Please Read - Promotions And Possible Changes

[kennythebomb]

"Personally, I'd accept a bump to D1, but I'd not be too excited about it knowing that I'd more than likely never take a podium."

I agree.

 

[standard235]

Yeah. I have no replay device and my dad won't let me get one. He said it was pointless and he won't let me buy something I might not like. Oh well. I might just do it anyways.

Back on topic, I will never make D1... not for a long time. Oh well. Bye.

 

[kennythebomb]

Yeah. I have no replay device and my dad won't let me get one. He said it was pointless and he won't let me buy something I might not like. Oh well. I might just do it anyways.

Back on topic, I will never make D1... not for a long time. Oh well. Bye.

lol....that's a new one

"daddy won't let me buy a 20 dollar maxdrive!"

 

[Teledriel]

Ok, I said I would get back to this, so here I go. Again these are My opinions, and nothing is meant to be harmful to people.

A) Replays ~ Yes I said D1 should have Replay verification, but my question is how many really care about the lower poeple's replays? I posted my replay, asking someone to check it, and the only one that cared enough was Kolyana, 2 days later, even after she asked others to please check the file. How does this make someone like me feel, if people don't care enough to maybe watch replay's and at maybe PM suggestions?

B) Podiums & Points ~ If points didn't mean a thing, then why did most of the "vets" agree to Flat-out's leaderboard, and try to make it "Offical". Div 3's has always been "Unoffical" and CFM, Koly, and I have the understanding that if he wants it to be stopped, it will be in a heartbeat. But we did this to help promote better compition amoung our ranks.

Everyone has had the Podiums in the sig lines most of the time here. Some go as far as how they do each week, some just put Starts, 1st, 2nd 3rd. But that is all a matter of pride, and how they want to show their love of the game to others, and there accomplishments. There is nothing set in stone that says your sig must conform with a standard. (With the excpetion that Luxy and 'Lil Tatter Tot have requested that it would help them on the leaderboard, if you put your controller type with Division in sig line, but it still is not a mandatory requirement)

Unless CFM advances 20ish people up out of Div 3, I will have a slim chance to gain a podium majority of the time until a lot of weeks from now. I am just happy if I can make it in the top 20. 7 Weeks, 6 Postings (Failed one run) and only 2 17th's. But I still come back for the fun, enjoyment, try to help some people (with little as I can), try to improve my driving skills, and the friendships that have been gained.

C) Divisions ~ Yes they need to maybe realigned. This is CFM's job though. I don't think that we need more than 3 divisons, but think that he should, do A) what he has asked and ask for voulnteers to move up, and B) maybe look at the performaces of constant drivers that overall place well if rack and stacked like you all did GT3 WRS. People talk about me and how I, "The Stat Guy", may "think" on somethings, but it exactly that, MHO. This was shared with Koly, cause we both had the same feelings on some things way back toward the start. And frankly, I told her, that I feel she should be promoted. This was back around week #4, if I remember correctly. But those were my thoughts

Just my 2 yen worth (which is less than 2 pennies btw)

 

[Touring Mars]

Yes if every driver raced every week, but they don't do they? Just because someone has ran more races than you and therefore gain more points doesn't make them a better driver than you. I may go ahead of 3rdgenX once the leaderboard has been updated, am I therefore a better driver than he? you can bet that I'm not.

My thoughts exactly... there needs to be some sort of way that, if for some reason you take a few weeks off, you can come back safe in the knowledge that you can always have a chance of climbing the leaderboard, otherwise, what would be the point?

 

[Small_Fryz]

My thoughts exactly... there needs to be some sort of way that, if for some reason you take a few weeks off, you can come back safe in the knowledge that you can always have a chance of climbing the leaderboard, otherwise, what would be the point?

your missing the point here.

the leaderboard is here for drivers to check their progress against others who run consistently. If you want to be at the top of the leaderboard then you have to compete for 6 weeks. Its not all about the leaderbord though, thats just some nice stats to look at, its not gonna effect how the WRS is run at all.

And yes i do value my spot on the leaderboard and try to get some nice points everyweek, i take the leaderboard as "whos most consistent" not as "who is fastest"

 

[Touring Mars]

your missing the point here.

the leaderboard is here for drivers to check their progress against others who run consistently. If you want to be at the top of the leaderboard then you have to compete for 6 weeks. Its not all about the leaderbord though, thats just some nice stats to look at, its not gonna effect how the WRS is run at all.

