Motorcycles in GT5?

[thelvynau]

You mean like the karts? Again, I don't mind it personally. But I'm sure that the majority of GT5 players couldn't care less if PD suddenly said "Nope. We're not going to add anything kart related anymore. Everything else will be car related."

Not to mention that most people (most noticeably on GTPlanet) are asking for new cars rather than motorcycles. Obviously PD would answer to the bigger crowd.

PD dont just get their feedback from here.

Imagine if every person on here disagreed with something and everyone else who dont come on here agreed with it we good people here would be largely out numbered.

 

[mjm23race]

Can't remember if I already wrote anything in this thread, but to keep it short

HELL NO!! not now, not ever!

Cheers

EDIT:

I would actually, seriously consider abandoning GT completely if they added bikes.

I am calling b.s. on this. If you would seriously leave GT because they added something that you didn't like, then I would say have fun playing Halo, or Forza or whatever.

There's always going to be two sides on this. One side that wants bikes, and one that doesn't. If PD does add bikes, then people are going to complain that they don't spend enough time adding new cars into the game.

Most GT players are car enthusiasts. They can tell you the difference between a GT-R and a GT-R SpecV, but not the difference between a Ducati 1098, 1098S, and 1098R. PD will always try to answer to the bigger audience, so, from a marketing view, adding bikes will just be a waste of time and money for themselves and GTers.

So no I don't want motorcycles in GT5. That should be for Tourist Trophy 2.

No matter what they do, there are going to be tons of people complaining about what they didn't do.

Of course not.

That's what the Tourist Trophy series is for.

1 game does not constitute a series. I would love to have a series.

So the main objection by many seems to be that creating bikes takes time away from GT-development, so it isn't necessarily an objection to bikes being included in GT5 (since it could be easily implemented in a way you won't have to see or use bikes) but basically an objection to Tourist Trophy 2 altogether.

That's a bit rich don't you think? What if I said GT6 takes time away from TT2?
Okay, GT-games are the bread and butter of PD but a lot here will enjoy waiting for GT6 whilst they play TT2 (and GT5, or both simultaneously if they were incorporated).
For all we know, they're already building those bikes and developing a sequel as we speak anyway, which I hope to be true.

That would be quite awesome, and monumental. Again no matter what, some people will never be satisfied, and will have to complain about something.

Who is actually being selfish then? The majority who don't want bikes or the minority who do?

The Minority on a forum devoted to a (at the moment) car sim is what I would expect. But broaden the spectrum to other parts of the gaming world and I bet there are almost as many people that would want bikes included or at the very least not care one way or another. Much to the dismay of many I am sure, there are actually quite a few people interested in the bike aspect. Must be something to it? Controversy can actually be sort of healthy it lets PD see what people are interested in either way, and they can figure out how to satisfy all of us.

Considering they had to deal with and relocate from a nuclear disaster, and they are still bringing us stuff for a year old game that they already made their money off of us for I think is pretty good! They obviously are developing things all the time for our future and their own. I just hope that future has a soft spot for the 2 wheeled part of motorsports!

 

[another_jakhole]

You mean like the karts? Again, I don't mind it personally. But I'm sure that the majority of GT5 players couldn't care less if PD suddenly said "Nope. We're not going to add anything kart related anymore. Everything else will be car related."

Not to mention that most people (most noticeably on GTPlanet) are asking for new cars rather than motorcycles. Obviously PD would answer to the bigger crowd.

Not like that karts. And that was only implemented because it was leaked that PD were working on them. This means that this is only the start of karting and I'm looking forward to it (GT6). DTM and FIA wasn't added in the game because of the unexpected, early release of GT5. Other motorsport like rally racing dirt/snow. Edit - and F1 even though it's obvious it's only there to be THERE, but still playable in GT5. The number of LMP cars in GT. All the other racing series's that are represented in GT. I'm stopping there, because I'm not going to try to sound like I follow all of that.

Another thing is that GT isn't all production cars, not all race cars, not all concept cars, not all karts, and not all Japanese and not all fantasy. It's everything. Looking at it this way, we can see that bikes in GT5 isn't exactly an unreasonable request.

