Russian Invasion of Ukraine
- Thread starter Rage Racer
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- Athens
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- Othershidapu
Last week, a lengthy announcement by the Union of Communists of Ukraine (UCU) was published on the SOLIDNET website . This is the first position of this specific organization, while so far the Communist Party of Ukraine has not issued an announcement. As is known, both of these political forces of Ukraine are under ban and persecution.
Below we publish extensive excerpts from the UKU Announcement.
On the causes and character of the conflict
The Union of Communists of Ukraine's overall assessment of the nature of the war, launched under the guise of a special military operation (SOE), generally coincides with the Communiqué of the Communist and Workers' Parties of February 24, 2022, supported by UKU.
In this war, two imperialist groups of world capital clashed on the territory of Ukraine: An international capitalist alliance of countries led by the USA and NATO and an international capitalist alliance of countries led by Russian state-monopoly capital. A number of the largest capitalist countries (China, India, etc.) have not yet directly entered the unfolding conflict, but are waiting, assessing its prospects for development. We agree with the conclusion that the source of this military conflict lies in the counter-revolutionary destruction of socialism in the USSR and the restoration of capitalism in the post-Soviet space.
In this war, two imperialist groups of world capital clashed on the territory of Ukraine: An international capitalist alliance of countries led by the USA and NATO and an international capitalist alliance of countries led by Russian state-monopoly capital. A number of the largest capitalist countries (China, India, etc.) have not yet directly entered the unfolding conflict, but are waiting, assessing its prospects for development. We agree with the conclusion that the source of this military conflict lies in the counter-revolutionary destruction of socialism in the USSR and the restoration of capitalism in the post-Soviet space.
The Ukrainian bourgeoisie, which grew by plundering the economic resources of the Ukrainian SSR, by seizing the property of the vast majority of the population, as was done in Russia, quickly concentrated this property in the hands of a few oligarchic groups at the level of sectoral monopolies and along with the country's economy, he also "privatized" state power. The contradictory position of these oligarchic groups consisted in the fact that they tried to limit as much as possible the participation in the concentration of private property in the country of both Russian and Western capital. Simultaneously,
For the ideological justification of the relative disengagement from both the East and the West, the Ukrainian oligarchic bourgeoisie simply needed the ideology of radical bourgeois nationalism, which also responded to the interests of the Western countries (especially after the "Orange Revolution" that they organized in 2004) with its anti-Russian orientation. It was then that Bandera and Shukhevych began to become heroes in the public consciousness of Ukrainians.
For the Ukrainian working class and the broad urban and rural proletarian masses, the restoration of capitalism turned into a colossal contraction and curtailment of their rights, in the process of deindustrializing the country. But in conditions of political and ideological disorientation, the working class, unions and left parties were only capable of rear-guard fighting. The discrediting of socialism by bourgeois propaganda led the Ukrainian proletariat to limit its struggle only to economic tasks and prompted the more skilled strata to migrate abroad in search of better wages.
UKU was directly involved in these class struggles of the 1990s and beyond, trying to preserve the international proletarian revolutionary tradition of class struggle and to counter the political opportunism that developed in the communist and leftist movement in Ukraine due to the dissolving state of labor class.
A direct condition for the growing confrontation between Russia and NATO countries on the territory of Ukraine was the global economic, trade and industrial crisis of 2008 and its consequences. The long-term stagnation of the world economy and all the efforts of the leading capitalist countries to shift the consequences of this crisis to the working class and the large proletarian strata, as well as to the dependent capitalist countries, showed that there is no economic way out of this crisis in the context of capitalism. To overcome this crisis, the leading capitalist countries, led by the USA, turned to the direct robbery of certain countries, thereby launching a series of coups through "color revolutions", local wars under the guise of "democratizing" the countries.
