MH17 Crash In Ukraine. Known info in OP.
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MH17 – Forensic Analysis of Satellite Images Released by the Russian Ministry of Defence
May 31, 2015
By Bellingcat
In this new report Bellingcat examines satellite images released by the Russian Ministry of Defence as part of the July 21st 2014 press conference on the downing of Flight MH17.
The Russian MoD stated at the press conference that the satellite photos show the activities of Ukraine’s air defences on the day that Flight MH17 was shot down. In particular, the position of two Ukrainian Buk missile launchers south of the village Zaroschinskoe were shown to be within firing range of MH17. The Bellingcat investigation has found the following –
– Satellite images presented by the Russian Ministry of Defence claiming to shown Ukrainian Buks linked to the downing of MH17 on July 14th and 17th are in fact older images from June 2014.
– The discrepancies visible in the Russian MoD satellite map imagery which shows they are incorrectly dated are visible in publicly available imagery on Google Earth.
– Error level analysis of the images also reveal the images have been edited.
– This includes a Buk missile launcher that was removed to make it appear the Buk missile launcher was active on July 17th, and imagery where Buk missile launchers were added to make it appear they were within attack range of Flight MH17.
From here
Sketchy update yet again.
Why is the world still waiting for the West to show their satellite photos? Now all we have are altered Russian ones.
May 31, 2015
By Bellingcat
In this new report Bellingcat examines satellite images released by the Russian Ministry of Defence as part of the July 21st 2014 press conference on the downing of Flight MH17.
The Russian MoD stated at the press conference that the satellite photos show the activities of Ukraine’s air defences on the day that Flight MH17 was shot down. In particular, the position of two Ukrainian Buk missile launchers south of the village Zaroschinskoe were shown to be within firing range of MH17. The Bellingcat investigation has found the following –
– Satellite images presented by the Russian Ministry of Defence claiming to shown Ukrainian Buks linked to the downing of MH17 on July 14th and 17th are in fact older images from June 2014.
– The discrepancies visible in the Russian MoD satellite map imagery which shows they are incorrectly dated are visible in publicly available imagery on Google Earth.
– Error level analysis of the images also reveal the images have been edited.
– This includes a Buk missile launcher that was removed to make it appear the Buk missile launcher was active on July 17th, and imagery where Buk missile launchers were added to make it appear they were within attack range of Flight MH17.
From here
Sketchy update yet again.
Why is the world still waiting for the West to show their satellite photos? Now all we have are altered Russian ones.
VolkswagenX
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Where in the world are you accessing from, and have you tried a proxy?
@Dennisch & @Denur, working for me. Will digest later.
In parallel news there are reports that Malaysian Airlines is now "technically bankrupt", a state of affairs that the overseers say began long before the events of 2014.
VolkswagenX
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The Netherlans but the link is working now.
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http://www.news.com.au/travel/trave...ile-but-not-ours/story-fnizu68q-1227380696180
Russia now says MH17 was shot down by a BUK missle but it was "Ukraine's" not ours.
Russia now says MH17 was shot down by a BUK missle but it was "Ukraine's" not ours.
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That's always been their story.
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Moscow (AFP) - The Russian firm making missiles similar to the one the West claims downed Malaysia Airlines flight MH17 in Ukraine said on Tuesday the passenger jet was likely hit by a BUK missile system.
All 298 passengers and crew on board the Malaysia Airlines jetliner -- the majority of them Dutch -- died when it was shot down over rebel-held eastern Ukraine last year.
Officials from state-controlled missile producer Almaz-Antey said they could not pinpoint which side shot down the plane, but intimated that the Ukrainian army was responsible as they unveiled their own report into the incident based on publicly available photographs of the wreckage.
"The first stage of our analysis showed that the type of missile system used was a BUK-M1," company official Mikhail Malyshevsky said at a press conference, Russian news agencies reported.
