Islam - What's your view on it?

  • Thread starter SalmanBH
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There is no "better or worse", but it's disingenuous and frankly insulting to compare Islam and Christianity with regards to slavery in the modern world, or to forget the roots of the abolitionist movement. The one good thing about Qatar 2022 is that this issue is gaining more publicity so stories like this will be reported over here more frequently.
 
@SniperRed3 the Qu'ran also says,
33:50 - "Prophet, We have made lawful to you the wives to whom you have granted dowries and the slave girls whom God has given you as booty."

Polygamy and Sex Slavery!

That said, I hope you're not thinking I admire the bible!

The three major monotheistic religions of the world all teach immoral and vile behavior to their adherents. The fact that many ignore these teachings is fortunate, but insufficient. All three religions have teachings trapped in a time warp of primitive barbarism and their gods have not changed those teachings.

Islam differs from the other two only in the degree of damage done to societies. How often do we hear the terms "Jewish suicide bomber" or "Christian suicide bomber"? When the bombs went off at the Boston Marathon, did you say "there we go, another atheist is blowing people up!"?

Make yourself lists of the war-torn regions of the world, despotic regimes, extremely misogynistic societies, countries with the highest risk factor for tourists, countries which have laws which provide the death penalty for non-belief in god, countries which have extreme legal penalties for homosexuality. Now look at the predominant religion in each of those areas. Which one tops each list? How often was it Islam?
 
Which Christian denomination supports the KKK? When were the Crusades and what were the reasons for them? And the name of one "Islamophobic" nutter?

If the aim of your argument was to pit Islam against Christianity over which has done more harm to the world (past and present) or to show that they're equally as bad then that's failed, but I'm not sure what that has to do with the discussion?
 
GBO Possum
Islam differs from the other two only in the degree of damage done to societies. How often do we hear the terms "Jewish suicide bomber" or "Christian suicide bomber"? When the bombs went off at the Boston Marathon, did you say "there we go, another atheist is blowing people up!"?
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It's not the religion's fault. It's the way how people interpret it. The radical, extremist Islam comes from Wahhabi/Salafi preachers who call people for violence. Most of those Islamic extremists haven't even read the Quran personally. For example, Islam forbids suicide in any circumstances. But you hear about "suicide bombers", right?
 
Rage Racer
It's not the religion's fault. It's the way how people interpret it. The radical, extremist Islam comes from Wahhabi/Salafi preachers who call people for violence. Most of those Islamic extremists haven't even read the Quran personally. For example, Islam forbids suicide in any circumstances. But you hear about "suicide bombers", right?
Click to expand...

I can't agree that it's not the fault of religion. The Qu'ran is unambiguous. And the extremists don't call it "suicide" like we do, they call it "martyrdom in a holy war". That's different. In fact the extremists dislike intensely that the civilized world call it "suicide".

For a collection of unambiguous Qu'ranic exhortations to violence, CLICK HERE.
 
GBO Possum
I can't agree that it's not the fault of religion. The Qu'ran is unambiguous. And the extremists don't call it "suicide" like we do, they call it "martyrdom in a holy war". That's different. In fact the extremists dislike intensely that the civilized world call it "suicide".
Click to expand...
Even the "holy war" - the "small Jihad" or "Jihad of sword" forbids any actions causing death of:
- women and children
- elderly
- disabled and heavily sick people
- peasants and hired workers
- Al-Dhimmi - polytheists who concluded a non-agression treaty with Muslims, and Al-Mustahmans - polytheists who's been given immunity from any Muslim;
- Ahlu Al-Kitab - "People of the Book" - Christians, Jews and Sabians.

But the extremists don't give a ****.

For a collection of unambiguous Qu'ranic exhortations to violence, CLICK HERE.
Click to expand...
Or, one may click here for something similar in the Bible.
The Bible was used by people to excuse violence, too. Remember the Inquisition. But this doesn't make Christianity a religion of violence.

One does not need to make or support violence to be in any religion, including Islam.
Islam is just the easiest one for use to excuse killing and set people to fight.
 