And yes i do value my spot on the leaderboard and try to get some nice points everyweek, i take the leaderboard as "whos most consistent" not as "who is fastest"

yeh, i realise that you need to race for 6 weeks solid... but it's good that you can be back up to your true spot on the baord after just 6 weeks, as opposed to being forever behind if the points total were cumulative over the year... but i agree, a solid individual performance in any given week is more gratifying than your leaderboard spot...

 

[ROB 256R]

1. I'd be game for a bit of D1 action, but I wouldn't mind waiting till next week to move coz i think i might be on for an overall podium for the first 8 week series combined.

2. Complusory replay verification in D1 is a good idea. More grade A replays to watch means more chances to learn stuff from them.

3. Some quality ideas there. The relay race sounds like loads of fun.

 

[Sphinx]

My thoughts exactly... there needs to be some sort of way that, if for some reason you take a few weeks off, you can come back safe in the knowledge that you can always have a chance of climbing the leaderboard, otherwise, what would be the point?

I agree with Fryz, you are missing the point mate.

TM, if you got the point your post would've read something like this:

My thoughts exactly... there needs to be some sort of way that, if for some reason you take a few weeks off, you can come back safe in the knowledge that you can always have a chance of climbing the Divisions, otherwise, what would be the point.

However, if your post was written like that then it would've been a pointless post because that already happens anyway.

For some reason many members believe that the leaderboard is the pinnacle of the WRS, it's not, it's there for fun, enjoyment, a little titbit for our amusement during our time of rising up through the divisions and winning podiums (if we're lucky )

Teledriel highlighted the fact that some of us called for the leaderboard to be made official, this is true, but not in the way you guys believe it should be. I made a call for the leaderboard to be recognised because I felt that all the hard work that went into it should be rewarded in some way, I didn't like the label of 'unofficial' in the subject line seeing that we all use it in whatever way we see fit and get a lot enjoyment from it, and therefore I/we asked for it to become part of the WRS (official). I can see how this has been taken the wrong way now, and perhaps I/we should've been more clearer in our request, but ask yourself why the call was rejected and you may find the answer, even though it has been said in the thread a number of times already.

Everyone has had the Podiums in the sig lines most of the time here. Some go as far as how they do each week, some just put Starts, 1st, 2nd 3rd. But that is all a matter of pride, and how they want to show their love of the game to others, and their accomplishments.

In short:
Bragging rights

 

[Kolyana]

In short:
Bragging rights

We agree on something

 

[Sphinx]

Firstly, I'm new here so I feel a little out of line by even piping up ... sorry.

Doesn't appear to hold you back none.

 

[Kolyana]

Have I just been dissed? I can never tell with these veterans

 

[Kent]

I plan on getting into some racing with you guys as soon as I can.

However, I just thought it would be important to give you (CFM) a heads up... I qualified in division 1 but now I'm feeling more like D2.

Oh well... I will just have to come back and race to find out.
See y'all around the track soon enough,
Until then,
-

 

[Sphinx]

Have I just been dissed? I can never tell with these veterans :
(

Just highlighting that not only can we agree on something's, but we can also both be facetious.

 

[Sphinx]

I plan on getting into some racing with you guys as soon as I can.

However, I just thought it would be important to give you (CFM) a heads up... I qualified in division 1 but now I'm feeling more like D2.

Oh well... I will just have to come back and race to find out.
See y'all around the track soon enough,
Until then,
-

It'll be nice to see you back in the frame Kent 👍 👍

 

[Touring Mars]

However, if your post was written like that then it would've been a pointless post because that already happens anyway.

Perhaps... I think it should remain the way it is, and that is just my opinion... but I think the way that CFM finds the easiest to organise is the best way, regardless of what I (or anyone else) thinks, but I appreciate the offer to give him some feedback... I don't think I'm missing the point though... I thought the whole point of a leaderboard was to be able to see how you compare against other folk, whether you wish to 'conquer' it or not... ??

It'll be nice to see you back in the frame Kent 👍 👍

I'll second that

 

[Kolyana]

Just highlighting that not only can we agree on something's, but we can also both be facetious.

You know, I wasn't being facetious, and I apologize if it's come across that way.

In my original post I acknowledge that my experience of the WRS, it's roots, events that have shaped it, and people that have been here from the beginning is woefully inadequate. Therefore, in adventuring an opinion, I run the risk of suggesting something widely considered as unacceptable, something dismissed many years ago or even - dare I say it - something that the 'old hands' find offensive.

I acknowledge this position of weakness as a prelude to offering my opinion, as an 'excuse - if you will - if I accidentally stoke old embers that are best left alone.

