The biking thread

[Greycap]

I'm even more of "lots of legs, very little back" type with a 173 cm height and 80 cm inseam, and the sweet spot for me tends to be an around 430 mm reach with a 60 mm stem. Shorter than that and the stem starts getting so long that it messes the steering up, hence my rant a few pages ago about the people who want to put L sized riders on S sized frames with 100+ mm stems because smaller is always better. Oh heck no it isn't. I've experienced huge changes in handling with as little as 15 mm, with the longer stem it wallowed from side to side when pedalling out of the saddle but with the shorter one tracked perfectly straight. Something about the front end geometry but no idea what.

 

[Eunos_Cosmo]

I'm even more of "lots of legs, very little back" type with a 173 cm height and 80 cm inseam, and the sweet spot for me tends to be an around 430 mm reach with a 60 mm stem. Shorter than that and the stem starts getting so long that it messes the steering up, hence my rant a few pages ago about the people who want to put L sized riders on S sized frames with 100+ mm stems because smaller is always better. Oh heck no it isn't. I've experienced huge changes in handling with as little as 15 mm, with the longer stem it wallowed from side to side when pedalling out of the saddle but with the shorter one tracked perfectly straight. Something about the front end geometry but no idea what.

Yeah I'm not a fan of long stems - I feel like the longer it gets, the more of a moment it has on the steering which causes the front wheel to wander as you described. I'm hoping I can keep them stem on this build short and because it's a low stack frame, put on a tall riser bar, like the Surly Sunrise or similar.

This is a Kona Unit (or maybe a Karate Monkey?), but this is what I'm going for, more or less -

 

[Omnis]

Soooo I impulse bought a coefficient AR because it’s the only one I saw on eBay after almost a whole year of browsing. Buyer accepted a $50 discount on his list price. I’ll see if this “swope” concept is any good, and if it is I’ll probably be able to find a coefficient RR and sell my Pro PLT to cover that cost.

 

[Eunos_Cosmo]

I want carbon.

Does anyone have experience with cable-actuated hydraulic disc brakes? I'm thinking of running them on my Riff build for a variety of reasons. I really like the feel of true hydro discs, but for this bike I want something a little bit more completely foolproof. I'd get Paul Klampers (full mech), but they are quite expensive (more than my frame )

 

[Omnis]

I want carbon.

Does anyone have experience with cable-actuated hydraulic disc brakes? I'm thinking of running them on my Riff build for a variety of reasons. I really like the feel of true hydro discs, but for this bike I want something a little bit more completely foolproof. I'd get Paul Klampers (full mech), but they are quite expensive (more than my frame )

Just get Juin F1s. https://www.ebay.com/itm/175426130547?var=474719820944

The rears don't stop fantastically well (the whole install was a little fiddly), but the fronts are fantastic even with resin pads. Huge upgrade over the basically unusable Clarks tektro clones that came with my bike. Didn't I do enough yammering about my brake woes here? I was looking at Growtac Equals because the Klampers are freaking MASSIVE. However, it doesn't make sense to have brakes that are more expensive than your whole bike. You can go through 3 sets of F1s before you come up on the price of those other premium brakes. JuinTech is even making the GT 4 piston and now a 6 piston caliper, but they are like 100 extra bucks per pair of pistons. Ridiculous. The F1s are plenty of stopping power on our flat roads. I still like my rim brakes on the road bike better.

Since you're building out the frame, are you doing a groupset transplant or building from scratch? I would suggest taking a good look at Microshift Sword if you want to do the cable-hydraulic route. Otherwise go full hydro.

 

[Eunos_Cosmo]

Just get Juin F1s. https://www.ebay.com/itm/175426130547?var=474719820944

The rears don't stop fantastically well (the whole install was a little fiddly), but the fronts are fantastic even with resin pads. Huge upgrade over the basically unusable Clarks tektro clones that came with my bike. Didn't I do enough yammering about my brake woes here? I was looking at Growtac Equals because the Klampers are freaking MASSIVE. However, it doesn't make sense to have brakes that are more expensive than your whole bike. You can go through 3 sets of F1s before you come up on the price of those other premium brakes. JuinTech is even making the GT 4 piston and now a 6 piston caliper, but they are like 100 extra bucks per pair of pistons. Ridiculous. The F1s are plenty of stopping power on our flat roads. I still like my rim brakes on the road bike better.

