the 911, the back end sticks hard. Take this opportunity to go without it. I understand the need with cars that are not planted but the RSR is properly planted.

Look at the throttle indicator, his is smooth on exit, yours is flickering because power is cutting in and out.

Well observed. That might be the reason for the impression of "waiting" for the moment of acceleration.

So I just tried turning TCS and the other assists off, and ran through those corners once before quitting to come write this. Yep, that's the difference all right. It was pretty clear.

Of course, learning how to drive this way will be a chore, but at least now I have a track where I can see the results.

Question: What about ASM and CA? I turned them off too. Should I be trying to learn to drive without any of them? I'm assuming yes.

 

[zjn]

If you wanna see how small the differences can be between a leaderboard driver, and me, check this out. Even going frame-by-frame, the differences are really subtle. Well, I guess they're subtle, I'm not really sure. And I'd appreciate your help. I feel like there's a fundamental principle hiding here that would really make a difference if I could understand it.

I put together a video showing one of the leaders side-by-side with me in the first couple of turns at Catalunya. I show it normal speed, then 1/2 speed, then 1/4 speed.

Going into the second turn, we're only 1 or 2 mph difference. He manages to get 10 mph ahead of me after the second turn. In the 1/2 speed and 1/4 speed clips, I freeze-frame going into the second turn so you can see what I mean.

I know I don't take the first corner exactly like he does, but I'm pretty close. And I have assists turned on, and he doesn't. The difference may well be the assists, but I have a feeling there's more to it.

Anyway, if you have the patience, let me know what you think.

Great comparison!

I'm not good enough to have proofs of what I'm saying, but I think two factors are killing your exit speed compared to the other guy: one is TC as already mentioned, the other is the angle you are having. It's quite visible in the stop motion at 1:10
I think the combination of less straight car + TC causes it.

About TC: I have mixed feelings about it. I do agree that it cuts power, but I still have the habit during race not to control properly the trottle due to excitement of the moment (maybe I'm in a fight, maybe I'm trying to close a gap). For this reason I only go TC0 in races when I'm quite confortable that the car can handle my revisable style