GTP_Registry Discussion Thread (GT5)

[Stotty]

Bumper cam here.

Cockpit is far too restrictive IMO... people may say it's the most realistic way to play the game, but you get a much wider field of view in real life than you get in GT5... field of view is particularly important for on-line where you absolutely have to be aware of where other cars are around you at all times.

 

[Hun200kmh]

The most realistic view is the one provided by bumper cam. It is not realistic to see two wheels and two pairs of hands (your own and the game's recreation of them) and the game's hands don't even replicate your own moves.

I said this before and I say it again. The TV screen is my windshield, my wheel is THE car's wheel, and my hands are THE driver's hands. When I look to the TV screen I look OUTSIDE.

Everything in cockpit cam, at least the way it is implemented now (even in the most restricted FOV) is nothing but a graphical achievement. Nothing to do with reality.

 

[Dr_Watson]

The most realistic view is the one provided by bumper cam. It is not realistic to see two wheels and two pairs of hands (your own and the game's recreation of them) and the game's hands don't even replicate your own moves.

I said this before and I say it again. The TV screen is my windshield, my wheel is THE car's wheel, and my hands are THE driver's hands. When I look to the TV screen I look OUTSIDE.

Everything in cockpit cam, at least the way it is implemented now (even in the most restricted FOV) is nothing but a graphical achievement. Nothing to do with reality.

Been saying that exact same thing for years. 👍

cockpit cams however are cool in PC sims like GTR where I can have 3 screens, delete the wheel, move the camera up close to the dash, and the camera turns with the wheel to look into the corners.

 

[racingfreak01]

I said this before and I say it again. The TV screen is my windshield, my wheel is THE car's wheel, and my hands are THE driver's hands. When I look to the TV screen I look OUTSIDE

This is the truth

 

[Captain Roh]

You guys are crazy

lol. Seriously, forget for one second that you dont sit anywhere near the middle of the car for a start. Then go sit in your real car with you hands on the wheel and stare into the middle distance. In your periphery you can see your hands, your wheel, the dash, the roof, everything! Unless you press your nose to the windscreen then bumper cam looks nothing like real life.

Whats more is when you're playing computer games you ARE staring into the middle distance. The screen is much farther away than your windscreen and so when you're in the moment and not thinking of field of view you see pretty much the same as you do in real life. You get shadows, you get shakey head, and you get the enclosed feel of being in a car.

Bumper cam is terrible It allows you to see more of the track than you would EVER be able to in real life. The angle is completely different. The lighting is completely different. The sense of speed is completely different. And the FEELING you get, is completely different.


All that said, it doesnt take a genius to know that every single one of us is completely different too. So while I think you guys are crazy I guess more of you think the same about me.

But I still maintain that while the cockpit view may not be 100% realistic, it is still the closest thing to reality in GT5.


PS: Perhaps we should get back on topic some time soon too

 

[spyrrari]

You were damn quick on Tuesday night.

Spy has passed the control line in first place. Ad infinitum.

Yeah i love that line verrrry much...



spy.

 

[MrJim]

Please don't stone me for this, but I have always enjoyed chase cam the most. Why would I want to drive such beautiful works of art to not even see them?

Also I drive with my PS3 controller (sixaxis) 90% of the time and I like to be able to see when the car starts to slip since I have no force feedback to feel it with.

 

[NINE_HUNDRED]

Is chase cam the 3rd person view (I always called it that, when you see the whole car), I used to always drive in that view back in GT2/4 but then just got used to bumper cam.

 

[racingfreak01]

Please don't stone me for this, but I have always enjoyed chase cam the most. Why would I want to drive such beautiful works of art to not even see them?

Also I drive with my PS3 controller (sixaxis) 90% of the time and I like to be able to see when the car starts to slip since I have no force feedback to feel it with.

Controller definately justifies chase cam 👍

Do you use chase cam with wheel as well? I so you need an award and not stoning...cause thats definately an art

 

[GTP_CICO]

Yeah i love that line verrrry much...



spy.

Castrol Supra FTW

I guess I made some improvement with the wheel went from D2S (DS3) to D1S . I hoped for D2G top D1B, so didnt expect this to be honest. Congratz to everybody who entered:tup: thanks to the admins for checking the times so fast .

 

[Anghammarad]

But I still maintain that while the cockpit view may not be 100% realistic, it is still the closest thing to reality in GT5.

Apart from the fact that 90% of the cars have the steering wheel on the wrong side.

 

[racingfreak01]

Apart from the fact that 90% of the cars have the steering wheel on the wrong side.

I'm sure you meant to say the right side 👍

 

[MrJim]

Controller definately justifies chase cam 👍

Do you use chase cam with wheel as well? I so you need an award and not stoning...cause thats definately an art

When I use the wheel, I'd say my time is split pretty evenly about 60% chase cam, 40% cockpit (when available 👍). I guess it might be partially due to the fact that I grew up playing racing games that either had bumper or chase and that was it. As I said before I love to apreciate a car's appearance while I race, so I've never really cared for bumper cams. Really, GT5P and GT5 are the first games that I've ever played much in cockpit view. In other games that have it, it just doesn't feel right to me... something's missing but I can't quite put my finger on it.

