Mother at 12?

[Keef]

Couldn't you PM your responses to Fam's advice directly to him intead of making another warned-against post and annoying him once again? I'm not mad, I'm just curious.
So, anyway, I think it absolutely disgusting that whnever I come into this thread I end up picturing myself fiddling with a 12 year old pregnant whore with flappy-meat-wing-syndrome.
Oh god, I just threw up in my mouth.

 

[Rogue Ssv]

Believe it or not...I actually never thought of that. Oh my God Im so stupid...Thanks for the idea, Ill do that next time.... anyway, I have nothing more to say on the topic, so...

 

[Keef]

What, having sex with a twelve year old? Dude, whatever blows your skirt up.

 

[Jondot]

No. Absolutely not. Kids have NO clue about raising a child, and very little idea of how much responsibilty a child actually is. That baby is getting screwed right off the bat, being born into an irresponsible family.

Yes. Not just that, but the kid will most probably have some kind of problems when his/her mother is smoking 20 a day...

Sad as it is, i bet this isn't an isolated case either.

 

[Diego440]

Sad as it is, i bet this isn't an isolated case either.

It's a social phenomenom (sp?)

 

[Poverty]

This story is reminding me of he aid workers in africa who are having sex with children as young as six in exchange for aid. There are some messed up things going on in this world.

 

[SRV2LOW4ME]

Unfortuantly, this 12 year old doesn't surprise me. The city I live in has the highest teen pregnancy rate in all of Canada. A 17 year old girl walking down the street with a toddler holding her hand while she's pushing a stroller down the street with a baby in the oven is almost common site around here.

Years ago, it was a shocker to hear about 16 year olds becoming preggers, but as we heard about it more, the shock value went away, and now its nothing new. Society, atleast in North America, has become used to it, and has passed the point of trying to prevent and has started to support it, offering programs, shelters (sometimes apartments), and money, etc. which I feel is part of the problem. Their young minds see having sex as cool, comparable to smoking, and don't care if they get preggers because they'll be given whatevers needed as soon as they have the baby. I know what girl in specific who lost her kid to child services and was fighting for her back, and when asked why, she responded with "because I can't afford my apartment without a kid". So your baby is just a pay check to you, nice.

In my opinion, its disturbing and wrong, as most (not all, there are some exceptions) of these children won't be given a decent life being raised by these young, inexpierenced mothers. Its also sad to say, with kids raising kids, it just adds momentem to the downward spiral of society.

 

[Gil]

What, that you're dead?

No, you silly, silly man.
That other part.

And SVR2LOW4ME just because it's a common sight, doesn't mean it's "right".
People every where are all concerned about getting sex at an early age.
They seem to be unconcerned with the "consequences", of which pregnancy, has become relatively minor. What about STDs?

When I was in high-school in the "self-indulgent" 1980's in California, the heart of liberal attitudes, we had a high-school of about 1000 kids.
I don't remember anybody being visibly pregnant. I know a couple of girls had babies. So, there were sex-capades.
Perhaps, there were more abortions.
Perhaps there was more condom use.
Perhaps most of us were only getting to third base.
Perhaps the pregnant girls were being hidden from the rest of us.
But for the record, I was way more worried about becoming a father, than about STDs.

I remember a friend, one girl that was from up north (San Jose), that had gotten pregnant, and got shipped off to the "Grans" in TX to have the baby, and I believe she gave it up for adoption. It was all kind of a big secret.

I guess my point is that a lot of stuff that maybe shouldn't, has become acceptable and commonplace. That still doesn't make it "right".
Granted, I look at my kids now, and realize that they are growing up, in some ways, way faster than I did.
I know 14-year-old girls that are built like the girls in my graduating class.
But just because they are built like grown women, doesn't mean that they are anything more than little girls. They need a chance to grow up more, so they will be a bit less likely to be the "victim" of some skirt-chasin' older guy.

 

[SRV2LOW4ME]

Gil - I know it isn't right, thats why I said...

In my opinion, its disturbing and wrong

...What i'm saying though, is its a finger up the poop shoot for society when we've already been given a fist. The shock value on the public of the rise in young mothers is almost to the point where its gone, and its just accepted as common place.

What about STDs?

They are taught about STD's and pregnancy starting in grade 7 (12 years old) here, so its not a matter of not knowing, its more a matter of not being able to comprehend it in a mature manner. Take smoking for example. They know its bad for them, its told to them everywhere (TV, posters, parents) and yet they ignore the warnings because its "cool" and all their friends are doing it.

Perhaps, there were more abortions.
Perhaps there was more condom use.
Perhaps most of us were only getting to third base.
Perhaps the pregnant girls were being hidden from the rest of us.

Thats a good list of ideas, and most of them are true. Another one you can look at is religion, which plays a big part in a girls morals and beliefs, especially when it comes to child bearing, and I believe you could probably find a direct coralation between the decline of religion in schools and in society with the rise in young mothers.

Also, the way sex is presented in all forms of media, such as billboards, music, TV, etc, and how its presented to them as something everyone does, giving them the thoughts and ideas to have sex at an earlier step in life.

I don't think all girls are developing at earlier stages, but I think they're presented like they are with the clothes they wear. Many of the girls you went to school with probably did have bodies like those of today, only now they're wearing low pants, thongs, and push up bra's with small tops where as i'm sure back when you were in school, the girls dressed more conservativily. Again, you can thank music, TV, etc, for that.

I agree with you completely as I feel these young mothers are nothing more then burdens on our government, soaking up money and resources that should be going to more important causes. Why should we have to pay for their inability to say "no" after being presented all the information, because theres no way they can claim "oh, I didn't know this would happen without wearing a condom!". Unfortuantly, any answers I have would probably be considered illegal, or unmoral, but hopefully an answer that works can be found before society no longer feels the fists and needs the whole arm.

