GT7 is just GT Sport+ (Trailer Breakdown)

[MaxAttack]

Fully convinced this is a wind up now, well played @pwningstone

I engaged with the man for half an hour this morning, went about my day, ate a meal, did a half hour hot lapping, had conversations with three separate friends and sorted out a few things around the house. He's still going.

Bad troll job is bad, but at least I'm not the one who took over four hours out of my day for this.

 

[pwningstone]

Yep, I'm burning time. I crashed after work and now I can't sleep. Off the rest of the weekend so I don't care much.

 

[DriveSpark]

Just because you don't see how the systems works doesn't mean the system isn't there.

Just because you think you know how something works, doesn't mean to say you are correct. Especially when you sprinkle completely made up statements as "facts".

Either you're too naive to accept that you might just be wrong on a some things or you're trolling.

 

[pwningstone]

Just because you think you know how something works, doesn't mean to say you are correct. Especially when you sprinkle completely made up statements as "facts".

Either you're too naive to accept that you might just be wrong on a some things or you're trolling.

I'm trolling you, thought it was painfully obvious in that post.

 

[Famine]

As you can see from the capture of the GT7 menu that "GT Sport Live" is included. As you may know, this includes videos from the tournament event series. This means that GT7 will participate in the GT Sport tournament series because it wouldn't be included in a game that didn't have it.

I'm not sure how you got from "videos" to "GT7 will participate in the GT Sport tournament" - the "because" in your second sentence is doing a lot of heavy lifting and brushing over a lot of information that really isn't there.

GT Sport was called GT Sport because it had (and was originally centred on) esports. The Gran Turismo branding for esports is "Sport Mode", and "GT Sport" is shorthand for "Gran Turismo esports".

It makes sense to continue that branding from Gran Turismo Sport to Gran Turismo 7, so it makes sense that "GT Sport" would be a subsection of GT7 (especially given the "past, present, and future" comments; GT4 is the past, GT Sport was the present). While it also makes some sense to assume that the format will be quite similar, it doesn't make sense to assume that people playing PS4 Gran Turismo Sport (or even taking advantage of PS5's BC and playing PS4 Gran Turismo Sport on PS5) will be able to participate in PS5 Gran Turismo 7's GT-branded esports mode.


That said, we haven't seen GT Sport Mode in the game. We've only seen "GT Sport Live", which is the bit of the GT site where live event videos (including streams), results and race reports live. All that this implies is that there's a section of GT7 where you can watch or read about live events held in the GT-branded esports tournaments. There's certainly nothing you can infer about actually taking part in them, much less what game or console you'd be using.

 

[Normalaatsra]

GT Sport is GT7 Prologue.
Nuff said.

 

[matrix_gt1]

I'm not sure how you got from "videos" to "GT7 will participate in the GT Sport tournament" - the "because" in your second sentence is doing a lot of heavy lifting and brushing over a lot of information that really isn't there.

GT Sport was called GT Sport because it had (and was originally centred on) esports. The Gran Turismo branding for esports is "Sport Mode", and "GT Sport" is shorthand for "Gran Turismo esports".

It makes sense to continue that branding from Gran Turismo Sport to Gran Turismo 7, so it makes sense that "GT Sport" would be a subsection of GT7 (especially given the "past, present, and future" comments; GT4 is the past, GT Sport was the present). While it also makes some sense to assume that the format will be quite similar, it doesn't make sense to assume that people playing PS4 Gran Turismo Sport (or even taking advantage of PS5's BC and playing PS4 Gran Turismo Sport on PS5) will be able to participate in PS5 Gran Turismo 7's GT-branded esports mode.


That said, we haven't seen GT Sport Mode in the game. We've only seen "GT Sport Live", which is the bit of the GT site where live event videos (including streams), results and race reports live. All that this implies is that there's a section of GT7 where you can watch or read about live events held in the GT-branded esports tournaments. There's certainly nothing you can infer about actually taking part in them, much less what game or console you'd be using.