Political "games" behind the strengthening of fascist political organizations
The coming to power in 2010 of monopoly oligarchic groups led by Yanukovych, considered pro-Russian bourgeois, on the one hand, strengthened the cooperation of the Russian and Ukrainian monopolies, but only to the extent that it allowed Ukrainian oligarchs to maintain control over the economy and property in country. On the other hand, Yanukovych appointed as his political advisers on election technology experts from the US and Great Britain, such as Manafort, who advised him, based on "polls", to shape such an election campaign for his re-election to the second term , so that in the second round his opponent is Tiaginbok – head of the Nazi party "Svoboda" (renamed socialist-nationalist party).
As a result, with the money of the supposedly "pro-Russian" oligarchs, Nazi groups began to grow and from fringe groups to reach the level of political parties. They were given the opportunity to win local council elections in the western regions and to elect their deputies to the Ukrainian Parliament. To this end, Yanukovych did not even cancel the decrees of his predecessor, Yustenko, awarding the titles of "Hero of Ukraine" to Bandera and Shukhevyts.
However, Yanukovych's "advisors" played a different "card" behind his back. Under their leadership, pro-Western oligarchic groups, with the support of US and EU imperialism, staged a coup in 2014. The pro-fascist and Nazi organizations they supported not only proved to be the striking force of this coup, but were armed with the new oligarchic power and in the form of paramilitary "volunteer battalions" they became its strike force
The coup marked the start of a civil war in Ukraine between supporters of the new nationalist government and its opponents, leading to the secession of Crimea and its absorption by Russia as a result of a referendum, as well as the formation of the Donetsk People's Republics and of Lugansk (LDNL), which ended up in a state of prolonged armed confrontation with the authority of Kiev (…)
The so-called "de-Nazification" is a pretext
The real causes of the special military operation lie in the fact that the Russian oligarchic bourgeoisie has realized that it will not be able to financially overcome the consequences of the global financial and economic crisis. It decided, finally, to sacrifice this small share of the profits, derived from the cooperation with the Ukrainian oligarchs and with the capital of the West, for the sake of redistributing the spheres of influence in the world economy and capturing new markets for its goods, as and to counter increasing efforts by US-led NATO countries to occupy Russian territory and gain access to its raw materials.
This war is not in the interest of the "Russians", for the "protection of the Russian-speaking population", the "de-Nazification" of the Ukrainian state, but in the interest of Russian capital, which felt the danger and the need to create new international conditions so as to secure further opportunities for profit, to increase his funds. This war does not incorporate or protect the interests of Russian, Tatar, Chuvash, Yakut workers and workers of all other nationalities of the Russian Federation.
The military conflict, which began in the form of civil confrontation and civil war on the territory of Ukraine (…) is developing into an imperialist conflict, becoming the beginning of an imperialist world war (…)
The consequences for the workers of Ukraine
For the working class of Ukraine, this imperialist war has the most tragic consequences. The role of "cannon fodder" and the inevitability of death during hostilities, mass impoverishment, unemployment, complete restriction of rights and freedoms for the sake of protecting the interests of the Ukrainian big bourgeoisie have been thrown onto the shoulders of the workers. oligarchs and the interests of the Western bourgeoisie for the destruction and robbery of Russia, for the seizure of its natural resources. This will inevitably be accompanied by the destruction and seizure of Ukrainian industrial and natural resources, including in the event of Russia's success. The same fate awaits the vast majority of the Ukrainian petty-bourgeois.
The big bourgeoisie has already taken its children out of the war and taken them abroad, just as it has exported its capital. But this is not the main thing: The big bourgeoisie is getting rich from the war under Zelensky, just as it was under Poroshenko: Theft of finances, profit from the resale of weapons, supplies for uniforms, food for the army, for repairs, for humanitarian aid, etc. In war, the bourgeoisie makes billions of dollars and the conscripts will have to be equipped and fed by relatives, friends and volunteers, which is clearly not enough. As in peacetime, but now even more arrogantly, the bourgeoisie gets rich by stepping on the bones of the working class!
