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Well put friend! You could always take FORZA MOTORSPORT for a ride. Or wait for Project CARS.
Grid Autosport is also GOOD. You'll enjoy that.
Sound Update (PD is now hiring! + Email!)Answered
- Thread starter FoRiZon
- 1,262 comments
- 96,920 views
Well put friend! You could always take FORZA MOTORSPORT for a ride. Or wait for Project CARS.
Grid Autosport is also GOOD. You'll enjoy that.
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- 2,534
- Johannesburg
- Tayeedz1
The man has a point though. GT Needs good samples. It was mentioned in PitStop on how samplea are recorded and how that's gonna change.
Last night I caved in and Bought and E46 M3, it hardly even sounded like the straight 6 we know and love, twas butchered I say!
I have to say that the engine is good (though needs improvement) but the samples aren't. There are hardly any games I know that have a correct downshift, heel-toe gear change sound. GT did those properly.
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^^ GT did thos properly up until version no. 4.
Just baffles me what went wrong after that.
Forza has great downshifting sounds BTW. Have you played FM4 or 5?
Just baffles me what went wrong after that.
Forza has great downshifting sounds BTW. Have you played FM4 or 5?
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Ah, that explains the non-sequitur posts; you can't read!
Please, stop putting words into my mouth.
Ha, actually just careless this time!Is that a pun? Double entendre'?
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- Tayeedz1
I think this makes @Griffith500 happy
This makes me happy however... Too happy. I wish PD would get the roar of the engine, turbo spool, blow off valve and Dr Jerkel ,Mr Hyde characteristic for plenty of engines.
Played 4 and 3 a few times, don't have an Xbox but I tried them at a few gamestands by expos and in games shops. We don't have Xbox One here in South Africa yet so eish no Forza 5.... Forza's downshifts, redlines and climbing down the RPM range have always sounded weird to me, their sound samples are on point however along with their sound projection.
This makes me happy however... Too happy. I wish PD would get the roar of the engine, turbo spool, blow off valve and Dr Jerkel ,Mr Hyde characteristic for plenty of engines.
Played 4 and 3 a few times, don't have an Xbox but I tried them at a few gamestands by expos and in games shops. We don't have Xbox One here in South Africa yet so eish no Forza 5.... Forza's downshifts, redlines and climbing down the RPM range have always sounded weird to me, their sound samples are on point however along with their sound projection.
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- 30
- Brasil
This from google translator amigo?
yes the old google translator, cliché
Thanks for understanding and not judging
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^^ 👍
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They have a long way to go if they're to get the fidelity and variety that FM2 had.
Compromises.
Nobody believes that the PS3 isn't capable of great things. What it isn't capable of is everything, despite Sony's claims to the contrary.
The current samples are indeed generally "bad" (usually badly balanced, and missing vital components; often totally wrongly applied).
I'm sure if PD had just focused on improving their sampler, and feeding it with new samples processed from the new recordings they've been collecting since GT4, they could have made an impression on PS3. But it wouldn't have been much of an improvement overall, and it's likely that the variety would have suffered even more than it already has. In planning for the future, I expect they wanted to take a bigger step forwards than GRiDAS has.
In terms of the landscape of engine sound synthesis technology, that implies an entirely new (in-game) generation method is required (which we've since been told is exactly what they're working on), and my spidey sense tells me it has nothing to do with samples.
That latter point means that the new method PD has been working on won't hit the hardware in the same way that a sampler would. That makes it an unknown at the least (which is still your worst nightmare in software systems), or a real programming burden with lots of twists and turns in compromising computational cost against eventual quality, not to mention original research and very bespoke technical expertise. It will also make it difficult to compare to a sampler, particularly in terms of that "quality" / cost balance.
The main reason for PD using a new method, and especially eschewing samples (assuming I'm right; the Red Bull and Senna cars are a massive hint that I am), is most likely for the built-in variety it can offer, going forwards. It might seem odd, but PD is looking further forward than most, it's just they haven't been able to pull the future in quickly enough. Which is annoying, I'm getting impatient.
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They have a long way to go if they're to get the fidelity and variety that FM2 had.
Compromises.
Nobody believes that the PS3 isn't capable of great things. What it isn't capable of is everything, despite Sony's claims to the contrary.
The current samples are indeed generally "bad" (usually badly balanced, and missing vital components; often totally wrongly applied).
I'm sure if PD had just focused on improving their sampler, and feeding it with new samples processed from the new recordings they've been collecting since GT4, they could have made an impression on PS3. But it wouldn't have been much of an improvement overall, and it's likely that the variety would have suffered even more than it already has. In planning for the future, I expect they wanted to take a bigger step forwards than GRiDAS has.
In terms of the landscape of engine sound synthesis technology, that implies an entirely new (in-game) generation method is required (which we've since been told is exactly what they're working on), and my spidey sense tells me it has nothing to do with samples.
That latter point means that the new method PD has been working on won't hit the hardware in the same way that a sampler would. That makes it an unknown at the least (which is still your worst nightmare in software systems), or a real programming burden with lots of twists and turns in compromising computational cost against eventual quality, not to mention original research and very bespoke technical expertise. It will also make it difficult to compare to a sampler, particularly in terms of that "quality" / cost balance.
The main reason for PD using a new method, and especially eschewing samples (assuming I'm right; the Red Bull and Senna cars are a massive hint that I am), is most likely for the built-in variety it can offer, going forwards. It might seem odd, but PD is looking further forward than most, it's just they haven't been able to pull the future in quickly enough. Which is annoying, I'm getting impatient.