You can't really say that. Just like how some people say that the rally in GT5 is garbage and Colin Mcrae/Dirt does it better so they don't see a point in it. Doesn't mean that's the consensus of the majority of GT players and it doesn't mean that they'll never improve rally in GT5. Karting and rally will inevitably improve as this is really only the first GT game with this physics engine. Oh yea, they had to test physics on the karting, so that might mean they'll have to do the same for bikes this time around if it get's implemented the best way (the most time-consuming way, too).

PD dont just get their feedback from here.

Imagine if every person on here disagreed with something and everyone else who dont come on here agreed with it we good people here would be largely out numbered.

👍

I am calling b.s. on this. If you would seriously leave GT because they added something that you didn't like, then I would say have fun playing Halo, or Forza or whatever.

It's completely called for to say that as it's exactly how it looks. It's ignorant to go through with something like that. How wrongly spiteful can someone be to do that? Not even wrong, it just looks unnecessary and blah.


General statement -
People are saying that PD only follows the same formula and it's the same ol', same ol'. How can you say that when you're denying the entry of variety? GT is a sole car game and has been for years. Now it's gone on to karting and F1 (yes I know), so why not GP racing?

 

[1241Penguin]

PD dont just get their feedback from here.

So you're suggesting that PD rambles around motorcycle forums looking for cyclists who play GT5?

Imagine if every person on here disagreed with something and everyone else who dont come on here agreed with it we good people here would be largely out numbered.

Where else have you seen the idea of motorcycles in GT5 pop up?

Not like that karts. And that was only implemented because it was leaked that PD were working on them. This means that this is only the start of karting and I'm looking forward to it (GT6). DTM and FIA wasn't added in the game because of the unexpected, early release of GT5. Other motorsport like rally racing dirt/snow. Edit - and F1 even though it's obvious it's only there to be THERE, but still playable in GT5. The number of LMP cars in GT. All the other racing series's that are represented in GT. I'm stopping there, because I'm not going to try to sound like I follow all of that.

If PD were to add yet another motorsport (namely motorcycles), every other series in GT5 (NASCAR, F1, WRC) would have even less effort put into it.

The licenses have been highly underused by PD. Using WRC as an example, all PD did was add some cars and that's it. They didn't even bother with real-life WRC tracks.

I'd rather PD get rid of half of the motorsports if that means they can improve the rest.

Another thing is that GT isn't all production cars, not all race cars, not all concept cars, not all karts, and not all Japanese and not all fantasy. It's everything. Looking at it this way, we can see that bikes in GT5 isn't exactly an unreasonable request.

So I'm getting cars and karts. Anything else you'd like to add?

You can't really say that. Just like how some people say that the rally in GT5 is garbage and Colin Mcrae/Dirt does it better so they don't see a point in it. Doesn't mean that's the consensus of the majority of GT players and it doesn't mean that they'll never improve rally in GT5.

What has PD done with the WRC license? The inclusion of WRC cars. That's it.

Karting and rally will inevitably improve as this is really only the first GT game with this physics engine. Oh yea, they had to test physics on the karting, so that might mean they'll have to do the same for bikes this time around if it get's implemented the best way (the most time-consuming way, too).

How do you know?

 

[Watt2159]

one thing I would like to say, is that people are worried that if bikes are added to GT, or there is another TT made, that it will slow down the progress of GT6, I have to say that does sound like a good point, but here is the thing, PD already has about......200(?) or so models from TT, and all PD really has to do is re-model, and re-texture the bikes for better quality, and then impliment the driving physichs into GT5. They've already proven that they can do that with GT HD, and I highly doubt that PD would release 200 bikes in on DLC, maybe 10 at the most.

 

[1241Penguin]

Oui! Again, I don't mind bikes in GT5 - I'd actually want it. But not if it means slowing down the addition of new Premium cars and slowing the development of GT6.

If PD took the shortcut and ported them from TT, then I don't care.

 

[peterjford]

What has PD done with the WRC license? The inclusion of WRC cars. That's it.

And if all they did with licenses from motorcycle manufacturers was the inclusion of some motorcycles I would be happy with that. How poorly they implemented WRC has nothing to do with whether or not they should include motorcycles.

