Kazunori Yamauchi Responds to Gran Turismo 7 Fan Outrage

[StefaBGD]

This stupid game, which now I can not even play as it is stuck, is jut one big RIP OFF!!! 😡🤬

Crazy... Probably not gonna end anytime soon.

View attachment 1128134

We, player should put effort to make it first game that has score o.o!!!!

 

[KJF]

As the game stands now, the first thing everyone needs to do is grind Fisherman's Ranch. Before, you go to the used cars, better grind Fisherman's. Before you go tune a car, better grind Fisherman's. Since many cars are only available at intervals, you have to grind to get them, or miss them for weeks (or months, who knows?). The grind has become everything.

And this is the ultimate issue imo. The price of collecting cars is insane but I don't believe that is the primary reason why the game feels so unfun for many. The game forces you to grind, and then rewards that grind with a choice. Do you buy a stock car? Or do you tune up/paint/mod a car in your garage so you can actually race it?

It's a fundamentally broken system that never allows the player any room to breathe within the game. Enjoying the game in the moment (tuning a car, applying a livery and racing it) means that you cannot progress your collection, and progressing your collection leads to less opportunities to tune and enjoy the cars you already own.

 

[MroczMR]

I just hope this situation will resolve in a matter of Days. April is around the corner so I hope we will soon get first big update with additional conetn and full clarification where this game is heading.

If there won't be any sign of progress until April... then this game won't stay too relevant.

 

[Lomic]

Given that I’m stuck with the misguided* purchase I made, I’m now trying to reset my expectations in order to improve my happiness.

I am close to your way of playing. Except that from start I had no interest in collecting a lot of cars nor all cars.

The game is still lacking events for various types of cars, licenses and so on. Guess it will come with future updates.

The thing that annoys me the most is the economy. The number of hours I have to play (and I don't grind) to buy and tune the few cars I would like to have... And I forget the luxury ones I would love to get like the McLaren F1. I know that I won't be able to get them, not in a near future, not in a few years either.

And thankfully for me I rarely play sport mode where I would need some good GR3-GR4 at least, with tuning, to have enjoyable races.

 

[Adam Barber]

That dealership really shot PD in the foot with the timing of the McLaren F1 and the 917K. I do think that those cars should be way out of reach especially as the game is barely 3 weeks old and players are seemingly expecting to immediately own everything in sight. People need to chill out and take it for what it is, a game that's played for fun. GTSport really spoiled players with credits and throwing free cars at players and credits, at least with GT7 I feel like I own the cars and they're not just there.

 

[GTCam]

I believe that the game should have a consistent model across all races in terms of rewards. So if they developed a scientific calculation that calculated reward based on variables, such as time, distance, difficulty, then if it is standard across all races, then great. If they felt that some rewards were more generous than others, then so be it, provided they apply the model across all races.

However, the games advertising offered many desires to play the game… including car collecting enthusiasts. Therefore, unless the game is going to offer enough events to either win all cars or enough money to buy all cars, then mechanically repeating events is unavoidable to those that want to collect cars.

 

[Lomic]

GTSport really spoiled players with credits and throwing free cars at players and credits, at least with GT7 I feel like I own the cars and they're not just there.

You feel you own the cars the Cafe menus kept throwing at you too ?

I think there is balance between being thrown cars everytime you push a button and not ever being able to buy even one of the most expensive cars.
I've made ~6M in 40 hours of gameplay, which means that I will be able to buy the McLaren F1 with 120h of gameplay ? (if I dedicate all my earnings to buying that car, any spending during that time would just delay the purchase of the unicorn). No thanks.

 

[Johnnn]

That dealership really shot PD in the foot with the timing of the McLaren F1 and the 917K. I do think that those cars should be way out of reach especially as the game is barely 3 weeks old and players are seemingly expecting to immediately own everything in sight. People need to chill out and take it for what it is, a game that's played for fun. GTSport really spoiled players with credits and throwing free cars at players and credits, at least with GT7 I feel like I own the cars and they're not just there.

But it's not fun at all. I want to try my 917K I paid for. We bought all cars and want to play with them.

I feel like the game is broken and MC score is deserved.

 

[Ande3200]

I think part of the problem is that at endgame GT7 is functionally worse than something like AC.

At endgame in both you're going to be making your own fun and driving what you feel like. But GT7 locks all the cars behind a credit grind, making it hard to set up races exactly how you want. AC just gives you the cars and lets you have fun.

