If you could redesign career mode...

[steve30x]

PD had a particular vision, a linear progression path, which forces you to race cars you aren't really interested in, at tracks which don't always suit the car, and there is no way around it.

Don't want to play through the cafe section?

Such is life.

I prefer the good old linear pathway in career mode in racing gameswith unlocking things over time but I don't like that cafe mode and menu system. Nor do I like having to be forced to collect cars. The vast majority of the cars I've had to collect will never get used so its pointless in forcing me to collect them. I think the Cafe mode should be a completely seperate arcade mode in itself and go back to the way career mode used to be in GT 1 - 4

Also I would love to have the ability to completely restart the career mode again without having the need to create another PSN account to do so like you can with GT Sport. When I'm done with the GT7 career I'll be done with it unless they introduce a way to restart career mode because I have no intention of playing online

 

[Aloha62_2]

I would just switch to a copy of GT2s with a few more specialised events in each category. Keep the menu system for a special missions section akin to GT4s.

Not being able to race at certain venues until doing specific menus is just nonsense honestly.

I don't have GT7, but have watched streams on it and have to say I'm not impressed.

 

[DodgySyrup]

It is not difficult to please everybody. You can have a much less directive campaign and not tie some basic functionnalities to the progress of said campaign (like multiplayer for example). We are not stuck between two options that cannot be built otherwise.

I agree, to an extent.

I suppose they decided early on that they had to make the cafe system compulsory or most people would skip it and they'd end up wasting time and resources on a game mode players might ignore.

 

[wheelhp]

Just drop in all the events from GT3+GT4

 

[awildo]

The same as GT4 would've been great.
Meaning you get points per each race in career mode. The crappier the car you race with, the more points you get.
With 200 points as difficult as gold licences for example. Makes it a lot more challenging.

 

[Dodger2142]

Make any licenses above A really mean something would be a good start, it's pointless unless you are trophy hunting to go for the S in the current state of the game.

Hoping more events are added though over the coming months.

 

[gigio79]

So, let's say first off you aren't completely sold on the cafe system etc...and you were in charge at PD when the game was being designed - what would you have done differently?

Now, I know there will be some Gran Turismo purists who feel certain things aren't true to the history and ethos of PD vision.

But, I feel like it could have benefited from a more conventional campaign.
I would have the game starting with a license test that you complete, and then you gain access to a series of championships.

They could be similar in nature to the current system, so Japanese hot hatch then American muscle cars etc...

You win each mini championship of 2 or 3 races, are rewarded with a car, then you move to the next tier of license tests and repeat.
Each tier becomes progressively more challenging, with the reward becoming better and better.
You'd also have one off invites where there's an opportunity to win top tier prizes that are among the most expensive in the game.

The tuning system would be there, but the multiplayer and daily races wouldn't allow the current exploits, obviously.

After completing all license tests and the subsequent championships you are then invited to a series of ultra competitive events which have various extra challenges like hit track markers at the apex, or get 3 laps in q row each faster than the one before, get the fastest lap, all stuff to earn extra credits, and give rewards for clean racing etc...the usual that is already on offer in some ways.
There would also be daily invites that would offer you the chance to race the classic cars and give you the chance to win parts and exclusive livery items.

You could win a different part each day, like engine day one, body day two, wheel day three etc...and if you log in everyday and win all the challenges on day 5 you get enough parts to build the whole car.

Ultimately, this isn't an especially original departure from standard racing game structure, but I think it would be more intuitive and engrossing than the current offering.

That being said, is there anything you'd like to see improved or done away with, a particular structure etc...?

Honestly, there are several things I would change. First of all the career structure with the event map is a bit confusing. Also the prizes are too low, the game includes over 400 cars, it will be difficult to buy them all, certainly I will not spend euros to buy the credits online. Some events are not structured in the best way, with wrong tires or settings and without the possibility of changes. One more thing, I can't see the group of cars, only the PPs. Hope the next updates can make Gt7 better.

 

[evil_dave86]

The cafe menu books are a nice way to introduce the game. I have no problem with them.