 

[another_jakhole]

And if all they did with licenses from motorcycle manufacturers was the inclusion of some motorcycles I would be happy with that. How poorly they implemented WRC has nothing to do with whether or not they should include motorcycles.

That was my point 👍. I thought I was clear about that in the first sentences of my reply.

Oui! Again, I don't mind bikes in GT5 - I'd actually want it. But not if it means slowing down the addition of new Premium cars and slowing the development of GT6.

If PD took the shortcut and ported them from TT, then I don't care.

They'd have to do the physics for them since they didn't just improve GT4's physics engine for Prologue and GT5. Everything was from scratch using the knowledge they had of the physics since the start of GT.

Karting and rally will inevitably improve as this is really only the first GT game with this physics engine. Oh yea, they had to test physics on the karting, so that might mean they'll have to do the same for bikes this time around if it get's implemented the best way (the most time-consuming way, too).

How do you know?

... good lord.


AAAAND that's why I feel the need to source everything.

 

[1241Penguin]

And if all they did with licenses from motorcycle manufacturers was the inclusion of some motorcycles I would be happy with that. How poorly they implemented WRC has nothing to do with whether or not they should include motorcycles.

Everything's going to be half-assed if PD does one thing partially and something else partially in an attempt to implement as many features as they are asked to.

They'd have to do the physics for them since they didn't just improve GT4's physics engine for Prologue and GT5. Everything was from scratch using the knowledge they had of the physics since the start of GT.

Alright then. How do you know PD can manage themselves to get this done whilst trying to add more cars to GT5? Given PD's history of not being able to do things efficiently and without delay.

... good lord.


AAAAND that's why I feel the need to source everything.

My bad. I thought you were referring to GT5.

 

[analog]

Thing is, you can't blame people for not liking or wanting bikes, even Kaz himself admitted they didn't interest him much, TT was a pet project lead by one dedicated bike-mad employee which he gave his blessing to.
What does strike me as odd is that some are so anti-bike for whatever reason and seemingly afraid it might hurt the GT-franchise in more than one way, it completely blinds them from accepting a Tourist Trophy sequel (or bike DLC) could or should be a viable possibility in the near future.

Right now, I can't play my copy of TT on my PS3 (haven't got a PS2 anymore) and believe me, I've tried to replace it with other bike titles in recent years, yet they don't even come close apart perhaps from the graphics at which they finally trumped TT, the physics or even the scope (remember, road bikes mostly and not just racing bikes, it really was the GT of bike games) are so limited or appallingly bad that a lot of GT fans really crave (relatively speaking ofcourse) for a new TT game much more than another GT title right now.

So I guess you could indeed argue that GT should only be about cars, but since when does the same reasoning apply to Polyphony Digital?

 

[Watt2159]

Oui! Again, I don't mind bikes in GT5 - I'd actually want it. But not if it means slowing down the addition of new Premium cars and slowing the development of GT6.

If PD took the shortcut and ported them from TT, then I don't care.

Exactly that would be a GIGANTIC time saver, all they'd really need to do after that is implement the driving model.

 

[thelvynau]

So you're suggesting that PD rambles around motorcycle forums looking for cyclists who play GT5?

Where else have you seen the idea of motorcycles in GT5 pop up?

If PD were to add yet another motorsport (namely motorcycles), every other series in GT5 (NASCAR, F1, WRC) would have even less effort put into it.

The licenses have been highly underused by PD. Using WRC as an example, all PD did was add some cars and that's it. They didn't even bother with real-life WRC tracks.

I'd rather PD get rid of half of the motorsports if that means they can improve the rest.

So I'm getting cars and karts. Anything else you'd like to add?

What has PD done with the WRC license? The inclusion of WRC cars. That's it.

How do you know?

I am suggesting they dont only do their research here.

As great as this site is (the best in my opinion) there are other avenues for pd to get peoples wants and wish lists not everyone who plays gt5 come on here.

 

[uMadson?]

1 game does not constitute a series. I would love to have a series.

It may not, but it's a different game altogether so yeah. I hope you got what I meant.

 

[LMSCorvetteGT2]

I am suggesting they dont only do their research here.

As great as this site is (the best in my opinion) there are other avenues for pd to get peoples wants and wish lists not everyone who plays gt5 come on here.

If only though, right?