Also as a related side note, I used the sixaxis on the qualifier (because it's what I use the most). Does that mean I should state sixaxis instead of DFP in my sig?

Edit: Sig changed

 

[Hun200kmh]

I'm sure you meant to say the right side 👍

That's exactly what he - rightly - said!

 

[Captain Roh]

I could be wrong, but doesnt the steering wheel go from left to right depending on what country you're racing in?

It could be specific to where the car was made too

 

[Anghammarad]

I could be wrong, but doesnt the steering wheel go from left to right depending on what country you're racing in?

It could be specific to where the car was made too

No it depends on the car PD used to model from. Since Japan drives on the left side of the road almost all cars are right hand drive. It doesn't change.

 

[Captain Roh]

No it depends on the car PD used to model from. Since Japan drives on the left side of the road almost all cars are right hand drive. It doesn't change.

Good job I was born and raised in the good old U K of E Right hand drive suits me fine! Aint that right my friends from a land down under!! 👍

 

[chromatic9]

You guys are crazy

lol. Seriously, forget for one second that you dont sit anywhere near the middle of the car for a start.

Bumper cam is in the middle of the car though. It's wrongly called bumper cam.

Cockpit cam has laggy steering animation and only rotates a little over 90 degrees left/right. I don't like the box within a box feel with most of the steering wheel shown as well as my steering wheel. Tripple screen on a PC where you can change the view properly works best.

 

[Captain Roh]

Bumper cam is in the middle of the car though. It's wrongly called bumper cam.

Cockpit cam has laggy steering animation and only rotates a little over 90 degrees left/right.

Sorry... I meant in real life.

'Bumper' cam has a central viewpoint. I was refering to the fact that in real life, you dont sit anywhere near the middle of your car. (unless you have a mclaren f1 )

Should of been more clear 👍

With regard to the steering animations I really dont notice. My attention is on the road, just like in real life too. Its the periphery sense thats improtant. You see movement and thats all you need

 

[Torquemada42]

Warning, noob question!

I'm unsure where to look to see when races are scheduled. Or perhaps they aren't scheduled yet! Can anyone enlighten me?

 

[Captain Roh]

Warning, noob question!

I'm unsure where to look to see when races are scheduled. Or perhaps they aren't scheduled yet! Can anyone enlighten me?

You're correct mate the events havent been scheduled yet. Once they are they receive a sticky in this WRS subforum 👍

 

[DTM]

You guys are crazy

lol. Seriously, forget for one second that you dont sit anywhere near the middle of the car for a start. Then go sit in your real car with you hands on the wheel and stare into the middle distance. In your periphery you can see your hands, your wheel, the dash, the roof, everything! Unless you press your nose to the windscreen then bumper cam looks nothing like real life.

Whats more is when you're playing computer games you ARE staring into the middle distance. The screen is much farther away than your windscreen and so when you're in the moment and not thinking of field of view you see pretty much the same as you do in real life. You get shadows, you get shakey head, and you get the enclosed feel of being in a car.

Bumper cam is terrible It allows you to see more of the track than you would EVER be able to in real life. The angle is completely different. The lighting is completely different. The sense of speed is completely different. And the FEELING you get, is completely different.


All that said, it doesnt take a genius to know that every single one of us is completely different too. So while I think you guys are crazy I guess more of you think the same about me.

But I still maintain that while the cockpit view may not be 100% realistic, it is still the closest thing to reality in GT5.


PS: Perhaps we should get back on topic some time soon too

Totally agree with that. Maybe is the cockpit view not 100% realistic but it comes very close. Big part of using cockpit view is the fun factor. I hate using bumper view, i never ever have Schumacher sitting on the bumper while racing

 

[chromatic9]

Sorry... I meant in real life.

'Bumper' cam has a central viewpoint. I was refering to the fact that in real life, you dont sit anywhere near the middle of your car. (unless you have a mclaren f1 )

Should of been more clear 👍

Thats just an illusion. GT5 doesn't simulate driving down the road in a right hand car and bumper cam so called Mclaren F1 central position.

With regard to the steering animations I really dont notice. My attention is on the road, just like in real life too. Its the periphery sense thats improtant. You see movement and thats all you need

Regarding peripheral vision. When driving in real life my view is on the road, at best I see a fraction of the steering wheel or top of the dashboard, perhaps a slight view unfocussed view of the bonnet (hood). Using cockpit means drawing a silhouette around the screen and needing to pull your chair closer. Bumper cam feel less inhibited and a little bit more like a full windscreen feel. There's no point modelling a bit dashboard or bonnet, it'd be difficult to get it looking good.

What is the point of having most of steering wheel and dashboard in view then. You'd have to be really close to the screen so that when you look down and see the steering wheel and speedo etc so that it reflects just like what would happen in real life when you look down. GT5 speedo is so fuzzy and jagged though, getting closer doesn't help.

