PlayStation 5 Rumors Latest: Console Reveal Within the Next Six Weeks

Terronium-12
You know what I find funny? Maybe this is just me placing too much of an emphasis on certain trends, or I'm just being an a-hole, but it's hilarious (to me) that now it's confirmed the PS5 is comparatively weaker than the Xbox Series X....specs don't matter all of a sudden? You can't place too high of an emphasis TFLOPs, it's how the developers use the power given to them, etc.

Was anyone saying these things when the PS4 had the better specs than the Xbox One? :lol:
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Don't let anyone fool you, including the games media, it is hilarious. If MS had this conference, believe me, it would be a laughing stock. Sony zealots would be all over it. It was all about power until Xbox One X came out, prior to that, it was nothing but posting Digital Foundry 1080/900p videos all the time.

Even Mike Ybarra (former MS engineer/exec) remembers:



It's the same with backwards compatibility, Sony zealots always stated "I don't play old games". Now that Phil Spencer made it a "must-have" again thanks to the gold standard the Xbox BC team set, Sony fans flip-flopped.

The fact IGN, Jason Schrierer/Kotaku and others keep focusing on SSD and the "specs don't matter" is pure bull. When you build a PC, what's first on your mind, CPU/GPU or SSD/Audio? Specs matter, always has. Game loads 4 seconds faster, yippie.
 
Terronium-12
You know what I find funny? Maybe this is just me placing too much of an emphasis on certain trends, or I'm just being an a-hole, but it's hilarious (to me) that now it's confirmed the PS5 is comparatively weaker than the Xbox Series X....specs don't matter all of a sudden? You can't place too high of an emphasis TFLOPs, it's how the developers use the power given to them, etc.

Was anyone saying these things when the PS4 had the better specs than the Xbox One? :lol:
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Its only funny because you seem to have little idea on computer architecture.

The PS4 and XB1 had very similar architecture ideologies and so it was easy to compare the metrics (numbers that people often quote for performance). The PS4 had a 40% metric differential (advantage in speed and amount) so it was completely obvious which system was more powerful.

Many gamers, with their reliance on certain metrics, are just showing how they have no idea of computer architecture. Cerny even highlights this in the presentation. 10 TF on RDNA2 =/ 10TF on GCN. 36 CUs on PS5 =/ 36 CUs on PS4.

The reason its so hard to compare PS5 and XBSX is because of their very different ideologies for their architecture. XBSX went with a higher amount while PS5 goes with higher speed. The CPU/GPU difference is also 8-15% iirc while PS5's SSD is 200% XBSX. We also have no idea about the microarchitectures of these systems: PS5's I/O unit has multiple Zen 2 processors, there's a separate audio chip no longer using the main RAM, XBSX is said to also have a separate audio chip, XBSX Velocity architecture hasn't been detailed etc.

I guess a car analogy would be one car going faster in the straights, and the other going faster in the corners, with both producing similar lap times.
 
Terronium-12
You know what I find funny? Maybe this is just me placing too much of an emphasis on certain trends, or I'm just being an a-hole, but it's hilarious (to me) that now it's confirmed the PS5 is comparatively weaker than the Xbox Series X....specs don't matter all of a sudden? You can't place too high of an emphasis TFLOPs, it's how the developers use the power given to them, etc.

Was anyone saying these things when the PS4 had the better specs than the Xbox One? :lol:
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Sure, you had Microsoft employees saying exactly that back then: http://www.thesixthaxis.com/2013/07...ys-tech-specs-are-meaningless/comment-page-2/

Albert Penello:​

"The problem is that Sony decided to go out and publish a bunch of numbers, which are in some ways meaningless,” he said. “Because this isn’t like 1990, when it was 16-bit versus 32-bit.”

"For me, I’d rather not even have the conversation, because it’s not going to matter,” Penello continued. “The box is going to be awesome. The games are going to be awesome.”

"You bought a system to play great games and have great experiences.” he says. “I feel like our games and experiences are going to be every bit as good, if not better, technically – on top of all the magic we’re going to add with the instant switching, and the power of the cloud.”
​
Pretty hilarious, and unfortunate because the two hardware designs was almost exactly the same outside of ram setup so the spec number comparison made even more sense. And "power of the cloud" was so far fetched barely any devs spoke on it, with the games promised to use it (crackdown) ended up in development hell and massively downgraded. Specs was the least of MS's problems though considering they initially were forcing 24-hr DRM online connection requirements with a price tag of $100 more, which was where most of the backlash came from gamers. Glad MS did a complete 180 for this gen, putting pressure on Sony, competition is always great for consumers.

