Should U.S. attack Iraq and other countries for the war on terrorism?

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I can't think of a president in my lifetime that hasn't been truly divisive, though.... maybe with the exception of Ron Reagan, who was everybody's president...
 
Originally posted by M5Power
I can't think of a president in my lifetime that hasn't been truly divisive, though.... maybe with the exception of Ron Reagan, who was everybody's president...

Mmm - that's true to a point - it might just be the level of division I'm picking up on - it seems to have a genuine 'edge' on it now that I haven't seen before. There doesn't appear to be much common ground between sides here.
 
Originally posted by vat_man
It's hard to get a feel for things in the US from here, but just going on the level of debate in Australia, and from what I've been able to pick up, nobody seems to be neutral about him.

I've always thought him too war-happy, and it seems like I'm in good company.

Of course, I may be a touch biased myself. ;)
 
Originally posted by risingson77
I've always thought him too war-happy, and it seems like I'm in good company.

Of course, I may be a touch biased myself. ;)

I don't tend to think of him as war happy. I think of him as wanting to protect the U.S. before 9/11 happens all over again.
Seems like people have forgotten about 9/11. I'm thinking if he just sat back and let Sadaam do whatever he wanted to do it wouldn't be long before we would be complaining that Bush didn't do anything. Sadaam is a threat to that portion of the world at the very least. After Desert Storm I doubt Sadaam is going to ignore the U.S. Take him out before it's too late and he does something like what happened at the WTC.
 
About the power of countries's militaries. I don't think it all relies on how much blunt power they have, but how efficiently they can use their power and how many allies they have.

Some countries don't even need a huge army all the time. Look at Swizterland, they havn't been involved in a war for a long time, maybe the rest of the world should take their example....:odd: :confused:
 
Maybe someone should inspect the U.S. for weapon of mass destruction. It's only fair. Who is the U.S. to decide who is a terrorrist and who isn't. The CIA has been conducting state-sponsored terrorist acts and assasinations since the end of WW2. Who do you think invented CRACK. The CIA invented it to help extract intel from prisoners, but needed real-world testing, so it was distributed on the streets of L.A.and now look at it. The war on terrorism is like the war on drugs you can't win it you can only limit the damage. There are terrorist cells all over the world(including the U.S.). The U.S. shouldn't whine to much about Bin Laden they trained him and supplied him with kit against the Russians. The U.S. tries to often to play both ends against the middle and expect to come out on top. I find it funny how the U.S. will notwade into conflicts where they have nothing to gain(Former Yugoslavia, Israel, East Timor, Rwanda,etc) if you know the truth of why the U.S. tried to arrest Addids men in Somalia was not because they were stealing food shipment it was because there were rumours of Al-Qeida members present in Mog.
 
Originally posted by milefile
Are you ****ing serious?

His comment was in response to mine of, "Why shouldn't Iraq have WMD's?"

Well, why shouldn't they? Iraq has never attacked us. We have WMD's. Why shouldn't they? In fact, we've killed more people using "weapons of mass destruction" than they have.

Furthermore, when they DID use chemical weapons in the Iran-Iraq war, guess who was providing the satellite targeting data! Yes, Saddam was our good buddy back then.

I don't think anyone should have WMD's. But I don't think it's our right to just go in and take them from another country without ANY evidence to show that they are planning on using them in an attack against us or our allies.
 
Originally posted by freerider
Maybe someone should inspect the U.S. for weapon of mass destruction. It's only fair. Who is the U.S. to decide who is a terrorrist and who isn't. The CIA has been conducting state-sponsored terrorist acts and assasinations since the end of WW2. Who do you think invented CRACK. The CIA invented it to help extract intel from prisoners, but needed real-world testing, so it was distributed on the streets of L.A.and now look at it. The war on terrorism is like the war on drugs you can't win it you can only limit the damage. There are terrorist cells all over the world(including the U.S.). The U.S. shouldn't whine to much about Bin Laden they trained him and supplied him with kit against the Russians. The U.S. tries to often to play both ends against the middle and expect to come out on top. I find it funny how the U.S. will notwade into conflicts where they have nothing to gain(Former Yugoslavia, Israel, East Timor, Rwanda,etc) if you know the truth of why the U.S. tried to arrest Addids men in Somalia was not because they were stealing food shipment it was because there were rumours of Al-Qeida members present in Mog.

