RVR's 1st Annual 525PP European Car Shootout!!! Final Tester and Tuner Results! :D

[Indy Racerfan]

Kinda pissed I haven't been to any of the dirt tracks this year(been a real bad one for me) wish PD would have added USAC sprints and wings...

 

[ACSR421]

I looked up the Laguna Seca website. Check out the maps here. Good info on the Racing Lines map.

Thanks for sharing this. I saved to my GT5 folder. 👍 👍

 

[XDesperado67]

I looked up the Laguna Seca website. Check out the maps here. Good info on the Racing Lines map.

Thanks for site.👍👍

Whut you running on that 1/4 mile? I haven't been to the Track this year (tired of breakin ish on my only car currently) I'm gonna get a new Beater for winter, as I totaled my Accord EXR.

Last year, on Street Tires (Yeah, they use full slicks or Drag Radials often, I don't.) with my clutch finished and slipping first (raping my 0-60footer to I think 2.5 to 2.8 if I remember correctly. I hit the Trap at 13.4 @ 107mph. I would hit it faster but at a slower speed had I had the new clutch/throw-out bearing (mine was fried to ish) installed. Plans are to have her RTR next season when I have a decent Beater. Ohh yeah, I'm running a MKII GTi with a 98 VR6 Swap. The list of aftermarket goodies is long, next step is Boost & 4-Motion.

It would be sweet if we got to do engine Swaps in GT5. That Feature had me buying a XBox & playing a bunch of Forza back in tha day.

Unfortunately its been a couple years since I ran anything. Last car I ran on the 1/8th was an '89 5.0 Cobra with a 400 shot of juice. Fun while it lasted but engine and car weren't in good shape when I got them so the juice ended up really burning it up. Punched a piston through the head and that was that. Helped crew some friends midget Sprint car for a while but they moved out of the area so now I'm just a spectator until I get the money to blow on cars again.

 

[Indy Racerfan]

by the way, who is hosting Assassins tune?

 

[XDesperado67]

by the way, who is hosting Assassins tune?

Think ACSR421 is but not positive.

 

[ACSR421]

by the way, who is hosting Assassins tune?

I'm hosting it. I have it offline until assassin gives me his part list.

 

[AssassinTuner]

Thanks for site.👍👍

Unfortunately its been a couple years since I ran anything. Last car I ran on the 1/8th was an '89 5.0 Cobra with a 400 shot of juice. Fun while it lasted but engine and car weren't in good shape when I got them so the juice ended up really burning it up. Punched a piston through the head and that was that. Helped crew some friends midget Sprint car for a while but they moved out of the area so now I'm just a spectator until I get the money to blow on cars again.

Nasty! Yeah I bet the Juice was fun. My bud used to run a 1.3 Spirit(that tiny geo metro looking thing) on juice at the local 1/8th. The 1/8th was shot enough for him to tag some SC Stangs before they could catch up and
pass. It was funny to watch them with one eyebrow raised looking a lol PO'ed

But I gear yah. Seems like every few Trips out cost a few hundred in repairs. Launching out of a prepped gate high revving is Hell on tha ride. I went through 3 exhaust pipes & 2 sets of motor mount inserts, fried clutch, broken clutch pedal bracket, burnt coil pack, burst hoses, broken accessory belt, and one burnt head lamp connector. All in one summer, not to mention tires (holly crap they go quick and cost $$$$$) I also had some electrical gremlins, that drove me nuts for 6months replacing fuses like it was going out of style.. Thankfully redoing my grounds fixed that.

 

[AssassinTuner]

I'm hosting it. I have it offline until assassin gives me his part list.

I'm getting on that right now, these Nitro R/C's have me beat. So tired.