But it's not a career mode.

I think people calling it the 'career mode' are much mistaken. As an actual career mode is completely absent from the game.

 

[DodgySyrup]

It is not difficult to please everybody. You can have a much less directive campaign and not tie some basic functionnalities to the progress of said campaign (like multiplayer for example). We are not stuck between two options that cannot be built otherwise.

I agree, to an extent.

I suppose they decided early on that they had to make the cafe system compulsory or most people would skip it and they'd end up wasting time and resources on a game mode players might ignore.

 

[AutumnalGlow]

I suppose they decided early on that they had to make the cafe system compulsory or most people would skip it and they'd end up wasting time and resources on a game mode players might ignore.

When designing a game, if you think it'd be a waste of time because most players would not be interested, maybe it just is a waste of time?

I enjoyed the cafe system but I very much believe it should've only been a side mode. It could've been the place to find races that reward cars, but with more challenging races (and I mean races, not chase the rabbit) and better cars/harder races locked behind higher licenses. This would've also given people an incentive to play the mode, without making the game's progression as linear as it currently is.

 

[o000o]

I would just switch to a copy of GT2s with a few more specialised events in each category. Keep the menu system for a special missions section akin to GT4s.

Not being able to race at certain venues until doing specific menus is just nonsense honestly.

I don't have GT7, but have watched streams on it and have to say I'm not impressed.

The cafe menu books are a nice way to introduce the game. I have no problem with them.

But it's not a career mode.

I think people calling it the 'career mode' are much mistaken. As an actual career mode is completely absent from the game.

The cafe is a campaign but is a portion of it. For said GT2, the Cafe part of GT2 is similar if it's like this:

When designing a game, if you think it'd be a waste of time because most players would not be interested, maybe it just is a waste of time?

I enjoyed the cafe system but I very much believe it should've only been a side mode. It could've been the place to find races that reward cars, but with more challenging races (and I mean races, not chase the rabbit) and better cars/harder races locked behind higher licenses. This would've also given people an incentive to play the mode, without making the game's progression as linear as it currently is.

This is the AI problem (so unrelated to the system but it's for offline gameplay overall like any single races). I suspect they removed qualifying and grid starts because they want to give superficial difficulty while keeping the AI the same, or for here at least for giving it some 'challenge' before Sophy. It's shown too that the one that implemented grid start is the likes of Clubman Cup Plus that does have better AI. And they did say Sophy won't be available at launch. It depends on when and how Sophy would be implemented. As if the game should be actually delayed to implement this.

How "Gran Turismo Sophy" Actually Works: More Details on Polyphony Digital and Sony AI's New Technology

Polyphony Digital recently unveiled Gran Turismo Sophy, a new artificial intelligence driving system which will appear in Gran Turismo 7. The technology was developed in collaboration with a 25-person team at Sony AI, utilizing the latest advancements in machine learning. The team's research was pub

www.gtplanet.net

Just drop in all the events from GT3+GT4

Actually GT7's variation of events like drivetrain challenges with country and PP class level is nice and more than GT4 (GT3 did have it for drivetrain). So not merely copy pasting here.

 

[DodgySyrup]

When designing a game, if you think it'd be a waste of time because most players would not be interested, maybe it just is a waste of time?

I enjoyed the cafe system but I very much believe it should've only been a side mode. It could've been the place to find races that reward cars, but with more challenging races (and I mean races, not chase the rabbit) and better cars/harder races locked behind higher licenses. This would've also given people an incentive to play the mode, without making the game's progression as linear as it currently is.

Well, not so much a waste of time then, but, maybe, some players would just feel like there are better ways to structure the game that makes BETTER use of their time.

Do you know what I mean?

 

[AutumnalGlow]

Well, not so much a waste of time then, but, maybe, some players would just feel like there are better ways to structure the game that makes BETTER use of their time.

Do you know what I mean?

I think so, but the same could be said about any number of side features.

