Potato...

[Veinz]

Impossible with real life slick tires... that car has too low power

That corner is sharpish with a big dip in it, before it wasn’t hard to get any kind of rwd car loose through there. The GR4 McLaren is definitely not the most powerful, but it’s still a 400hp supercar and hards aren’t that grippy. You would think it would still at least get a little loose driving so aggressively, but it doesn’t react at all.

Even if I ride the curb while being aggressive with the steering angle and throttle, barely no reaction.

There’s something funky going on here, granted it does feel much easier than before in terms of oversteer.

 

[Groundfish]

With respect to those last few posts...
Take an example like Dirt Rally 2.
They did not choose to release the game with many of the more popular effects people like typically with the ffb.
I may be wrong but I seem to remember videos of the development process and it was developed with help from a real rally driver.
The ffb on that is very very good imo but it lacked the surface chatter.
What it has though is really reall good steering rack feel which to me felt really good and gives a great sense of the car.
Imo as implemented it’s a pretty realistic ffb. Many of the sim as They were called above nerds hated it.
For my taste in a real car you get more the feel of bumps through the chassis through your butt than via the steering wheel. You feel bigger hits in the wheel but imo much ffb is overcooked to stimulate rather than ‘realistic’ Surface chatter effect sells games though so...
It’s just a great discussion this.
I’d bet in game development pro real life drivers would not agree on physics and ffb much.
So what you have is people who have spent thousands of hours building a game driving technique based on the games physics model. Of course they are gonna be pissed when changes occur.
I guess that’s neither here nor there but in any case thousands of game hours differ from thousands of real life hours.
Everyone’s idea of what would be ‘best’ can only come from their experiences.

 

[breeminator]

Tried the Gr.3 911 - rear tyres glued to the road under throttle, like the R8, the pattern continues of it being related to weight distribution.

 

[dabz343]

If this is true, PD should scrap the FIA and do like Forza, using pads on live events (which is an option but a bit ridiculous for a racing game IMO) and stop pretending to care about a decent, realistic and interesting eSports competition.

They can't have it both ways and they should listen to the people who are have been to the live events and reporting their insatisfaction with the changes that have been made and how negatively they impact a fair and transparent competition.

They can have it both ways--that's what happens when you have a franchise built on blind, loyal fans.

Now, the FIA partnership is another entirely different discussion--remember, the FIA is just dipping their toes into eSports. If there is one thing that I know from experience with the FIA, they will not let a video game company dictate terms. And Kaz knows this all too well--being Asian, he know that status can be a double-edged sword. Credit to Kaz for convincing the FIA to join, but now--after 18 months in--he may be facing margin call from the FIA. When you sell a promise, you better know how to deliver...and in today's competitive market, you better know how to over deliver.

 

[Mr P]

Well my first reply in here was after testing only the RBJ after the update... I see a world of difference in the Gr.3 cars now I tired those today.... back in March when the F1 G-TR was first released I done a few laps on select tracks and one of those being Dragon Trail Seaside with the stock car and RH tyres .. anyway the overall lap difference from then till now is quite drastic for sure! I run probably 10 laps today in the maclaren and got it down into the 1'38's but 3 months ago in March the car was much faster and easier to drive and could run steady 1'35's but not now

anyway the pro's and cons of updates is in full effect haha.. better in some cars but 10 times worse in others

Here's a a vid I done in march to show a much more driveable maclaren compared to the one I jumped in this morning 👎



Not the end of the world but the Gr.3 cars seem to suffer the most changes this update for sure

 

[Brzlav]

Didn't he crash there few years ago and had to go to the hospital ?

Yeah, like Michael Schumacher in Silverstone '99. What a noob...

 

[kjeldsen]

If this is true, PD should scrap the FIA and do like Forza, using pads on live events (which is an option but a bit ridiculous for a racing game IMO) and stop pretending to care about a decent, realistic and interesting eSports competition.