Duh. Everybody already knows we have them. And so does Britain, India, Pakistan, France, and other European countries, including Russia. The problem is, we don't use them, and we don't have biological weapons. Why? How do I know? We don't need 'em.

It really makes me sick the way people actually go to bat for Saddam. It's sick. He's a murderer. He has killed tens if not hundreds of thousands of people. He commited his first murder at eight years old. He has used chemical weapons on his own citizens. He controls his population by forcing them to move all around the country and taking their homes away. He used chemical weapons against Iran many times.

The fact that people try to compare the U.S. with this lunatic is absurd and all it does is make you look ignorant.

Yeah. Go ahead and bring up Hiroshima. Go ahead.
 
Originally posted by TAFJonathan
His comment was in response to mine of, "Why shouldn't Iraq have WMD's?"

Well, why shouldn't they? Iraq has never attacked us. We have WMD's. Why shouldn't they? In fact, we've killed more people using "weapons of mass destruction" than they have.

Furthermore, when they DID use chemical weapons in the Iran-Iraq war, guess who was providing the satellite targeting data! Yes, Saddam was our good buddy back then.

I don't think anyone should have WMD's. But I don't think it's our right to just go in and take them from another country without ANY evidence to show that they are planning on using them in an attack against us or our allies.

See this dot? >.

That's your brain.
 
Originally posted by DGB454
I don't tend to think of him as war happy. I think of him as wanting to protect the U.S. before 9/11 happens all over again.
Seems like people have forgotten about 9/11.


On the day of September 11, I would've supported the president in attacking just about any country he wanted. But I've come to my senses and not let emotion take so much control since then. You call it forgetting, I call it logic.
 
Originally posted by TAFJonathan
His comment was in response to mine of, "Why shouldn't Iraq have WMD's?"

Well, why shouldn't they? Iraq has never attacked us.

No, but they've attacked their neighbours, our allies, and shown aggression towards Israel. Before you have a tantrum about the fact that they haven't shown aggression towards Israel, I must point out that Hussein pays suicide bombers' families based on the number of people they kill.
 
Originally posted by M5Power


On the day of September 11, I would've supported the president in attacking just about any country he wanted. But I've come to my senses and not let emotion take so much control since then. You call it forgetting, I call it logic. [/B]

You forgot about the rest of my quote. We lead the coalition against Iraq in Desert Storm. Do you think he has forgotten that?
Attack him before he attacks us.
 
Originally posted by DGB454
You forgot about the rest of my quote. We lead the coalition against Iraq in Desert Storm. Do you think he has forgotten that?
Attack him before he attacks us.

I think he'd much rather stay in power than ever even dream of attacking the United States. He's never done it in the past or even shown interest in it, frankly.
 
Your right ..he's just a good ole boy. Never mean'n no harm...What was I thinking?

Ya know this whole thing can be avoided if he would just cooperate and show us the destroyed weapons. Why doesn't he just do that if he is telling the truth and doesn't have them any longer? It's as if he want's to go to war.
 
Because they're destroyed. He's recycled them and turned them into barbed wire to keep citizens out of his palaces.... like, DUH! :P
 
Originally posted by DGB454
Your right ..he's just a good ole boy. Never mean'n no harm...What was I thinking?

Ya know this whole thing can be avoided if he would just cooperate and show us the destroyed weapons. Why doesn't he just do that if he is telling the truth and doesn't have them any longer? It's as if he want's to go to war.

I wish more people would see the simplicity in this. They'd rather stick their heads in the sand.
 
Originally posted by DGB454

Ya know this whole thing can be avoided if he would just cooperate and show us the destroyed weapons. Why doesn't he just do that if he is telling the truth and doesn't have them any longer? It's as if he want's to go to war.

Well how come this country keeps secrets that we do? For years, the government denied the existence of Area 51 despite the fact that you could actually see it from about a mile away. Totally absurd.

