New Yellow Flags??

[JulesDennis]

He went off at Surtees corner at Brands Hatch so I had slowed on approach anyway. His car suddenly appeared smack in front of me as I was accelerating out so, technically, I wasn't slowing as I passed his car. That could have led to the penalty but it doesn't make it right. The car that went off shouldn't have ghosted in the first place and he should have rejoined the track in a normal fashion. We were both A/S rated drivers.

In other words you did not slow down and kept the same pace you always have in that section.So you did not get a penalty for passing that car but because you did not slow down.

@Outspacer You may think that you did not slow down but if your pace was slower in that section than "normal",the system would take it as you actually did slow down.
Perhaps it has to do with hitting the brakes for "x" seconds and going slower than "normal".I dont know how it works.
All I know is that people need to "slow down" under yellow flags.

 

[turnupdaheat]

In other words you did not slow down and kept the same pace you always have in that section.So you did not get a penalty for passing that car but because you did not slow down.

As I, and others, have done on other occasions without penalty. If you are privy to exactly how PD implement these penalties please inform us.

 

[JulesDennis]

As I, and others, have done on other occasions without penalty. If you are privy to exactly how PD implement these penalties please inform us.

All I know is that under a yellow flag you cannot overtake another car (not involved in an accident) and you need to slow down.
How it works (the "slow down" part) we
a.Either wait for PD to give us the specifics or
b.make theory about it.
At this point only b can happen.

 

[turnupdaheat]

All I know is that under a yellow flag you cannot overtake another car (not involved in an accident) and you need to slow down.
How it works (the "slow down" part) we
a.Either wait for PD to give us the specifics or
b.make theory about it.
At this point only b can happen.

Exactly, so perhaps you should have added a "perhaps" to your statement as to why I received the penalty.

 

[JulesDennis]

Exactly, so perhaps you should have added a "perhaps" to your statement as to why I received the penalty.

My explanation is the only logical one under FIA yellow flag rules.
If you think that it was a bug or a system failure I'm fine with that.You just need to be aware that in case of not slowing down in yellow flag sectors,you are going to get a penalty every single time if the system works as it should.

 

[Outspacer]

@Outspacer You may think that you did not slow down but if your pace was slower in that section than "normal",the system would take it as you actually did slow down.
Perhaps it has to do with hitting the brakes for "x" seconds and going slower than "normal".I dont know how it works.
All I know is that people need to "slow down" under yellow flags.

We'll have to keep an eye on it. 'What is normal?' is the big question, and if they even check. My pace was gradually slowing anyway from lap to lap because of tyre wear, but I'm pretty sure I didn't slow noticably more than that (when I didn't get any penalty). In F1 they get away with a minimal throttle lift, and it's unlikely PD can reliably detect to that level (ref. the weasling down penalties thread). The point of slowing for a single yellow isn't to be 'slow', it's to be away from the ragged edge and with greater control of the lines that the car can take.

 

[GTWelsh]

Exactly, so perhaps you should have added a "perhaps" to your statement as to why I received the penalty.

I think it's worth prefixing everything anyone says on here with "In my opinion" in your head before you read it, often its implied, sometimes it's meant as fact when it actually isn't.
Unless they have a source for the information of course.

I'm not having a go at anyone, just saying

 

[turnupdaheat]

My explanation is the only logical one under FIA yellow flag rules.
If you think that it was a bug or a system failure I'm fine with that.You just need to be aware that in case of not slowing down in yellow flag sectors,you are going to get a penalty every single time if the system works as it should.

Do you believe my "perhaps" comment was inappropriate?

I am aware of FIA yellow flag rules but we are talking about how the system in the game works now. As it stands, when a yellow flag starts waving a message appears at the top of the screen informing drivers not to pass other cars under yellow flag conditions. No mention of slowing down. As I said, I have passed single cars involved in incidents and while under yellow flag conditions without slowing and without receiving a penalty so it is not clear at the moment whether or not I would have avoided a penalty if I wasn't on the throttle at the time the ghosted car was suddenly beamed down in front of me.

 

[JulesDennis]

I think it's worth prefixing everything anyone says on here with "In my opinion" in your head before you read it, often its implied, sometimes it's meant as fact when it actually isn't.
Unless they have a source for the information of course.

I'm not having a go at anyone, just saying

My only information is how yellow flags work in rl.If the game follows the same rules then we have a logical explanation of what is happening and why (example:a system bug or error/a valid penalty for not following the rules).
All other things in this post is just personal opinion (including mine).