Since you're building out the frame, are you doing a groupset transplant or building from scratch? I would suggest taking a good look at Microshift Sword if you want to do the cable-hydraulic route. Otherwise go full hydro.

Well...I'm actually thinking of doing single speed so no need for a groupset per say.

 

[Eunos_Cosmo]

I'm thinking of picking up a used hardtail or hybrid from local market to canibalize for parts. I found a nice little Jamis Sequel S3 locally for $350. I'm thinking I could get things like the crankset, headset, wheels, stem, fork (probably too short), seatpost & seat, cables, for a lot less money than buying those individually. Good plan? Bad plan?

Jamis® Sequel®

Built to tackle anything midtown can throw at it, Sequel® is clearly ready for urban assault no matter the surface or condition.

www.jamisbikes.com

 

[Omnis]

Well...I'm actually thinking of doing single speed so no need for a groupset per say.

So you need brakes, why?

 

[Eunos_Cosmo]

Decided I'm going to use my 650B/27.5 wheelset I already have for my gravel bike for this build (I have my 700c wheelset on the gravel bike right now anyways) to save a little coin. With that coin - I got myself one of these -

MRP Rock Solid Carbon Rigid Fork
About half the weight of a comparable fork from Surly/Kona/SOMA and a good bit less money than a Whisky fork. I'm also a fan of its tough double stanchion look and non-boost hub spacing (which matches the rear triangle). I got the 465 A-C version (20mm less than the optional Soma Fork that gives a 67 deg head tube angle) which should steepen up the headtube angle a bit (I think roughly 69 degrees). Should make the bike more fun at lower speeds and I'm not looking to do crazy single track on this bike.

Also ordered a set of Swchalbe Hurricanes in 27.5x2.25. I wanted a fast tire that still has some cornering lugs and these really seem to fit the bill. Only $33/ea which seems like a great deal too.

Also ordered a Surly Sunrise bar to pick up locally monday/tuesday. $75
Original budget: $1000
+proceeds from selling Giant $200 = $1200
-Soma Riff Frame $265 = $935
-MRP Fork $460 = $475
-Swhalbe Tires $66 = $409
-Surly Sunrise Bar = $334

With that, I've got a rolling chassis, so to speak. So I've got $334 left to build the rest of the bike. I think that's doable knowing I don't have to worry about wheelset and knowing it will be single speed...at least for now. Gonna try to find some hot deals on the local market for things like crankset, headset, pedals, dropper + saddle, etc.

 

[Eunos_Cosmo]

Damn it. The Schwalbe tires are not tubeless ready. I'm trying to cancel the order. I'm instead going to go with the Continental Ruban...little more expensive but better compound and tubeless.

+Schwalbe Hurricanes $66
-Continental Ruban $70

Budget left = $330

On the hunt for a single speed conversion kit for a Shimano 11 speed hub. There seem to be a bunch on Amazon for like $20. Not a critical life safety item, so I think I'm gonna go for max cheapness here. I think I'm going to shoot for around 60 gear inches to start with for this bike. I think that will put me into like a 32t:15t combo based on various calculators. The top end of my comfort range for cadence is 90rpm and that will put me at 16mph with 60 gear inches, and probably spinning out just below 20mph. It might be undergeared for climbs, so I'll have to see how it works.

The one area that really confuses me is the whole bottom bracket, crankset, chainline alignment area. I know the BB is 73mm but aside from that, I don't know where to begin. Help?

 

[Greycap]

On the hunt for a single speed conversion kit for a Shimano 11 speed hub.

The one area that really confuses me is the whole bottom bracket, crankset, chainline alignment area. I know the BB is 73mm but aside from that, I don't know where to begin. Help?

