Official 2011/12 Barclays Premier League Thread

[cuco33]

3 big games today for me.

Man U x Liverpool and the whole Evra x Suarez ordeal.. You'd think to avoid further drama that a handshake would happen, especially since England is super busy right now with the whole Terry racism and Capello leaving. I don't think Evra is 100% innocent but Suarez just made himself look like a fool.

Chelsea losting to Everton, and looking mostly flat... AVB, come back to Porto because you're getting kicked out!!

Spurs 5-0 slaughter of Newcastle. That 1st half, wow. This Tottenham side is making some damage that's for sure!


Not EPL related but rather La Liga... Barcelona lost 3-2 to Osasuna giving Real Madrid the chance to go 10pts up top pending they beat Levante!

 

[Alex.]

Marchi has there ever been any doubt in your mind that Suarez said what Evra reported? I don't think so. I think you saw Evra accuse him of it and therefore decided it was fact, as many other united fans have done. We here in this thread are debating the issue and are open to both possibilities, much unlike yourself.

 

[marchi]

Marchi has there ever been any doubt in your mind that Suarez said what Evra reported? I don't think so. I think you saw Evra accuse him of it and therefore decided it was fact, as many other united fans have done. We here in this thread are debating the issue and are open to both possibilities, much unlike yourself.

No my friend, I read what was admitted by Suarez himself in court documents. Combined with the fact that his argument is as piss weak as you'll find in any court in the world, it's pretty blood obvious who the guilty party in the debacle is. And it is beyond clear to anybody that isn't emotionally involved with Liverpool or Suarez.


I'm actually starting to feel sorry for Dalglish. That scrote has torn his reputation to pieces. After everything he did for the families at hillsborough, he gets treated like that by his own player which un does him.

 

[Famine]

That statement makes it sounds like Suarez's kids had to eat the dirt under their nails for the period he was banned. If I don't weep because he didn't earn 100k quid for 2 months, please forgive me

Is it more justifiable to wrong someone if they earn a lot of money? Or is money irrelevant if someone is wronged?

He truly believes he has done nothing wrong - either honestly or delusionally - and he believes all the crap he's got in the press is Evra's fault. Not only does he truly believe he's done nothing wrong, his manager truly believes it, his teammates truly believe it and the club truly believes it.

Again, whether he's guilty or not, the handshake simply shouldn't have gone ahead - it was fine for QPR and Chelsea to avoid it on the allegation alone, but not when there's been a kangaroo court convicition?

It's not like he was just let out of jail after serving 30 years for a crime he didnt commit. Yes, then I could understand he might not want to shake his accuser hand. But this was a 8 match ban, brought about by his own ill-advised language.

All we know he said was the Spanish equivalent of "my n*****" - confirmed by all parties. As a black-origin youth speaking to a black-origin youth, that's moronic but not unreasonably so. Nothing else Evra stated as coming out of Suarez's mouth has any confirmation from anywhere else - so as it stands, it's an 8 match ban (from the kangaroo court of the FA - the same guys who upheld the idiotic red card for Vincent Kompany) brought about by what someone else said he said... That's the point.

We'll never know what actually happened between the two (I nearly said "men", but they are both moronic children), only that Suarez denies saying what it has been said he said while the FA saw fit to ban him on only the evidence of Evra.

Incidentally, looks like Suarez decided to ignore Dalglish

Not a shocker - he's a moronic child.

Sorry Famine, but Liverpool players state they heard the altercation

Any black player who heard Suarez say "I kicked you because you're black", "I don't speak to blacks" and "Blacky blacky black black" wouldn't pull on a shirt supporting him, teammate or not. No white, Hispanic or Asian player should either - I'd take the club fine rather than put on a shirt supporting someone I'd hear racially abusing someone else. You would too, I'd wager.

Suarez admits to using the word Negrito and according to several uruguayan posters on a general football forum I visit, pretty much admitted to saying it simply to wind Evra up in an interview.

Oh well, that's fine then. Who needs to actually hear what Suarez said and why when some posters on a forum can tell us?

Again, all we know is that a black-origin youth said "my n*****" to another black-origin youth.

And it is beyond clear to anybody that isn't emotionally involved with Liverpool or Suarez.

