[POLL] United States Presidential Elections 2016

[RC45]

Obviously not all liberals are going to think this, just like how not all Trump supporters are xenophobic/queerphobic/islamaphobic.

Which 'side' is going to pose the greatest threat to the other?

To me, it seems like the extreme right rhetoric poses a greater risk (at least for civil rights). because there is threat to policy surrounding women's rights, queer rights etc. due to a Republican majority in the House and Senate as well as plans to implement the next Scalia into the SCOTUS.

On top of that, you have the vitriolic rhetoric Trump's victory has emboldened for a part of his supporters; a mass of climate change deniers and many who want religion and the state to get freaky together.

What would the risks have been for conservatives if Clinton won?

(keep in mind I'm posting this as a liberal so I have some bias. I'll try to be opened minded though).

I have often seen this type of response, so I am intrigued where these ideas have come from:

Which women's rights are under threat?

Which gay rights are under threat?

Having a court balancing conservative justice is a terrible thing as opposed to yet another uber-liberal legislate from the bench justice?

Where exactly has any conservative ever proposed a state sponsored religion?

 

[RouWa]

Why you ask?

18 months = about 540 days. If you divide 197,603 by 540 you get 365. I can't imagine a party running 365 TV spots every day in a single state.

Among the key benefits are [snip] the ability to vote your own salary.

The 630 members of the German parliament have the sime right, but their monthly income is currently "only" 9.327 € (about 10k $/month). That's okay. It's more than you need to live, but it won't make you extremely rich.

 

[Dennisch]

WASHINGTON — Vice President-elect Mike Pence will take over the job of leading Donald J. Trump’s transition effort, taking the helm from Chris Christie, the governor of New Jersey, as Mr. Trump moves to assemble a government after his stunning upset victory, the transition team said on Friday.

Mr. Christie had been in charge of the transition for the last several months, but the surprise nature of Mr. Trump’s victory made it critical to move more quickly to assemble a team. Mr. Christie’s standing has been in question in recent weeks as two of his former aides were convicted in the scandal involving the political motivation behind lane closings at the George Washington Bridge in 2013.

The president-elect told advisers he wanted to tap Mr. Pence’s Washington experience and contacts to help move the process along, according to people familiar with the discussions. An executive committee including members of Congress will advise Mr. Pence as the process moves forward.

Mr. Christie, along with Rudolph W. Giuliani, the former mayor of New York, and Michael T. Flynn, a retired lieutenant general who has been a top campaign supporter, will serve as vice chairmen of the transition, the sources said.

Rick Dearborn, the chief of staff to Senator Jeff Sessions, Republican of Alabama, will move from the campaign’s Washington office to help run the transition office. He move will push aside Rich Bagger, who is close to Mr. Christie and had been working on the transition.

The transition team is adding 12 members, including a Republican donor, Rebekah Mercer; Stephen K. Bannon, Mr. Trump’s campaign chairman; Reince Priebus, the chairman of the Republican National Committee; Peter Thiel, a co-founder of PayPal; Representative Marsha Blackburn, Republican of Tennessee; and three of Mr. Trump’s adult children and his son-in-law, Jared Kushner.

Mr. Trump’s administration is being assembled behind the scenes. But like much else in the nation’s capital, little stays secret for long.

The list of names being mentioned as possibilities for crucial posts in Mr. Trump’s cabinet is growing by the hour, giving official Washington what it craves most: a never-ending parlor game as speculation grows about who might actually get the jobs.

A big revelation may come soon, according to Mr. Trump himself, who went on Twitter on Friday morning with some news. “Busy day planned in New York,” the president-elect said. “Will soon be making some very important decisions on the people who will be running our government.”

And for the rest of the article on The New York Times.

 

[GTsail]

From my point of view, only if wages didn't suffer under the same period.

What do you mean that "wages suffered"?

You mentioned that inflation was a problem during Obama's term, and from my look at the data, inflation is currently averaging lower under Obama's term than under the terms of our last four or five Presidents. Do you think that low inflation is "bad"?

 

[RC45]

18 months = about 540 days. If you divide 197,603 by 540 you get 365. I can't imagine a party running 365 TV spots every day in a single state.



The 630 members of the German parliament have the sime right, but their monthly income is currently "only" 9.327 € (about 10k $/month). That's okay. It's more than you need to live, but it won't make you extremely rich.

I think she may be confusing all adds aired in a certain market versus just one candidate airing their adds.

Remember the ads are targeted to the local audience. The only national candidates are the President and VP.