They can't have it both ways and they should listen to the people who are going / have been to the live events and reporting their insatisfaction with the changes that have been made and how negatively they impact a fair and transparent competition.

Uhh? They had it both ways so far, this update doesn't change anything.

But yeah, it will be interesting to hear what the actual top drivers think, after the dust have settled and knee jerk reactions is replaced by actual experience.

 

[zzz_pt]

Uhh? They had it both ways so far, this update doesn't change anything.

But yeah, it will be interesting to hear what the actual top drivers think, after the dust have settled and knee jerk reactions is replaced by actual experience.

Yeah, but it's getting worse and worse. And more people are giving up FIA altogether.

 

[dabz343]

Sorry, I don't see this crowd giving up on FIA Championship...they may bitch and moan, but the usual suspects will show up and nod agreeably with PD...and that's unfortunately an acceptable reality.

 

[Leo Thorne]

Has anyone who uses the H shifter noticed that when you push the clutch like say 30% in, the car either brakes or accelerates?

It’s weird and I can’t really explain it well.

 

[zzz_pt]

Sorry, I don't see this crowd giving up on FIA Championship...they may bitch and moan, but the usual suspects will show up and nod agreeably with PD...and that's unfortunately an acceptable reality.

Well if you're in the top 0.001% and can qualify almost for sure, I can get why you would keep playing and winning. But most of the people who give up are those who fight hard and spent a lot of time practicing. With constant changes (to the worst) and no clue about why they're made, some guys left/are leaving. I mean, I know a few guys who've been to live events and GTAcademy finalists who gave up FIA or the game entirely. Not because of 1.39 in specific, but it's just another water drop that will be the last for some players out there.

If the physics tweaks change the cars so much that they stop you from having fun driving, what's the point in even competing. It gets to be more of a job (and a boring one) than what already is. Tire wear is already ridiculous. With the recent change, "paliative tire care races" (as I call them) will be even worse.

 

[pantherjag]

Well my first reply in here was after testing only the RBJ after the update... I see a world of difference in the Gr.3 cars now I tired those today.... back in March when the F1 G-TR was first released I done a few laps on select tracks and one of those being Dragon Trail Seaside with the stock car and RH tyres .. anyway the overall lap difference from then till now is quite drastic for sure! I run probably 10 laps today in the maclaren and got it down into the 1'38's but 3 months ago in March the car was much faster and easier to drive and could run steady 1'35's but not now

anyway the pro's and cons of updates is in full effect haha.. better in some cars but 10 times worse in others

Here's a a vid I done in march to show a much more driveable maclaren compared to the one I jumped in this morning 👎



Not the end of the world but the Gr.3 cars seem to suffer the most changes this update for sure

I think what's happened here is you drove the car in March without BOP on giving you 200kg less weight and 75 more horsepower than the BOPed version.

I presume the 1.38's you did were in the daily event meaning BOP was applied.

I did a quick test on time trial version and was 3-4 seconds slower in the BOP version than stock. Pretty much a second down by first corner.

Easy mistake to make. Several times iv went to test a car in time trial and done 10 laps before realising iv not turned BOP on

 

[Mr P]

I think what's happened here is you drove the car in March without BOP on giving you 200kg less weight and 75 more horsepower than the BOPed version.

I presume the 1.38's you did were in the daily event meaning BOP was applied.

I did a quick test on time trial version and was 3-4 seconds slower in the BOP version than stock. Pretty much a second down by first corner.

Easy mistake to make. Several times iv went to test a car in time trial and done 10 laps before realising iv not turned BOP on

You could be right I will boot it up and try the F1 again tonight .. probably just me having a brain fart though 👍

 

[zzz_pt]

You could be right I will boot it up and try the F1 again tonight .. probably just me having a brain fart though 👍

If you do a low 1:35 with SS atm, you could probably be in top splits FIA races. For sure those laps back in march had a very different BOP.