If it's a MTB 11 speed, it's the exact same hub as a 8/9/10 speed that probably is more common naming for the conversion kits. Only road hubs are different in width between <10 and 11 speeds.

The chainline is a bit of a bottomless pit when you try to understand it. My Chisel is a good example of how standards aren't really standards - it has a 73 mm BB shell, a Boost rear axle, and thus at least in theory should need the Boost version of Shimano cranks. In reality it uses the "normal" crankset as the chainstays are narrow enough for the chainring to clear them, which is very nice as it means a narrower Q factor and the chainline is straight in the middle of the cassette. The chainline should be adjustable on the hub to match the cranks if the single speed kit is any good.

The bottom bracket itself of course depends on the cranks but there are two major styles - either the old fashioned square taper, or the gazillion different splined versions. Square taper is very nice if you never have to take it apart, for regular maintenance the Shimano Hollowtech is a clear winner as it doesn't need an extractor tool (like square taper and Octalink do) or has no easily breaking parts (SRAM brittle aluminium puller/extractor bolt, I'm looking at you) and is stupidly simple to take apart and put back together.

 

[Eunos_Cosmo]

The rear cassette on my 650b wheelset is an SLX M7000...which I think is a MTB cassette...so I guess that means the hubs are MTB hubs? They are 142mm and 11 speed, I know that much.

Noted RE bottom bracket. I'll probably go Shimano there.

Yeah, I guess the single speed kits just have a variety of spacers to get the chain alignment needed. I'm just going to get a cheap one with the right cog and hope it works.

Fork & Frame are supposedly both shipping today! Going to order the continental tires and pick up the bars tomorrow. Hopefully by this weekend I'll have something resembling a bike sitting in my garage.

I'm hoping this build comes in <26lbs though I'm not being too spendy with the lesser components.

 

[Eunos_Cosmo]

Parts are ariving

Surly Sunrise Bars. These boys are wiiiiide.

The fork and tires should arrive today too. Grips & single speed kit arrived yesterday. Pedals should come soon. I think I'm going to take the frame to my LBS to have them fit the headset and cut down the steerer, both of which I'm a little uneasy about doing. I may try to do the BB myself where there seems to be less that can go wrong.

 

[Greycap]

I think I'm going to take the frame to my LBS to have them fit the headset and cut down the steerer, both of which I'm a little uneasy about doing. I may try to do the BB myself where there seems to be less that can go wrong.

If you have any doubts, don't do it. I know a case - not personally, just on the internet but there were very telling pictures to accompany the story - where a guy had bought a brand new carbon fork for his road bike. He had measured it extremely carefully, checked the measurements half a dozen times, applied masking tape on the steerer tube to mark the spot, and then attacked it with a hacksaw. Everything went perfectly fine... until he realized he had cut it on the wrong side of the tape mark.

Not that it's any rocket science, I've cut five of them this far but it's always a bit of a sweating moment when breaking out the pipe cutter (nicer finish than sawing for metal tubes in my opinion) to make sure there's no mistake in it. Too long is easy to shorten but it gets quite tricky the other way round.

 

[Omnis]

Yeah, never mark something with a line without an accompanying X or arrow.

 

[Eunos_Cosmo]

So that's a no to tin snips and eye balling it...right guys?

Pedals and tires arrived last night. Fork is stuck in transit. Frame is...unknown. Called them on Monday and they said the warehouse was a week behind. It's now been a week since I ordered the frame and no updates at all. Why do I have such bad luck with communication when ordering bikes?

 

[Eunos_Cosmo]

😍

 

[Eunos_Cosmo]

Scored a nice deal on Shimano MT201 calipers + levers (pre-bled!) front & rear for $80. Not the best brakes in the world, but from what I gather a totally decent budget hydraulic disc brake. Half the price of the Juin Tech brakes which don't actually come with levers.

Just need the headset, some kind of dropper/seatpost (I have a saddle) and the crankset/BB. I think that's it? Fork is still stuck in USPS hell...