I'd only like cockpit shown if I could look down to another screen and its there in a clear resolution. A big wrap around screen or some 9 screen tuned so that its rendering the surroundings and not just stretching an image on some massive screen set up.

Totally agree with that. Maybe is the cockpit view not 100% realistic but it comes very close. Big part of using cockpit view is the fun factor. I hate using bumper view, i never ever have Schumacher sitting on the bumper while racing

Just in case you believe that. Bumper Cam is behind the windshield and not the front bumper and is the same height as cockpit.

 

[MrJim]

lol one big difference is that bumper cam makes you go 3kph slower than cockpit (according to your image overlays anyways)

edit: i had it backwards

 

[Captain Roh]

Gahhh you sucked me in

To be honest I dont care that much.. Its just fun to debate. I just got finished writing whats down below and thought whatever man! We both prefer our respective viewpoints 👍

This isnt the place for camera discussion anyway

Thats just an illusion. GT5 doesn't simulate driving down the road in a right hand car and bumper cam so called Mclaren F1 central position.

Really? So if you were to hit the apex on a left OR right corner in 'bumper' cam, it wouldnt be the center of the car at the apex point? How about when you're overtaking? Because in cockpit view I know for sure, when I'm trying to pass somebody, I have less room from my POV if they are on the left of me than on the right of me.

Regarding peripheral vision. When driving in real life my view is on the road, at best I see a fraction of the steering wheel or top of the dashboard, perhaps a slight view unfocussed view of the bonnet.

Thats exactly what I said ..? Sit in your car and stare into the middle distance. You see ALL of those things in your periphery. Your focus is on the road.

What is the point of having most of steering wheel and dashboard in view then.

Just to be clear, I said before I use the 'Narrow' POV. Sometimes 'Narrower' depending on the car. I'm going for realism here incase you didnt get that. The pictures that you're referencing dont relate to me.

Just in case you believe that. Bumper Cam is behind the windshield and not the front bumper and is the same height as cockpit.

Just to go back a bit how do you know its not 'bumper' cam thats the illusion. The car underneath the view could be anywhere, its just coincedence that the HUD elements line up. If you sit still and change views the camera shifts.. You dont just get a cockpit pop into view around 'bumper' cam do you?

Ok double edit:

I got curious and decided to go and experiment. These were my findings and how i did it incase you want to replicate:

So I just picked a random track and found a control point. Autumn ring was my pick, and after starting I saw an apex with a white line and a sign reading Autumn Ring. I put it in 'bumper' cam first. My only point of reference was the guages on the screen, so I drove straight towards the sign directly over the white line at the farthest edge. I did the exact same thing in cockpit cam. Except I didnt use any interior reference points, I just drove a straight line passing the white line in the same place, imagining my face would hit the sign..

Ok so I dont explain it very well, but luckily there's a diagram.

I overlayed my findings like this:

When I took the photos I walked along the straight line I was driving to the sign and turned 180. I pointed my camera to where I imagined the farthest edge of the white line was and pressed the shutter.

The one closer in to the corner is 'bumper' cam. The one farthest out in cockpit.

Its as myself, Douqa and others suspected. For me its conclusive, but feel free to do your own tests.. I was just curious 👍

 

[DOUQA]

So going by that image above, bumper cam is actually offset to the drivers side? Surely not! I've been using bumper cam for years and felt I had the cars edges pretty much set(roughly as wide as the dials) and have never noticed it being off to one side.

I'm using a 5/8 brake setting for all but the final right hander in sector 2.

If you have time to fiddle with the brake bias you're going too slow.

👍

 

[DrTrouserPlank]

So going by that image above, bumper cam is actually offset to the drivers side? Surely not! I've been using bumper cam for years and felt I had the cars edges pretty much set(roughly as wide as the dials) and have never noticed it being off to one side.
👍

That's what that image would lead you to believe but it's not the case because when in cockpit view you are effectively still using that central seating position that you have when in bumper-cam. It's easy to notice 2 ways.

1) Swapping between bumper and cockpit view you will notice no change in the seating position. When you go from a supposedly right hand-drive cockpit view to bumper cam, the image should "snap" as the POV changes but it doesn't.

2) When in cockpit mode you'll notice that in a RHD car (for example) you are able to run the left hand tyres seemingly off the track as perspective would suggest without actually going off track. This is because you are actually sitting in the center but with a cockpit offset to make you think you're on the right hand side of the car.

The edges of the dials align almost perfectly with the width of the car, and I think that's why it's preferred as it allows the driver to be very accurate with his car positioning.

I've explained a lot of this pretty badly, but you get the point I hope.

 

[Faria0808]

Dan submitted using an DS3.

Here you see how awsome holl01 is !

He was with the DS in the qualifier, but he will use a G27 for the WRS

 

[DrTrouserPlank]

Here you see how awsome holl01 is !

He was with the DS in the qualifier, but he will use a G27 for the WRS

He used to win the WRS with the DS3 anyway.

 

[MrJim]

DS3 stands for Dual Shock 3 right? The same thing as SIXAXIS?