I guess I just don't really see this as a complete career mode experience, but rather that it should've been supplementary, and would've been excellent that way.

 

[GTP_reddevil]

If I could redesign the career mode/other elements of GT7:

• Events would be split and put into different sections (exactly how Gran Turismo 4 did with Beginner, Professional and Extreme).
• Split into the same categories as Gran Turismo 3,4 and 5 (Beginner, Amateur, Professional, Extreme, Endurance and Rally).
• Using race events from previous titles (mainly from GT3 onwards) so FR challenge available as a beginner and professional for example.
• I like the cafe collection idea but rather than being the forefront, it can be used as a side mission kind of thing with the focus towards more legendary and collective cars so no need for Japanese Compacts but the Skyline GT-R book would make sense - can also have a LM Road Car collection book as well (Ferrari F40, Porsche 911 GT1 and McLaren F1) for example and also you receive a credits prize or Roulette Ticket based on the difficulty/rarity of completing the menu book.
• Scrap the daily mileage - it ruins the fun sometimes for me.
• Split the used cars into different used cars dealerships like that of Gran Turismo 4 (wouldn’t work from day 1 but maybe in the future after a number of content updates).
• Return to Map shortcut button!
• Prize cars after each event is complete e.g. upon completing the Sunday Cup, you then get a prize car based on the event so it makes sense (exactly like GT3 to an extent).
• I like Roulette Tickets but make it a lot fairer - too many low credit prizes I’m currently only getting (as well as others).

Just some ideas if I could redesign the Gran Turismo 7 career format and other areas.

 

[VTiRoj]

Since I've "finished" the cafe menus, I feel like I can actually make a valid opinion now. Here's how I'd change the current career mode:

• Demote the Cafe mode to just something to encourage car collection
  • Have multiple lists that you can tick off, include all sorts of cars including legends with roulette ticket rewards that reflect the level of collection (i.e. the starter car menu would be a 1-star ticket but collecting 3 Gr.3 cars should give a 6-star)
  • Retain Lucas & friends commenting on the car you drive, that's a neat feature
• Scrap the current layout where tracks are separated by region with races listed under each track
  • Replace them with new headers to reflect the level of licence needed (Beginner - B, Intermediate - A, etc)
  • List events in a normal GT way (Sunday Cup, FR Challenge, Like The Wind, etc) with races for each
• Bring back earning a prize car for each series win
  • Repurpose the 3 card draw system for this
• Bring back endurance races as its own category and not just a mission mode
• Bring B-Spec back with its own events using the Sophy tech
• More races for rally cars, trucks, oddball cars, etc.
• Manufacturer races within each dealership like Gran Turismo 2 had
• Retain daily workout but give rewards for streaks
  • A 7-day streak could give a guaranteed high reward to make up for rigged tickets
• Move Circuit Experience to its own menu like GT Sport with its own rewards
• Give each car its own "fun" event
  • Knocking down cones in a Fit, drifting in a Silvia, etc.

Or basically Gran Turismo 5 with some aspects of Sport.

 

[Strittan]

I’d get rid of the constant and annoying hand holding during the menu books. Well, I’d get rid of the menu books as well, or at least not make them the main goal.

Call me nostalgic or whatever, but I’d simply go back to the basics of GT1-4. Start off by getting a cheap car and work yourself up from there, and do the license tests to unlock more events. You decide what cars to collect yourself, the game should not decide for you, and cars you don’t want you can sell.

I like the idea of UCD and Hagerty Collection, but the stock in each should be increased. I don’t see why there couldn’t be 20 cars available at the same time in Hagerty Collection, for example. Many of us don’t have time to wait months to find a car we want.

Edit: Oh, and I’d get rid of chase-the-rabbit “races” altogether, and re-introduce qualifying as an option for each and every single player race. If you then choose to skip qualifying you start last, simple as that.

 

[Keef]

I'm really digging the Pokemon-esque vibe but I definitely pictured a different "career" than this. I pictured a motorsports-oriented amateur-racer type thing. But also that's been done before countless times and it's been done pretty well so why would GT risk doing the same thing and possibly not as well?