Side note... did you guys know that the workers at Area 51 go to work by parking their cars in a large car park in McCarran Airport in Vegas and get on a 737 into the desert? Weird.
 
Originally posted by M5Power
Well how come this country keeps secrets that we do? For years, the government denied the existence of Area 51 despite the fact that you could actually see it from about a mile away. Totally absurd.

Side note... did you guys know that the workers at Area 51 go to work by parking their cars in a large car park in McCarran Airport in Vegas and get on a 737 into the desert? Weird.

Yep. And you pretty much can wipe your ass with the constitution once you work there, too.

But if a thousand-times-more-powerfull-country and most of it's allies were demanding us to get rid of WMD I'd like to think that our leader wouldn't walk us right off a cliff like Saddam will do to Iraq.

Saddam without WMD is just not Saddam... and he knows it. His motto is something like "better to burn out than fade away."
 
Originally posted by milefile

But if a thousand-times-more-powerfull-country and most of it's allies were demanding us to get rid of WMD I'd like to think that our leader wouldn't walk us right off a cliff like Saddam will do to Iraq.

So the question still remains...

WHERE'S THE PROOF???!!!

Maybe he's got them, but I'm an average citizen - and my government hasn't conclusively proven so.
 
Originally posted by M5Power
So the question still remains...

WHERE'S THE PROOF???!!!

Maybe he's got them, but I'm an average citizen - and my government hasn't conclusively proven so.
Proof schmoof.
 
Seriously? I believe Saddam has the weapons and should be ousted. Realistically? I'm never going to support a war which the government hasn't proven necessary.

Iraq attacked Kuwait in 1991 when Iraq was unprovoked. How are we any different untill there's proof?
 
Originally posted by M5Power
Seriously? I believe Saddam has the weapons and should be ousted. Realistically? I'm never going to support a war which the government hasn't proven necessary.

Iraq attacked Kuwait in 1991 when Iraq was unprovoked. How are we any different untill there's proof?

We're different because we do not have a dillusional desire to unite all Arabs under one Saddamese Iraq, kill all the Jews or at least get rid of them, and consolidate middle east resources into something on par with Europe or America, all under Saddam's rule. Kuwait was Saddam's Poland. Only we stopped him. Now he's a brooding little baby.

We would go in, get rid of Saddam and his WMD and leave the country to the people of Iraq.
 
Yeah, but we do want to kill enough Arabs to fill Israel, get rid of a government for which there is no proof of resistance, and take out a man who's done nothing but good for his country (I might get called on that one... :D)
 
Originally posted by M5Power
Yeah, but we do want to kill enough Arabs to fill Israel, get rid of a government for which there is no proof of resistance, and take out a man who's done nothing but good for his country (I might get called on that one... :D)

I bet you just might at that.
 
:lol: Well, considering 99% of his prisoners ... er, citizens ... voted for him last election, he must be doing something right.
 
Originally posted by M5Power
So the question still remains...

WHERE'S THE PROOF???!!!

Maybe he's got them, but I'm an average citizen - and my government hasn't conclusively proven so.

You really confuse me. I can't find any continuous political beliefs in your posts. First you attack me for being blindly liberal, and occasionally spout off some pretty right-wing sentiments. Then you come back and argue a very liberal point of view. What ARE your beliefs!?
 
Originally posted by TAFJonathan
You really confuse me. I can't find any continuous political beliefs in your posts. First you attack me for being blindly liberal, and occasionally spout off some pretty right-wing sentiments. Then you come back and argue a very liberal point of view. What ARE your beliefs!?

It makes intellectually lazy people content to be able to cram everybody into one of two categories. And it confuses them to encounter an independent thinker.
 
Originally posted by TAFJonathan
You really confuse me. I can't find any continuous political beliefs in your posts. First you attack me for being blindly liberal, and occasionally spout off some pretty right-wing sentiments. Then you come back and argue a very liberal point of view. What ARE your beliefs!?

I'm centrist in general and I act purely on what I believe when issues are put on the table. In my eyes, anybody who has full political allegiances too far to the right of John McCain and too far to the left of John Kerry are very extreme.
 

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