In the past the tradeoff would have been that Gran Turismo had a massive single player component, and the restricted car ownership would have been in service of that mode of gameplay. That's just not there in GT7, it dies of crib death after the menus and a handful of random events.

The way GT7 allows you to play at endgame, games like AC and PC2 do better. They allow you the freedom to make your own fun in a way that GT7 doesn't, since none of the games offer that much in the way of an endgame single player experience.

Unless you want someone to take all your toys away and make you work to get them back, then GT7 is for you. Some people are into that, but most wouldn't call it fun. I buy racing games to race the cars, not to drive a car I don't like to maybe one day earn access to a car I do.

For the people who will misrepresent this argument, I don't think GT7 should unlock all the cars (well, they should have a fully unlocked arcade mode but that's another thing). I think they should have a decent amount of single player content with a reasonably balanced economy because that's why GT does best. I just think that in failing to do so they've driven players into a mode of play that more resembles the "traditional" sims where everything is unlocked, but does it worse.

That is what makes ac and pcars boring to me, i prefer buying and winning the cars, and lack of any car customization is big no for me, but its of course very subjective, i am not trying to defend the grind in gt7, its a bit to much at the moment, but i prefer owning the cars and customize them, extra important for me if you use road cars, for same reason why you custmize your sports cars in real life,

 

[Adam Barber]

You feel you own the cars the Cafe menus kept throwing at you too ?

I think there is balance between being thrown cars everytime you push a button and not ever being able to buy even one of the most expensive cars.
I've made ~6M in 40 hours of gameplay, which means that I will be able to buy the McLaren F1 with 120h of gameplay ? (if I dedicate all my earnings to buying that car, any spending during that time would just delay the purchase of the unicorn). No thanks.

Those cafe menus did throw those cars at you way to willingly, those expensive cars are endgame stuff and expecting that be able to afford them immediately is never going to happen and shouldn't happen.

Game is what, 3 weeks old? Why do people need everything, now? Do the licenses, menus, circuit experiences, and missions. Learn the new physics. Then go after content.

 

[MaxAttack]

Irksome how people pick and choose what to remember from Kaz's letter. You all remember the "it pains me" and the "real world values" whenever it suits your arguments.

But hey, how about this nugget;

...update plans for additional content, additional race events and additional features that will constructively resolve this.

In light of this it seems quite silly to be complaining about not getting the most expensive, desirable and provenant machines in the game when we are still well inside its infancy as a game. Have some patience, getting everything given to us like candy was what GTS was, and I have no connection with any of the 30 Lancia Deltas I have in GTS. I finally have a Stratos in 7 and it made me warm and fuzzy, even if it is a total death machine (as it should be).

Respect is a two way street. A lot of you seem to feel personally disrespected by Kaz over whatever issue you have with the game, but if you won't pay him the respect to believe what he says when he comes to address you, why in the hell should be do anything out of respect for your desires.

Patience is a virtue.

 

[Adam Barber]

But it's not fun at all. I want to try my 917K I paid for. We bought all cars and want to play with them.

I feel like the game is broken and MC score is deserved.

Those MC scores are utterly meaningless anyway as are the reviews on that site, just because you didn't like a game doesn't mean that everyone should aswell. Those ultra expensive cars that I got in GTSport I probably used once or twice at most, I'd rather spend my time and credits on cars that I'd actually use.

 

[Johnnn]

That is what makes ac and pcars boring to me, i prefer buying and winning the cars, and lack of any car customization is big no for me, but its of course very subjective, i am not trying to defend the grind in gt7, its a bit to much at the moment, but i prefer owning the cars and customize them, extra important for me if you use road cars, for same reason why you custmize your sports cars in real life,

That's interesting. To me sim racing is about racing. I don't need to own anything because I can race with all cars I bought. Customization is not important to me, because we have so many different cars. If I want "tuning", I take different version of the car.

 

[Ande3200]

That's interesting. To me sim racing is about racing. I don't need to own anything because I can race with all cars I bought. Customization is not important to me, because we have so many different cars. If I want "tuning", I take different version of the car.

Maybe not for you but for most people it is, and that is what gran turismo is known for, if you don’t like that aspect then there is plenty of other racing sims that offers what you want, if pd was changing that aspect of the game i would not buy it, drivning cars like a miata or civic type r stock is not as fun as tunet up version in my opinion, i also love the aspect with exhausts they change how the cars looks and sounds

 

[Scaff]

those expensive cars are endgame stuff and expecting that be able to afford them immediately is never going to happen and shouldn't happen.