I'm neither - I can't stand Suarez and I loathe Liverpool. If I were to be biased it would be against both, as your statements seem to indicate you are. I haven't jumped to conclusions because I have no evidence beyond Suarez's admission of using the Spanish equivalent of "my n*****" and the imbeciles at the FA finding him guilty of much more significant racial abuse that he denies using on the word of another player.

 

[marchi]

Is it more justifiable to wrong someone if they earn a lot of money? Or is money irrelevant if someone is wronged?

He truly believes he has done nothing wrong - either honestly or delusionally - and he believes all the crap he's got in the press is Evra's fault. Not only does he truly believe he's done nothing wrong, his manager truly believes it, his teammates truly believe it and the club truly believes it.

Again, whether he's guilty or not, the handshake simply shouldn't have gone ahead - it was fine for QPR and Chelsea to avoid it on the allegation alone, but not when there's been a kangaroo court convicition?



All we know he said was the Spanish equivalent of "my n*****" - confirmed by all parties. As a black-origin youth speaking to a black-origin youth, that's moronic but not unreasonably so. Nothing else Evra stated as coming out of Suarez's mouth has any confirmation from anywhere else - so as it stands, it's an 8 match ban (from the kangaroo court of the FA - the same guys who upheld the idiotic red card for Vincent Kompany) brought about by what someone else said he said... That's the point.

We'll never know what actually happened between the two (I nearly said "men", but they are both moronic children), only that Suarez denies saying what it has been said he said while the FA saw fit to ban him on only the evidence of Evra.



Not a shocker - he's a moronic child.



Any black player who heard Suarez say "I kicked you because you're black", "I don't speak to blacks" and "Blacky blacky black black" wouldn't pull on a shirt supporting him, teammate or not. No white, Hispanic or Asian player should either - I'd take the club fine rather than put on a shirt supporting someone I'd hear racially abusing someone else. You would too, I'd wager.



Oh well, that's fine then. Who needs to actually hear what Suarez said and why when some posters on a forum can tell us?

Again, all we know is that a black-origin youth said "my n*****" to another black-origin youth.



I'm neither - I can't stand Suarez and I loathe Liverpool. If I were to be biased it would be against both, as your statements seem to indicate you are. I haven't jumped to conclusions because I have no evidence beyond Suarez's admission of using the Spanish equivalent of "my n*****" and the imbeciles at the FA finding him guilty of much more significant racial abuse that he denies using on the word of another player.

Famine, ignorance should not be an excuse or a defence. Regardless of who you are, what colour you are, where you're from, you don't call anybody a n*****. It's not like Nelson Mendela walks up to Mugabe and say "my n*****".... For Suarez especially in such a highly charged sport where tempers flare and somebody can quite easily take offense to it.

The only reason Suarez believes he did nothing wrong is because people keep telling him he didn't. Thats what gets most people including myself. Kenny should have come out and said "look we don't know what was said, if it was said it was said, we apologise for any offence Mr. Evra may have taken towards Suarez comments". Instead he craps on for months about how innocent Suarez is and suddenly he thinks he's innocent. Meanwhile they don't protest the charge.....


And I wouldn't call Evra a child. He acted respectable in this whole drama apart from the end of the game yesterday. After having your integrity questioned by none other than Liverpool, he has every right to act like he did. Notice he didn't do it in front of the Liverpool fans, but his own fans. Just because Suarez happened to be walking there....


Saurez called Patrice Evra a n***** is what we know. How they are brought up should bare no reflection on the outcome.


Also it's quite clear what Suarez says since he admits it himself.

 

[Mike Rotch]

Not only does he truly believe he's done nothing wrong, his manager truly believes it, his teammates truly believe it and the club truly believes it.

Speculation.

For all we know, both Dalglish and the squad could loathe him, know he said something bad and be putting on a "you'll never walk alone" spiel for the media and FA. We just cannot know.

Either way, my unchanging view is that he should have had a few spoonfuls of "pull your head in", shaken Evra's hand - or given the poorest excuse for a shake - and be done with it.

 

[Emptyone]

Rooney is quite frankly, the biggest sorry disgrace to the English team. When I heard on MOTD he said he wanted the England captaincy I laughed out loud, very loud. Marchi, Rooney deserves every bit of criticism he gets. Total disgrace. You're right he doesn't kick Spurs players in the stomach, he just assaults Montenegrin players.