I can see that perhaps I have come off all wrong - although I'm not sure where - and your comment about me having an opinion, or perhaps over stating it (again, I didn't realize this), is a reminder to me that perhaps I should shut up until I have 10 years of WRS experience under my belt, and even then only if I'm in D1.

I apologize to you, seriously, for clearly over stepping my bounds and can promise you that it won't happen again. I'll keep my opinions well and truly to myself until GT 8?

 

[Sphinx]

OK let me spell it out to you before you get any more paranoid than you already are.

Here is the post you submitted that was in regard to a comment I made earlier.

We agree on something

Now, by you using a WINK emoticon at the end of your posting, highlighted to me that your were trying to be funny/facetious. Right? If not, then why use the damn thing.

in return to your attempted funny remark (remember the WINK) I decided to try to be funny back by highlighting a comment you made much earlier in this thread, and like you I also added a WINK to show that I too was trying to be funny/facetious.

You then posted this in regard to my so-called return funny/facetious comment:

Have I just been dissed? I can never tell with these veterans

It was clear to me that you didn't understand my funny/facetous comment because you weren't sure if you had been "dissed" or not.

To assure you that you had not been "dissed" I made another post:

Just highlighting that not only can we agree on something's, but we can also both be facetious.

I even added a further WINK to make you feel at ease because you were unsure about it.

Now, may I ask how many WINKS does it take to get you to understand that like you, i was only having fun?


Here's a few more just in case OK NOW?

 

[Luxy]

Settle down you two ... just a misunderstanding

*removes nose from where it doesn't belong*

 

[Sphinx]

Settle down you two ... just a misunderstanding

*removes nose from where it doesn't belong*

It's OK Luxy. I'm happy now that I've joined the bragging brigade (read sig)

 

[Iceman]

Come on, what ever happened to racing because it's a good time, not about some silly leaderboard? It's good and all to see how you stack up against other drivers, but in the long run it really is irrelevant. All that really matters is you knowing that you've done your best in any given week. It doesn't matter if you race every week or 1 time out of 100, the position that really matters is the one you take in the current week. If you don't like the race, there's nothing that says you should have to race it. This leaderboard is causing some people to race something they don't like just to get a few points. I'm sorry to say it but the WRS has lost a lot of the good times that I had in GT3 since GT4 has arrived. Instead of being a social competiton among good friends it's now turning into a free for all to get a few points on the leaderboard, and as far as I can see, we've lost much of the humility and graciousness that has got the WRS where it is today. I'm sorry if I offend anyone but I'm really disappointed about these stats of podiums in your sigs. If you really feel confident enough to flaunt something like that, then you should move up a division, plain and simple. I've got nothing against putting your division or accomplishments such as BC victories in your sig (hell, if I could win a BC race I'd do it too ) because those are things you can truly be proud of. Seeing a placement on a leaderboard is a nice convenience but it is NOT life or death. The nature of the WRS competition is that it provides an attractive option for those who like to compete in well organized spot races at their discretion, not week after week. Therein lies the downfall of the leaderboard in that it is finite but weekly races will keep going on past the number of races used to keep a total of points. As I see it, the only way to judge your standing is week by week.

 

[Small_Fryz]

i agree Ben 👍

 

[Androoos]

Very well said. I agree completely.

 

[KLR142]

I'll put myself up for promotion, I know I didn't spend enough time on the qualifier, but I didn't know what I was supposed to be shooting for, and I of course wanted to get into the real race. I think that making the first two weeks for a newbie to participate in the regular series and then be placed into a division is a good idea because of this...

But don't promote me until after this week. Unless I come back here and say you can promote me(I'll have to chop off at least ONE second off of my final time first).

Otherwise, I think the current setup is just fine and dandy, we just need to keep going and let it settle down as more people come in and join up.

 

[Kolyana]

Two ... seconds??? UHOH

 

[Speedy Samurai]

I think that promotions should be up to CFM. If you are consistently in the top 3 or 5 week after week, you should be promoted even if you don't want to be. I can imagine someone wanting to stay in a lower division just to keep getting a high placing and points on the board.

 

[RedWolfRacer]

I would agree with there being fun in the WRS. But last week, when I thought I had the PERFECT lap and was good enough to warrant a podium, I found myself outside of the top ten or so! My fun was officially killed. Yes, the driving was fun even though I HATE Skylines, but I thought I would end up with something I could be proud of. The only positive thing I came out with last weeks was that I earned points and fixed my PS 2 for the nth time.

Yes, the WRS is fun but at the same time it has the ability to consume you in some way. I was angry, but I got over it as soon as I had to go to work that night. I ended up racing part of the JGTC in GT4 for "fun" but found myself trailing there, too (I was roughly 100HP weaker and 150 KG heavier than most of the other cars and was running on Racing Hard tires to boot). I got sick of it and finally went to bed, got up at 5 the next day and went to school one irate puppy.