Everything else is limited to local district level. Each local precinct would be where you vote for you Senator, your Congressman, Judges, Sheriff, District Attorney, Tax Assessor, School Board members etc. - each of these offices is pretty much split down the party line.

What do you mean that "wages suffered"?

You mentioned that inflation was a problem during Obama's term, and from my look at the data, inflation is currently averaging lower under Obama's term than under the terms of our last four or five Presidents. Do you think that low inflation is "bad"?

If real wages decline then the lower inflation number is of no relief to the consumer as their spending capacity is still affected.

In theory, the basket of goods (although that's also a manipulated crock as the basket no longer includes food and energy - the 2 biggest costs consumers face) may cost less, but the basket of goods is still a higher percentage of the consumers available income.

The net result is the lower inflation number is not what is experienced by the consumer - they experience an increase in their cost of living when measured against their income.

The numbers game is reflected in how the voters vote - seeing that they are the consumers, there is your metric of success or failure.

 

[Daniel]

I have often seen this type of response, so I am intrigued where these ideas have come from:

Which women's rights are under threat?

Pense wants to abolish Roe v Wade. Whatever your opinions on abortion, it does remove the right of women to decide whether or not to have an abortion. The addition of another Scalia may increase chances of this happening.

Which gay rights are under threat?

Pense (with a socially conservative SCOTUS) may prevent the ban of conversion therapy, which is the pseudoscientific attempt to change one's sexual orientation. It has consisted of (in the past) lobotomies, genital electric shocks and drugs. Nowadays it still results in depression, anxiety and suicidal thoughts.

Having a court balancing conservative justice is a terrible thing as opposed to yet another uber-liberal legislate from the bench justice?

It depends if they're balancing or not. I'm just using Scalia as an example since he was pretty against gay marriage. I am also saying this as a gay guy, so I (again) might have some bias.

Where exactly has any conservative ever proposed a state sponsored religion?

Not an explicitly sponsored, but religion is seen everywhere in politics, which I find odd given that the first Amendment says otherwise. Didn't both VPs quote the Bible during the theirs debate?

 

[Johnnypenso]

Pense wants to abolish Roe v Wade. Whatever your opinions on abortion, it does remove the right of women to decide whether or not to have an abortion. The addition of another Scalia may increase chances of this happening.
Pense (with a socially conservative SCOTUS) may prevent the ban of conversion therapy, which is the pseudoscientific attempt to change one's sexual orientation. It has consisted of (in the past) lobotomies, genital electric shocks and drugs. Nowadays it still results in depression, anxiety and suicidal thoughts.


It depends if they're balancing or not. I'm just using Scalia as an example since he was pretty against gay marriage. I am also saying this as a gay guy, so I (again) might have some bias.

Not an explicitly sponsored, but religion is seen everywhere in politics, which I find odd given that the first Amendment says otherwise. Didn't both VPs quote the Bible during the theirs debate?

The Supreme Court has leaned conservative for 40+ years and through 23 years of Republican Presidents. Roe v. Wade was 43 years ago. I don't recall any GOP Presidents in that time making any moves towards imposing any religion on anybody.

 

[McLaren]

Obviously not all liberals are going to think this, just like how not all Trump supporters are xenophobic/queerphobic/islamaphobic.

Which 'side' is going to pose the greatest threat to the other?

To me, it seems like the extreme right rhetoric poses a greater risk (at least for civil rights). because there is threat to policy surrounding women's rights, queer rights etc. due to a Republican majority in the House and Senate as well as plans to implement the next Scalia into the SCOTUS.

On top of that, you have the vitriolic rhetoric Trump's victory has emboldened for a part of his supporters; a mass of climate change deniers and many who want religion and the state to get freaky together.

What would the risks have been for conservatives if Clinton won?

(keep in mind I'm posting this as a liberal so I have some bias. I'll try to be opened minded though).

Your argument has altered. You originally spoke as if folks were in fear for their lives bc they would be physically attacked for their beliefs.

Now you're proposing the "fear" from Trump winning is their civil rights being affected. I'm sorry, but please explain how affecting your civil rights is a greater threat than the violence Liberals are already beginning to take part in.

Unlike the protestors, why not wait and see if these fears begin to come to fruition instead of assuming a Republican-held govt is going to actually do anything of the sort. Yes, they lean towards those views, but they still have 2 months before they take full control under Trump. Most of your concerns seem to come from Pence who remains only 1 man under Trump; he may have some influence but that's not a guarantee the rest of the govt or Trump will see eye-to-eye with him.

As for Clinton, the assumed war with Russia seems like a pretty valid concern over Syria.

 

[BobK]

18 months = about 540 days. If you divide 197,603 by 540 you get 365. I can't imagine a party running 365 TV spots every day in a single state.

