How in the Frank Bruno did Forza III do it?

[gtracedriver]

Umm, dunno about you but I'm pretty sure PD is doing the same exact thing with GT5. I'm positive that the cars look better in REPLAY mode than they do while racing. Most of the videos and trailers ar emade up of clips captured in replay mode or journey whatever photo mode.

GT is not like Flopza
http://img341.imageshack.us/img341/7514/gt5p.jpg

 

[SavageEvil]

Stop asking silly questions that you more than likely knew the answer to.

Not sure if i can justify responding to the likes of you, if that's all you had to say. sigh!

@Paladin, the 200 premium cars are all built in house and look incredibly more detailed that the cars in FM3. Also you can look around the cockpit while in race mode, I do this in GT5P.

 

[TokyoDrift]

Not sure if i can justify responding to the likes of you, if that's all you had to say. sigh!

@Paladin, the 200 premium cars are all built in house and look incredibly more detailed that the cars in FM3. Also you can look around the cockpit while in race mode, I do this in GT5P.

Yep, and all 400 cars in Forza 3 look better than the 800 'tard cars in GT5. I'd rather have all cars done to the same, slightly lower LOD than have 80% look poor in comparison to the remaining 20%.

 

[Spagetti69]

Without entering the debate of comparison between GT5/FM3 graphical quality (that isn't the point here!), I'd add to this that in FM3 you get all cars of like quality and with the same features, including cockpit view. In GT5, you apparently don't.

Yeah but in forza can you see the stitching in the seat belt. No so forza fails lol.

 

[Spagetti69]

Not sure if i can justify responding to the likes of you, if that's all you had to say. sigh!

@Paladin, the 200 premium cars are all built in house and look incredibly more detailed that the cars in FM3. Also you can look around the cockpit while in race mode, I do this in GT5P.

Uh so in forza you can look around the cockpit in race mode and the premium cars in GT can look around as well.

So what do you mean.

 

[alba]

Not inferior to the GT5 standard ones, in fact quite superior, Kaz should have outsource the 3d modelling and have Polyphony Digital making the finishing touches to the 3d models, that way you have great 3d instead of this bypolar thing.

By the way, the difference in the quality of the models between ingame and photomode doesnt cut the fact that theres more than 400 (485 now) gread 3d mdoels in Forza, just watch them in the photomode and menus, they can use them in the ingame portion because hardware limitations but the 3d models itself a great.
So outsourcing IS the way to go.

I was implying PREMIUM models

GT is not like Flopza
http://img341.imageshack.us/img341/7514/gt5p.jpg

Yes, that's actually my biggest gripe with Forza, the LOD disparity

 

[SavageEvil]

Uh so in forza you can look around the cockpit in race mode and the premium cars in GT can look around as well.

So what do you mean.

No you can't, you can look left and to the right about 170 degrees I think and then it swaps to exterior view, there is no rear compartment and no rear to look out of either. I own FM3 I've tested out the cockpit on numerous occasions it's better than not having one, but significantly below what was in GT5 Prologue. That is what I meant.

 

[JAGUAR1977]

Forza 3 has been a nice diversion while I wait for GT5 but it isn't even in the same league.

It's time to move the genre forward rather than packing games with as many mediocre cars and tracks as possible.

 

[McLaren]

It's time to move the genre forward rather than packing games with as many mediocre cars and tracks as possible.

That's a bit ironic considering a huge portion of GT's car list is going to be a bunch of those same "mediocre cars" in Forza.

 

[Perkel]

OK SOMEONE REALY NEED TO TELL YOU GUYS TRUTH:

All we know is GT5 is 6 years in production

And they moddeled 200 premium cars and upped res for 800 other.

TURN 10 in just TWO YEARS made 400+, 1 MILION POLY (twice as much as PREMIUM GT5 car) CARS WITH COCKPIT and NOW AFTER 3 YEARS it is closing with DLC to 500.

EVEN IF THIS IS FOR PHOTOMODE From those 1 MLN poly cars you can easly recreate 500k-200k poly cars in no time with interior etc.

THAT is futureprof menagment. Not wasting human resources to get last gen content in HD.

Polyphony Digital NEED to hire 200 more people or PD will be on second place in therm of content and quality when forza 4 will hit store shelfs.

Also when we reach point where new consoles will be out Forza team just imput those 1 Mln poly cars in game. And there you have it. Kaz will be again doing new models from scrath and forza team can from start give people 800-1000 cars with updated lightning engine etc .

Polyphony Need to increase human resources ASAP if they want to be industry leaders like they are now. Even superb 130-180 people can't match 400 mediacore people work.

It's math people, not skill. They aren't on PD level yet but with new iteration they WILL deliver better game in every way than PD.

 

[Famine]

TURN 10 in just TWO YEARS made 400+, 1 MILION POLY (twice as much as PREMIUM GT5 car) CARS WITH COCKPIT

If they're 1 million polygons each, they've used 850,000 of them on the undersides.

 

[Terronium-12]

Yeah but in forza can you see the stitching in the seat belt. No so forza fails lol.

Who gives a damn about seatbelt stitching?