 

[Auditore]

Is this confirmed? Can I get out of the Renault contract?

Are you Daniel Ricciardo?

 

[Draggon]

Has anyone who uses the H shifter noticed that when you push the clutch like say 30% in, the car either brakes or accelerates? It’s weird and I can’t really explain it well.

Something like this was going on in GT5 with the Opel Speedster. Using less than 100% on the brakes gave the car increased rpm and sudden acceleration. I'm using the DS4, so I can't comment on this in Sport.

 

[dabz343]

Well if you're in the top 0.001% and can qualify almost for sure, I can get why you would keep playing and winning. But most of the people who give up are those who fight hard and spent a lot of time practicing. With constant changes (to the worst) and no clue about why they're made, some guys left/are leaving. I mean, I know a few guys who've been to live events and GTAcademy finalists who gave up FIA or the game entirely. Not because of 1.39 in specific, but it's just another water drop that will be the last for some players out there.

If the physics tweaks change the cars so much that they stop you from having fun driving, what's the point in even competing. It gets to be more of a job (and a boring one) than what already is. Tire wear is already ridiculous. With the recent change, "paliative tire care races" (as I call them) will be even worse.

I hear you. Unfortunately it's a numbers game and PD is rightfully focusing on economies of scale. As long as they have sufficient interest from players, they're going to continue to do what they have been doing. Now if sponsors--like the FIA--start leaning on them, or other prominent eSports platforms emerge, then PD will have to make a choice on where they want to play--casual, competitive or both.

Like I stated many times, PD has the potential to establish a robust platform that invites drivers of all skills--but their first-mover advantage is evaporating fast...and they seem to be mired in mitigating tradeoffs, not forging ahead.

 

[The Cake]

u know what, im gonna change my opinion from much worse to much better. Did not test it out properly before today, and i fell for that because everybody was saying it was more understeery than before. I had a really hard time for 1.37 update, it was far to more oversteery for my liking. But The understeering in the 1.37 update was like, stamp on the accelerator with the ferrari 458 street car and it would not break traction. For this update, im really surprised. You have to brake earlier, and that a good thing, I think. It should not be like u can go 100% brake pressure with out consequences, I dont think its like that in real life.

I havent tried so many cars but i liked the
supra gt3, racing medium tires. maybe just a littble bit to grippy on the rear tires, but i did get oversteery moments (im a conscious driver, I like starting of slow, try to be smooth etc)
Bmw m4, n400 sports medium tires, it was really good, did get a lot of oversteering on accelerator, it was really good and really fun. I like braking early
Supra n 300, much much better, sports hard tires
Toyota mr 2, same as above.

Need to try and drive more on the limit, but so far so good.

I know u all care about dr and sr, A(3000 dr points from a+/sr s - drivertag: CakaCool

 

[Boston77]

This.

I'm officially giving up on trying to communicate with PD now. No more improvement threads, no more polls, no more constructive criticism posts; just memes & venting!

Sad, but I understand.
Improvement to GT and to the community was always the goal.
I gotta thank you for all your efforts over the years.
Long live shuffle!

 

[Haitauer]

Here comes my detailed opinion with few videos.

First of all now that i've given it few hours of testing at daily quali of gr3 in Dragon Trail, pushing the cars deliberately over limit, I must say im pleased with the physics. But before you make a comment against this please read forward.

I think the physics are actually pretty good now. Weight transfer and losing and regaining grip are somewhat intuitive. Love it how one is able to push certain gr3 cars into a dance between under/oversteer and slip/grip. That said, there was my big revelation - CERTAIN cars. Theres just massive differences how this change in physics has affected different cars. Some like Mustang and 458 are balanced just around the limit where throttle, brake and entry speed make all the difference. RSR and R8 are both pretty effortlesly balanced just point and go. The R8 a slightly more prone to understeer where RSR is like a surcigal instrument. Neither extremy fast though - that trophy goes to Supra with just insane turn in and pretty violent but very controllable exit. Supra propably is OP at the moment. GTR surpriced me properly on first shikane. Thought it would be RSR like balanced, but that power it has makes it pretty twitchy on acceleration - but what a pleasure to try to master and taste the new physics.