That said, I think the four divisions would be a good idea. How it is created and decided, however, is where the problem lies. I would feel much better if I could compete better with those in my division and a promotion would be a big boost in enthusiasm for many racers, myself included.

Improvement is always possible, but it may or may not make everyone happy. Eventually, no matter what you do, we'll all get used to it and accept it.

Good luck with all of it, though, CFM. Looks like you've got an even bigger job to do than usual. Props! 👍

 

[Kolyana]

Red, it can be a bummer to put in so much hard work and find yourself woefully lacking and trailing around the back of the pack (one reason why Teledriel and I added the unofficial D3 leaderboard, to give everyone something to chase), but I can assure you that you WILL improve. I finished 20th on my first week and I raced my heart out ... heck, one week I put everything I had into it and mustered a stunning 11th or something ... but I was overjoyed .. I had improved.

Racing hard and often will improve your skills, so the WRS becomes a challenge to yourself more than against some of the freakishly fast guys around here. Pick some guys around your skill level and target beating them, rather than walking away with a gold cup ... you'll be surprised how soon you're working your way up the ranks.

Which is why I think a few guys around here are saying that it'snot about how often you race, or the points, or even where you place, but rather the simple fun of driving and improving and the friendly competition.

 

[Tedehur]

When I joined the GT3-WRS back in week 65, there was no leaderboard (official or unofficial), only stats compiled by Famine and lotus350 concerning the number of wins, podiums and races.
Races were fun anyway, I was in the mid-div2 pack, but the only important thing was the fight I was having with some fellow racers week after week.
I created the first leaderboard after week 77, because I thought that could be some sort of short term memory (2 months only), and that would reward people who were racing weekly without ever being among the top 3.

I think too that at the end of the day, points or podiums or ranking on any board shouldn't be the issue. Why don't just we just enjoy racing with friends, sharing settings and tips... ?

Many racers here are new to the WRS, and I find they give to much consideration to this point system of mine. To them, I'd like to stress on the fact that points and ranking are no indicators for fame or consideration.
Should I stop with the leaderboard for a while so that you all feel the true WRS atmosphere ?

@newbies : next time you look at this board of mine, don't look at the ranking or points column next to your name, look at the racers names above and below. You'll find your rivals for next week. A week later, search for their names in the result thread and compare your time to theirs. Hopefully after a few weeks, you won't give too much credit to what your points or ranking are, but you'll just be happy when Mr X has been eating your dust or mad when you've been eating his all week long.

I'm coming back to CFM's first post :

1) I don't think there's any need to change the division system. When somebody is so fast that he/she has no competition any more in his/her division then CFM promotes him/her to the next division. That's what happened with Alpine, vexd, Large Fryz...
Several people can also be promoted at a time, like what happened to the top 3 div 3 racers a few weeks ago.

But the promotion system should be 100% CFM's decision. Would't you find arrogant people asking for their own promotion ? When they've shown their skill on the track, then they will obviously be promoted.

2) I don't know what to think about this. Making replays mandatory would strengthen the idea that the WRS is some well structured, coherent race series, and the WRS is just the opposite : friends racing together for fun.
Back in GT3, people were gaining other racers' consideration and respect by posting their replays even if they were slow racers (Not long ago I still had a link to my replays from week 65 to 106 in my sig).
On the other hand, we can be sure that we'll have many cheaters posting dummy times if replays are not mandatory.

Perhaps that's a tip for the newbies : posting fast times is only 50% of what you need to be considered a fast driver by other racers. Systematic posting of your replays (slow and fast weeks) make the remaining 50%.

3) CFM has been around for a long enough time, I trust him for putting up good combos and great new ideas.


I've not been having much time to race in the past weeks, and now my PS2 is slowly dying : it would read the disc once on ten tries. I'll have to convince Mrs. Flat-out that putting 150 € in a new PS2 would be a good idea

 

[Luxy]

I think too that at the end of the day, points or podiums or ranking on any board shouldn't be the issue. Why don't just we just enjoy racing with friends, sharing settings and tips... ?

@newbies : next time you look at this board of mine, don't look at the ranking or points column next to your name, look at the racers names above and below. You'll find your rivals for next week. A week later, search for their names in the result thread and compare your time to theirs. Hopefully after a few weeks, you won't give too much credit to what your points or ranking are, but you'll just be happy when Mr X has been eating your dust or mad when you've been eating his all week long.

Well said, Cyril 👍