The fact of the matter is GT5 doesn't have interior views on every single car. Forza does, whether you want to acknowledge it or not...on all 500+ cars available now.

But of course it's Gran Turismo so let's excuse every possible shortcoming, and only criticize other games, right?

 

[gtracedriver]

OK SOMEONE REALY NEED TO TELL YOU GUYS TRUTH:

All we know is GT5 is 6 years in production

And they moddeled 200 premium cars and upped res for 800 other.

TURN 10 in just TWO YEARS made 400+, 1 MILION POLY (twice as much as PREMIUM GT5 car) CARS WITH COCKPIT and NOW AFTER 3 YEARS it is closing with DLC to 500.

EVEN IF THIS IS FOR PHOTOMODE From those 1 MLN poly cars you can easly recreate 500k-200k poly cars in no time with interior etc.

THAT is futureprof menagment. Not wasting human resources to get last gen content in HD.

Polyphony Digital NEED to hire 200 more people or PD will be on second place in therm of content and quality when forza 4 will hit store shelfs.

Also when we reach point where new consoles will be out Forza team just imput those 1 Mln poly cars in game. And there you have it. Kaz will be again doing new models from scrath and forza team can from start give people 800-1000 cars with updated lightning engine etc .

Polyphony Need to increase human resources ASAP if they want to be industry leaders like they are now. Even superb 130-180 people can't match 400 mediacore people work.

It's math people, not skill. They aren't on PD level yet but with new iteration they WILL deliver better game in every way than PD.

Forza3 is their 2nd game which is little better than Forza2. It is 720P max 8 cars and looks good only in bullshots. Cockpit view is bad as well as interior models. Also look at the racing gloves it looks like socks rather than gloves, the driver hands are stuck on steering wheel rather than holding it

GT5 has 200 ultra realistic cars and standard models will be good. Let us wait and see

 

[bullie77]

Who gives a damn about seatbelt stitching?

The fact of the matter is GT5 doesn't have interior views on every single car. Forza does, whether you want to acknowledge it or not...on all 500+ cars available now.

But of course it's Gran Turismo so let's excuse every possible shortcoming, and only criticize other games, right?

I think he was being ironic...

 

[McLaren]

Forza3 is their 2nd game which is little better than Forza2. It is 720P max 8 cars and looks good only in bullshots. Cockpit view is bad, look at the racing gloves, the driver hands are stuck on steering wheel rather than holding.

GT5 has 200 ultra realistic cars and standard models will be good. Let us wait and see

Forza 3 is their 3rd game.
Bullshots is an opinion. I think the game looks fine.
Holding what? The gear lever/paddles when it comes time to shift?


Personally, imo, PD should have gone Eden's route. Not super-over-the-top detail, but just as much passion into the interior models as PD while still looking marginally better than some of Turn10's "dull-grey" interiors.

 

[gtracedriver]

The driver hands holding steering wheel compare that to GT5P, nfs shift, drit they all look so much better.

 

[JAGUAR1977]

Uh so in forza you can look around the cockpit in race mode and the premium cars in GT can look around as well.

So what do you mean.

Looking around the cockpit is a very minor benefit of the premium car modelling.

 

[mykem]

Who gives a damn about seatbelt stitching?

The fact of the matter is GT5 doesn't have interior views on every single car. Forza does, whether you want to acknowledge it or not...on all 500+ cars available now.

But of course it's Gran Turismo so let's excuse every possible shortcoming, and only criticize other games, right?

A few of the cars in Forza 3 have missing dashboard and most are poorly constructed. One example i've seen around is the recent model Super GT GT500 Nissan GTR:

Here's the actual cockpit:

And GT5 rendition:

I've never played Forza 3 but to me it seems that the cockpit are swiftly put together with very little attention to details. Not only does the view seem constricted but the LED display is missing.

 

[Nattefrost]

TURN 10 in just TWO YEARS made 400+, 1 MILION POLY (twice as much as PREMIUM GT5 car) CARS WITH COCKPIT and NOW AFTER 3 YEARS it is closing with DLC to 500.

Everyone can throw insane levels of polycounts at 3D models. That's completely irrelevant. You don't need any knowledge about 3D modelling and polycounts to see that GT5's premium cars look spectacularly better than Forza 3's cars. It's unsurprising those premium cars take a lot longer to create, even if the polycounts says otherwise.

 

[McLaren]

The driver hands holding steering wheel compare that to GT5P, nfs shift, drit they all look so much better.

That's just picking at straws then if you're going to use the driver's hands as an argument as to why GT is better.

 

[Snaeper]

Outsourcing.

Polyphony Digital are the only ones who work on GT5, never will they send something to put themselves at the will of another company.

 

[JAGUAR1977]

That's a bit ironic considering a huge portion of GT's car list is going to be a bunch of those same "mediocre cars" in Forza.

Mediocre as in being modelled to the same standards we've seen for the past decade.

PD's premium car modelling goes beyond making a car look realistic.

Do people want a true car simulation with all that involves or just thousands or car models that look and drive like the real thing?

 

[McLaren]

Mediocre as in being modelled to the same standards we've seen for the past decade.