Then there is some just messed up cars. The worst i tested being the gr3 m3. Just insane understeer. Theres a video of me trying my best to tear it to oversteer, but handbrake seems to be the only way.

So what i think is wrong if i say the physics are fine. The BOP is messed up, but in a strange way. I initially tought its clearly an LSD problem, so i went to arcade time trial to try fix the gr m3 with lsd. But nothing. Even extreme changes to lsd made just a bit of difference. Then i had a revelation. What is the one big thing we dont have control over but PDI most likely uses to alter car balances - weight balance. If the weight balance/transfer of the cars or its affect to grip has changed, it seem some cars just have messed up weight balance for the new physics.

So - as a fact or fake news i say the physics (on track) are better, but they need to fix quite a few cars setups to get them working as they should.

Few videos: (please remove if too many)

Mustang and 458:




Supra



Gtr
https://youtu.be/1DEh6Umlxos

Trying to break the M3
https://youtu.be/0w0ZzB0kw8c

https://youtu.be/sHQ5h21-jmA (wrong video)

 

[BreakerOhio]

u know what, im gonna change my opinion from much worse to much better. Did not test it out properly before today, and i fell for that because everybody was saying it was more understeery than before. I had a really hard time for 1.37 update, it was far to more oversteery for my liking. But The understeering in the 1.37 update was like, stamp on the accelerator with the ferrari 458 street car and it would not break traction. For this update, im really surprised. You have to brake earlier, and that a good thing, I think. It should not be like u can go 100% brake pressure with out consequences, I dont think its like that in real life.

I havent tried so many cars but i liked the
supra gt3, racing medium tires. maybe just a littble bit to grippy on the rear tires, but i did get oversteery moments (im a conscious driver, I like starting of slow, try to be smooth etc)
Bmw m4, n400 sports medium tires, it was really good, did get a lot of oversteering on accelerator, it was really good and really fun. I like braking early
Supra n 300, much much better, sports hard tires
Toyota mr 2, same as above.

Need to try and drive more on the limit, but so far so good.

I know u all care about dr and sr, A(3000 dr points from a+/sr s - drivertag: CakaCool

It takes courage to admit change. Glad someone gave it some time and reported back. That's good to hear.

As dedicated as this group is I think all of you can and will adapt with practice to 1.39! Think of this obstacle is the way to grow your driving skills, race car driver learn to adapt . all the past physics and gameplay styles has trained some of you to say it feel like it's easier to drive now, I think because you are a better driver now. This made Sport Mode races much more intense yet cleaner.

I've done a handful of daily race B races yesterday in Sport mode. GR.3. And today's daily B GR.3 I had stint of 5 consecutive clean races, and now riding on 3 clean races again. The racing is super competitive, clean, close, and good clean overtakes all the races I've been in. Actually the cleanest and most fun jostling I've played in Sport mode to date. Some Drivers are running wide and losing it under pressure more I'm noticing because they are pushing harder under pressure. Driving defense is working and respected well at least on SR S group, I think because the cars are better to control and drive around incidents and keeping the racing intense and clean is easier because we can tuck in the nose with lift off much better when attack the corners and back off on incidents much better than before

 

[Haitauer]

This made Sport Mode races much more intense yet cleaner.

Noticed this too yesterday

 

[Hoopzah]

So people are mad because... cars act more realistic? Do people really expect to stomp on the throttle (thus losing weight on the front i.e grip) and the vehicle will continue to turn?

With ABS set to weak the physics are much better and more real to me. Kudos PD. I'm also pretty sure allot of the staff get together & go out to track days. So there's that...