You said it better then me Famine. Respect!

 

[MaxAttack]

I'm not sure how you got from "videos" to "GT7 will participate in the GT Sport tournament" - the "because" in your second sentence is doing a lot of heavy lifting and brushing over a lot of information that really isn't there.

GT Sport was called GT Sport because it had (and was originally centred on) esports. The Gran Turismo branding for esports is "Sport Mode", and "GT Sport" is shorthand for "Gran Turismo esports".

It makes sense to continue that branding from Gran Turismo Sport to Gran Turismo 7, so it makes sense that "GT Sport" would be a subsection of GT7 (especially given the "past, present, and future" comments; GT4 is the past, GT Sport was the present). While it also makes some sense to assume that the format will be quite similar, it doesn't make sense to assume that people playing PS4 Gran Turismo Sport (or even taking advantage of PS5's BC and playing PS4 Gran Turismo Sport on PS5) will be able to participate in PS5 Gran Turismo 7's GT-branded esports mode.


That said, we haven't seen GT Sport Mode in the game. We've only seen "GT Sport Live", which is the bit of the GT site where live event videos (including streams), results and race reports live. All that this implies is that there's a section of GT7 where you can watch or read about live events held in the GT-branded esports tournaments. There's certainly nothing you can infer about actually taking part in them, much less what game or console you'd be using.

Can we lock it now before the circle perpetuates?

There isn't really any information in here that couldn't have been posted in the GT7 Reveal thread.

 

[pwningstone]

I'm not sure how you got from "videos" to "GT7 will participate in the GT Sport tournament" - the "because" in your second sentence is doing a lot of heavy lifting and brushing over a lot of information that really isn't there.

GT Sport was called GT Sport because it had (and was originally centred on) esports. The Gran Turismo branding for esports is "Sport Mode", and "GT Sport" is shorthand for "Gran Turismo esports".

It makes sense to continue that branding from Gran Turismo Sport to Gran Turismo 7, so it makes sense that "GT Sport" would be a subsection of GT7 (especially given the "past, present, and future" comments; GT4 is the past, GT Sport was the present). While it also makes some sense to assume that the format will be quite similar, it doesn't make sense to assume that people playing PS4 Gran Turismo Sport (or even taking advantage of PS5's BC and playing PS4 Gran Turismo Sport on PS5) will be able to participate in PS5 Gran Turismo 7's GT-branded esports mode.


That said, we haven't seen GT Sport Mode in the game. We've only seen "GT Sport Live", which is the bit of the GT site where live event videos (including streams), results and race reports live. All that this implies is that there's a section of GT7 where you can watch or read about live events held in the GT-branded esports tournaments. There's certainly nothing you can infer about actually taking part in them, much less what game or console you'd be using.

I don’t think PD is going to have separate world tournaments and I don’t think they are going to axe PS4 users from the tournament any time soon.

If PD releases GT7 in the next year people will be pissed if they only allow PS5 players a chance to compete.

This could very well be a reason that PD will wait for the release after people have had enough time to upgrade.

I just don’t think PD wants to cut their user base down to nothing when their World Tournament is becoming so popular.

 

[matrix_gt1]

I don’t think PD is going to have separate world tournaments and I don’t think they are going to axe PS4 users from the tournament any time soon.

If PD releases GT7 in the next year people will be pissed if they only allow PS5 players a chance to compete.

This could very well be a reason that PD will wait for the release after people have had enough time to upgrade.

I just don’t think PD wants to cut their user base down to nothing when their World Tournament is becoming so popular.

It’s a GT game. It’s gonna sell fine and build its base pretty quickly.

 

[pwningstone]

It’s a GT game. It’s gonna sell fine and build its base pretty quickly.

Yeah, you clearly don’t know the history of GT sales or their timeline within console iterations.

 

[Azerach]

They'll have the 2020 season on GTS and have GT7 as an exhibition event at the world tour finals towards the end of 2020/early 2021. GT7 will be used for 2021 season.