 

[Indy Racerfan]

ok think I have all the tuners added have to check OP again so I can end initial test and get to my reviews and hot lapping

 

[AssassinTuner]

ok think I have all the tuners added have to check OP again so I can end initial test and get to my reviews and hot lapping

Looking forward to them, so many cool cars to Drive. I'm jealous of people getting to drive the Muira. That with the 20mill Old School Jag/Ferrari/Ford Racers are the Cars I truly want but haven't been able to focus on acquiring. Soon

 

[XDesperado67]

@Assassin speaking of engine swaps...
Most fun with a car was droping a 289 in a late '70s Mustang II with the cheesy graphics on it back when I was young and dumb. Car was a load of fun racing the back roads where I live. Of course when my buddy who was the confirmed Mustang addict got tired of another guy talking smack about his '68 Camaro with a built 327 and that we couldn't take him in a drag race things got a bit crazy...word to the wise don't put a stroked 351 Cleveland with a welded 9inch rear in a stock Mustang II frame.

 

[AssassinTuner]

@Assassin speaking of engine swaps...
Most fun with a car was droping a 289 in a late '70s Mustang II with the cheesy graphics on it back when I was young and dumb. Car was a load of fun racing the back roads where I live. Of course when my buddy who was the confirmed Mustang addict got tired of another guy talking smack about his '68 Camaro with a built 327 and that we couldn't take him in a drag race things got a bit crazy...word to the wise don't put a stroked 351 Cleveland with a welded 9inch rear in a stock Mustang II frame.

That sound torquey like a Mofo. Must of tweaked the frame up something good, rip apart much of the back end? Or did you use a regular drive shaft and snap it at launch? Stangs snap em often.

Seen a crew swap one on a Fox Body in like 15min on a Drag racing show.

 

[Indy Racerfan]

Looking forward to them, so many cool cars to Drive. I'm jealous of people getting to drive the Muira. That with the 20mill Old School Jag/Ferrari/Ford Racers are the Cars I truly want but haven't been able to focus on acquiring. Soon

I have them all, have only put hard miles on the Jaguar, the others get droooled over in the garage. just waiting for the 2J to pop up in UCD then I'll have all the classic racers.

Indy

 

[shmogt]

Looking forward to them, so many cool cars to Drive. I'm jealous of people getting to drive the Muira. That with the 20mill Old School Jag/Ferrari/Ford Racers are the Cars I truly want but haven't been able to focus on acquiring. Soon

You win the jag for free

 

[XDesperado67]

That sound torquey like a Mofo. Must of tweaked the frame up something good, rip apart much of the back end? Or did you use a regular drive shaft and snap it at launch? Stangs snap em often.

Seen a crew swap one on a Fox Body in like 15min on a Drag racing show.

Drive shaft survived...engine mounts ripped clean out along with the "engine strap" he had welded on...frame suffered numerous cracks and basically the car was unsalvageable. But for one glorious instant it shut the bowtie boys up. After that they were a lot more careful how they talked around him. I went heathen on him and got a Plymouth Duster but he forgave me since it wasn't a Chevy.

 

[Indy Racerfan]

All but five tuners add to PSN FR list
Need BigBerry, Brave Bear, Mafia_Boy, Temetias, and Jackthalad(pending)

 

[XDesperado67]

All but five tuners add to PSN FR list
Need BigBerry, Brave Bear, Mafia_Boy, Temetias, and Jackthalad(pending)

Not sure Brave Bear may need a host as well. He was having system issues(read dead PS3) for the FF shootout.

Was trying to have it resurrected not sure if it happened.

 

[Indy Racerfan]

ok will put ? PS issues in note book. and what of the others if they dont have them list by Monday are they S.O.L.?

Indy

 

[AssassinTuner]

Drive shaft survived...engine mounts ripped clean out along with the "engine strap" he had welded on...frame suffered numerous cracks and basically the car was unsalvageable. But for one glorious instant it shut the bowtie boys up. After that they were a lot more careful how they talked around him. I went heathen on him and got a Plymouth Duster but he forgave me since it wasn't a Chevy.