Rage Racer
Or, one may click here for something similar in the Bible.
The Bible was used by people to excuse violence, too. Remember the Inquisition. But this doesn't make Christianity a religion of violence.

One does not need to make or support violence to be in any religion, including Islam.
Islam is just the easiest one for use to excuse killing and set people to fight.
Click to expand...

He's not saying the bible is better. This topic is about islam and the qu'ran. I guess @GBO Possum doesn't find the bible any better in any way.


Comparing the qu'ran to the bible is pretty bad. The standard of morality or decency is pretty low if it exists at all.
 
Rage Racer
Even the "holy war" - the "small Jihad" or "Jihad of sword" forbids any actions causing death of:
- women and children
- elderly
- disabled and heavily sick people
- peasants and hired workers
- Al-Dhimmi - polytheists who concluded a non-agression treaty with Muslims, and Al-Mustahmans - polytheists who's been given immunity from any Muslim;
- Ahlu Al-Kitab - "People of the Book" - Christians, Jews and Sabians.

But the extremists don't give a ****.


Or, one may click here for something similar in the Bible.
The Bible was used by people to excuse violence, too. Remember the Inquisition. But this doesn't make Christianity a religion of violence.

One does not need to make or support violence to be in any religion, including Islam.
Islam is just the easiest one for use to excuse killing and set people to fight.
Click to expand...

tumblr_mwqahaR91Q1rh2tw8o1_400.gif
 
zzz_pt
He's not saying the bible is better. This topic is about islam and the qu'ran. I guess @GBO Possum doesn't find the bible any better in any way.


Comparing the qu'ran to the bible is pretty bad. The standard of morality or decency is pretty low if it exists at all.
Click to expand...
I'm not comparing, I just mentioned it as an example.
Violence in the book is not a reason to label the religion as "violent" or "causing damage". People from such places as Kazakhstan or Russia's Tatarstan and Bashkortostan would not like to be undeservedly embarassed because of stereotypes about their coreligionists.
 
Obedient wife says "In the Koran it says a man should marry four women".

Edit:- is there any doubt that "Allah" was invented by men, not women? And not particularly nice men at that!
 
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I really feel for the people that years ago migrated to Australia from Lebanon, for example. They came at the same time as many did from Greece and Italy. I don't have any memory of Islam being an issue on either side. It seems they found their place, and were very much settled. Then came the change, and suddenly it was that much more difficult for the long-established Muslims to be at ease in their adopted home. The culprit? Not intolerance by Non-Muslims, but the unnecessary stirring of the pot (read: "Australia is full of infidels, and needs Sharia law") by nu-skool Muslims. It breaks my heart when I think of how much life might have changed for Hassan, the man who owned the fish and chip shop around the corner from us when I was a kid.
 
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Rage Racer
WTF? And police can't even handle them? ****. What kind of law enforcement is this?

But, I think, it should be "Islamism in Sweden", not "Islam". Don't generalize. ;)
Click to expand...

But how do you separate "Islamism" from Islam? They have the same religion. They have the same books.

Islamism is the inevitable result of Islam, if past history is any guide.

The Swedes generously allowed Islam into their country and they got Islamism with it.
 
Rage Racer
WTF? And police can't even handle them? ****. What kind of law enforcement is this?

But, I think, it should be "Islamism in Sweden", not "Islam". Don't generalize. ;)
Click to expand...

Someone woke up grumpy :)

Islam is the way of life as well as the name of the religion... so it's good :D

I think the police could handle it but I imagine it's like some traveller sites or rough council estates in the UK; the police will only visit there if they have a specific reason. Random visits can cause more trouble than hey solve. Not an ideal situation but money doesn't grow on trees and so forth ;)
 
GBO Possum
But how do you separate "Islamism" from Islam?
Click to expand...
Easily.
You may be surprised, but there are a lot of Muslims living around me without any problems. In Moscow, there are no Muslim-populated areas where non-Muslims are afraid to hang out. For our Muslims, Islam is just a normal religion like Christianity for us. They do not wish to settle Sharia laws or oppress "infidels". And as I mentioned before, most of their women are not different from ours in clothes (hijab is a rarity here) or behavior.