Penello was still right though, developers never look at just teraflop numbers and determine one platform is better without factoring in the design architecture and a bunch of other stuff that may help with rendering/developing games, It was always gamers fighting over numbers.

It's also not like these twitter quotes are from random gamers too. They are developers, some of which most likely have had dev kits for both systems, and engineers who have worked on gpus. Here's an ex-AMD gpu engineer.



Andrea Pessino is the chief technology officer and lead programmer and co-founder of RAD games



 
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Well the ps5 does seem designed and thought out really well around it's strengths, and in some innovative ways.

And does have a few pretty good advantages too, and most devs who speak out seem to really support that view.
Remains to be seen how that will turn out but it doesn't seem so clear cut.

Probably will be easier simpler to have bit higher res and smoother fps for multiplatform game devs on the series x but even that remains to be seen it seems, depending on the balance of each design, and how devs go about coding their games. Just my 2 cents on it for now.
We'll see in the short term which is easier possibly and on the long run the potential of each.

Saying that putting a fast ssd in a pc doesn't make it faster apart from loading is comparing different beasts.
Unless you have a pc with everything at the most efficient and fast on the market. Even then if it isn't designed specifically around every part that makes it up and for just games then it's different. Also just a small percentage of people have top of the line stuff.

Plus games aren't optimized so much, as we know , on most pcs so.

The series x does have alot more cus but it doesn't seem to translate to as much of an increase in Tf in comparison right. We'll see.

Im still going to wait and see for a ps5 pro, just in case waahah hehe. Well just to have all as best can be and have the ps5 exclusives.
If no pro, well I'll be ok with a std ps5 i hope even for multiplat games. Resolution and fps should be pretty high on next gen right, just hope devs don't try squeeze in still lower than optimum fps especially, and no tearing pls lol.
 
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I feel there's clarity needed in reference to my original comment.

I'm not saying raw horsepower is the be-all, end-all — though it is damn important with both the PS5 and Series X's lofty performance targets — nor should it be the primary reason one goes for one console over the other. It isn't a PC, and any first-party titles are going to take full advantage of the uniform hardware in every one of the two consoles.

My point, or rather what I'm poking fun at, is this: had the tables been turned, and the PS5 touted higher specs than the Series X, do some of you sincerely think certain people would still parrot the same "TFLOPs don't matter, it's how the developers use what's given to them." rhetoric? Because, I have to tell you, I sure don't. Do I care? Of course I do, but from the perspective of a PC hardware enthusiast. Will that influence my picking one over the other? Of course not, because they're both as good as mine.
 
@GT6mebe I'm going to keep this straight and to the point: come into this, or any other thread with the express intention of inciting an argument again, and you'll find yourself on vacation.

With that said, everyone else continue as you were.
 
Castrol96
So PS5 is not backwards compatible with PS1, PS2, PS3 or even fully with PS4?
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Nothing is known one way or the other about the earlier consoles, but if you're asking can you play every single PS4 game out of the gate on the PS5...the answer is no, though it will support damn near all of them.
 
beyond72
Really? Trees would be the least of my wishes for the new GT.
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Why not? The technology is already there for them to fully implement it.

ruestchiva
I hope instead of this, Polyphony spends time increasing car and track diversity.
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The people working for track design and modelling aren't the one working for cars. PD is not an indie dev. And I don't see any issue adding more tracks while also improving its visuals. Some of the track landscape in GTSport is kinda outdated already.
 
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Just watched the reveal, most of the technical nitty gritty is way over my head. Definitely most excited about faster loading speeds and the 3D audio. All of my gaming console/PC have only ever had HDDs so I'm prepared to be amazed by the improvement in loading times. 3D audio is cool but it looks like you're gonna need headphones to make the best of it (which I don't like using for extended gaming sessions due to discomfort) and you need to hope one of their HRTF profiles matches yours. Graphics wise, honestly I'm happy with the level we already have on PS4. Just need to improve VR resolution. But then again, I'm no graphics buff :lol:

Oh and backwards compatibility is a big plus too. Bought almost all my games digital this gen so I'm all set. I'm worried about titles that have been removed from PSN like Driveclub though - will I still be able to redownload it and all the DLCs in the future?

Price and wheel compatibility are another thing I'm looking forward to being confirmed. It's crazy, it feels just like yesterday that I bought my PS4 for GTS launch and now next gen is almost here :crazy: The gap between PS3 and PS4 feels much longer.
 
