Hybriding/save hacking arrives in GT6 - Public discussion

[TRC GeorgiaDawg]

Just stop with this hideous analogy already, please.

Or maybe people could take his analogy in context and quit trying to play word games to defend defenseless positions. Again, this is clear TOS violations we're talking about here. There is no room for debate and/or discussion. I hope the hacker guy in here is right about the fact that if they're reported they will be banned. I know I'll be reporting everyone I see doing it.

 

[Tornado]

Or maybe you could take his analogy in context and quit trying to play word games to defend defenseless positions. Again, this is clear TOS violations we're talking about here.

A Terms of Service violation! Oh no! That clearly makes it the moral equivalent to one of the most heinous crimes a person can commit. I hope all those (figurative) rapists who did the credits glitch circa-1.01 get their just desserts too.

 

[Teal]

Or maybe people could take his analogy in context and quit trying to play word games to defend defenseless positions. Again, this is clear TOS violations we're talking about here. There is no room for debate and/or discussion. I hope the hacker guy in here is right about the fact that if they're reported they will be banned. I know I'll be reporting everyone I see doing it.

This. And I said in my original post that it was extreme. Is hacking a game the same as raping a woman? No and anyone with a brain can see that. But it's the same way of thinking. The "I’m doing what I want and I’m not going to let anyone stop me". Hacking a game because you can......taking a candy bar from the store without paying because you can. Where do you draw the line?

Maybe PD can give us a "poor sport" option. If you are caught using a hacked car in any way. They lock your PSN into "poor Sport rooms" ones filled with other hackers. IDK. All I see is a lot of pissing and moaning, but nobody is coming up with solutions.

 

[Johnnypenso]

Well said.

No, it ruins the game. Look what happened to GT5 online, the amount of players dropped significantly during the hacking era and it made it a pain in the 🤬 for non hackers like me.

Complete falsehood. Online in GT5 came back to life when hybriding was at it's peak. Before hybriding there were usually around 200 rooms a night. During hybriding it shot up to double that most nights. After hybriding back down to 200. Hybriding was and will be very popular.

And let me teach some of you something. Hackers ARE banned, and they are banned permanently. However it is easy for hackers to unban themselves UNLIMITED TIMES. BUT they need a constant source of online I.Ds.. which are a PAIN to obtain. So my best advice is to keep reporting people that are hacking online. I think its childish and stupid to modify cars like that online. .

The only people that got banned were those that used the secret menu. Anyone who just hybrided their cars had no trouble at all. I drove nothing buy hybrids online for months, usually in lobbies marked "Hybrids Welcome" and ran my own hybrid lobbies and I don't know a single person who got banned, in spite of in some cases, having hundreds of them.

Maybe PD can give us a "poor sport" option. If you are caught using a hacked car in any way. They lock your PSN into "poor Sport rooms" ones filled with other hackers. IDK. All I see is a lot of pissing and moaning, but nobody is coming up with solutions.

A solution to what? The tools already exist in the lobby setup paramters to keep out any cars with outrageous HP. Any car that makes it into a lobby with proper limitations will not have a performance advantage over you.

 

[Cosbuster]

Where do you draw the line?

Not being against the law?

 

[Teal]

Not being against the law?

So breaking the law is wrong, but it's okay to break the TOS?

 

[Ameer67]

What I'm waiting to see is how fast hacking will spread. Faster than GT5? Slower?

 

[69Fastback]

Complete falsehood. Online in GT5 came back to life when hybriding was at it's peak. Before hybriding there were usually around 200 rooms a night. During hybriding it shot up to double that most nights. After hybriding back down to 200. Hybriding was and will be very popular.



The only people that got banned were those that used the secret menu. Anyone who just hybrided their cars had no trouble at all. I drove nothing buy hybrids online for months, usually in lobbies marked "Hybrids Welcome" and ran my own hybrid lobbies and I don't know a single person who got banned, in spite of in some cases, having hundreds of them.

i know not all of them got banned neither did i claim.

You will have hackers, you will see them, you will get owned by them. thats the truth... and if you buy cars and enable hackers to do their spread of the hybrid cars then thats on you ... but there is a way to report people and a way to get them banned for cheating or ruining online rooms for players. Hybrids are interesting, and might be cool to some, but ruining the online for other people is not cool, and when they report you its fair game too. Im just spreading the word on what people that get stuck with these mean hackers can do..

 

[ukfan758]

Complete falsehood. Online in GT5 came back to life when hybriding was at it's peak. Before hybriding there were usually around 200 rooms a night. During hybriding it shot up to double that most nights. After hybriding back down to 200. Hybriding was and will be very popular.