The Swedes generously allowed Islam into their country and they got Islamism with it.
Click to expand...
In Russia, we have Islam for hundreds of years already. But when we get Islamism, we fight it immediately.

TenEightyOne
Someone woke up grumpy :)

Islam is the way of life as well as the name of the religion... so it's good :D

I think the police could handle it but I imagine it's like some traveller sites or rough council estates in the UK; the police will only visit there if they have a specific reason. Random visits can cause more trouble than hey solve. Not an ideal situation but money doesn't grow on trees and so forth ;)
Click to expand...
At least, police must not be afraid to visit these areas because of "people throwing stones", lol. What if they get guns, not stones? The government will give up the power then?
 
Oh boy, i'm gonna get flamed...(1st, i'm not english or american, so my grammar can be wrong)
Let's be honest.:confused:
I don't believe in those religions, i believe there is something, but i will finish with that at the end of my story.
Christian, Islam, Bhoedism, Hindoisme, Jewisme, Jehova, Scientology, etc. etc. etc.
Where are these gods? Who wrote the rules?:dunce:
Topic starts with Islam, aha, islam, hate, terrorisme, Womens abuse.
NO!!! those words are the topics that rule in the media, those actions are applied by the extreme islam.
Are there, in our view, also normal people in the islam? Yes there are.💡
Let's turn it around, lets start way back.
Jesus? Did he perform miracles? The bible says so.
Okay, lets take steps forward, midieval Witches, who was scared? My guess, there were christians also that time.
What did they do? Throw them in the water, if they drown, they're innocent. Lots of dead witches!!
But jesus performed magic, witches did too? What do the 10 commandments say? Do not kill? hmmm.
The crusades, wow, christians murder and conquer in the name of ????.

What did happen in history in the name of god? Good things, but also lots of bad things.Remember school?

Islam, Abuse of women....here we go...Christian priests, Abuse of children.:nervous:
Now some of you will say: "NOT ALL PRIESTS":banghead:
Then also say: "Not all of islam" Be honest, don't be a politician.:cool:
Do you know what the old christians did to their women? Go back into history.:dunce:
Do you know what happens in lots of families that is on police record but not always in the media?:eek:

Going back in history, the white people are the worst kind, murder and slavery, lots of wars.
And it all started in Europe.Whell, according to school history books.Could be a lie, don't know, wasn't there when it happened.
War, slavery, murder was all over the world, only it took a long time before europe accepted the world was not flat.So what do we really know?:dunce:

My religion: I'm raised christian, or in my language "Rooms Katholiek"
The word Rome is in my religion. who killed Jesus? O yes, the the great great great grandfathers of the roman christians.
At 14 i guessed: God does not listen, too much misery in the world, we are being punished, not saved.

I believe that there is something, but not the stuff we made up.
The koran is written by humans
The bible is written by humans
Hindoeism is remembered, not written ( i don't really know myself)
It all happened thousends of years ago.
all other gods dissapeard and a few appeard.
The vikings had lots of gods
The greek had lots of gods
The romans had lots of gods
The egyptians had lots of gods
etc. etc. etc.
Where are those gods??? Left in a spaceship, because humans made a mess of it?

If you don't want to get the truth? Stop reading now.
Humans are the worst thing on this planet.
Humans kill this planet.
Humans are the worst virus that ever walked this planet.
Humans infect this planet and also eachother.
Humans kill humans and animals.
I think, that our DNA was dumped on this planet by Aliens, far far away, to get rid of this virus.
And i thought of that long before the movie "prometheus".

Stop pointing fingers, look into a mirror and think about you and what you are.
Are you a good person? or do you also want to kill a person when he did something to you, your family or your country?
Religion is not the problem, Humans are the problem.
 