Gosh that was simple. They don't need to faff about with legacy physics.

 

[pwningstone]

They'll have the 2020 season on GTS and have GT7 as an exhibition event at the world tour finals towards the end of 2020/early 2021. GT7 will be used for 2021 season.

Gosh that was simple. They don't need to faff about with legacy physics.

Well, from what we can see from the trailer it already has Legacy physics.

 

[Famine]

I don’t think PD is going to have separate world tournaments and I don’t think they are going to axe PS4 users from the tournament any time soon.

Your thought process here seems to be that GT7 will have Sport Mode, PD won't want to drop the 8m+ userbase it has on PS4, so GTS and GT7 will run merged events (at least initially) courtesy of BC and Crossgen, and that means the two must play in an identical way or one console's users will have an unfair advantage.

That's fine - it makes sense, to a point - but it's not directly related to the existence of a GT Sport Live icon in the main navigation screen or anything else we've seen in the trailer. In addition, one thing I've learned over the last 20 years is that what PD does it not always entirely based on what makes sense (at least externally; we keep on buying the games though).


GT Sport's median active weekly userbase is around 140,000 players, and has never exceeded 275,000 players. Kazunori's presentation in Paris in 2019 said that 348,000 people raced in the FIA events across all of 2018 (and some of those were second (and third) accounts!). When you take into consideration the prospect that GT7 could ship 3m copies in week one (GT5 sold 5.5m in its first two weeks), there's more than enough people to pack out the Daily Race and FIA lobbies.

If we assume it's a launch (and if it is, bundle) title and that GT7 follows GTS's path and doesn't start the FIA competition in earnest until Spring, that's five months to build up a playerbase - by which time GT7 could have exceeded GTS's lifetime sales (it may not do so, but a "proper" GT game is more likely to see GT3/4/5/6 sales rates than GTS sales rates).

We should also take different kinds of sport mode races into account. It is absolutely possible that GT7 and GTS will run merged Daily Races with similar underlying physics - and we'll have threads just like wheel vs. controller on PS4 vs PS5, and the advantage each confers - but only run FIA events on the new game and console. There isn't any particular reason why this couldn't or wouldn't happen, though GT7 would need to recognise your DR/SR from GTS in order to do so. No point building up your esports rating in Sport Mode on one console to lose it on the other.

This is, of course, all conjecture. That's why I'm presenting it as such. The only plain fact we have about online multiplayer is that we've seen nothing of any online multiplayer in GT7 yet. In terms of actual driving, all we've seen is an offline race at the rejigged Trial Mountain with (presumably numbnuts) AI opponents.

 

[matrix_gt1]

Yeah, you clearly don’t know the history of GT sales or their timeline within console iterations.

That’s.... a big assumption to make. Lol u have no idea how closely I’ve followed this series. U should find out when I became a member here. Also I can show u folders and folders of previews and screenshots of previous GT games. I know very well when these games came out in correlation with the consoles.

GTSport was the first true online GT title yet it still grew a huge fan base.. even though it was the biggest departure of previous games. No one had any confidence in it when it came out. It was so different and so... bare. And yet it grew quick and fast and enabled polyphony to host multiple world events. Yes it didn’t sell as well as previous titles but it still sold a crazy number.

GT7 is not gonna have as much trouble. It’s showing the audience who perhaps missed the style of gameplays before GTS that “don’t worry, we have all the stuff u miss.”

I’d be very very surprised if it doesn’t do as well as GTSport.

 

[pwningstone]

Your thought process here seems to be that GT7 will have Sport Mode, PD won't want to drop the 8m+ userbase it has on PS4, so GTS and GT7 will run merged events (at least initially) courtesy of BC and Crossgen, and that means the two must play in an identical way or one console's users will have an unfair advantage.