I should have been more clear, the amount of non hacking rooms decreased during the hacking era of GT5, you are correct about how the hacking made the online room numbers increase.

 

[dedwards252]

I said that reporting them does ban them, and in order for them to get back and UNBAN themselves they need another JB PS3, which arent being made anymore, those available are expensive, and rare... and the process of getting that ID is in itself tedious. . so while they have unlimited tries .... they will eventually STOP because those I.Ds will eventually RUN out one way or another. so keep on reporting them


And the PS4 is not hacked, that was my point ( and new PS3 models cant be hacked) . I dont know if its of any help to you but thats surely an option to avoid something that is the UNAVOIDABLE hacks already on certain PS3s.

And you better hope the PS4 doesnt get hacked. Its encrypted the same way credit card companies do ... so if they PS4 goes down, you have bigger fish to cry about LOL

I hope you are right about the PS4. The only problem is that there is currently no decent racing simulator available for PS4. Maybe Xbox one and Forza 5 are a better option. Not sure, since I've never played Forza.

 

[69Fastback]

So breaking the law is wrong, but it's okay to break the TOS?

one is life the other is a stupid game. where do you draw the line? or do you have no real life to compare it to?

I dont think people care about your opinion, its the way you try and explain your analogy. its horrible, and makes you look like if youre suffering like rapist victim which im guessing youre not.

 

[NFSCARBON1]

I won't be touching this yet. In GT5 I enjoyed it because it brought new life to.a stagnating 2 year old game. GT6 is only a few months old and still isn't finished yet. Wait till we have the course maker, community features and Senna DLC and if GT6 is still awful, then modding would start to make sense

 

[Johnnypenso]

Hacking doesn't hurt anybody

Did you happen to notice that after the hacking started, PD had started to force us to use whatever car they wanted for seasonal events? When the game gets flooded with hackers online, legitimate replicas or a real car, Realistic power upgrades, or full blown over the top hacks, what ever. PD had to take time out and put in measures to stop those from being used. That cost man power, and that cost money. Time and money taken from development of new features. Maybe GT6 is incomplete because you took that time from PD to have those features in GT6.

Strawman much? You may not be aware of this it's kind of new, but the entire game is designed around every event having parameters to enter. PD had to force certain cars in GT5 because they didn't utilize simultaneous HP/PP/Weight restrictions in TT's. Those options now exist in the game so there's no excuse for PD not implementing them in TT's so we can carry on business as usual. We're talking minutes of programming here not days. Cost effectively zero.

As has been mentioned ad nauseum but ignored by the sky is falling crowd, the tools are in the game already to deal with this.

i know not all of them got banned neither did i claim.

You will have hackers, you will see them, you will get owned by them. thats the truth... and if you buy cars and enable hackers to do their spread of the hybrid cars then thats on you ... but there is a way to report people and a way to get them banned for cheating or ruining online rooms for players. Hybrids are interesting, and might be cool to some, but ruining the online for other people is not cool, and when they report you its fair game too. Im just spreading the word on what people that get stuck with these mean hackers can do..

No it's not the truth, it's a fallacy. I never once got owned by a hacker nor did I see an outrageously powered car online. I don't go into lobbies without restrictions because I'm not looking for a free for all. And unless Sony has changed the rules, you can report all you want and it makes no difference. I'm sure I was reported dozens of times. There are millions of people playing this game, do you really think Sony is going to respond to hundreds or thousands of messages saying "Johnny is cheating"? Seriously? It doesn't work like that.

 

[Teal]

I dont think people care about your opinion.

The same finger can be pointed at you.

 

[69Fastback]

The same finger can be pointed at you.

But im not complaining like you !! you just dont get it..

Your analogy is NOT COOL. not your opinion .. LMAO .. put your finger somewhere else im talking about your horrible analogy, not your opinion, capiche?

lets see how he will spin this to make his " rape " analogy make sense to anyone, including people on the same boat as his HAHA

and try to quote my posts, not nag on me like a girl on something i said time ago, which is totally unrelated and has NOTHING to do with the fact that people agree that your analogy, although, shocking to prove your point, its still in awful taste and the mere fact that you consider your suffering the same as a rape victim is really disturbing ....

"its taking something that you cant have" .... really ? BUAHAHAHAHA

 

[JLG_GT]

Exactly where I knew this thread would be...

Good luck guys!

 

[Griffith500]

Umm? Really, people actually gave likes for this comment?

To answer it, by the fact that it LOOKS like a Redbull Car and SOUNDS like a Redbull car, and then kicking the person from the lobby for using it.

This is a completely different issue and nothing at all to do with hacked cars in lobbies.