Rage Racer
What if they get guns, not stones? The government will give up the power then?
Click to expand...

If you've got gangs who've got some firearms then that's completely different, I think they're referring more to stone-throwing and general dissent. Sweden has pretty low gun crime overall.
 
dddsprayshop
Going back in history, the white people are the worst kind, murder and slavery, lots of wars.
And it all started in Europe.Whell, according to school history books.Could be a lie, don't know, wasn't there when it happened.
War, slavery, murder was all over the world, only it took a long time before europe accepted the world was not flat.So what do we really know?:dunce:
Click to expand...


Proof please. You can't go around making racist comments no matter your age, education level or literacy in English without backing it up with facts.
 
1. i'm white.
2. You call me a racist? I'm calling the truth that is backed up by writing all over the ages.
3. did you go to school? How old are you? if you are younger then 16, you're still learning.
4.Quoting just one little thing, is pulling my whole story out of context, but you wanted this.
if you are insulted? not my problem, you wanted this answer.
if you did not wanted it? then don't ask the question.


okay, here it goes.
Alexander the great, is great? how? by killing and conquer, was greek=white
Roman empire, was great?How? by killing en conquer thru europe, are italian=white
Spanish inquisition? Hunting people for religion, torture, killing, are spanish=white
Vikings sail to "america" to conquer indians land, failed but killed are scandinavian=white
Need more? Okay
Christopher Columbus, took some indians as slaves back for his queen Chris was born italian=white
American pelgrims, not all, conquer today's america, killed Indians by force and disease are european= white
Dutch,Spanish,Italian,English went to africa and asia, to conquer, and get black slaves, guess what= white
The English against the americans, you know? 4th of juli thing. Yup again english=white
India, the English want to conquer...again english=white
Germans, WW1 and WW2, you know the story, eeeehm white?
i can go on and on and on and did not mention russia, ow russia? what happening there right now?Poetin = black,gay,moslim?

So how many people died sinds the year 0, its 2014 now, how many? Millions? Billions? I'm sure that it is much more then a few million.( According to history books)

I don't have to back it up, it is already backed up.
You ask for proof? Where do you live? You must live somewhere that has no knowlidge of history.
In history books
In school
In films.


To back up that i'm not a racist.
In Africa the Hutsi's and Tutsi's murdered each other, why? Same as in bosnia? it suddenly happened because of religion or something else?
How many died? Millions? or thousends?

Indians (the Native Americans) had tribal wars, yes killed, how many?
Ancient china, dynasty wars, yes death.

But they did not teach me a lot of that in school, nooo, they teached me the stuff of the european people.Nice huh?



Kingdoms of europe wanted to conquer.
Do you see any king of europe in history that was black,brown,red or yellow?
Do you see any prime minister in europe that is not white?
How long did it take America to get a NON-white president?
Before mandela was the African president, Who was the president? A white guy!!

I'm 45yrs old, i've heard of history, and still see it happen.
Open your eyes and stop asking proof, look around, there is proof everywhere.

My working colleages, are from Morocco,Turkey,scotland,ireland,germany, italy,spain,portugal,india,suriname,dutch,polish,tsech,hungary.
I speak dutch, my dialect,german,english at my work, i work with them all, not against them.

to end it.
I'm not a racist, i'm ashamed about these so-called white humans did and still do.
I'm dutch, My skin is pink or white, i care for people and i hate some people.
But i dont care or hate because of race or color.

My skincolor make me not to worry, but it also makes me worry.
I'm called a racist, for calling ancient cruel european people white.
Our european ancestors where cruel, no doubt about that.
Majans, and some egyptian farao's where cruel, and now it is islam?
Shure, go at it.
A dad killed his kids here in the netherland a few moths ago, lets bomb all dads
A mother killed her kids, she was depressed, lets bomb all mothers.

See the red line? Humans are evil.
 
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dddsprayshop
1. i'm white.
Click to expand...

Meaning you can't be racist?

dddsprayshop
2. You call me a racist? I'm calling the truth that is backed up by writing all over the ages.
Click to expand...