Something else people seem to forget is this is all built in-house from scratch. Their (PD) not using an already existing game engine and tweaking grip with a drop down menu. S#@$ takes time to get right.

 

[GTPorsche]

PD have had decades of development work with racing games. How much more time do they need to get things right?

 

[zzz_pt]

So people are mad because... cars act more realistic?

Under braking? Yes, it feels a bit more realistic. Maybe too much slide, but better than before. More challenging too. Once you start turning and hit the apex, it's not more realistic.

Do people really expect to stomp on the throttle (thus losing weight on the front i.e grip) and the vehicle will continue to turn?

No. People expect to control oversteer on corner exit with throttle input instead of getting understeer. Especially in GR3 race cars.

 

[dabz343]

So people are mad because... cars act more realistic? Do people really expect to stomp on the throttle (thus losing weight on the front i.e grip) and the vehicle will continue to turn?

Yes, the front-end lift during hard excel is a factor in how a car turns and exits under power, but you are oversimplifying what quality drivers have cited as a complaint. An FR car like the GT-R, counters this effect by having substantial mass over the front axle. Conversely, a RR car like the 911, suffers even more during exits because the engine is behind the rear axle.

So how in the hell can anyone drive a 911, let alone be competitive? Why are there countless fans that rave about its handling prowess? Are they all nuts or is someone here missing some bearings?

Well, I don't have time to go into that with you. But I will encourage you to understand how the rear axle might affect steering during exits for a rear-drive car. If you don't already know, take a minute to review the mechanical derivations that exist in an open differential verses a limited-slip differential. Subsequently, this may lead you to weight transfer/ABR/camber/etc/etc and ultimately to finding speed in any car.

As someone mentioned above, it take courage to admit that they may have misinterpreted, misspoke or misjudged. And I hope that those who have spoken out favorably for 1.39--especially about traction on exits--take the time to listen to those that have criticized it.

This updated physics has certainly drawn a divide. From the comments from this thread, the reason for the disparity is pretty evident IMO.



Btw, NO...the 911 does not have a MAGIC diff.


Here's a 2.7 RS doing wheelies around turns lol, gotta love Ferdinand for this Gem.

 

[Beezer215]

6-5-19
Scheduled maintenance.

 

[Groundfish]

I have to say after driving today (got in about an hour) doing gr3 DT qual I am impressed!
Each step of this games evolution brings me more and more enjoyment. I drove the yank tank fr and Godzilla.
Got in about the same time on each.
I think they drive better than before. Ended up at the same time to the tenth in both. 39.3. Like I said I’m no alien.
PD is trying to drag the gaming world kicking and screaming into this game.
When you get the car loaded on entry now it’s very very cool. Even better than before you must be very smooth with your inputs to keep it from breaking traction as it’s loaded. I’ve been really into this ever since getting a handle on that 356 speedster one make at Brands Indy.
Brilliant stuff really.
I’ve put in a lot of time on DT. I hate that first uphill s section, but today was by far the most fun I’ve had there qualifying.
The subtlety and response to fine inputs is intuitive. I just think it’s really fricken good.
This game is goin places.
Excepting that Tuscan whatever piece of junk they had on Red Bull Ring one make a while back, I haven’t found a car that I would say has a poor setup to be honest.
Imo this update mirrors every previous one where they have steadily made the game better.
I think what I noticed on this combo is just a finer sense of control and response from very subtle changes.
For like the yank tank (vet) it’ll carve like crazy, but it requires smooth inputs and good line.
It will understeer for sure with hamfisted inputs, but it will also respond to good ones.
For me it’s just great stuff.
With each update the driving keeps getting better imo and closer to the cars being an extension of your mind.
It was engaging before but this is even better.

 

[dabz343]

Nevermind

 

[toddstar77]

For me the update definitely was more prevalent in the Gr.3 races I did with the Mustang, I was all over the shop in the first couple of laps, felt loose, then running wide, but got used to it..... faster than prior I don't know, haven't checked.