365 ads a day works out to about 15 per hour. If you consider how many channels are available, that actually sounds pretty accurate; say fifteen channels means one ad per hour. From all parties, not 15 per hour per party. Considering that 40% of the airtime in this country (or my area at least, by my reckoning) is advertising, I'm somewhat surprised the number isn't higher.

 

[mister dog]

Is he a master manipulator, and all the extreme remarks were part of his strategy to get attention?:



(probably posted before, but i don't feel like going through 285 pages to find out so apologies in advance )

 

[Sanji Himura]

Unemployment cut in half since the recession.

Excuse me, but I'm new here. Would you mind explaining to me how not counting people who have given up looking for work in the final unemployment numbers, something that Obama did, was actually good for the economy? Furthermore, mind explaining to me how Bush's unemployment numbers were always revised down and Obama always revised his numbers up and calling the latter actually better for the economy?

 

[RC45]

Pense wants to abolish Roe v Wade. Whatever your opinions on abortion, it does remove the right of women to decide whether or not to have an abortion. The addition of another Scalia may increase chances of this happening.

How is 1 justice added to the court going to suddenly cause this decision to be overturned?
And what the VP wants is not what drives the Supremes.

Pense (with a socially conservative SCOTUS) may prevent the ban of conversion therapy, which is the pseudoscientific attempt to change one's sexual orientation. It has consisted of (in the past) lobotomies, genital electric shocks and drugs. Nowadays it still results in depression, anxiety and suicidal thoughts.

And again what does this have to do with e VP? Laws are promulgated by Congress not the VP or POTUS.

It depends if they're balancing or not. I'm just using Scalia as an example since he was pretty against gay marriage. I am also saying this as a gay guy, so I (again) might have some bias.

Which means what? Where is the fear coming from?

Not an explicitly sponsored, but religion is seen everywhere in politics, which I find odd given that the first Amendment says otherwise. Didn't both VPs quote the Bible during the theirs debate?

Clinton has quoted the Bible as well - considering the country was founded on Judea Christian principals it stands to reason.

And the First Amendment simply bars the state form establishign areligion or interering with the practice of religion by the people.

Its freedom OF religion, not freedom FROM religion.

And I as an atheist immigrant married to a minority I am not worried at all. On any front.

 

[ClydeYellow]

The president-elect told advisers he wanted to tap Mr. Pence’s Washington experience and contacts to help move the process along, according to people familiar with the discussions. An executive committee including members of Congress will advise Mr. Pence as the process moves forward.

Such draining.
Much swamp.
Wow.

What did I tell ya? Say hello to your new Tea Party government - they've been in Washington banging prepubescent girls and stealing your money for a while now, but before that, nobody really gave credit to their wacky ideas.
Oh, but I'm sure the workers who have voted from him will enjoy such a surge in quality of life now that people like Pence will be free to implement the extreme version of trickle-down economics while guys like Giuliani order the police to shoot rubber bullets and tear gas grenades on them if they doth protest too much.

 

[Northstar]

View attachment 605735

Such draining.
Much swamp.
Wow.

What did I tell ya? Say hello to your new Tea Party government - they've been in Washington banging prepubescent girls and stealing your money for a while now, but before that, nobody really gave credit to their wacky ideas.
Oh, but I'm sure the workers who have voted from him will enjoy such a surge in quality of life now that people like Pence will be free to implement the extreme version of trickle-down economics while guys like Giuliani order the police to shoot rubber bullets and tear gas grenades on them if they doth protest too much.

Anyway you could tell me the winning lotto numbers and the next 3-4 Superbowl winners?

 

[McLaren]

This might be the most disgusting thing I've ever seen. Your child picks Trump in a mock election at school only because he sees him on TV (so clearly, it's just a misguided vote to begin with) & you decide to pack his bags and tell him to go find somewhere else to live. Supposedly, the mother did this to "teach" him a lesson, but this goes on far too long & she even tells her younger son to go with the "Trump lover".

*I know YT title probably won't resonate well, but this is one of the few videos without additional dialogue.

The multiple stories of kids getting beat up at school, someone on Twitter claiming protestors attacked & injured his dog, and this? Love trumps hate, what a load of nonsense these folks adopted. Even Hillary must be thinking, "Jesus Christ, & these are people who voted for me".

 

[Northstar]

What the 🤬 is wrong with that monster (The only humans in that video were the kids)?

I actually agree with a Youtube comment for once in that crap like that is exactly why we are in the state we are in and also why it won't change anytime soon.

 

[LMSCorvetteGT2]

Basket of deplorables eh?