 

[Greycap]

Scored a nice deal on Shimano MT201 calipers + levers (pre-bled!) front & rear for $80. Not the best brakes in the world, but from what I gather a totally decent budget hydraulic disc brake.

I don't think there's a bad Shimano hydraulic brake in existence nowadays, but bad rotors are a different thing altogether. Avoid at least the cheapest Shimanos like a plague, they're apparently made of some creamy cheese and even good calipers can't get good power out of them. The easy way to identify them is the "hundreds of small holes" drilling pattern.

 

[Eunos_Cosmo]

I don't think there's a bad Shimano hydraulic brake in existence nowadays, but bad rotors are a different thing altogether. Avoid at least the cheapest Shimanos like a plague, they're apparently made of some creamy cheese and even good calipers can't get good power out of them. The easy way to identify them is the "hundreds of small holes" drilling pattern.

Good tip.

Thankfully, I already have a goodish set of discs on the 650b wheelset I'm going to be using, Shimano RT70s. They've got about 1500 miles on them, but they have worked flawlessly on my Ribble so I expect them to continue working well for me. Unfortunately this locks my gravel bike into 700C for the immediate future. I'll probably get another set of DT swiss 650bs for that bike sometime next year.

I'm still confused on the crankset - there are so many standards and acronyms Can somebody look at the bike spec and just send me a link to a decent budget crankset & BB that will fit?

Soma Frame Riff Blue (Standard)

www.somafabshop.com

 

[Greycap]

Thankfully, I already have a goodish set of discs on the 650b wheelset I'm going to be using, Shimano RT70s.

Brilliant rotors, I have the same ones in 160 mm size on my Chisel. The original plan may have been XT rotors but there's no way I'm going to deal with the eyesore that is four spoke rotors, ever, so SLX it was in the end.

For the crankset and BB perhaps these. Don't know if it meets your idea of budget though.

EDIT - Don't be scared by the 1x12 specification. First hand experience says that it works perfectly fine in a 1x10 build, so why not a single speed too.

2-PIECE CRANKSET for 135 mm, 142 mm and 148 mm O.L.D. Frames 1x12-speed | SHIMANO BIKE-EU

The SHIMANO FC-MT510-1 mountain bike crank delivers precise and reliable shifting for 1x12-speed drivetrains.

bike.shimano.com

SHIMANO Threaded Bottom Bracket 68/73 mm shell width | SHIMANO BIKE-EU

With better sealing and rotation the SHIMANO DEORE bottom bracket delivers high driving efficiency.

bike.shimano.com

 

[Eunos_Cosmo]

One thing that always comes up when I search for Shimano components is Shimano-branded components, for half the price, on Aliexpress. I'm assuming it's not legit, but at the same time...how could it possibly be legal to have such conspicuous knockoffs? So are they the real thing? Has anyone here bought "Shimano" stuff from Aliexpress before?

 

[Shaun]

Shimano-branded components, for half the price, on Aliexpress.

I reckon that answers your question.
Shimano are very strict with their geo-blocking of parts on their sales network. For example I can't order most Shimano stuff from the UK like I used to because it was cheaper. It now has to come through an authorised Shimano Australia dealer.

how could it possibly be legal to have such conspicuous knockoffs?

The Chinese don't care about copyright laws.

As for the quality on Aliexpress I have never bought from there so can't give you any advice on it.
Just because it's Chinese it doesn't automatically mean it's of poor quality. Last time I read, about 90% of the worlds carbon frames come out of about three factories in China.

The Chinese are also pumping out some good quality carbon wheels at a huge discount to say DT Swiss and Enve for example.
Might be worth trawling some forums regarding the Aliexpress "Shimano" gear for quality etc. That's if you want to go down that road.

 

[Omnis]

One thing that always comes up when I search for Shimano components is Shimano-branded components, for half the price, on Aliexpress. I'm assuming it's not legit, but at the same time...how could it possibly be legal to have such conspicuous knockoffs? So are they the real thing? Has anyone here bought "Shimano" stuff from Aliexpress before?