Actually, that's not a legitimate complaint, at least not one unique / specific to hybriding, either. How do you know whether that Red Bull car has been power limited or not? How do you know that GT300 car doesn't have a different turbo fitted? Surely choosing your car according to the outward appearance of a would-be competitor's car is unreliable, unless it's supposed to be a stock car room.

In that latter case, though, you ought to set the "stock car only" flag in the room options - this might need confirming, but surely that blocks hybrids from joining, too (certain hp hacks might slip through, but those will be obvious one way or the other).

My advice: race to the regs, that's what everyone else is doing. If someone wants to come in with an under-performing car relative to the regs, they're clearly setting the level of their own race - maybe they want more of a challenge, and you're inadvertently ruining their experience by choosing a slower car. If they appear to have a better car, remember the regs.

At the end of the day, you know what you're racing, and everyone else knows what they're racing, individually. But if there's scope for voluntary and optional "leveling" of the playing field (by choosing a slower car to match someone else's), surely the issue isn't actually one of a car's outright pace, but one of the player's pace in that particular car? That's what Shuffle racing is all about, incidentally.

Failing any of that, communicate with them. They may lie, and that will become apparent in the race. That, again, is not an issue specific to hybriding.

 

[Teal]

Like I said, I'm comparing the thinking behind the actions is the same. Once you get that idea feel free to try again.

 

[Johnnypenso]

I should have been more clear, the amount of non hacking rooms decreased during the hacking era of GT5, you are correct about how the hacking made the online room numbers increase.

That part is true, but as I recall, online circuit racing was just about dead in GT at the time. There were a handful of old soldiers still carrying the banner like @bloodredsky running street cars on street rubber, but by that time, just before hybriding it was mostly drag, drift, cruise, cops lobbies and a handful of circuit racing on RS rubber, usually at the Nurb.

 

[Griffith500]

Like I said, I'm comparing the thinking behind the actions is the same. Once you get that idea feel free to try again.

But it's not the "thinking" (as you've described it) that is the problem in either case (it's the capitalist ideal, surely?), rather the consequences.

If you want to argue that the consequences are the same in either case, feel free.

 

[69Fastback]

Like I said, I'm comparing the thinking behind the actions is the same. Once you get that idea feel free to try again.

No, no, no. See we understand what youre TRYING to do.

You can use any other analogy to make your point.... because that one is horrible and makes you look like an utter creepy, self righteous wannabe. We get it the world revolves around you and whatever you say, we all collectively have to somehow decrypt your awful analogy... everyone here is wrong, youre right... im done.

 

[Johnnypenso]

What I'm waiting to see is how fast hacking will spread. Faster than GT5? Slower?

Faster than a speeding bullet, more powerful than a locomotive...it'll spread like wildfire because I think there's even more pent up anger and emotion about the missing features in the game, lack of customization, poor sound samples etc.

 

[Bluntified]

I said that reporting them does ban them, and in order for them to get back and UNBAN themselves they need another JB PS3, which arent being made anymore, those available are expensive, and rare... and the process of getting that ID is in itself tedious. . so while they have unlimited tries .... they will eventually STOP because those I.Ds will eventually RUN out one way or another. so keep on reporting them


And the PS4 is not hacked, that was my point ( and new PS3 models cant be hacked) . I dont know if its of any help to you but thats surely an option to avoid something that is the UNAVOIDABLE hacks already on certain PS3s.

And you better hope the PS4 doesnt get hacked. Its encrypted the same way credit card companies do ... so if they PS4 goes down, you have bigger fish to cry about LOL

I don't even know where to begin with this one. This is the most non-sense I've read in a while. Explain to me how I can go to my local shop (EBgames and others) and find JB PS3s for under $100? Sure they're not in production but they aren't, by any means, hard to find.

As for the need to buy a new console to un-ban yourself, that's false! There are plenty of ways on unbanning a PS3, even IP bans. Educate yourself before making things up.

As for unavoidable hacks, that's false too. Cloud saving! That would eliminate any save data from being compromised as there wouldn't be any raw data to work with, unless you hack their servers .

-

With that said, back to topic; I think all this Hybridding is blowing out of proportion. Some like it, some don't; I see it pretty much 50:50 (just a guess). All this talk about unfair advantage and whatnot is really up to the host. If there are active hosts running "race for real" rooms, there really shouldn't be any problem with "fairness".

The only issue that I have personally is the fact that I don't know what the heck the other guy's driving. I choose my car solely on what everyone else is driving; so what @Chrunch Houston mentioned earlier makes perfect sense.

All in all, I guess the best thing we could all do as modders and non-modders is to educate each other. Some people don't mod because they either don't know how to or find it un-ethical/cheating. Modders mod because of the sense of freedom of expression. If we could somehow find common grounds, we could work together. I'll be keeping my eyes open for Master Chassis/engine swap compatibility lists in the near future.