Not that I usually stand up and defend Rooney, but for those of us on Twitter, it's fairly clear that he didn't want the captaincy from his tweet, he actually recommended Gerrard. Just thought I'd clear that up

 

[TyrrellRacing]

Not that I usually stand up and defend Rooney, but for those of us on Twitter, it's fairly clear that he didn't want the captaincy from his tweet, he actually recommended Gerrard. Just thought I'd clear that up

👍 Seems Lineker twisted the message. Rooney himself said;

Linekar tell them the full message what i said.

 

[marchi]

Not that I usually stand up and defend Rooney, but for those of us on Twitter, it's fairly clear that he didn't want the captaincy from his tweet, he actually recommended Gerrard. Just thought I'd clear that up

Problem is, Gerrard is not the right man. On this seasons play, he should be a bench player at best and you honestly need a player that will play 90 mins of most matches. Carrick, Parker and Lampard 'Carrick especially' have been superior to Gerrard in the midfield role.

Rooney is the logical choice in the pecking order 'youngish and a big personality, born winner etc', but the fact he'll miss the first two games due to petulance, means he shouldn't get it yet. Same thing for Joe Hart 'without the issues, but age etc'.

For me it comes down to two players, Ashley Cole and Frank Lampard. Given Lampard has rarely played well for England, that for me leaves Cole. Solid player and experienced.

What the FA should be doing is employing an interim captain like Cole, 'who will more than likely retire from international duty before the next world cup', and then pick a full captain during the qualifying for the world cup.

 

[Liquid]

Why is Joe Hart suspended? He's fine. There's nothing wrong with Joe Hart but you know they just won't give it to him.

Nothing wrong with a goalkeeper captain. Shilton and Kahn are previous examples.

An unrelated statistic, but;

Thus far England have not lost a single game in which Joe Hart has played in goal.

 

[marchi]

Why is Joe Hart suspended? He's fine. There's nothing wrong with Joe Hart but you know they just won't give it to him.

Nothing wrong with a goalkeeper captain. Shilton and Kahn are previous examples.

Yeah I read that again after I sent submit.

Hart's still a bit young. He'll have enough pressure on him as Keeper so it's worth waiting until after the tournament to give it to him.

 

[NINE_HUNDRED]

I don't think Carrick is captain material, what you said about Frank not playing well for England can be said for Carrick too, he has the odd good game every now and then, but doesn't play like he does for UTD.

I think Cole could be a good option, maybe Gareth Barry? Though he doesn't seem like the type either to me.

I think if Gerrard stays fit for the rest of the season, he deserves it. He's a leader type, doesn't mess about and just gets on with it.

 

[Brend]

Come on Wolves. 👍

 

[bradford]

Suarez admits refusing to shake Evra's hand in a Liverpool FC statement.
http://www.liverpoolfc.tv/news/latest-news/luis-suarez-i-m-sorry

People who claimed it was Evra who refused it look even stupider than they did before.

 

[Liquid]

He also apologises for the incident. Which is a start. But this isn't the last we'll hear of this.

---

Other news: Massacre at Molyneux. My prediction? McCarthy won't last much longer. Wolves played well second half, but West Brom were deadly.

 

[Famine]

Famine, ignorance should not be an excuse or a defence. Regardless of who you are, what colour you are, where you're from, you don't call anybody a n*****. It's not like Nelson Mendela walks up to Mugabe and say "my n*****".... For Suarez especially in such a highly charged sport where tempers flare and somebody can quite easily take offense to it.

And yet hundreds of thousands of young, black males refer to each other as "my n*****" every day. This is part of the colossal hypocrisy behind the word.

Yes, this needs to be addressed. No, rabid, partisan sports support is not the medium in which to do it.

And I wouldn't call Evra a child. He acted respectable in this whole drama apart from the end of the game yesterday. After having your integrity questioned by none other than Liverpool, he has every right to act like he did. Notice he didn't do it in front of the Liverpool fans, but his own fans. Just because Suarez happened to be walking there...

Sir Alex disagrees with you.

Saurez called Patrice Evra a n***** is what we know. How they are brought up should bare no reflection on the outcome.

Yet Evra told the FA he also said he doesn't talk to blacks, kicked him because he's black and said "blacky blacky black" to him. That formed part of his "conviction" for it.

Suarez denies it and only admits to the cultural colloquial "my n*****" which, as I said earlier, hundreds of thousands of young, black males use every day to refer to each other.

Speculation.