 

[m8h3r]

I've driven bikes on a number of different games and I've never been able to do it correctly. I always fall off or similar. It's a no vote for me because I personally like the 4 wheels which I can control (somewhat) in comparison to me just getting stressed out at my bike falling over 24/7

 

[mjm23race]

I've driven bikes on a number of different games and I've never been able to do it correctly. I always fall off or similar. It's a no vote for me because I personally like the 4 wheels which I can control (somewhat) in comparison to me just getting stressed out at my bike falling over 24/7

Very much like real life. Anyone can drive something with 4 wheels but it takes some practice to master 2 wheels. But once it is mastered there is nothing that compares. I am sure that with aids on you could get on and ride with no problems.

 

[Griffith500]

Very much like real life. Anyone can drive something with 4 wheels but it takes some practice to master 2 wheels. But once it is mastered there is nothing that compares. I am sure that with aids on you could get on and ride with no problems.

Yes, TT offered a range of different options in this regard, much like GT does, but it also had two separate control, er, "paradigms", if you will, in that the default control set gives you one brake button and molly-coddles you around the track. The "expert" mode leaves most of it up to the player (except the body positioning stuff; aside from fore-aft weighting and "head tuck", it's all automated by lean angle and such, but still customisable via the "riding form" system, which was a revelation in itself.)

It was the GT4 physics engine, though, so it had perma-ABS and weird stability control, and really, really weird tyre physics, but it felt so natural to swing the bike from corner to corner, and each bike felt subtly different. As has been said, it really was the GT of bike games, very accessible, great feel, not necessarily 100% accurate. Needs improving, needs a sequel.

And for those "worried" about PD not spending 100% of their time on GT6, remember that's happened from the get-go. It's happening now, too, given they're still supporting GT5 to some extent.

 

[spikeyhairdude]

I would like bikes as it would be a change. More racing variety.

Bad thing about it is if you go online with a bike. some **** would keep crashing into you so the rider flies off.

Trust me Loads of people did this to me in midnight club because i was the faster one.

 

[Griffith500]

Online restrictions would help there, in the same way that you can virtually eliminate the rammers in GT5.


I've just had a thought (it'll take the rest of the day for me to recover). Should PD make a TT2 (in whatever form), they should also release a free update for the current (at that time) GT game with a few different bikes that you can test in arcade mode, or online, or what have you. It might be difficult in terms of the physics, but that would be such a good move on so many levels.

 

[Spagetti69]

Trust me Loads of people did this to me in midnight club because i was the faster one.

How? If you were faster?

 

[another_jakhole]

 

[sik180sx]

Really!? I can't believes this question is being asked,this a driving simulator for cars,it cant be turned into,tdu,midnight club or project gotham.
If you want to ride bikes go get moto gp,sbx or even one of the titles from thq for some dirt squirters,but in gran turismo?

 

[mjm23race]

Really!? I can't believes this question is being asked,this a driving simulator for cars,it cant be turned into,tdu,midnight club or project gotham.
If you want to ride bikes go get moto gp,sbx or even one of the titles from thq for some dirt squirters,but in gran turismo?

The reason people are asking for it is because PD made a great game in TT, but it is out of date and on an old system. Probably the easiest way to get the ball rolling is to have bikes as an addition to the GT series. It seriously shouldn't affect anyone that doesn't like bikes, dont use them if you dont like them. I am sure you would never be forced to race against them either. If it is just because you don't want to share a bit of box art for the greater good of Polyphony, then shame on you.

The problem with the titles that you mentioned as an alternative is that theuy all suck. Horrible physics, too arcade style, or again too out of date. That's like saying if you don't like what they do to GT then go play NFS, Nascar, F1, or whatever else is out there. It just isn't the same, and really isn't a decent alternative.

So far the only arguments I have really heard are:

1. I dont like bikes, and this is a car simulator.

It is only a car simulator until PD decides to put bikes in it, then it becomes a motorsports simulator. Again, I am sure no one will make you interact with bikes if you choose not to.

2. It will take too much time away from DLC and GT6, and I want more premium cars.

Honestly no one has any idea what PD does with it's time and resources. I am sure they are smart enough to work on things that are most important at any given time. I am also sure more premium cars, and more tracks are in our future no matter what.