I think T10 is quite popular for ditching the good stuff from previous games when making a new one. Has been happening since FM2, and did happen yet again with the release of FM5.
PD better have some really fancy sound design techniques in their arsenal. Competition's getting quite stiff. Not every fan is going to continue to buy into "more cars and tracks is better" with every release.
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I'm glad that you like it. I don't. I dispute that FM's feature atrophy is at all "popular". In an ideal world, these things just wouldn't happen.
Compromises.
The competition's barely changed - nothing tops PGR4 in terms of absolute sample fidelity, still. All the effort is on glitz and there's still little substance behind it in the main - iRacing's simulation approach is the only real, exciting thing to happen to engine sounds recently, and it's actually a physics feature: drivetrain flex.
Most of the difficulty with "more cars and tracks" is the sheer work involved. Hence the extra work towards a course creator; is there an analogue for sound, I wonder?
As I said, that flexibility is a key motivator for trying something new, especially given the potential reward. It may not be important to you, but PD aren't just trying to make a game for you alone - don't take it the wrong way, but I'm quite glad of that.
Compromises.
- 2,534
- Johannesburg
- Tayeedz1
Well with the way Peeps have been talking about Grid AS's sounds. I'll do the usual real life comparison
GRiD AS
Real Life
While the sound from GRiD AS is good, it has fidelity and variety however the sample is not 100% but take what I just said with a pinch of salt because with Sims nothing perfect but they can be close to it. The gear changes, downshifts and pops from the exhaust are on point. Also considering that this on last gen consoles as well with that kinda sound, it makes me wonder what PD has up their sleeve. I'm getting impatient as well. I want my "Improved Sounds" update for GT6 and a "Major Update" teaser of the major update for GT7
Ey yo @Griffith500 , I recall you saying there was a taster of the supposed engine in GT5P? Where exactly so I can whip out GT5P tomorrow and check it out?
GRiD AS
Real Life
While the sound from GRiD AS is good, it has fidelity and variety however the sample is not 100% but take what I just said with a pinch of salt because with Sims nothing perfect but they can be close to it. The gear changes, downshifts and pops from the exhaust are on point. Also considering that this on last gen consoles as well with that kinda sound, it makes me wonder what PD has up their sleeve. I'm getting impatient as well. I want my "Improved Sounds" update for GT6 and a "Major Update" teaser of the major update for GT7
Ey yo @Griffith500 , I recall you saying there was a taster of the supposed engine in GT5P? Where exactly so I can whip out GT5P tomorrow and check it out?
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- Brasil
Yes of course, Grid seemed to be a good game at first, but then I did not like
I have not played Forza yet, but seems to be a good game with a little bit of everything.
Only game on Playstation and PC
I tell you my companions, I do not buy more games PD if she did not do this Update
I'll feel wronged with my money spent on a game unfinished
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Just a point: when I say variety, I mean things like this:
Most of which is achieved without touching the manifolds, which would make a much bigger difference. For instance, despite the fact that the Rover / Buick V8 in the Griffith uses the same firing order as the old small block Chevy, the unique exhaust configuration (manifolds that collect in front of the engine) gives it its signature growl.
The sound engine in GT5P is more or less the same as it is in GT6. My ear was pricked by the spatial mixing, frequency-dependent directional sources, and hence separate engine and exhaust sources, transmission delay from distant objects, atmospheric attenuation from the same etc., none of which was in GT4.
And there were the "sound simulation" credits that also weren't in GT4. It all pointed towards a major shift in the way they looked at sound, and now we have the Red Bull and Senna cars and the tantalising prospect of a "completely different way of generating engine sounds".
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If you're crazy about cars and racing, you SHOULD NOT be missing out on FM! Go ahead, get an X1. You will not be disappointed. Set up your deadzones properly when you do.
Let us know, we're here to help!
I'm glad that you like it. I don't. I dispute that FM's feature atrophy is at all "popular". In an ideal world, these things just wouldn't happen.
Compromises.
The competition's barely changed - nothing tops PGR4 in terms of absolute sample fidelity, still. All the effort is on glitz and there's still little substance behind it in the main - iRacing's simulation approach is the only real, exciting thing to happen to engine sounds recently, and it's actually a physics feature: drivetrain flex.
Most of the difficulty with "more cars and tracks" is the sheer work involved. Hence the extra work towards a course creator; is there an analogue for sound, I wonder?
As I said, that flexibility is a key motivator for trying something new, especially given the potential reward. It may not be important to you, but PD aren't just trying to make a game for you alone - don't take it the wrong way, but I'm quite glad of that.
Compromises.
A game that's all about driving ain't no good with proper engine sounds and race effects. Any serious racing game or sim fan would tell you the same.
Being said, if GT screws up sound again, as a consumer luckily, I've got several choices - one of them is not buying their product!
Can you imagine a game like GOW, TR or Dead Space with BAD sound? Sound is half the equation right there. Same can be said for driving games and sims, where immersion and feedback from audio visual ques is everything.
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GT's visuals are impressive, I'll give it that much. However, the whole standards/premium thing irks me. It should not be present in a sim to begin with. Anyway...
Too bad the sound doesn't match up.
Too bad the sound doesn't match up.
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Really??? What were they doing all this time?!!
1. GT needs to ditch the whole premium/standard hoopla for good.
2. If they can focus less on car count, they can certainly devote more time towards getting the sounds JUST right. The PS4's hardware is quite powerful, simply put.. they have no excuse with GT7!
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- Tayeedz1
1. I highly agree on that.
2. Waiting for the PC Elitists to come and comment
I wished more of PD's practices are mentioned. We're pretty much dying to know what they have planned and not just the "We'll have to see" mentality.
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