This argument has been made a few times and it has a number of flaws.

• If that was the case then why did PD cycle not one, but two of them into the Legends UCD at this point in time, would it not have made more sense to start it out with cars in the price range of the DeTomaso?
• People have put in the grind for them, so it is going to happen
• PD/Sony have provided a mechanism by which anyone can buy any car on sale, in any dealership, and could do so from day 1. You just need to open your wallet wide.

As such the central tenant of your claim is fatally flawed, and even if it were true, it would further highlight poor game design on PD's part (actually either scenario does that).

 

[Johnnn]

Maybe not for you but for most people it is, and that is what gran turismo is known for, if you don’t like that aspect then there is plenty of other racing sims that offers what you want,

Last time I checked MC score I am not the only one. I like typical careers. GT7 has none and you can't even rent a car. It's not good.

 

[Scaff]

Maybe not for you but for most people it is,

Stating 'most people' would require proof, it's far better to say that people have different preferences in this regard.

and that is what gran turismo is known for,

It is, that doesn't however excuse them from implementing it badly

if you don’t like that aspect then there is plenty of other racing sims that offers what you want,

Or maybe PD implementing it better. It's perfectly possible to have a 'buy and upgrade' game design and still allow people to test drive cars, have them available in Free Run/Arcade, or loan them for events for a decreased payout. Plenty of titles follow this route and it provides a good balance for all cars, hell I know of one title that actually lets you try out paid DLC cars before you buy them!

 

[Ande3200]

Last time I checked MC score I am not the only one. I like typical careers. GT7 has none and you can't even rent a car. It's not good.

The rant has nothing to do with tuning its about the nerf from races and game being down for so long, i can promise you that of the remove the tuning and customization the game would drop quikly,

 

[Adam Barber]

This argument has been made a few times and it has a number of flaws.

• If that was the case then why did PD cycle not one, but two of them into the Legends UCD at this point in time, would it not have made more sense to start it out with cars in the price range of the DeTomaso?
• People have put in the grind for them, so it is going to happen
• PD/Sony have provided a mechanism by which anyone can buy any car on sale, in any dealership, and could do so from day 1. You just need to open your wallet wide.

As such the central tenant of your claim is fatally flawed, and even if it were true, it would further highlight poor game design on PD's part (actually either scenario does that).

That legendary dealership is purely random and in now way is the game forcing players to buy those any of those cars at all, it's FOMO that's causing everyone to panic as they must have them now. They'll come back around eventually and I'll still likely not use them then. It feels like a lot of the complaints are from people who haven't aywe a numbered GT game and started with sport where cars were just thrown at you and I never felt like I needed/wanted to buy anything. Again the game is 3 weeks old and there's been confirmation of more events coming, people just need to chill out and remember it's just a game, don't like it? Go play something else.

 

[AudiMan2011]

That legendary dealership is purely random and in now way is the game forcing players to buy those any of those cars at all, it's FOMO that's causing everyone to panic as they must have them now. They'll come back around eventually and I'll still likely not use them then. It feels like a lot of the complaints are from people who haven't aywe a numbered GT game and started with sport where cars were just thrown at you and I never felt like I needed/wanted to buy anything. Again the game is 3 weeks old and there's been confirmation of more events coming, people just need to chill out and remember it's just a game, don't like it? Go play something else.

You are clearly unaware of the tactics of psychological manipulation that the whole game industry uses to exploit people, not just PD. Its baked into the game design, not just something random.

 

[Adam Barber]

But it's not fun at all. I want to try my 917K I paid for. We bought all cars and want to play with them.

I feel like the game is broken and MC score is deserved.

If you got access the everything immediately then you'd get bored within a week and there wouldn't be any game to it.

You are clearly unaware of the tactics of psychological manipulation that the whole game industry uses to exploit people, not just PD. Its baked into the game design, not just something random.

If you think what PD is doing is bad whether intentional or not then you've got no idea what other publishers are like and how bad it could be.

 

[Johnnn]

If you got access the everything immediately then you'd get bored within a week and there wouldn't be any game to it.

What kind of argument is that? Most games have everything open because you paid for it. Artificial blocking is weird but I can play that game. It's completely broken in GT7.