The consequences of this imperialist war will be equally disastrous for the working class of Russia and the countries of the Russian bloc. They strike devastatingly at the proletarian masses of all the countries of the world. A world war cannot but have global consequences: Hunger, impoverishment, unemployment, falling wages are already sweeping the planet. But the war will drag the armies of many countries into the battles, turning their workers into "cannon fodder"!
The consequence of the world imperialist war that began on the territory of Ukraine will not be getting rid of the global financial and economic crisis, but its catastrophic deepening, which in turn (as happened in the past) will lead to revolutionary situations in some countries where the contradictions escalate the most. Under the conditions of international economic and political integration, the development of revolutionary situations will lead to the formation of chains of revolutionary uprisings.
The way out for the peoples
UKU sees the way out of imperialist war for the working class not in abstract appeals for peace and disarmament (which, at best, can only delay the war so that the parties involved can accumulate forces for the sake of an even more violent conflict), but to the need to eliminate capitalism as a parasitic and destructive social system, in which the competition of capital inevitably leads to crises and wars.
In the struggle against war as a struggle against the power of capital to be able to wage war, we set the task of fighting the capitalists in each of the belligerent states (…)
Capitalism (…) the source of crises and wars, can only be ended by uniting the efforts of the workers' struggle at the international level in the course of the international communist revolution, which develops from the chains of revolutionary situations. The only thing we can oppose to bourgeois nationalism (and its forms – chauvinism and fascism), which pushes peoples together to war, is proletarian internationalism (…).
Proletarians of all countries, unite!
Below we publish extensive excerpts from the UKU Announcement.
On the causes and character of the conflict
The Union of Communists of Ukraine's overall assessment of the nature of the war, launched under the guise of a special military operation (SOE), generally coincides with the Communiqué of the Communist and Workers' Parties of February 24, 2022, supported by UKU.
In this war, two imperialist groups of world capital clashed on the territory of Ukraine: An international capitalist alliance of countries led by the USA and NATO and an international capitalist alliance of countries led by Russian state-monopoly capital. A number of the largest capitalist countries (China, India, etc.) have not yet directly entered the unfolding conflict, but are waiting, assessing its prospects for development. We agree with the conclusion that the source of this military conflict lies in the counter-revolutionary destruction of socialism in the USSR and the restoration of capitalism in the post-Soviet space.
In this war, two imperialist groups of world capital clashed on the territory of Ukraine: An international capitalist alliance of countries led by the USA and NATO and an international capitalist alliance of countries led by Russian state-monopoly capital. A number of the largest capitalist countries (China, India, etc.) have not yet directly entered the unfolding conflict, but are waiting, assessing its prospects for development. We agree with the conclusion that the source of this military conflict lies in the counter-revolutionary destruction of socialism in the USSR and the restoration of capitalism in the post-Soviet space.
The Ukrainian bourgeoisie, which grew by plundering the economic resources of the Ukrainian SSR, by seizing the property of the vast majority of the population, as was done in Russia, quickly concentrated this property in the hands of a few oligarchic groups at the level of sectoral monopolies and along with the country's economy, he also "privatized" state power. The contradictory position of these oligarchic groups consisted in the fact that they tried to limit as much as possible the participation in the concentration of private property in the country of both Russian and Western capital. Simultaneously,
For the ideological justification of the relative disengagement from both the East and the West, the Ukrainian oligarchic bourgeoisie simply needed the ideology of radical bourgeois nationalism, which also responded to the interests of the Western countries (especially after the "Orange Revolution" that they organized in 2004) with its anti-Russian orientation. It was then that Bandera and Shukhevych began to become heroes in the public consciousness of Ukrainians.