 

[niky]

On teenage pregnancy... it's probably only shocking in light of the culture we have at the moment... unfortunately, being that young and having a kid in this society automatically guarantees that you won't have the financial resources to take care of it, not like in tribal societies where it's more common and extended family groups exist to share the burden.

The problem isn't just that they're having kids at a young age. The problem is that thanks to the rigorous career pathing and ridiculously loooong educational programs Western society dictates, most people aren't really self-sufficient till they're waaaaaay into their reproductive age.

You don't really need to be in school fifteen to sixteen years to learn to be an accountant, you know... But then, a lot of people can do twenty or more years and still won't be able to do simple statistics.

Thus, it becomes morally questionable to have kids at 16 (a ripe age to become a great hunter! Whoo Whoo!) or even at 18 (y' could be tilling a lot of land at that age, sonny), not because it's too young... but because you don't have the wherewithal to support the little rugrat. The maturity question exists only because we're focused on allowing our kids to be immature for as long as we can. I know a lot of 12 year olds more mature than me... Of course, if we train our kids to be responsible for themselves at home (really responsible), then they won't have this problem in the first place.

The religious question goes both ways... religion preaches chastity, yes, but it also bans contraception (not outright anymore, but they still prohibit it in more subtle ways). Great if kids accept both teachings, really bad if they forget the one about chastity, but still have a bias against contraceptives.

Information is a two-edged sword. The only way to actually prevent kids from absorbing mis-information and cues about sex from the media is to use the media to teach them about condom/contraceptive use and safe sex.

Of course, that leads to the dilemma of having them know even more about sex, but it'll save some of them from having babies. Most will ignore the warnings, though... like you've said... but idiocy is a sickness that really doesn't have any cure.

Maybe mandatory ligation or vasectomies should be in order? Then you have your tubes patched up once you're legal age for pregnancy/fathering... say...oh... when you're thirty?

 

[Kylehnat]

Maybe mandatory ligation or vasectomies should be in order?

Personally, I don't think there are enough castrato singers in the world today 💡.

See that stone? I just killed two birds with it. BOO-YAH!

 

[niky]

That's one bird, two stones, and a big rock crusher, actually...

And yeah, it would be interesting to have castrati again... ooh! ooh! New employment opportunities for the willing! Have your kid neutered and send him to the Vienna Boy's Choir!

 

[GT4_Rule]

Oh my god....she think she can cope with it since she has experience looking after young kids. What a joke. Motherhood is nowhere as easy as looking after a few kids.

 

[Touring Mars]

The father is on a rape charge.

Which is the first time I've heard of in absolutely ages where an underage girl has given birth and the father has actually been prosecuted for the crime of statutory rape (of which he is guilty - sex with an under-16 year old IS statutory rape).

Though I'm a little puzzled why she hasn't been charged too.

Precisely what I was thinking. It's up to the parents of the child/victim to bring a charge of statutory rape, isn't it? In this circumstance, I think it's a bit rich for a parent who allows their child to do whatever the hell they want to then throw their arms up in horror at the consequences. If I were the parents of the underage 'father', I'd be inclined to sue for statutory rape against the girl's family too.

I hope my comments are not misconstrued... I think that both of these children are victims in this case, both of them have been let down by their respective legal guardians. It just seems highly ironic that the parents are so concerned about it now - a classic case of closing the stable door once the horse has bolted...

 

[TurboSmoke]

Precisely what I was thinking. It's up to the parents of the child/victim to bring a charge of statutory rape, isn't it? In this circumstance, I think it's a bit rich for a parent who allows their child to do whatever the hell they want to then throw their arms up in horror at the consequences. If I were the parents of the underage 'father', I'd be inclined to sue for statutory rape against the girl's family too.
...

agreed. Statutory rape should be reviewed. Sure the lad is guilty but he himself is below the age if criminal responsibility. I know that ignorance of the law is no protection from it but what you have here is a case of two kids mucking about and getting into real trouble.

The parents are to blame in my opinion.

 

[ExigeEvan]

Precisely what I was thinking. It's up to the parents of the child/victim to bring a charge of statutory rape, isn't it? In this circumstance, I think it's a bit rich for a parent who allows their child to do whatever the hell they want to then throw their arms up in horror at the consequences. If I were the parents of the underage 'father', I'd be inclined to sue for statutory rape against the girl's family too.

I think the only time girls have been convicted of statory rape have been when substances are involved or they's used a certain 'item'.

 

[Gil]

I don't think all girls are developing at earlier stages, but I think they're presented like they are with the clothes they wear. Many of the girls you went to school with probably did have bodies like those of today, only now they're wearing low pants, thongs, and push up bra's with small tops where as i'm sure back when you were in school, the girls dressed more conservativily. Again, you can thank music, TV, etc, for that.

You are only sorta right. I grew up in California in the '80's. Conservatism was right out the window there.
The girls wore little of nothing back then too. (At least in Cali).
And there were a few that were pretty well "equipped" in 9th grade.

But now it's 7th grade girls looking near grown, and near nekkid.

 

[Kylehnat]

But now it's 7th grade girls looking near grown, and near nekkid.

I remember some, um, shall we say...advanced girls as early as 5th grade. Also, one of my cousins started menstruating in 4th grade. Some people say it's the hormones in milk...

 

[Danoff]

Is this really all that shocking? As our species goes, 11-12 used to be the opening of the breeding years. By late 20s you were dead. Yes girls are capable of getting pregnant at 11-12 years old, and if they're capable somebody out there is going to do it.

 

[GT4_Rule]

Its advancing for sure. I read a report on that subject about a year ago.

 

[FERGU$_MANERGU$]

what is wrong with this world