I know, I know...it's Bush's fault!

Water cannons never looked so good

No, really.

If you knew anything about the subject which you clearly don't, you'd see why this was done. It's not some poor outreach there is actual incentive in doing this. I actually am in this area, I actually see this stuff first hand, if you have no clue don't spout trite, unless you like being called out. Now, @R1600 has done just fine underlining a point that you should probably try to understand.

 

[RC45]

If you knew anything about the subject which you clearly don't, you'd see why this was done. It's not some poor outreach there is actual incentive in doing this. I actually am in this area, I actually see this stuff first hand, if you have no clue don't spout trite, unless you like being called out. Now, @R1600 has done just fine underlining a point that you should probably try to understand.

NASA has no place using tax dollars to outreach anything to anyone outside of their original mandate - period.

If a group cannot 'feel good' about their own contributions to any particular discipline then the problem lies with them - and the fact that the subject matter has moved on is more of a testament about their lack of progress over a period of history than anything else.

IOW, if the muslim (Persian) world has failed to keep up with their original contributions they made to the fields of science and math then so be it, that means they stagnated and are now no longer the leaders. (and to be honest, most of the real contributions where made pre-islam and even borrowed from other non-Persian sources))

That is the nature of competition and survival. Civilizations rise and civilizations fall - the middle east peaked around 700 a.d.

BTW I provided the interview video confirmation of the outreach directive - yet you deny the action.

 

[Omnis]

Rand Paul wasn't a candidate for POTUS. Trump never said anything about spending money to build a wall either.

Did you even read what I quoted?

 

[Northstar]

This might be the most disgusting thing I've ever seen. Your child picks Trump in a mock election at school only because he sees him on TV (so clearly, it's just a misguided vote to begin with) & you decide to pack his bags and tell him to go find somewhere else to live. Supposedly, the mother did this to "teach" him a lesson, but this goes on far too long & she even tells her younger son to go with the "Trump lover".

*I know YT title probably won't resonate well, but this is one of the few videos without additional dialogue.

The multiple stories of kids getting beat up at school, someone on Twitter claiming protestors attacked & injured his dog, and this? Love trumps hate, what a load of nonsense these folks adopted. Even Hillary must be thinking, "Jesus Christ, & these are people who voted for me".

CPS must have gotten flooded as apparently they arrived while a news crew was there interviewing neighbors.
http://sportscar365.com/imsa/iwsc/hawksworth-alon-complete-3gt-lexus-lineup/
I don't recall anything like this crap happening in '04, '08 or '12. Have we really lost our minds in 4 short years?

 

[McLaren]

CPS must have gotten flooded as apparently they arrived while a news crew was there interviewing neighbors.
I don't recall anything like this crap happening in '04, '08 or '12. Have we really lost our minds in 4 short years?

The detective we spoke with says the video doesn't appear to show any wrongdoing, so right now no charges have been filed.

"She explains it was a joke," Luera explained.

Hahahah. That was so funny making that child cry and berate him. I forgot we also now live in a society where people can basically screw with others and then go, "BRO, IT'Z A JOKE! CHILL" when people retaliate b/c that makes it all better.

Maybe we have lost our minds.

Edit* This happened in Texas, too? Smh.

 

[LMSCorvetteGT2]

NASA has no place using tax dollars to outreach anything to anyone outside of their original mandate - period.

Says you, they're a government organization and engineering/science agency first and foremost, in a global society where other regions hold smart minds that are more into actually working in such a field. The recruitment is tantamount to continuing to thrive.

If a group cannot 'feel good' about their own contributions to any particular discipline then the problem lies with them - and the fact that the subject matter has moved on is more of a testament about their lack of progress over a period of history than anything else.

Lack of progress? Yet again you have no idea what the hell you're raving about.

IOW, if the muslim (Persian) world has failed to keep up with their original contributions they made to the fields of science and math then so be it, that means they stagnated and are now no longer the leaders. (and to be honest, most of the real contributions where made pre-islam and even borrowed from other non-Persian sources))

No it doesn't they haven't stagnated at all. You seem to not really understand the context of the video other than some right wing rhetoric that this is clearly a democrat president pandering to a group that isn't liked by said right wing rhetoric.

That is the nature of competition and survival. Civilizations rise and civilizations fall - the middle east peaked around 700 a.d.

BTW I provided the interview video confirmation of the outreach directive - yet you deny the action.

I deny what exactly, I rejected the notion that you fully think you know what the hell you're talking about. I reject it on the grounds that some of us actually are in the field and you don't seem to be unless you'd like to say otherwise. It get's old seeing this same bit where people see something have no idea what the agency does or the people who work in it and just run with this supposed liberal agenda running rampant.