Damn, sounds like good times & one Glorious Run

That's why I'm messin with Nitro R/C Cars & Trucks for the moment. They seem expensive at first but compared to the Full Sized Deal, it's cheap.

 

[CSLACR]

Your 0 ABS gripe doesn't make sense. Yeah it rotates when the tires get red hot, not when they lock what's your issue though, it's supposed to. So you turned ABS back on? Why?

No, when only the front wheels are locked (determined by red front wheels, blue rear wheels) it still spins.
If you've ever driven a non abs car, you know if the front wheels are locked, especially if they're the only ones locked, turning doesn't happen at all, but it seems in GT5, once your speed drops enough it will just spin anyway, the hell with physics.

Anyway, since you ask, I put abs back on because the car has abs IRL. Also without any pedal feedback or g forces, braking without abs is harder than it should be.

 

[AssassinTuner]

No, when only the front wheels are locked (determined by red front wheels, blue rear wheels) it still spins.
If you've ever driven a non abs car, you know if the front wheels are locked, especially if they're the only ones locked, turning doesn't happen at all, but it seems in GT5, once your speed drops enough it will just spin anyway, the hell with physics.

Anyway, since you ask, I put abs back on because the car has abs IRL. Also without any pedal feedback or g forces, braking without abs is harder than it should be.

Red doesn't not essentially mean "locked" it means supper hot, on the verge of locking, & obviously locked. When locked you go straight.... When you slow down enough you can kick out to a side sliding (not really "rotating") a lill if done right as a last resort after overshooting the corner, not recommended as it kills your corner speed/exit speed.

The ABS IRL is nothing like the GT5 version, GT5 is more like ABS/TCS/ASM and when Tracking cars with ABS Stability/Traction control, what CAN get shut off does, what can't often gets disabled, so you can actually drive the car. With the extent we modify cars in the game, standard systems like those get 86'ed where possible.

I tried removing the Cat and adj. power limiter = same 446 hp but at 99%, 2.82 pw with 329 ft-lbs torque. I also tried diff. combos of parts ecu no ecu, race manifold etc. The only combo that gave higher hp was the original parts with a sport air filter 447hp/329tq @98% and 2.81 pw. This is the only 04 M3 I have so not much else I can do. Its your call on which parts to install though.

Try limiting to 99.9%

Engine Tuning Stage 2
Tuned ECU installed

sport Intake manifold & Filter

Stock exhaust Except Install the Titanium Racing Exhaust.

Limiting @ 99.9% at 449hp & 329ft-lb @ 1277kg = 2.79 kg/HP


If you don't get the same numbers I get, or it's over PP, limit down from there to 525pp and let's call it finished. In that case 447hp will have to do.

 

[CSLACR]

Red doesn't not essentially mean "locked" it means supper hot, on the verge of locking, & obviously locked. When locked you go straight.... When you slow down enough you can kick out to a side a lill if done right as a last resort after overshooting the corner, not recommended as it kills your corner speed/exit speed.

The ABS IRL is nothing like the GT5 version, GT5 is more like ABS/TCS/ASM and when Tracking cars with ABS Stability/Traction control, what CAN get shut off does, what can't often gets disabled, so you can actually drive the car. With the extent we modify cars in the game, standard systems like those get 86'ed where possible.

I agree the ABS isn't proper in GT5, but neither with or without is realistic, and without feedback (literally none) threshold braking becomes a game of memorizing where to put the pedal for different turns, etc.
Also interesting is I found the braking distances didn't seem to change much, whether locked or unlocked, only the turn in of the car.
In any case, I had best results at 6/3 bias, rather than 7/3, to keep the front from locking so easily, especially since the rear kicks out under 60mph no matter what.
I'm sure with practice and perfection someone could achieve the same times without as with ABS in GT.