@turnupdaheat I only post my opinion based on real life rules.I dont know if the system actually works as it should or even more how it caculates the "slow down" part of the yellow flag rules.Thats actually PD job to explain not mine.
I think the "slow down" part is going to be a "grey" area the same way penalties for contact with another car are.There are going to be cases where the user is not going to get a penalty when he is not actually slowing down (just because he's pace is slower in that moment in that sector) and cases when even if the user does slow down,is going to get a penalty because the system would think he did not slow down enough.
PD is not going to make it clear any time soon so the only thing we can do is to know the rules and pray that the system does not get those wrong.

 

[GTWelsh]

My only information is how yellow flags work in rl.If the game follows the same rules then we have a logical explanation of what is happening and why (example:a system bug or error/a valid penalty for not following the rules).
All other things in this post is just personal opinion (including mine).

@turnupdaheat I only post my opinion based on real life rules.I dont know if the system actually works as it should or even more how it caculates the "slow down" part of the yellow flag rules.Thats actually PD job to explain not mine.
I think the "slow down" part is going to be a "grey" area the same way penalties for contact with another car are.There are going to be cases where the user is not going to get a penalty when he is not actually slowing down (just because he's pace is slower in that moment in that sector) and cases when even if the user does slow down,is going to get a penalty because the system would think he did not slow down enough.
PD is not going to make it clear any time soon so the only thing we can do is to know the rules and pray that the system does not get those wrong.

I totally agree with what you said though, I wasn't disagreeing earlier, I knew it was your opinion, and I agree with that opinion

 

[BSDShoes]

I was just given a 10 second penalty for passing a vehicle in the daily that had crashed a couple of seconds in front of me. So, do I stop and wait till he is going again before I can pass?? WTF. He crashed and left the track why should I get a penalty. As I generally start in the second half of the grid for most races, two thirds of my place improvements are a result of crashes in front of me. So how does this new flag system actually work???

Same exact thing happened to me yesterday, was behind this car that crashed and spun out and the "no passing" indicator came up and I drove past him and was given a 10 second penalty, I was baffled at why. I've driven past cars that crashed or spun out during no passing several times without getting a penalty though.

 

[ASH32]

As I, and others, have done on other occasions without penalty. If you are privy to exactly how PD implement these penalties please inform us.

So far in my experience you don't have to slow down under yellows on GT Sport and if the car that caused the yellow is off track you don't get a penalty when you pass it (as of course you shouldn't).

When the car is on track though, even spun around or when it's been auto reset to track sometimes you will get a penalty, even in the warm up (not that it matters there).

There also may be an issue when more than one car is involved in the accident with the game deciding only one car caused the issue and then you may get a penalty for passing the other car, even when that one is also off track. I have not experienced this enough yet though to draw a firm conclusion or to know if the one time I've seen it was a bug or something.

 

[GTWelsh]

So far in my experience you don't have to slow down under yellows on GT Sport and if the car that caused the yellow is off track you don't get a penalty when you pass it (as of course you shouldn't).

When the car is on track though, even spun around or when it's been auto reset to track sometimes you will get a penalty, even in the warm up (not that it matters there).

There also may be an issue when more than one car is involved in the accident with the game deciding only one car caused the issue and then you may get a penalty for passing the other car, even when that one is also off track. I have not experienced this enough yet though to draw a firm conclusion or to know if the one time I've seen it was a bug or something.

I'll have to try and treat it like real-life and slow down when coming up to accidents in the road and see how the penalties go. IRL you would never just nail it past 2 cars on the side of the road without slowing a lot. Maybe the game is expecting the same.

 

[JulesDennis]

So far in my experience you don't have to slow down under yellows on GT Sport and if the car that caused the yellow is off track you don't get a penalty when you pass it (as of course you shouldn't).

When the car is on track though, even spun around or when it's been auto reset to track sometimes you will get a penalty, even in the warm up (not that it matters there).

There also may be an issue when more than one car is involved in the accident with the game deciding only one car caused the issue and then you may get a penalty for passing the other car, even when that one is also off track. I have not experienced this enough yet though to draw a firm conclusion or to know if the one time I've seen it was a bug or something.

Thats the thing.PD did not gave any info about yellow flags.
So we have to assume that :
a.Work as in real lfe
or
b.Work in a way we cannot explain (at least for now).
Every single time I've had a yellow flag I never got a penalty.Everytime I know I:
a.Did actually slow down (its more a "reflex" reaction)
b.Never passed any car that was not involved in accident
c.Passed car -cars- involved in the insident,that were is some cases on the track and other cases off track
and never got a penalty.Maybe I was just lucky?It could be the case.