That's fine - it makes sense, to a point - but it's not directly related to the existence of a GT Sport Live icon in the main navigation screen or anything else we've seen in the trailer. In addition, one thing I've learned over the last 20 years is that what PD does it not always entirely based on what makes sense (at least externally; we keep on buying the games though).


GT Sport's median active weekly userbase is around 140,000 players, and has never exceeded 275,000 players. Kazunori's presentation in Paris in 2019 said that 348,000 people raced in the FIA events across all of 2018 (and some of those were second (and third) accounts!). When you take into consideration the prospect that GT7 could ship 3m copies in week one (GT5 sold 5.5m in its first two weeks), there's more than enough people to pack out the Daily Race and FIA lobbies.

If we assume it's a launch (and if it is, bundle) title and that GT7 follows GTS's path and doesn't start the FIA competition in earnest until Spring, that's five months to build up a playerbase - by which time GT7 could have exceeded GTS's lifetime sales (it may not do so, but a "proper" GT game is more likely to see GT3/4/5/6 sales rates than GTS sales rates).

We should also take different kinds of sport mode races into account. It is absolutely possible that GT7 and GTS will run merged Daily Races with similar underlying physics - and we'll have threads just like wheel vs. controller on PS4 vs PS5, and the advantage each confers - but only run FIA events on the new game and console. There isn't any particular reason why this couldn't or wouldn't happen.

This is, of course, all conjecture. That's why I'm presenting it as such. The only plain fact we have about online multiplayer is that we've seen nothing of any online multiplayer in GT7 yet. In terms of actual driving, all we've seen is an offline race at the rejigged Trial Mountain with (presumably numbnuts) AI opponents.

I think one of the biggest problems for GT Sport and the number of active online participants is that there is a huge drop in conversion between players that play career mode vs players that enjoy online events.

I think that fudge factor is going to be even more of a factor for a fully fledged “numbered” GT game.

3mill copies a week is ambitious, but not out of the realm of possibility. I think the number of active participants in online racing will take time if there is the hurdle of buying the console at release.

It is entirely conjecture, and it’s probably fair to say that even PD may have not quite figured out the transition timeline.

Given what was shown in-game, and what we have seen in GT Sport, I think it’s pretty safe to say that is going to be more of an evolution than revolution and I expect the physics to be nearly identical to GT Sport. All I can hope for is decent improvements over time.

I am still kind of bummed that we didn’t seen any evidence of an improved suspension or tire model. One can hope that we’ve only seen a prebaked version showing off the looks.

Whether it’s entirely accurate, my assumption based on what was shown is that GT7 will not have improved game engine physics utilizing the PS5s power. Just GT Sport + some GT4 and throw in some glittery120hz 4K. Not that it’s entirely a bad thing, but I think a lot of online racers really wanted to see an improvement in the physics department

 

[matrix_gt1]

I think one of the biggest problems for GT Sport and the number of active online participants is that there is a huge drop in conversion between players that play career mode vs players that enjoy online events.

I think that fudge factor is going to be even more of a factor for a fully fledged “numbered” GT game.

3mill copies a week is ambitious, but not out of the realm of possibility. I think the number of active participants in online racing will take time if there is the hurdle of buying the console at release.

It is entirely conjecture, and it’s probably fair to say that even PD may have not quite figured out the transition timeline.

Given what was shown in-game, and what we have seen in GT Sport, I think it’s pretty safe to say that is going to be more of an evolution than revolution and I expect the physics to be nearly identical to GT Sport. All I can hope for is decent improvements over time.

I am still kind of bummed that we didn’t seen any evidence of an improved suspension or tire model. One can hope that we’ve only seen a prebaked version showing off the looks.

Whether it’s entirely accurate, my assumption based on what was shown is that GT7 will not have improved game engine physics utilizing the PS5s power. Just GT Sport + some GT4 and throw in some glittery120hz 4K. Not that it’s entirely a bad thing, but I think a lot of use online racers really wanted to see an improvement in the physics department

There we go man. You stuck to your opinion while not dismissing others. Props to u man

 

[Theufcveteran]

Me reading the other 6 pages of this thread after waking up:

 

[Sage Ages]

what I think is

its just a guess

Wow, very strong evidence for these claims that you got there.