For all we know, both Dalglish and the squad could loathe him, know he said something bad and be putting on a "you'll never walk alone" spiel for the media and FA. We just cannot know.

The problem with that line of speculation is John Barnes. Barnes is no longer affiliated with the club and suffered racial abuse from his own fans while he was there. While Kenny Dalglish was there.

I don't believe for a second that Barnes and Dalglish would stand up for a racist and their only evidence is Suarez - who is of black-origin himself - saying "my n*****" to another black man.


I will reconfirm that if it's okay to cancel a handshake in case a guy accused of racism has to shake the hand of the guy he allegedly abused, it's a no-brainer to cancel a handshake when a guy convicted of it has to shake the hand of the guy he abused - particularly if the guy shows no remorse because he doesn't believe he was wrong. The situation should simply never have been allowed to happen.

And if you think that's bad, two Aston Villa mascots just refused to shake the hand of the Manchester City mascot!

Problem is, Gerrard is not the right man. On this seasons play, he should be a bench player at best and you honestly need a player that will play 90 mins of most matches. Carrick, Parker and Lampard 'Carrick especially' have been superior to Gerrard in the midfield role.

Rooney is the logical choice in the pecking order 'youngish and a big personality, born winner etc', but the fact he'll miss the first two games due to petulance, means he shouldn't get it yet. Same thing for Joe Hart 'without the issues, but age etc'.

For me it comes down to two players, Ashley Cole and Frank Lampard. Given Lampard has rarely played well for England, that for me leaves Cole. Solid player and experienced.

What the FA should be doing is employing an interim captain like Cole, 'who will more than likely retire from international duty before the next world cup', and then pick a full captain during the qualifying for the world cup.

Ashley Cole is an utter a-hole. He barely has any self-discipline, on or off the pitch - and there's a number of allegations that follow him round like a very bad smell. Again, if it was okay to remove the captaincy from John Terry on the basis of having sex with the wrong woman and then for an allegation of an offence, Cole shouldn't be in consideration.

England's next captain should either be Joe Hart or Scott Parker.

 

[Liquid]

England's next captain should either be Joe Hart or Scott Parker.

I read something cryptic along the lines of, "England's next captain should be a player who will have retired before the 2014 World Cup". A clear indication towards Parker, but Hart wouldn't be a bad choice for you either. Shilton was captain for a time, so I don't see why it can't be Hart. He's got plenty of years left in him.

 

[Emptyone]

A clear indication towards Parker, but Hart wouldn't be a bad choice for you either. Shilton was captain for a time, so I don't see why it can't be Hart. He's got plenty of years left in him.

I subscribe to the opinion that Hart can be a long term captain, but for the Euro's the FA are likely to appoint an interim captain, such as Scott Parker, to make sure the experience is there. He seems a cool head and plays well most of the time, plus doesn't seem to be injury prone as other older players are.

 

[mp10]

England's next captain should either be Joe Hart or Scott Parker.

Thats exactly what i was thinking, both know how to keep a team organised.

 

[Mike Rotch]

And if you think that's bad, two Aston Villa mascots just refused to shake the hand of the Manchester City mascot!

 

[Famine]

Sky Sports News were making a big deal out of it too*:

​

*by way of satire

 

[Mike Rotch]

If I wasn't at work, I'd dig out the epic snub some Chelsea kid gave to Stevie G a few years back in the players tunnel.

 

[Liquid]

 

[NINE_HUNDRED]

Another, the kids don't like Stevie

 

[Smallhorses]

[SAF Voice] *chew* *chew* *chew* Ah, that's disgraceful, those mascots should be sold, should never be allowed to mascot again. *chew**chew**chew*[/SAF Voice]

 

[marchi]

I see FSG have forced Suarez to apologise for not shaking Evra's hand. Bit late now.

 

[Smallhorses]

Maybe you could take a leaf out of his book and apologise to me for attacking me personally rather than my opinion a few pages ago? Just a thought.

 

[Bram Turismo]

I think it'll be the other way around.

You were saying?

I shouldn't speak too loud, though. My houseowner is a Liverpool fan!

 

[marchi]

Maybe you could take a leaf out of his book and apologise to me for attacking me personally rather than my opinion a few pages ago? Just a thought.

Yeah..... no

 

[Mike Rotch]

clip

Yea, that's the one . Had to love the one Vs Newcastle. the kid looked like someone was trying to hand him a jar of warm vomit. Poo' old Stevie G