 

[sik180sx]

The reason people are asking for it is because PD made a great game in TT, but it is out of date and on an old system. Probably the easiest way to get the ball rolling is to have bikes as an addition to the GT series. It seriously shouldn't affect anyone that doesn't like bikes, dont use them if you dont like them. I am sure you would never be forced to race against them either. If it is just because you don't want to share a bit of box art for the greater good of Polyphony, then shame on you.

The problem with the titles that you mentioned as an alternative is that theuy all suck. Horrible physics, too arcade style, or again too out of date. That's like saying if you don't like what they do to GT then go play NFS, Nascar, F1, or whatever else is out there. It just isn't the same, and really isn't a decent alternative.

So far the only arguments I have really heard are:

1. I dont like bikes, and this is a car simulator.

It is only a car simulator until PD decides to put bikes in it, then it becomes a motorsports simulator. Again, I am sure no one will make you interact with bikes if you choose not to.

2. It will take too much time away from DLC and GT6, and I want more premium cars.

Honestly no one has any idea what PD does with it's time and resources. I am sure they are smart enough to work on things that are most important at any given time. I am also sure more premium cars, and more tracks are in our future no matter what.

Don't get me wrong,if they put bikes in thats cool because,like you said i won't have to use them.I'm more surprised they are being asked for,like gt5 doesn't already have enough.

But just a hypothetical,what if they put seasonals up for bikes and i wanted the cash,but refuse to steer a motorcycle with a steering wheel.that would be a pain in the rear,and i don't think i would be the only one thinking this,or would i?

 

[mjm23race]

They always have drift TT's to go along with regular TT's when the new seasonals come out. I can't stand drifting so I just skip it. If I need the money bad enough I will go do a different seasonal instead of the drift one. Same principal, just because something is in the game doesn't mean you have to do it or like it. There are plenty of other things to occupy my GT time.

 

[J91patriz]

I love motorbikes, especially superbikes, that to be fully exploited require to be taken to a racetrack. I've been riding for a couple of years now, and have gained some experience with how a bike handles and how to ride it.

But just like any rider I've looked for a decent simulator to use mainly during winter periods, and, back then I thought Sbk x could have been a good idea.

Well I was wrong, and it's not only that game that I find really far from being a simulator, Moto gp is also one affected , in my opinion, by a big issue.

What I find problematic of motorbikes' simulators is how you can control a bike.
Using a ds3 is really difficult to really balance the movements properly (e.g. entrying a corner and keeping a good and constant lean angle).

I was a big fun of TT and played it quite a lot, yet I found it less realistic than it's brother Gt4. I remember watching some replays where I was literally on the asphalt, using my ears rather than my knee while going through the corner.

So in my opinion if Pd were serious about implementing bikes, they should do a great job, which would require time and resources that they seem not to have in abundance, perhaps causing other delays on the release of their coming games

 

[jonjwlee]

Firstly Polyphony Digital are not a publishing house; they are developers. Having them publish a game when they've never done it before is probably not a good idea. Secondly, if a Tourist Trophy sequel were to be made by anyone but PD, it won't be called TT. There's no way they'd relinquish control of their reputation like that. It doesn't matter if it's good or bad rep, it's still theirs.

Sorry, I didn't mean it that way. What I was trying to say was to have a Tourist Trophy sequel developed by a third party, but with Polyphony Digital overseeing the development throughout the process.

I really don't think an outside developer would ruin the game as long as Polyphony keeps a close eye. I might sound a bit elitist, but Tourist Trophy isn't like Gran Turismo. Since GT is pretty much Kazunori Yamauchi's pride and joy, I can see why he'd want to work on the series himself. Whereas I don't think Tourist Trophy has much the same attachment to the team so it probably wouldn't hurt the company much to outsource development of the title.

Basically, I, too, think TT2 as an entirely separate game is the most sensible, just to make sure Sony doesn't come up with some silly pricing ideas, and to avoid complication in general. Nobody wants just 10-20 bikes.

My thoughts exactly. It wouldn't make much sense taking a spanner to the basic foundations of GT5 just to add a few bikes.