The 3D audio will work just fine on discrete speaker systems, too. Transfer Functions for speaker arrays are generally much simpler than for heads and pinnae :)
 
Castrol96
So PS5 is not backwards compatible with PS1, PS2, PS3 or even fully with PS4?
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Most likely, all multiplatform games will be BC, first party games that utilizes low level programming will need patches. My guess is that Driveclub isn't BC.
 
Has everyone forgot how the 12TF of the XB mean nothing for 2 or 3 years (until 2022 or 2023) die to MS's commitment to release all games on PC and, worse of all, on Xbox 1?

I mean first party devs and games (which are the major selling point of the hardware in the first place) on the XBSX will be 2 to 3 years behind what Sony's first parties are doing right now.
 
LeGeNd-1
I'm worried about titles that have been removed from PSN like Driveclub though - will I still be able to redownload it and all the DLCs in the future?
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I think it's always been the case that you forever have access to re-download any PSN games or DLC you purchased regardless of whether it is still openly available on the store.
 
zzz_pt
Has everyone forgot how the 12TF of the XB mean nothing for 2 or 3 years (until 2022 or 2023) die to MS's commitment to release all games on PC and, worse of all, on Xbox 1?

I mean first party devs and games (which are the major selling point of the hardware in the first place) on the XBSX will be 2 to 3 years behind what Sony's first parties are doing right now.
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Well they are going with a tiered approach for the new hardware itself, so it remains to be seen what the more affordable versions can do. The cross-platform focus for first party devs might offer some clues in that respect. I don't think it's a big deal, really, just puts more pressure on devs. First party games will still make good use of the best hardware, I'll bet.
 
Griffith500
Well they are going with a tiered approach for the new hardware itself, so it remains to be seen what the more affordable versions can do. The cross-platform focus for first party devs might offer some clues in that respect. I don't think it's a big deal, really, just puts more pressure on devs. First party games will still make good use of the best hardware, I'll bet.
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Yes, but world design is heavily compromised because MS's studios need to design around the worst common denominator which is the XB1. The only thing devs can push on the XBSX is the performance, but not game design. Not for the first 2 or 3 years at least.

You'll still see elevators and corridors on first party MS games because they can't get rid of them.

On the PS5, devs can, in theory, build worlds larger and with a lot more detail on the screen than we've ever seen due to the fast SSD's stream capabilities. That's what I'm getting from people who know about the impacts of that in world building / level design.
 
Will GT (or Forza) really be able to improve the AI much with this next tech. Or will we be stuck with 'chasing the rabbit' forever?
As a long time gamer, I know the AI in games always needs some kind of advantage over the player to be competitive, but even just more
variables would be nice, like any car in the pack is capable of finishing first or last, or is that a pipe dream?
 
zzz_pt
Yes, but world design is heavily compromised because MS's studios need to design around the worst common denominator which is the XB1. The only thing devs can push on the XBSX is the performance, but not game design. Not for the first 2 or 3 years at least.

You'll still see elevators and corridors on first party MS games because they can't get rid of them.

On the PS5, devs can, in theory, build worlds larger and with a lot more detail on the screen than we've ever seen due to the fast SSD's stream capabilities. That's what I'm getting from people who know about the impacts of that in world building / level design.
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You're expecting a step change in the way game environments are made that isn't going to happen. It'll take time. This is part of the inertia problem.

PS5 games will not make full use of the ability to pull vast amounts of data continuously for a while either, for the same reason.

So in a way MS are being sensible. Once everyone starts to get to grips with what is possible, learns new tricks and can streamline production in a different way (the downside to having more detail is that you have to make it all and tie it all together), sure, then the older / lesser consoles will prove troublesome in trying to adapt a vision, so to speak.

It won't be until developers are really pushing up against the limits of the new hardware that we will actually see any real innovation anyway. That's just how people work: constraint drives originality.
 
The more I think about it, the more I think MS put themselves into this 'hole' with the Xbox One and the Series X. The 360 had been a massive MASSIVE success, but MS had always billed the Xbox as a spec'd down PC dedicated to games and with the Xbox One they got lost in the messaging and the concept was messy. To claw back ground they went back to the PC and with One Pass they've got themselves in this situation where they kinda have to make a console that is similar enough to a PC that devs can easy day-one have a PC and Series X versions ready to go.

Sony hasn't got that inflexibility and so they can really push hardware innovation that you can't get on a PC at the moment and create something a bit more custom, more akin to consoles of old.
I think it would have been easy for Sony to have been suckered into this performance chase… which would have helped the Xbox/PC echo system that Sony hasn’t got. But with them side stepping that whole fight it really helps set them aside.

The fact that dev’s are seemingly excited about the PS5 kinda speaks to Sony’s approach after the PS3 that’s been far more dev focused.
 

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