For the Ukrainian working class and the broad urban and rural proletarian masses, the restoration of capitalism turned into a colossal contraction and curtailment of their rights, in the process of deindustrializing the country. But in conditions of political and ideological disorientation, the working class, unions and left parties were only capable of rear-guard fighting. The discrediting of socialism by bourgeois propaganda led the Ukrainian proletariat to limit its struggle only to economic tasks and prompted the more skilled strata to migrate abroad in search of better wages.
UKU was directly involved in these class struggles of the 1990s and beyond, trying to preserve the international proletarian revolutionary tradition of class struggle and to counter the political opportunism that developed in the communist and leftist movement in Ukraine due to the dissolving state of labor class.
A direct condition for the growing confrontation between Russia and NATO countries on the territory of Ukraine was the global economic, trade and industrial crisis of 2008 and its consequences. The long-term stagnation of the world economy and all the efforts of the leading capitalist countries to shift the consequences of this crisis to the working class and the large proletarian strata, as well as to the dependent capitalist countries, showed that there is no economic way out of this crisis in the context of capitalism. To overcome this crisis, the leading capitalist countries, led by the USA, turned to the direct robbery of certain countries, thereby launching a series of coups through "color revolutions", local wars under the guise of "democratizing" the countries.
Political "games" behind the strengthening of fascist political organizations
The coming to power in 2010 of monopoly oligarchic groups led by Yanukovych, considered pro-Russian bourgeois, on the one hand, strengthened the cooperation of the Russian and Ukrainian monopolies, but only to the extent that it allowed Ukrainian oligarchs to maintain control over the economy and property in country. On the other hand, Yanukovych appointed as his political advisers on election technology experts from the US and Great Britain, such as Manafort, who advised him, based on "polls", to shape such an election campaign for his re-election to the second term , so that in the second round his opponent is Tiaginbok – head of the Nazi party "Svoboda" (renamed socialist-nationalist party).
As a result, with the money of the supposedly "pro-Russian" oligarchs, Nazi groups began to grow and from fringe groups to reach the level of political parties. They were given the opportunity to win local council elections in the western regions and to elect their deputies to the Ukrainian Parliament. To this end, Yanukovych did not even cancel the decrees of his predecessor, Yustenko, awarding the titles of "Hero of Ukraine" to Bandera and Shukhevyts.
However, Yanukovych's "advisors" played a different "card" behind his back. Under their leadership, pro-Western oligarchic groups, with the support of US and EU imperialism, staged a coup in 2014. The pro-fascist and Nazi organizations they supported not only proved to be the striking force of this coup, but were armed with the new oligarchic power and in the form of paramilitary "volunteer battalions" they became its strike force
The coup marked the start of a civil war in Ukraine between supporters of the new nationalist government and its opponents, leading to the secession of Crimea and its absorption by Russia as a result of a referendum, as well as the formation of the Donetsk People's Republics and of Lugansk (LDNL), which ended up in a state of prolonged armed confrontation with the authority of Kiev (…)
The so-called "de-Nazification" is a pretext
The real causes of the special military operation lie in the fact that the Russian oligarchic bourgeoisie has realized that it will not be able to financially overcome the consequences of the global financial and economic crisis. It decided, finally, to sacrifice this small share of the profits, derived from the cooperation with the Ukrainian oligarchs and with the capital of the West, for the sake of redistributing the spheres of influence in the world economy and capturing new markets for its goods, as and to counter increasing efforts by US-led NATO countries to occupy Russian territory and gain access to its raw materials.
This war is not in the interest of the "Russians", for the "protection of the Russian-speaking population", the "de-Nazification" of the Ukrainian state, but in the interest of Russian capital, which felt the danger and the need to create new international conditions so as to secure further opportunities for profit, to increase his funds. This war does not incorporate or protect the interests of Russian, Tatar, Chuvash, Yakut workers and workers of all other nationalities of the Russian Federation.