 

[MatskiMonk]

u

U

u

u

u

AUP doesn't like this.

 

[matrix_gt1]

AUP doesn't like this.

Yeah sorry, I was doing like five things at once. I’m glad thats what YOU took from my messages though

 

[Lee x sensai]

I remember first show case for GTsport look very bad and have the same UI from GT6 before release, they have a bunch car to release screenshot in game for the promo that never release in the game. You need to relax and let PD do their work, wait couple more 2-3 year down the line what they going show us. We can’t judge anything from the first trailer with bunch place holder in game. If you follow enough gran tursimo from very beginning. They did that a lot in every version of the game in beta or alpha. I don’t expect game ready launch when the PS5 release, I want them cook some more in the oven. You overreacting over the trailer with place holders that we don’t know much.

 

[matrix_gt1]

I remember first show case for GTsport look very bad and have the same UI from GT6 before release, they have a bunch car to release screenshot in game for the promo that never release in the game. You need to relax and let PD do their work, wait couple more 2-3 year down the line what they going show us. We can’t judge anything from the first trailer with bunch place holder in game. If you follow enough gran tursimo from very beginning. They did that a lot in every version of the game in beta or alpha. I don’t expect game ready launch when the PS5 release, I want them cook some more in the oven. You overreacting over the trailer with place holders that we don’t know much.

I remember this too

 

[Chubbymudkip]

I am a computer engineer with experience in robotics. This is the type of stuff that we simulate when designing robots. So yeah, I do.
I can extrapolate whatever I can get away with regardless of what anyone else thinks about the value of it.

If I had a nickel for every time I heard a CS kid talk like a mechanical engineer
I wouldn't worry about the salary gap!

 

[Keef]

I'm not sure why you're complaining about this. GTS is a wonderful game that ticks all the boxes of a competitive racing simulator, but lacks any career mode for when you actually want to achieve long-term RPG goals like classic GTs offered. So GT7 adds that in, while also preserving the FIA-partnered and high-quality online competition, and other community aspects we like. You get the best of both worlds. There's literally no downside to this at all.

Pretty much the only change I'd request from GTS is a community asset sorter that makes even the tiniest bit of sense.

 

[TurismoBad]

 

[Shingo_civic]

My fears have come true.
Evidently they wanted 4k 60fps at all costs so they simply took GTS as it was, raised the resolution and improved the reflections a bit ... From what I saw in the trailer i am very disappointed by the ingame technical aspect...

 

[Lee x sensai]

I remember this too

Yeah, I think people need start to read the info provided by PD before jumping to conclusions without fact.

 

[Streeto]

I haven't posted here or played a GT game in a long time and this thread recalls some of the reasons why...

People complaining about a game they've never played, or continue to play, or even one they never plan on playing at all. Classic GTP!

 

[SDSPOWER01]

Given that this is all pre-final version Alpha or what not it is still a work in progress. Sony have claimed that they wanted to show and make sure everything was captured through the Playstation 5 system when showing gameplay or ingame CGI.

Gran Turismo 7 PRE-FINAL version PS5:


Gran Turismo Sport Latest Version PS4 PRO:


I think what is most noticable here is that POP in seems to be less of thing now compared to GT SPORT, you can tell by when you look at rear view camera in the interior view. Obviously there are still some shadow pop-ins in the threes or fences but it is much less compared to what you have got in GT SPORT.
Darker areas also seem to be much better color balanced in which areas that are too dark is still visible to the human eyes, and overall the lighting seems to react much believable with textures of the interior.

All of this is noticable and the game is still in Pre-Final version.
Also the bump in graphics if people were expecting anything other to get blown out of the water is clearly asking for too much at this point.
In fact it only shows how good GT Sport visuals were being on the PS4/PS4 PRO.