 

[Outspacer]

Thats the thing.PD did not gave any info about yellow flags.
So we have to assume that :
a.Work as in real lfe
or
b.Work in a way we cannot explain (at least for now).
Every single time I've had a yellow flag I never got a penalty.Everytime I know I:
a.Did actually slow down (its more a "reflex" reaction)
b.Never passed any car that was not involved in accident
c.Passed car -cars- involved in the insident,that were is some cases on the track and other cases off track
and never got a penalty.Maybe I was just lucky?It could be the case.

We know it's based on real life yellow flags, of course, but we can only assume "b.Work in a way we cannot [fully] explain (at least for now)".

Maybe you haven't happened across quite the same case, with a respawned car? In which case... lucky

Your a, b & c hold for me as well, in most cases, but for sure I'll try to find an opportunity to get a purple sector under yellow, without passing anyone on track at all... that should settle the 'slowing' question.

 

[BigJimmy]

This should clarify why you got a penalty.

Enter corner in 6th, no yellow flag, car in 4th is crashing:
View attachment 695287

Car in 4th has crashed, yellow flags:
View attachment 695290

Still yellow flags:
View attachment 695291

Exit corner in 5th, ahead of crashed car. No Passing warning displayed:
View attachment 695292

Still in yellow flag zone, No Passing warning still displayed, overtakes car in 4th for position:
View attachment 695293

Retains 4th position:
View attachment 695294

Remaining in 4th, driver exits the sector for a penalty:
View attachment 695295


It seems pretty clear cut that you got a penalty for overtaking the Viper you were racing with and not for overtaking the car that crashed...

That's clear but I real life, the Yellows would not come out that fast. There should be a delay and people should be able to capitalise on on-track situations as they are developing.

It think its pointless actually, as the yellow flag is a safety feature, and thats not needed in a computer game. No one actually gets hurt.

 

[MustakeSVT]

Wow, overtaking under yellow has been illegal for as long as I can remember in any kind of racing. And I'm 50! Pretty cut and dry what happen here.

 

[Outspacer]

Wow, overtaking under yellow has been illegal for as long as I can remember in any kind of racing. And I'm 50! Pretty cut and dry what happen here.

I presume you're talking about the video in post #2, rather than the one in post #76?

If so then yeah, them's the rules. Harsh though - yellow comes and goes in about 1 second, Viper takes a poor line, and the end of the sector is just a few yards further on. But still, this thread has long ago agreed that it wasn't a bug, and it's clear what the reason for the penalty was - in that case.

 

[ASH32]

I'll have to try and treat it like real-life and slow down when coming up to accidents in the road and see how the penalties go. IRL you would never just nail it past 2 cars on the side of the road without slowing a lot. Maybe the game is expecting the same.

It probably should be but it isn't. I've nailed it past a car that spun and nothing happened, maybe I didn't beat my best time in that sector but I certainly did not lift at all as he was way off and there was no chance of me hitting him.

The only time I've got a penalty for ignoring yellows so far is in the warm up when I passed a car (very slowly too) that was still ghosted but had been auto reset to track after causing the yellow.

Does the slow down message appear all the time because if it does I've not noticed it, or does it only appear when you are about to pass a car the game believes you should not be passing because of the yellows.

Maybe we should all go out with the swarm of idiots at the beginning of the warm up as someone will crash and then respect or break the yellow rules various ways and see what penalties (if any) we get. It's likely the only way we will know for sure how they are supposed to work.

 

[danardif1]

I think a mixture of the revised yellow flag rules and the ghosting effect gave me a completely undeserved 5 second penalty yesterday. A car had spun off before Sheene curve at Brands, and as the car was reset and I was coming up to pass the ghosted car, it turned solid again before it had started moving, and in passing what was a stationary car but one that the system then thought was live on track it thought I had passed under yellows and gave me a penalty. What's most annoying about this is that I was passing the car that caused the yellows!!!

 

[ASH32]

Yes the auto reset of cars will be causing a lot of these unfair penalties, hopefully that's the next thing changed, it doesn't belong in a racing game anyway and now it's causing problems too.

 

[danardif1]

Yes the auto reset of cars will be causing a lot of these unfair penalties, hopefully that's the next thing changed, it doesn't belong in a racing game anyway and now it's causing problems too.

I agree completely. Resets should be manual and should then come with a period where the car is ghosted and out of affecting the race.

 

[JamesB]

I posted this in another thread, but I'm reposting as I'd love to know how this bloody time penalty system works. Not exactly a yellow flag issue I agree, but I can't seem to find anything else that refers to 'unfair' time penalties...