What does strike me as odd is that some are so anti-bike for whatever reason and seemingly afraid it might hurt the GT-franchise in more than one way, it completely blinds them from accepting a Tourist Trophy sequel (or bike DLC) could or should be a viable possibility in the near future.

With all due respect, just as there have been car guys who can't handle Polyphony doing anything other than Gran Turismo and cars (who I admit have gone overboard with some of their remarks), there are also a smaller (but no less caustic) group of people who feel like everyone who opposes bikes being in GT is absurd and lambasts them angrily as being ignorant and selfish.

And for those "worried" about PD not spending 100% of their time on GT6, remember that's happened from the get-go. It's happening now, too, given they're still supporting GT5 to some extent.

Although I am leaning towards Polyphony outsourcing development of a Tourist Trophy sequel to another company, you and a number of others make a very good point. Those people who think a Tourist Trophy sequel would result in another 'unfinished' game are missing the point. GT5 suffered not because there wasn't enough effort focused on it, but because it was the victim of Polyphony's own high expectations, coupled with the ridiculous demands made by fans and critics alike. The completely new physics and graphics engine, the Course Maker, the improved AI, those alone must have taken an insane amount of time and money to develop. The graphics, in particular, does not look that spectacular at first glance, but then you take it all in and realise that in terms of lighting, shadow and just sheer realism it blows almost every other game out of the water, even a year on.

Also, part of the reason PD implemented the Standard cars in the game must've been because of the people commenting that 200 cars weren't enough (in actual fact GT5's Premium cars, even minus the DLC, were more than all of GT3's cars). And complaints of the lengthy development must have forced Polyphony to rush the game out a bit. So there really isn't an issue with Polyphony not spending enough of their time on the game, but rather with them (and everyone else) managing their expectations. And besides, who are we to tell Polyphony to make just one game at a time?

Really!? I can't believes this question is being asked,this a driving simulator for cars,it cant be turned into,tdu,midnight club or project gotham.
If you want to ride bikes go get moto gp,sbx or even one of the titles from thq for some dirt squirters,but in gran turismo?

The whole point in this thread centres around the fact that MotoGP, SBK and the like are nowhere near the level set by Tourist Trophy.

 

[Griffith500]

M-M-M-MONSTER POST post post ...

Sorry, I didn't mean it that way. What I was trying to say was to have a Tourist Trophy sequel developed by a third party, but with Polyphony Digital overseeing the development throughout the process.

I really don't think an outside developer would ruin the game as long as Polyphony keeps a close eye. I might sound a bit elitist, but Tourist Trophy isn't like Gran Turismo. Since GT is pretty much Kazunori Yamauchi's pride and joy, I can see why he'd want to work on the series himself. Whereas I don't think Tourist Trophy has much the same attachment to the team so it probably wouldn't hurt the company much to outsource development of the title.

I'm not against outsourcing, but I'm skeptical that it would actually happen. And Tourist Trophy really is like GT; in fact it is GT, just with bikes. Sure Kaz may not be as "attached" to it, but it's still born of his studio. You think he'd "disown" a remake of Omega Boost, too? He may well do, but I'm not so sure; I've never played, but I've read that it was pretty iconic, too.

My thoughts exactly. It wouldn't make much sense taking a spanner to the basic foundations of GT5 just to add a few bikes.

Thankfully, nobody really wants just a few bikes; if they do go the route of integration on some level (even if it's just shared online rooms) then it needs to be full-fat, because most people would take that "opportunity" given the choice. I know this thread is "bikes in GT5" but really it should be (and has more-or less become) "TT2, integrated or standalone?", which is more interesting and actually meaningful.

With all due respect, just as there have been car guys who can't handle Polyphony doing anything other than Gran Turismo and cars (who I admit have gone overboard with some of their remarks), there are also a smaller (but no less caustic) group of people who feel like everyone who opposes bikes being in GT is absurd and lambasts them angrily as being ignorant and selfish.

To be fair, there is provocation on both sides, but intolerance is unnecessary; it's a game. The number of stubborn, self-satisfied, borderline ego-maniacal, short-sighted, one-line dismissals do outnumber the more thoughtful posts, and it is on the "car-guy" side more. I blame Jeremy Clarkson, personally. It's cool to hate motorcyclists, and bicyclists in general, actually. When you're exposed to that kind of attitude as a biker, you can see why they might react like a coiled spring.