 

[XDesperado67]

I agree the ABS isn't proper in GT5, but neither with or without is realistic, and without feedback (literally none) threshold braking becomes a game of memorizing where to put the pedal for different turns, etc.
Also interesting is I found the braking distances didn't seem to change much, whether locked or unlocked, only the turn in of the car.
In any case, I had best results at 6/3 bias, rather than 7/3, to keep the front from locking so easily, especially since the rear kicks out under 60mph no matter what.
I'm sure with practice and perfection someone could achieve the same times without as with ABS in GT.

Question have you tried a higher ABS value? Supposedly higher numbers equate to the brakes being pulsed at a lower rate allowing more wheel rotation and better grip for turning while extending stomping distance. Makes me wonder if we should be using ABS10 instead of ABS1 since that would actually simulate the ABS system at its minimum value as opposed to ABS1 which is a maximized ABS set to stop a vehicle as fast as possible.

 

[CSLACR]

Question have you tried a higher ABS value? Supposedly higher numbers equate to the brakes being pulsed at a lower rate allowing more wheel rotation and better grip for turning while extending stomping distance. Makes me wonder if we should be using ABS10 instead of ABS1 since that would actually simulate the ABS system at its minimum value as opposed to ABS1 which is a maximized ABS set to stop a vehicle as fast as possible.

A car will spin easier at ABS 2 then ABS 1, yes. One of the reasons I use ABS 2 on most of my tunes, though the difference in steering becomes less the higher you go, you're probably right, on lower performance cars, a higher ABS setting should probably be used, with bb at 5/5 for the most realistic drive possible, and it definitely increases braking distance when you get into higher numbers.

 

[ACSR421]

I'll change to those parts and get it back online for you Assassin. I redid the engine/chassis rebuild as requested but the specs didn't change.

 

[AssassinTuner]

I'll change to those parts and get it back online for you Assassin. I redid the engine/chassis rebuild as requested but the specs didn't change.

Cool, thanks Man. 447hp is good enough for me. Thanks!

 

[XDesperado67]

A car will spin easier at ABS 2 then ABS 1, yes. One of the reasons I use ABS 2 on most of my tunes, though the difference in steering becomes less the higher you go, you're probably right, on lower performance cars, a higher ABS setting should probably be used, with bb at 5/5 for the most realistic drive possible, and it definitely increases braking distance when you get into higher numbers.

Hmm things to consider for future shootouts.
Thanks for the information. Being a mediocre driver using a DS3 it can be difficult at times to differentiate between fine differences in settings.

 

[XDesperado67]

Cool, thanks Man. 447hp is good enough for me. Thanks!

Since when is 447 HP ever good enough?
Of course your not trying to lug 2+ tons around Laguna Seca in 1:30 either

 

[AssassinTuner]

I agree the ABS isn't proper in GT5, but neither with or without is realistic, and without feedback (literally none) threshold braking becomes a game of memorizing where to put the pedal for different turns, etc.
Also interesting is I found the braking distances didn't seem to change much, whether locked or unlocked, only the turn in of the car.
In any case, I had best results at 6/3 bias, rather than 7/3, to keep the front from locking so easily, especially since the rear kicks out under 60mph no matter what.
I'm sure with practice and perfection someone could achieve the same times without as with ABS in GT.

Get a lil better with it, don't give too much input and 7/3 will work better. It's all about hitting the braking points, toss the Driving line, it becomes Racing.

 

[XDesperado67]

Okay since I've decided not to use the Land Rover Range Stormer here's something for all you bored tuners and drivers to do.
Take 1 Range Stormer add all engine/power enhancements possible. This should put you at 533PP. Then add 200kg ballast bringing total weight to 2700kg. Use power limiter to reduce remaining PP to 525. You should end up with 681HP and 738ft-lb torque. Tune suspension etc. to taste and using SS tires see how far under 1:31.847 you can get on Laguna Seca.
I love this monster but the Audi Pikes Peak is faster so that's most likely what I'll be using...unless of course I decide to actually try winning this thing in which case I'll pull out the secret weapon.

P.S. I can put the max weight fully loaded Range Stormer on share if anyone wants to play with it but doesn't own one.