PS: I'm not for it nor against it. I've made a few in GT5 but found it too time consuming and tedious, I don't need a second job .

 

[Verbal]

Like I said, I'm comparing the thinking behind the actions is the same. Once you get that idea feel free to try again.

I'm sorry, no sane human being will begin to get anything that even remotely resembles that idea, and you know it.
Whether hybrids in GT6 is a good thing may be a valid discussion, but you're not doing it any service by such a comparison.

 

[MXH]

...but nobody is coming up with solutions.

Giving players more customization and tuning options has been the solution to hacking/hybriding since day one - something that has been mentioned more times than I can count on these forums, including this thread.

So clearly, there's a solution. The questions is whether PD will ever incorporate these options. Else, I can see this go on till the end of time.

 

[Johnnypenso]

With that said, back to topic; I think all this Hybridding is blowing out of proportion. Some like it, some don't; I see it pretty much 50:50 (just a guess). All this talk about unfair advantage and whatnot is really up to the host. If there are active hosts running "race for real" rooms, there really shouldn't be any problem with "fairness".

All in all, I guess the best thing we could all do as modders and non-modders is to educate each other. Some people don't mod because they either don't know how to or find it un-ethical/cheating. Modders mod because of the sense of freedom of expression. If we could somehow find common grounds, we could work together. I'll be keeping my eyes open for Master Chassis/engine swap compatibility lists in the near future.

Exactly:tup:👍 Freaking out about it serves no one and gets us nowhere. PD will deal with it in their own way but in the meantime we have to work with it so why not find the best ways to make things work for everyone and move forward? Whether one likes it or not won't make it go away. Complain directly to Sony/PD if it's a major issue for you personally (the proverbial you, not you), but we'd all be served better by discussing the ways we can work with or around hybriding so we can all have the kind of racing we want.

The sky is not falling. We can deal with this.

 

[AngryEater]

You've avoided the question.

I'll answer yours though, if you'll answer mine.

Cheat - act dishonestly or unfairly in order to gain an advantage.

So my question remains; how am I cheating exactly by making a slower car and using it entirely within my own off-line races and free-runs?

Anytime rules and regulations are disregarded; regardless of intent to prosper is Cheating. Rules is rules;In most competitve fields users of Non-P.E.D.'s are subject to the same punitive penalties as the actual performance enhancer users.
#cheating defined

 

[Tornado]

This. And I said in my original post that it was extreme. Is hacking a game the same as raping a woman? No and anyone with a brain can see that.

And yet you continue defend the assertion as if it was a valid comparison. Interesting.

So breaking the law is wrong, but it's okay to break the TOS?

You certainly thought so when it was regarding something you didn't object to. But in a word, yes. The Terms of Service is simply the terms of service. When you break it, Sony is the arbiter of how to respond (assuming they do at all). For GT5 that meant just patching the game. It did not mean banning people from the service. It did not mean deleting garages. It did not mean taking away the save backup. Despite all of the championing you did in the hopes they would ban people and so a year ago, it just meant changing it so the hybrids didn't effect people online anymore. They didn't do those things to people for using the credits glitch for GT6; even though they placed an actual, real life money value on in game credits.


I also feel it prudent to make sure you're aware why it breaks the Terms of Service, because last time you made this argument (as linked above) you did not understand to the extent that you said hybriders should be blamed if their actions lead to the removal of the ability to break the terms of service in a different way. The use of an outside tool has no bearing on the matter. Knowledge that actions being done are against the Terms of Service has no bearing on the matter. Discovering an exploit yourself has no bearing on the matter. The amount of effort required to do it has no bearing on the matter.

Like I said, I'm comparing the thinking behind the actions is the same. Once you get that idea feel free to try again.

Now it's a thought process. Even more interesting. Perhaps you can explain why I'm interested in seeing the amount of customization and freedom GT5 ultimately had, but have no interest in stealing something or forcing sex from someone. Does that mean "serial hybriders" have the same mental mental disorders commonly associated with serial rapists and kleptomaniacs (as the two examples you brought up to compare)?

 

[p3bucky]

What I'm waiting to see is how fast hacking will spread. Faster than GT5? Slower?

Slower considering the trading feature in GT5 is what really got it going and GT6 doesn't have that.

 

[apexpredator100]

Hacking, at least for me, hasn't really been a problem in GT5 as most of the hackers would roam around hybriding/hacked car lobbies rather than going into clean racing lobbies and causing havoc. The latter still happened at times in GT5, but I haven't encountered it except for one or two times.