 

[Adam Barber]

What kind of argument is that? Most games have everything open because you paid for it. Artificial blocking is weird but I can play that game. It's completely broken in GT7.

Giving people everything immediately isn't fun, that's the point. Look at the Forza Horizon games as an example, they come out and people love them but after a few weeks nobody cares and the playerbase have all got bored.

 

[torque99]

But it's not fun at all. I want to try my 917K I paid for. We bought all cars and want to play with them.

I do agree with this, we paid full price for the game £60-£100 so ideally all the cars they included on day one should at least be playable within the game via arcade mode or a 'reasonable' time earning credits for them without grinding.
I also want access to a few in the Legends dealer but with the limited timescale they introduced this time there is no way I can get 18+million credits even if they were sitting there a month. I only have 400,000cr at the moment so no chance for me to get these cars (unless something changes) or I win all my roulettes as gold bars

 

[GTP_reddevil]

If you got access the everything immediately then you'd get bored within a week and there wouldn't be any game to it.

Us as players (typically) aren’t expecting everything accessible from day 1 - but rather the process of accessing further content should be somewhat reasonable and so far this isn’t possible in GT7 properly.

 

[Johnnn]

Giving people everything immediately isn't fun, that's the point. Look at the Forza Horizon games as an example, they come out and people love them but after a few weeks nobody cares and the playerbase have all got bored.

LOL, what? Assetto Corsa, Assetto Corsa Competizione, Project Cars 1, Project Cars 2, F1 and many others. Even in casual games you usually have some renting.

And if I look at Horizon 4 I played it more than 1500 hours because it has so many cars and things to do. Horizon never bored me. Economy there is a bit slow but way faster than in GT7.

 

[wowbaggerBR]

If you got access the everything immediately then you'd get bored within a week and there wouldn't be any game to it.

Thing is... nobody is asking for that. People are asking for a sensible middle ground between the insane level of grind required to get a 20 million car today (more thant 20 hours!) and a faster progression system achieved by a more ballanced economy.

And, as others have been saying to you, if the issue was preventing player from getting this or that car early, why on earth make them available instantly, no effort required whatsoever, just a matter of open your wallet and presto? Your argument here simply doesn't make any sense.

If you think what PD is doing is bad whether intentional or not then you've got no idea what other publishers are like and how bad it could be.

Man, sending the game with no MTX to reviewers, skewing the economy so that everything takes way longer, making MTX packs much more expensive than before, introducing FOMO mechanics, issuing a patch that makes the economy even worse few days after release, issuing a tone deaf open letter to your loyal fans, all in matter of weeks... doesn't get worse than this, really.

Polyphony and Sony's behaviour are the sort of thing that makes EA go like "oah, this is a bit greedy!"

 

[El_Beardo]

The game is 20 days old.
We're getting new cars.
New events.
New menus.
Other additional features.
Seasonal events coming too, apparently.

Why the need to own everything NOW?

After 20 days.

You don't need every unicorn car available, right now.

GTS ruined things for a lot of you, I'm sure.

 

[Moglet]

Look at the Forza Horizon games as an example, they come out and people love them but after a few weeks nobody cares and the playerbase have all got bored.

How did you get access to the player numbers?

 

[Scaff]

That legendary dealership is purely random

Given that nothing else of that nature in the game is, or ever has been in the series, I find that very unlikley.

and in now way is the game forcing players to buy those any of those cars at all,

I didn't say it was.

it's FOMO that's causing everyone to panic as they must have them now.

Which is a game design mechanic.

They'll come back around eventually and I'll still likely not use them then.

You =/= everyone

It feels like a lot of the complaints are from people who haven't aywe a numbered GT game and started with sport where cars were just thrown at you and I never felt like I needed/wanted to buy anything. Again the game is 3 weeks old and there's been confirmation of more events coming, people just need to chill out and remember it's just a game, don't like it? Go play something else.

I literally own every GT title, numbered or otherwise, including such oddities as the BMW 1-Series demo (fun fact - first time the 'ring appeared in GT), all day 1, have met Kaz, got my copy of GT3 signed by him. It's also ironic that you claim others haven't a history with the series because GTS 'threw cars at you', it's been well documented already in this thread and others than the majority of the past titles not only threw cars at you, but had significantly less grind (we even published an article on that) than either GTS or GT7, and also let you sell those cars as well.

As such, no I don't think I will take your instruction to stop playing it, what I will do instead is continue to discuss what I do and don not like about it, just as I have done here for near 20 years.