The military conflict, which began in the form of civil confrontation and civil war on the territory of Ukraine (…) is developing into an imperialist conflict, becoming the beginning of an imperialist world war (…)
The consequences for the workers of Ukraine
For the working class of Ukraine, this imperialist war has the most tragic consequences. The role of "cannon fodder" and the inevitability of death during hostilities, mass impoverishment, unemployment, complete restriction of rights and freedoms for the sake of protecting the interests of the Ukrainian big bourgeoisie have been thrown onto the shoulders of the workers. oligarchs and the interests of the Western bourgeoisie for the destruction and robbery of Russia, for the seizure of its natural resources. This will inevitably be accompanied by the destruction and seizure of Ukrainian industrial and natural resources, including in the event of Russia's success. The same fate awaits the vast majority of the Ukrainian petty-bourgeois.
The big bourgeoisie has already taken its children out of the war and taken them abroad, just as it has exported its capital. But this is not the main thing: The big bourgeoisie is getting rich from the war under Zelensky, just as it was under Poroshenko: Theft of finances, profit from the resale of weapons, supplies for uniforms, food for the army, for repairs, for humanitarian aid, etc. In war, the bourgeoisie makes billions of dollars and the conscripts will have to be equipped and fed by relatives, friends and volunteers, which is clearly not enough. As in peacetime, but now even more arrogantly, the bourgeoisie gets rich by stepping on the bones of the working class!
Consequences for the Russian people and other peoples
The consequences of this imperialist war will be equally disastrous for the working class of Russia and the countries of the Russian bloc. They strike devastatingly at the proletarian masses of all the countries of the world. A world war cannot but have global consequences: Hunger, impoverishment, unemployment, falling wages are already sweeping the planet. But the war will drag the armies of many countries into the battles, turning their workers into "cannon fodder"!
The consequence of the world imperialist war that began on the territory of Ukraine will not be getting rid of the global financial and economic crisis, but its catastrophic deepening, which in turn (as happened in the past) will lead to revolutionary situations in some countries where the contradictions escalate the most. Under the conditions of international economic and political integration, the development of revolutionary situations will lead to the formation of chains of revolutionary uprisings.
The way out for the peoples
UKU sees the way out of imperialist war for the working class not in abstract appeals for peace and disarmament (which, at best, can only delay the war so that the parties involved can accumulate forces for the sake of an even more violent conflict), but to the need to eliminate capitalism as a parasitic and destructive social system, in which the competition of capital inevitably leads to crises and wars.
In the struggle against war as a struggle against the power of capital to be able to wage war, we set the task of fighting the capitalists in each of the belligerent states (…)
Capitalism (…) the source of crises and wars, can only be ended by uniting the efforts of the workers' struggle at the international level in the course of the international communist revolution, which develops from the chains of revolutionary situations. The only thing we can oppose to bourgeois nationalism (and its forms – chauvinism and fascism), which pushes peoples together to war, is proletarian internationalism (…).
Proletarians of all countries, unite!
- 2,216
- Isle of Wight, UK
Step 1: muddy the thread for actual pages demanding sources as you dispute something widely regarded to have happened after being given multiple valid sources, all while cherrypicking your own sources that turned out to argue directly against you
Step 2: drop, unprompted in the thread, the thoroughly long and wordy ramblings of a bunch of Ukrainian communists, who themselves go on a 90 paragraph rant on how capitalism is to blame for the war, without using a single dependable or verifiable source for the entirety of its length.
Internet communist roleplaying. Not even once.
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- 712
- Athens
- GTP_Shaman
- Othershidapu
Solidnet | Union of Communists of Ukraine, О войне и задачах рабочего класса
News, documents and calls for action from communist and workers’ parties.
www.solidnet.org
Scaff
Moderator
- 29,744
- He/Him
- ScaffUK
Self-citing doesn't really meet the standard of independently verifiable, even a quick glance over the screed shows one omission of fact designed to misslead.Solidnet | Union of Communists of Ukraine, О войне и задачах рабочего класса
News, documents and calls for action from communist and workers’ parties.