Company officials said that the BUK-M1 missile had not been produced in Russia since 1999 and was in the arsenal of the Ukrainian armed forces.
Almaz-Antey alleged that the missile was probably fired from close to the village of Zaroshchenske to the south of the jet's flight path.
"We cannot comment on who was stationed there" at the time, company director Yan Novikov said.
Ukraine and the West have accused pro-Moscow rebels of shooting down the plane with a BUK missile supplied by Russia.
Russia's defence ministry has denied any involvement and pointed blame at either a Ukrainian missile system or another jet.
Dutch investigators have collected wreckage of the plane and are expected to release a final report into the cause of the crash by around October.
British citizen journalist group Bellingcat released a report on Sunday claiming to show the Russian defence ministry had doctored satellite images to bolster its claims.
That should be clear enough, right?
VolkswagenX
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Moscow (AFP) - The Russian firm making missiles similar to the one the West claims downed Malaysia Airlines flight MH17 in Ukraine said on Tuesday the passenger jet was likely hit by a BUK missile system.
All 298 passengers and crew on board the Malaysia Airlines jetliner -- the majority of them Dutch -- died when it was shot down over rebel-held eastern Ukraine last year.
Officials from state-controlled missile producer Almaz-Antey said they could not pinpoint which side shot down the plane, but intimated that the Ukrainian army was responsible as they unveiled their own report into the incident based on publicly available photographs of the wreckage.
"The first stage of our analysis showed that the type of missile system used was a BUK-M1," company official Mikhail Malyshevsky said at a press conference, Russian news agencies reported.
Company officials said that the BUK-M1 missile had not been produced in Russia since 1999 and was in the arsenal of the Ukrainian armed forces.
Almaz-Antey alleged that the missile was probably fired from close to the village of Zaroshchenske to the south of the jet's flight path.
"We cannot comment on who was stationed there" at the time, company director Yan Novikov said.
Ukraine and the West have accused pro-Moscow rebels of shooting down the plane with a BUK missile supplied by Russia.
Russia's defence ministry has denied any involvement and pointed blame at either a Ukrainian missile system or another jet.
Dutch investigators have collected wreckage of the plane and are expected to release a final report into the cause of the crash by around October.
British citizen journalist group Bellingcat released a report on Sunday claiming to show the Russian defence ministry had doctored satellite images to bolster its claims.
That should be clear enough, right?
No, not clear at all and thanks for linking another article that had nothing to do with the article I was asking a question about...
Being a official of a state controlled company does not make one an offical spokesman of an entire country, right? Perhaps the title should have been:
Russian (state controlled) missle producer claims Ukraine shot down MH17?
VolkswagenX
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Yeah, thanks )
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It's the same article from a different website?
You asked about an official statement.
A statement coming from a spokesperson from a state controlled company should be clear enough.
Or do you want Putin telling you the same thing?
Unless I am missing something, or misreading what you want.
VolkswagenX
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This is what I asked, right?
No, I did not. See what I asked above.
It's not about what I want, It's about what was written..
I would have less problems with that if it was actually Putin who said this. He is an actual elected government official vs an official who works for a state owned weapons company. Please explain how Almaz-Antey is an official spokesperson on all matters concerning Russia?
Looks like you are missing something.
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THE Russian maker of the Buk air defence missile system has concluded that Malaysian Airlines flight 17 was downed by an older version of the missile, which isn’t in service with the Russian military but is in Ukrainian arsenals
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Clearing it up. The investigation had found shrapnel fragments (rectangle-shaped as I remember) of the 9M38 missile used by Buk-M1 systems. According to the manufacturer, all M1s in the Russian arsenals are replaced by Buk-M1-2 (which is basically an upgrade of the M1) and Buk-M2 systems, which (normally) use different missiles (9M317) with different blasting elements (not rectangles).
Well, this is explainable, since the "Buk" word had made too much noise on the media, plus it wasn't one of the new toys of the Defence Ministry revealed on that parade.
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Yep, I understand.