Anyway, I like what they came up with but I do wish it was somehow more involved. I actually do like chilling in cafes lol...I wish I felt a little more like I was there. Voice acting would've been nice to help make the characters feel alive, but again not having voices is how Pokemon does it as well.

Which gives me an idea. Pokemon obviously has a tv show and various movies and they're all great fun. What about a Gran Turismo animated series? I suppose it would be kinda like Initial D but with a much broader scope. In fact, they could do an homage within the cartoon to Initial D but the rest of it could feature various cars and racing. Might be cool.

 

[oskierox]

I would do a calendar, similar to like an MLB The Show game, with testing, and fun events throughout the year, race weekends, etc. You become a racing driver and go through a calendar year etc for the career mode? could be fun, and sprinkle in sponsor events throughout the year which could be the silly mileage tests, one lap wonders, and all that

 

[Lain]

# of cars x # of track layouts = over 40,000 one make race events to check off, and by events I mean 2 hour enduros.

Bam, endless content. And if they each paid a cool mil, they wouldn’t be as efficient as Fisherman’s Ranch but would allow players to make a healthy amount of money as they chew through it.

 

[GTvsForza]

To keep it simple, make it the same way as GT4.

 

[Veinz]

Have the same career structure as Pcars 2 with an economy that’s more generous than what we have now.

 

[Michael88]

I don't get it why PD replaced the usual oldschool Gran Turismo career mode with this car collection menus - because they could have had BOTH in the game.

Like, when you win a certain car or buy a certain car back in the garage a menu pops open with the option to complete a collection for a bonus, which also opens a little history video like we got in the menu's and maybe even unlocks an additional race with the cars you just collected.
There was absolutely no reason to replace the old GT career mode.

It would have made the old fans happy, it would have added something new and fresh, it would have been a win/win situation.


And of course better economy, more serious endurance races like 99 laps of XYZ and 5 hours of Spa etc, and cars than can be sold.

 

[gnorman]

I like the cafe as it gives a bit of immersion and atmosphere to the one player game finally after 25 years, but it is little more than a tutorial.

Car collection is long overdue, no doubt it will be dropped for the next one.

I don’t think PD will do enough to one player to actually make it a career though, it is little more than just a bunch of single races.

Considering the realism they strive for in the physics, the graphics and camera sim that is scapes they should retire the current way of doing career as it is 25 years old and actually get some realism in what it is like to run cars at track days and race meetings. The Gt series has very little immersion in single player mode compared to other titles.

I’d like to see a career that follows a race meeting - practice, qualifying of course, maybe a second race with the grid based on the order from the first race, or a reverse grid.

A race meeting that runs different races of different classes on the same track configuration.

Races counting towards championships that move around the country/continent/world.

Race meetings fitting into a calendar that shows what meetings are on when and where.

You can then pick which meetings to go to based on what cars you have and what championships you want to do.

Endurance races, using Bspec Bob or Sophy as part of your driver lineup.

Got too many cars? Run a race team and hire drivers.

Realism mode where damage to cars need to be paid for, travel to tracks is paid for, restrictions on using tech on cars that can never be installed - cpu or tcs on 60s muscle cars.

Track records for all tracks for all classes rather than just in time trial.

Proving ground to be able to benchmark cars.

Stats on races, wins, winnings, cost of upgrades and so on per car.

Create custom championships rather than just lots of individual races.

Have Sport mode mirror the career mode so you can do the same races against AI or other players.

That’s off the top of my head. I think I created a similar thread here after GT6, l’ll see if I can find it.

 

[Samus]

This is really all that was required.
Not a single person would have bought GT7 and then complained that it was “the same set of races we got in GT4”.

If it were an identical list we would have all, to a man, rejoiced.

It’s almost as if Kaz doesn’t know his customers. Every single one of us could have created a much better single player experience if we were given the opportunity. Every single one of us. So how does he manage to get it so wrong? 🤷🏻‍♂️

No, I absolutely would have. I don't want the same experience with a game over and over. I wanted something fresh, and I like that PD had a go at that. Unfortunately the implementation of Cafe Mode was not great.