Then, pick your choice of words better next time.

 

[SuperShouden]

A few of the cars in Forza 3 have missing dashboard and most are poorly constructed. One example i've seen around is the recent model Super GT GT500 Nissan GTR:

Here's the actual cockpit:

And GT5 rendition:

I've never played Forza 3 but to me it seems that the cockpit are swiftly put together with very little attention to details. Not only does the view seem constricted but the LED display is missing.

This. about 50% of the cars in Forza 3 are imported from Froza 2. Just like 50% of the cars in Forza 2 were imported from Forza 1. And I would assume that 50% of the cars in "Forza Preview" are imported as well.

There was a comparison to the cockpit views when FM3 and GT5P came out and the two games sometimes had COMPLETELY different cockpits. Which means someone was lying and my bets are on Turn10. All they did was take a photo of the dash. (and probably only one) and made a rough dash from that.

In short...Turn10 kinda cheated and PD...well, PD did this time. I mean 800 cars from previous GT games...yeah, that sounds like what Turn10 does.

(I just remembered that PD mentioned that GT5 is going to take up nearly an entire Blu-ray disc. That could also be the reason why we don't get 1000 premium cars.)

Also...the driver in FM3 must be Shaq with the seat all the way up with how high he is and how close to the steering wheel he is.

 

[The_Paladin]

Forza 3 is their 3rd game.
Bullshots is an opinion. I think the game looks fine.
Holding what? The gear lever/paddles when it comes time to shift?


Personally, imo, PD should have gone Eden's route. Not super-over-the-top detail, but just as much passion into the interior models as PD while still looking marginally better than some of Turn10's "dull-grey" interiors.

Eden is doing great but in Forza´s defense, they had to do lots of works in therm of 3D, 400 cockpits and hundreds of exterior 3d models (for the menus), all of that in less time than Eden, im quite sure they are going to make the cockpit and interior textures much better in Forza 4.

Btw, Forza´s 3d models are not 1 million polys at all, thats a huge miss information, they are about 250k-300k, there no car game around that uses more than 400k polys per car at this momment, 1 million could be the next gen max probably. GT5 sould be around 400k at max (remember is not about the number of polys, is about how you use them and how you use the textures, shaders and lighning, that where de GT5 premium models win).

Overall i prefer the Turn10 solution for the 3d models by far and i would be happy if Microsoft could give them atleast 2.5 or 3 years instead of just 2 to polish their game, i cant imagine what they could do with 5 o 6 years but probably would be much better than this.

 

[SavageEvil]

Forza 3 is their 3rd game.
Bullshots is an opinion. I think the game looks fine.
Holding what? The gear lever/paddles when it comes time to shift?


Personally, imo, PD should have gone Eden's route. Not super-over-the-top detail, but just as much passion into the interior models as PD while still looking marginally better than some of Turn10's "dull-grey" interiors.

I prefer PD to go their own damn route, let Eden do what they do and leave that to them. Premium cars are beyond anything FM3 has, they are reported to have interior damage, along with exterior deformation. Not that swap damage that FM does, but real time or so they say. FM3 does not have full interiors either, at least not until they release that FM3 with kinect support(why the hell?). You think GT5's interiors are marginally better than FM3's? Fire up GT5 Prologue and see that even at that stage GT5's interiors are a clear step above FM3, mind you at the time GT5 was released FM3 didn't have interior view to begin with. Rush, indeed it may have, better than standard GT5 cars of course, but the premium cars are another story completely.

 

[gtracedriver]

That's just picking at straws then if you're going to use the driver's hands as an argument as to why GT is better.

Do not know about you but that is the first I see in cockpit view. Forza3 is worst I have seen compared to games I have mentioned

Also you are way off the polycounts about Forza3. If you din't know the car models eg: the headlights actually changes when you are just about to race. The lightning model, shaders is also lacking compared to GT.

 

[The_Paladin]

A few of the cars in Forza 3 have missing dashboard and most are poorly constructed. One example i've seen around is the recent model Super GT GT500 Nissan GTR:

Here's the actual cockpit:

And GT5 rendition:

I've never played Forza 3 but to me it seems that the cockpit are swiftly put together with very little attention to details. Not only does the view seem constricted but the LED display is missing.

Actually thats good 3d modelled cockpit but has bad textures and in about 20 cars they are not working well with the dial, but thats Microsoft faults, not Turn10, they only give them 2 years per Forza so what they did with more than 400 cars (at the end of the year is going to be about 540) is awesome, especially if you compare it with the painfully slow GT5 production and this whole 800 GT4 cars fiasco.

 

[McLaren]

I prefer PD to go their own damn route, let Eden do what they do and leave that to them.

And look exactly where they got them. 200 cars in 5 years of development with a port-over of the rest. That was a smart move....

 

[The_Paladin]

Outsourcing.

Polyphony Digital are the only ones who work on GT5, never will they send something to put themselves at the will of another company.

You say this like is a good thing, clearly they dropped the ball in terms of numbers, they should have outsourced the 3d modelling and give the 3d models the final touches, 200+ models in 6 years is really bad.