If you’re buying drivetrain from aliexpress, stick with Sensah from their official channel

 

[Eunos_Cosmo]

Well...had my first oopsie.

Fork finally arrived. Fork has a 100x15 axle and my 650b wheel has a 100x12 hub. What's the easiest solution here? Seems like there are reducers on the market to let me run the 12mm axle in the 15mm fork. Bad idea? Alternatively, I could get a 15mm hub but that sounds like a pain and a lot more money.

edit: The radavist endorses the former approach - I think I'll order the converter axle.

 

[Eunos_Cosmo]

Found an ebay seller who makes custom 100x15 to 100x12 conversion sets. Sent him some photos and dimensions and he's putting together a set for me. Beats getting a new wheel. I think.

edit: the amount of standards in the mountain-biking end of the market is infuriating. At least with road and gravel, you kind of know that most components will fit most bikes. But mountain bikes are all over the place. I had a hard enough time finding any rigid fork with the right axle-to-crown and the right hub spacing, but there simply isn't one...I don't think...that has both of those how I want them AND has 12x100 axles. Is there really a need for a distinction between 12x100 and 15x100? You can't tell me that 3mm is going to make a big difference in terms of strength. Then there's boost, extra boost (or whatever its called). Really makes building a bike from scratch a pain.

 

[Greycap]

Is there really a need for a distinction between 12x100 and 15x100? You can't tell me that 3mm is going to make a big difference in terms of strength.

That's a thing that has to be asked from the road bike engineers, it's a problem created solely by them. The 15x100 had existed in the MTB world for about a decade until someone decided that road bikes must have thru axles too and the existing 15 mm axle obviously weighs a couple of grams too much and requires fork legs 3 mm wider (and heavier) so a new standard was absolutely necessary. There's zero reason why the tried and tested 15 mm couldn't have been used but they just had to have one of their own.

Why you can't find a MTB fork with a 12x100 axle is because... well, it's a road bike standard. MTB forks use MTB axles, and those are all either quick releases or 15 mm with the extremely rare exception of 20 mm DH parts.

 

[Eunos_Cosmo]

That's a thing that has to be asked from the road bike engineers, it's a problem created solely by them. The 15x100 had existed in the MTB world for about a decade until someone decided that road bikes must have thru axles too and the existing 15 mm axle obviously weighs a couple of grams too much and requires fork legs 3 mm wider (and heavier) so a new standard was absolutely necessary. There's zero reason why the tried and tested 15 mm couldn't have been used but they just had to have one of their own.

Why you can't find a MTB fork with a 12x100 axle is because... well, it's a road bike standard. MTB forks use MTB axles, and those are all either quick releases or 15 mm with the extremely rare exception of 20 mm DH parts.

So 15mm is standard on MTB forks, but 12mm is standard on the rear triangle? My SOMA has a 12mm rear axle. Is the logic that the front end takes more abuse and therefore the front axle needs to be stronger?

edit:

I've got $88 left of my arbitrary original $1k budget to finish this build. Still need a stem, chain, crankset+BB, seatpost and headset. Time to score some deals on craigslist.

 

[Omnis]

So 15mm is standard on MTB forks, but 12mm is standard on the rear triangle? My SOMA has a 12mm rear axle. Is the logic that the front end takes more abuse and therefore the front axle needs to be stronger?

edit:

I've got $88 left of my arbitrary original $1k budget to finish this build. Still need a stem, chain, crankset+BB, seatpost and headset. Time to score some deals on craigslist.

Buy a bike for $100 and transplant it. Look at my example with my GXP crankset woes though. Just look for what's been fitted up in the past and go with that. BSA 73mm that's going to be fun to find parts for.

 

[Eunos_Cosmo]

The residual parts are too specialized to try to find on a donor bike at this point I think, unfortunately. I also don't love the idea of selling a complete mountain bike...without a crankset and saddle If I had done a more conventional build, it would have made a lot of sense. But rigid 27.5 single speed with a high rise handlebar is not exactly a common bike these days...or ever