Sooooooo, can anyone explain to me the totally random and unfair nature of awarding 'slow down' penalties? Twice in the space of one online, daily race (Blue Moon Speedway) I was awarded 'slow down' time penalties for circumstances outside of my control. Firstly, taking the inside line at the last left-hander leading onto the start/finish straight, the driver to my right (who had run wide of his own accord) came across on me, sideswiped me and I got a 12 second slow down penalty?? Secondly, a different driver punted me up the a*se end, leading me to spin off and contact the barriers and I get another 'slow down' penalty?

What is going on here? Is the time penalty system totally arbitrary, broken or just total crap? It makes a mockery of the 'racing etiquette' certificate and favours d*ckheads who seem to think that punting up the back or bouncing off the side is fair play.

 

[Outspacer]

I posted this in another thread, but I'm reposting as I'd love to know how this bloody time penalty system works. Not exactly a yellow flag issue I agree, but I can't seem to find anything else that refers to 'unfair' time penalties...

Sorry, trying to stay away from those discussions now because they seem to fill up with 'opinions'. And it really has nothing to do with yellow flags

 

[UnkaD]

Still trying to get the 15 clean races in a row, just 'cause I'm obsessed with those things. I lost my streak again, but this time it was because a car spun on the last corner and I didn't come to a complete stop to wait for him to finish his donuts. The three guys ahead of me got penalties as well. This is just retarded.

 

[eran0004]

My personal incident I was last and passed only the guy who left the track and I think you should have the option to give up the place not just get smacked with 5 or 10 seconds. You might not even have visibility of an accident and swerve to miss the vehicle who has seen it as he hits his brakes, bang thanks for coming here is your penalty...........

The yellow flag shows on your screen though, so you shouldn't have to swerve past an accident.

 

[Inzyman]

I think a mixture of the revised yellow flag rules and the ghosting effect gave me a completely undeserved 5 second penalty yesterday. A car had spun off before Sheene curve at Brands, and as the car was reset and I was coming up to pass the ghosted car, it turned solid again before it had started moving, and in passing what was a stationary car but one that the system then thought was live on track it thought I had passed under yellows and gave me a penalty. What's most annoying about this is that I was passing the car that caused the yellows!!!

Nearly the same for me, ghosting car goes solid right in front of me whilst he is sideways! I hit him and get the " Down SR Flag " and penalty. WT!!

 

[Inzyman]

That would be it I would think,

So far in my experience you don't have to slow down under yellows on GT Sport and if the car that caused the yellow is off track you don't get a penalty when you pass it (as of course you shouldn't).

When the car is on track though, even spun around or when it's been auto reset to track sometimes you will get a penalty, even in the warm up (not that it matters there).

There also may be an issue when more than one car is involved in the accident with the game deciding only one car caused the issue and then you may get a penalty for passing the other car, even when that one is also off track. I have not experienced this enough yet though to draw a firm conclusion or to know if the one time I've seen it was a bug or something.

That would be the answer I suspect, vehicle ahead of me crashes then Ghosts, then reappears on the track all over the place. I pass and bang penalty. Explains what happened but is completely ridiculous......

 

[pedrocor]

Happened to me yesterday, at the Dragon Trail 10 lap Gr.4 race.

About lap 2 or 3, two guys in front of me tangled on exit of the last hairpin, both spin, one went spinning to the barriers on the left side, the other spun on the track, on the right side. As I went through, with the yellows, both were ghost, the one on the gravel almost stopped, the one on the right, pointing front to the barriers, stopped. Didn't pass anyone beside those two, got a 10 sec penalty.

Don't know i it was an issue with being more than one car in the accident or something, but was an unfair penalty. Had other two yellow flag situations on the race, passed the crashed car with no problem at all.

Not whining, just stating, it didn't destroyed my race, not the end of my life, as I was having a pretty sub standard race, I decided to give a try to a car I had never driven before, but it's bad programming.

BTW, I rear bumped some guy on a GT-R, as I was trying to slipstream him down the rear straight. He braked "miles" before the braking point, I was full throttle, couldn't avoid it. I was going to brake earlier than normal, as I usually do when I'm on the back of other car, but not the breaking point to very early braking. With the new system could see he got a 10 sec penalty, which was unfair to, as I believe it was his fault, there was no real harm to me, he was the one sent to the barrier and even brake testing me, I've to be ready to take avoiding measures. A pure racing incident.

 

[ASH32]

Just got two more 5 seconds penalties in the warm up (not even on purpose). Both for passing a car before the yellow flag warning even appeared, in the first case the yellows and no overtaking warning appeared on my screen after I went past (he was off track driving in the gravel for seconds before that), the second I never got the yellow warning at all, a car just randomly got reset to track just as I went past, didn't even see him go off, the first time I saw him was when his ghosted car was plonked back on.

I can see why some will get annoyed if this occurs during the race, usually though they go off and it's fine to pass them, its very odd.