The answer to "citation required" isn't "go find it", so you still need to show a valid source.

dddsprayshop
Alexander the great, is great? how? by killing and conquer, was greek=white
Roman empire, was great?How? by killing en conquer thru europe, are italian=white
Spanish inquisition? Hunting people for religion, torture, killing, are spanish=white
Vikings sail to "america" to conquer indians land, failed but killed are scandinavian=white
Need more? Okay
Christopher Columbus, took some indians as slaves back for his queen Chris was born italian=white
American pelgrims, not all, conquer today's america, killed Indians by force and disease are european= white
Dutch,Spanish,Italian,English went to africa and asia, to conquer, and get black slaves, guess what= white
The English against the americans, you know? 4th of juli thing. Yup again english=white
India, the English want to conquer...again english=white
Germans, WW1 and WW2, you know the story, eeeehm white?
i can go on and on and on and did not mention russia, ow russia? what happening there right now?Poetin = black,gay,moslim?

So how many people died sinds the year 0, its 2014 now, how many? Millions? Billions? I'm sure that it is much more then a few million.( According to history books)

I don't have to back it up, it is already backed up.
You ask for proof? Where do you live? You must live somewhere that has no knowlidge of history.
In history books
In school
In films.
Click to expand...

Good stuff! Not all-white though, which rather scotches your theory (not meaning to bring ginger hair into an already-charged debate). Or are you talking about the rulers rather than the fighters?

dddsprayshop
To back up that i'm not a racist.
Click to expand...

You did say.

dddsprayshop
In Africa the Hutsi's and Tutsi's murdered each other, why? Same as in bosnia? it suddenly happened because of religion or something else?
How many died? Millions? or thousends?

Indians (the Native Americans) had tribal wars, yes killed, how many?
Ancient china, dynasty wars, yes death.
Click to expand...

You're really confusing me now. How many indigenous tribespeople have died in all the wars in their tribal history? Is that what you're asking?

Do you count Chinese people as white, just so I know which way that fact confuses me?

You expressed a viewpoint that seemed racist, you seem to argue that you cannot be racist because you're white, you fail to provide citations for the facts (other than some which you regurgitated from uncitable memory) and you confused me at the end by demonstrating a large amount of "non-white-led" (to use your apparent categories) killing.

What are you trying to say, exactly?
 
I'm sorry, common knowledge of history?
Is this the new generation that does not believe the history books?
Can you read? Did you go to school, do you have memory? Why the question then?
You don't need to search it, you should already know it.
I learned this at school between the age 5 and 12, History class?

But thinking about it.
The bible is written by humans.
The koran is written by humans
History is written by humans.

Whoeps, what is true, and what isn't?
So if i delivered facts, i wasn't there, you all weren't there, how can anyone have real proof?
No samsungs or i-phones back then, no proof, only witnesses.
what's true in our life? My own life, and the rest? A point of trust then.
Do you trust me or your self?
Nazi war? you must know that, white power?

You're really confusing me now. How many indigenous tribespeople have died in all the wars in their tribal history? Is that what you're asking?

Do you count Chinese people as white, just so I know which way that fact confuses me?

You expressed a viewpoint that seemed racist, you seem to argue that you cannot be racist because you're white, you fail to provide citations for the facts (other than some which you regurgitated from uncitable memory) and you confused me at the end by demonstrating a large amount of "non-white-led" (to use your apparent categories) killing.

What are you trying to say, exactly?
Click to expand...

Yes i confuse you.
I need you to use your brain to think what this topic is.
To think instead of reading what you might think.
Humans are emotional.
One moment you're a racist, and suddenly you're not, and vice versa.
it just takes one event to change it..
 
My last post in this topic.
islam is a religion.
This is an off topic forum piece.
But this is GT-planet.
You want this kind of topic?
leave and go to a forum that handles this kind of thing.
This website and forum is all about race and drive games.
Don't mess up a nice thing with these topics.
 

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