Although I am leaning towards Polyphony outsourcing development of a Tourist Trophy sequel to another company, you and a number of others make a very good point. Those people who think a Tourist Trophy sequel would result in another 'unfinished' game are missing the point. GT5 didn't suffer not because there wasn't enough effort focused on it, but because it was the victim of Polyphony's own high expectations, coupled with the ridiculous demands made by fans and critics alike. The completely new physics and graphics engine, the Course Maker, the improved AI, those alone must have taken an insane amount of time and money to develop. The graphics, in particular, does not look that spectacular at first glance, but then you take it all in and realise that in terms of lighting, shadow and just sheer realism it blows almost every other game out of the water, even a year on.

Also, part of the reason PD implemented the Standard cars in the game must've been because of the people commenting that 200 cars weren't enough (in actual fact GT5's Premium cars, even minus the DLC, were more than all of GT3's cars). And complaints of the lengthy development must have forced Polyphony to rush the game out a bit. So there really isn't an issue with Polyphony not spending enough of their time on the game, but rather with them (and everyone else) managing their expectations. And besides, who are we to tell Polyphony to make just one game at a time?

Exactly, well put. We all want stuff for ourselves, but it's PD who actually have to make the things, and balance expectations with actual achievements.

The whole point in this thread centres around the fact that MotoGP, SBK and the like are nowhere near the level set by Tourist Trophy.

A bit like Gran Turismo, not so long ago. I think it's telling that PD have made two different motorsports / motor vehicle games that both (arguably, to some extent) nail that hardest of things to pin down: feel. I think TT should be given the same level of respect as GT for that alone.

 

[jonjwlee]

I'm not against outsourcing, but I'm skeptical that it would actually happen. And Tourist Trophy really is like GT; in fact it is GT, just with bikes. Sure Kaz may not be as "attached" to it, but it's still born of his studio. You think he'd "disown" a remake of Omega Boost, too? He may well do, but I'm not so sure; I've never played, but I've read that it was pretty iconic, too.

I meant Tourist Trophy not being like Gran Turismo merely in terms of the level of involvement and the scale of development through Polyphony and the following the games get from fans.

I guess you're probably right though. It's exactly that kind of love the team put into making every game that sets it apart from almost every other developer out there.

Thankfully, nobody really wants just a few bikes; if they do go the route of integration on some level (even if it's just shared online rooms) then it needs to be full-fat, because most people would take that "opportunity" given the choice. I know this thread is "bikes in GT5" but really it should be (and has more-or less become) "TT2, integrated or standalone?", which is more interesting and actually meaningful.

Indeed, although the idea of racing cars and bikes together remains an interesting avenue to explore. However, for it to really work the physics engine has to be improved, especially collisions; Tourist Trophy's collision physics weren't really up to snuff, because it took a lot to fall off your bike. And, let's face it, when you do fall off, you shouldn't just magically pop back up again.

To be fair, there is provocation on both sides, but intolerance is unnecessary; it's a game. The number of stubborn, self-satisfied, borderline ego-maniacal, short-sighted, one-line dismissals do outnumber the more thoughtful posts, and it is on the "car-guy" side more. I blame Jeremy Clarkson, personally. It's cool to hate motorcyclists, and bicyclists in general, actually. When you're exposed to that kind of attitude as a biker, you can see why they might react like a coiled spring.

Fair enough.

Clarkson aside though, do bikers really get that much hate from car guys?

A bit like Gran Turismo, not so long ago. I think it's telling that PD have made two different motorsports / motor vehicle games that both (arguably, to some extent) nail that hardest of things to pin down: feel. I think TT should be given the same level of respect as GT for that alone.

Very much so. I think for a lot of people here even porting Tourist Trophy to the PS3 would be enough to satisfy them.

 

[1241Penguin]

Clarkson aside though, do bikers really get that much hate from car guys?

Yes.

One time (talking about real life now), I was in the passenger seat of a car heading back home. While stopped at the lights, some dumb biker somehow managed to get their arm caught in the passenger side wing mirror. He split the glass in half and then zoomed off before we can even get to him.