If they're civilization peeked, this is news to me, considering those from that region are more enthused to come to the U.S. after obtaining a degree in their nation or ours and being leading scientist and engineers. The only other group of people on par are those of Asian back ground. Hate to break it to you, but the U.S. is a joke when it comes to sparking interests in it's own population to want to do the hard work it takes to be a scientist or engineer, nor do many states have the curriculum that would prepare students. The only group that gets left behind is us, but since we actually do everything we can to get international students over here and work for us in these fields it prevents us from falling backwards.

 

[Johnnypenso]

Did you even read what I quoted?

Yep.

 

[Northstar]

Hahahah. That was so funny making that child cry and berate him. I forgot we also now live in a society where people can basically screw with others and then go, "BRO, IT'Z A JOKE! CHILL" when people retaliate b/c that makes it all better.

Maybe we have lost our minds.

Edit* This happened in Texas, too? Smh.

What really scares me is that while browsing various articles on it I've seen a few people actually defend her.

My favorite:

Like I said she was showing him the consequences of being a follower and not making his own decisions. She was clearly disappointed in her child because she's trying to instill what it is to be a young black man in America. The importance of not following your peers.

Really? Good lord I've seen serial killers justify their actions better than that person!

 

[Dotini]

Depression is #4 in the 5 stages of acceptance. http://www2.bakersfieldcollege.edu/jkirst/spst48/stages_of_acceptance.pdf

Breaking down: Huma Abedin was crying as she walked to the Clinton campaign headquarters, carrying the access credential for the Brooklyn offices

 

[McLaren]

What really scares me is that while browsing various articles on it I've seen a few people actually defend her.
My favorite:

Really? Good lord I've seen serial killers justify their actions better than that person!

Ugh. The other side of that scenario is that if he said he voted for Hillary for the same reason, this video would have never been made. So, like you, I'm not buying that pitiful excuse.

 

[prisonermonkeys]

How is 1 justice added to the court going to suddenly cause this decision to be overturned?

Because the balance of power can shift to the conservatives. Roe vs. Wade was not a unanimous decision - it only just scraped through. The appointment of a pro-life judge could see the decision overturned if it were challenged, and/or possibly exert influence over other judges during deliberations and persuade them to change their vote.

Such draining.
Much swamp.
Wow.

To be fair, Trump has zero experience in public office. He's going to need to surround himself with people who know how the system works to understand it. How can he hope to change it if he doesn't know how to do it?

That said, I have my doubts about his ability to succeed. The entire system is built around checks and balances - things are designed to move slowly so as to prevent too much from changing too quickly.

Is he a master manipulator, and all the extreme remarks were part of his strategy to get attention?:

The big risk that he runs is that he could become another Tony Abbott. When Abbott defeated Julia Gillard in the 2013 federal election, he ran a very negative campaign. He went after Gillard the way Trump went after Clinton. Abbott was an excellent opposition leader, but once he got into government, he continued to think, act and behave like an opposition leader, and his leadership became completely dysfunctional.

 

[mustafur]

The Judge they are replacing was a conservative anyway so it shouldn't change too much, controlling the House, Congress and the Executive branch though is another story.

 

[Sanji Himura]

The Judge they are replacing was a conservative anyway so it shouldn't change too much, controlling the House, Congress and the Executive branch though is another story.

Here is the list of the Supreme Court Justices by age:

Ginsburg at 83
Kennedy at 80
Breyer at 78
Thomas at 68
Alito at 66
Sotomayor at 62
Roberts at 61
Kegan at 56

Justice Thomas has stated that he wants to retire from the court during this upcoming term, and there is the possibility that Justice Ginsburg and Justice Kennedy might die or retire during Trump's term. So with the Death of Justice Scalia, Trump might be able to pick four justices to the court, one liberal, one swing vote and two conservatives.

 

[mister dog]

The big risk that he runs is that he could become another Tony Abbott. When Abbott defeated Julia Gillard in the 2013 federal election, he ran a very negative campaign. He went after Gillard the way Trump went after Clinton. Abbott was an excellent opposition leader, but once he got into government, he continued to think, act and behave like an opposition leader, and his leadership became completely dysfunctional.

That's a big question mark which we'll find out in the next 4 years, but if all of this (the extreme remarks to grab attention, and the way he was able to downsize all of his strongest opponents), wasn't something impulsive which happened to work out but an actual strategy, he's a bloody master strategist IMO

Stems me hopeful that he knows what he's doing, and now that he's elected he'll start sounding way more rational on all fronts.