- 712
- Athens
- GTP_Shaman
- Othershidapu
Oh i get it, maybe bad argument, maybe poor language skills, maybe extreme anti-communism.
Because according to Scaff presenting here an announcement from a communist site that host Communist parties from all over the world somehow makes it automatically not credible...While books like this one is shaping people opinions.
Or better post some fake news from this "lady" that the western media happily reproduce...
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Zona
Premium
- 885
- Derbyshire
- Amowtek
Mate this isn't a thread to sprout your Communist BS.
Also looks like the wagner group are getting desperate for bodies and recruiting from prisons to feed the meat grinder:
inforesist.org
Also looks like the wagner group are getting desperate for bodies and recruiting from prisons to feed the meat grinder:
ЧВК «Вагнера» вербует заключенных в колониях РФ, чтобы отправить на Донбасс «искать нацистов»
Частная военная компания «Вагнера» начала вербовать заключенных в колониях Санкт-Петербурга, чтобы отправить их воевать ...
inforesist.org
Scaff
Moderator
- 29,744
- He/Him
- ScaffUK
It's bad arguments, quote mining, and poor sources.
More quote mining, as that's wasn't what I said at all. Go back and re-read my post on the matter, rather than making things up.
Actually don't worry, here it is, try actually reading it this time...
"Self-citing doesn't really meet the standard of independently verifiable, even a quick glance over the screed shows one omission of fact designed to misslead."
...let's see how much thought you put into it before using it as a source, can you spot it.
Pretty sure most people with a gram of critical reasoning didn't need that article to see through Trump and his fascist desires, I've never heard of that publication and can point to dozens of posts from myself (likely actually hundreds) identifying Trump and his enablers as such! Also a bit surprising that you cite an article that quotes Chomsky in it, particularly given his views on the Soviet state, Invasion of the Ukraine and Stalin!
Your source doesn't support your claim, not to mention that it highlights her dismissal for not doing here job correctly undermines your very claim!
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- 29,963
- Bratvegas
- GTP_Liquid
No.
Yes.
Your language skills have nothing to do with how terrible your arguments are. But at least you've already got your excuse; instead of ever thinking that your argument is wrong and people disagree with you, you can just say "It's my language skills, it's my language skills" over and over.
Joey D
Premium
- 47,521
- Lakes of the North, MI
- GTP_Joey
- GTP Joey
@Shidapu
Just post your pro-Communist drivel here since what you're going on about doesn't really have to do with Ukraine:
www.gtplanet.net
Yes, Russia is doing its best to cosplay the Soviet Union at the moment since it's mass-murdering an incredible number of innocent people, but this isn't the thread to try to convince people that Communism was somehow good.
Just post your pro-Communist drivel here since what you're going on about doesn't really have to do with Ukraine:
Communism and Socialism
Split off from the 'Church and State' thread... Originally posted by infallible I fail to see why communism, the government philosophy of everyone is equal, equal land owning of things etc etc, is a bad philosophy. The only reason it tanked, was because of the leaders and the human...
www.gtplanet.net
Yes, Russia is doing its best to cosplay the Soviet Union at the moment since it's mass-murdering an incredible number of innocent people, but this isn't the thread to try to convince people that Communism was somehow good.
- 712
- Athens
- GTP_Shaman
- Othershidapu
@Joey D
Actually it has to do everything with Ukraine but I'm going to stop here.
People eventually will come around,what they don't see today will see tomorrow.
I just hope will not be too late for the human species
What I can offer is some reading...read it and rejected,but read it, or better study them.
Anyway we only demand tomorrow...
Actually it has to do everything with Ukraine but I'm going to stop here.
People eventually will come around,what they don't see today will see tomorrow.
I just hope will not be too late for the human species
What I can offer is some reading...read it and rejected,but read it, or better study them.
Anyway we only demand tomorrow...
- 20,996
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- Blitzbay
- Blitzbay
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