I feel like the cafe mode would be far more satisfying if there was more of a hunt for the cars. As it is right now the game just gives you the three cars on a plate. It tells you where they are and winning most of them is just a matter of finishing 3rd in one race. There is no challenge in finding or acquiring them.

They're clearly leaning into the Pokémon with cars idea but there is no hunt, no surprise reward. Granted you can't directly translate hunting for Pokémon to hunting for cars in a racing game, you can't hide a car round the back of the Trial Mountain pit lane or in a scapes photo.

What they could have done though is told you that you can win a car, but not specifically what event. Just that it's one of 8 or something. So when you do find it, there is just a little bit of a feeling of the hunt. That was always how it was in the old games, you didn't know the prize until you got it.

For cars you can't win instead of automatically putting them in the UCD create some sort of minigame where you have to track them down. I'm not sure what, but surely they could come up with something.

Then there is the linearity issue that could be negated by letting you have multiple incomplete books open at a time, which would again help with the hunt aspect. You win a championship and what do you win? Could be one for the Mustang book, could be one for the City car book. It's not much, but that little bit of suspense and suprise can really make a difference. Everyone would have a different journey depending on which events they choose to do.

I do like the cafe idea broadly speaking but there is a lot of room for improvement before you even get into the formats of the races themselves.

Also, I doubt Kaz personally is doing the game structure. Cafe Mode might have been his idea, but he is unlikely to have worked on the events and structure itself. IIRC he hadn't even played GT5 all the way through because he was unaware of how fudged it up it was when you didn't have a high enough level to enter events or buy a car.

 

[Matej]

I would offer fully open Arcade mode with majority of cars and tracks unlocked for people who have no time and just want to pick up the game and play it.

And a GT mode for the people that do have time, that doesn't require a single grind because the payouts are well-matched, but instead uses different tactics to make you enter the events again, like completing it with a weaker car, no damage, consistent laps or stuff like that. But again, only optional things, none of that you have to do if you don't want to, it's just for 100% achievement.

And finally, fast AI that makes you feel you're racing. With the current AI, there is no sensation of racing, just catching up with some rabbit dude up front.

 

[FoxMulder]

The cafe isn’t even that bad, it just ended up feeling like a long tutorial with nothing else after. Like they skipped over entire classes of cars they have in the game.

The licenses and missions could be structured into the career as you progress into better cars.

 

[oskarcmr25]

The cafe is a campaign but is a portion of it. For said GT2, the Cafe part of GT2 is similar if it's like this:
View attachment 1124962

This is the AI problem (so unrelated to the system but it's for offline gameplay overall like any single races). I suspect they removed qualifying and grid starts because they want to give superficial difficulty while keeping the AI the same, or for here at least for giving it some 'challenge' before Sophy. It's shown too that the one that implemented grid start is the likes of Clubman Cup Plus that does have better AI. And they did say Sophy won't be available at launch. It depends on when and how Sophy would be implemented. As if the game should be actually delayed to implement this.

How "Gran Turismo Sophy" Actually Works: More Details on Polyphony Digital and Sony AI's New Technology

Polyphony Digital recently unveiled Gran Turismo Sophy, a new artificial intelligence driving system which will appear in Gran Turismo 7. The technology was developed in collaboration with a 25-person team at Sony AI, utilizing the latest advancements in machine learning. The team's research was pub

www.gtplanet.net

Actually GT7's variation of events like drivetrain challenges with country and PP class level is nice and more than GT4 (GT3 did have it for drivetrain). So not merely copy pasting here.

To be honest if Cafe and championships are like Gran turismo league from GT2 then they could add GT league to the menu with the rest of the events. World circuit/Cafe events would be like Gran turismo league so the main events where you can watch the ending credits after you finish those while also having GT league there for the rest of the events that you do to get 100% completion and to earn some cash to progress further just like Special events in GT2.