BTW, the systems that were shown on the parade in Moscow this year were the new ones with short fins.
Although I don't know what models were shown in other cities, the system that caught fire in Chita had the old models.
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The company was founded by the Russian presidency and any employee giving a press conference on behalf of its director (Vladislav Menshikov) is by dint an official spokesman, particularly anyone who's empowered to speak on the subject of Byk right now.
Official "investigations" of evidence relating to Byk in this case will naturally be undertaken by Almaz-Antey. If you look at their umbrella organisation they oversee every state asset that would likely be used to assess the "evidence". It is incredible that they would act without official sanction in this, I'm afraid.
If the situation were reversed politically (eg a senior Director's adviser from Lockheed made a statement about the likelihood of any given Lockheed missile downing an airliner) then the separation of industry and state would stop that statement from being considered state-official.
In the case of Almaz-Antey (and other large state-controlled Russian companies) the statement can be seen very differently... large industry operates completely differently there. Often that can actually be a good thing...
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Dotini
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Bellingcat, which appears to operate from a third-floor office in Leicester, a city in the English Midlands, “independent researchers.” ??
...examine the Bellingcat web site and try to figure out who runs it. I tried the about page and it was blank. The site consists of badly supported anti-Russian “reports”—no “investigation” aimed in any other direction.
http://www.salon.com/2015/06/03/we_..._has_turned_truth_in_the_ukraine_on_its_head/
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Unfortunately it is as close as news comes on this topic.
It's that or totally unbiased Russian reports.
But, our minister of foreign affairs Koenders had a sturdy talk with his Russian counterpart Lavrov today, maybe that will shed some new light on the matter, but somehow I doubt it.
It's that or totally unbiased Russian reports.
But, our minister of foreign affairs Koenders had a sturdy talk with his Russian counterpart Lavrov today, maybe that will shed some new light on the matter, but somehow I doubt it.
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My guess is the west probably are close to knowing or know exactly what has happened to the finest detail and are either planing something or sweeping it all under the carpet.
But their lack of say or information given to the public on this matter is virtually zero and its quite weird.
My guess is maybe a mass embargo and strict sanctions may be coming and it may all hit in one go.
But their lack of say or information given to the public on this matter is virtually zero and its quite weird.
My guess is maybe a mass embargo and strict sanctions may be coming and it may all hit in one go.
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Come on, you can do better than that
A third-floor office in Leicester? If indeed that's where the organisation is based then I don't see the problem... renting an office is renting an office. I'd be far more suspicious about their funding and motives if they were in Mayfair. If you're on a budget and you already live in Leicester then an office there has plenty to recommend it.
And Salon couldn't figure out who ran it? They're either lying or incapable of using Google for even simple tasks.
The point of Bellingcat is that they use crowd-sourced open-source methods to investigate stories. That's what they've done in this case; their results are explained and can be reproduced by any reader without the need for expensive, exclusive GCHQ-style software. They may be David to Russia's Goliath in this story but that doesn't make their findings any less valid.
I can understand Salon's horror at the idea of not being the only (or best) show in town but even by their standards this article made a huge number of assumptions and hoped that the reader might too.
Dotini
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Information is a weapon. You release it if it hurts the others, but don't if it hurts the agenda you are pursuing.
Who knows/cares what the truth really is? It hardly matters. What matters is our agenda, which appears to be worsening relations leading to conflict and war between the US/Britain and Russia /China. Since we are in the west, our interests supposedly coincide with the US/Britain, whether they have the right of it or not. If you're young and hopeful for a future, you must go with the gal you brought to the dance. If old and cynical, like me, you can afford to tell everyone to bugger off because you know they're all lying out their anal sphincter. Our leaders are insane, unfortunately. All of them.
My advice is to find the lies that please you most, and devote yourself to them. Give up the search for truth, and go for the pleasures of the flesh and the mind. Seek not for truth; if there is a truth, it will find you.
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