The GT6 Epic Whining and Crying Thread

[LMSCorvetteGT2]

We HOPE that by giving the whiners a specific thread, MAYBE they'll congregate here and stay off the other threads.

Ah yes, because once again having actual criticism on an open thread and not blind loyalty makes one a "bad person", sorry if people giving actual factual rhetoric hurts your feelings and ego when it comes to GT. Also people can't follow simple GTP rules, what makes you think you can herd them here to complain? You're optimistic and gullible, nice

I'm dissapointed that it was not released on PS4, there is no reason to the the PS4 now for me. Bad buisness decision too.

Sure there is, it will allow PD to take all the time in the world to work on 7 for PS4 since people will probably play the tar out of this for 3 years then get restless by year 4. The only issue with that is, Sony are probably going to drop the PS4 this holiday season if not Spring '14; so that time frame I gave is probably overly hopeful, and people will probably wish it was on GT4 after a year of play. Either way the point is clearly money and also tradition. It is tradition for a Sony console to have two GT core games, and so the PS4 and five and whatever else after as long as GT is around will also have such two game ideas. So while you may not get it the way you want it and save money, you'll still get a GT on the next gen console...you just might have to shell out more money if you want to have this game and GT7.

PD is a business after all

 

[BoneSawTX]

I can sum this thread up in one line:

"not sure if serious or trolling"

serious trolling, it worked.

 

[frankygt-r]

guys, its a sony decision, they wanted another gt on ps3 which has the larger installed base. if pd will improve gt5 weakness we will still have a great game. imagine a realistic phisics, improved online, realistic collision, better sound ecc... for sure if they still put standard crap cars it will be hard to not have a bitter taste in my mouth

 

[LMSCorvetteGT2]

Well, Forza 4 is worse, and this hasn't hurt its reputation all that much. And these simmish games need aids in order for the newbs and kids to have a fun time and keep buying the new games in the series (err... what he said ^).

You sure don't disappoint, so fixated as you stick to the cause -GT is the best and don't forget it- and with you around we sure wont. Forza 4 isn't worse and I'll leave it there before a flame war ensues, because you feel the need to insert your bias rather than talk with objective reason.

guys, its a sony decision, they wanted another gt on ps3 which has the larger installed base. if pd will improve gt5 weakness we will still have a great game. imagine a realistic phisics, improved online, realistic collision, better sound ecc... for sure if they still put standard crap cars it will be hard to not have a bitter taste in my mouth

Well it works both ways, in what I just said, both are companies that work hand and hand and thus this isn't a decision as to "oh we will give the gamers a second GT on the PS3, cause we care!!!" No they see an ability to make more money on a great money making title, while still being able to make more money on the PS4 via GT7 sales in the future. Thus everyone is happy!? Also I'm sure Sony listens to PD and doesn't just outright force them to commit a second game to the PS3.

 

[Encyclopedia]

If a car has appeared in four GT games (eg the Daihatsu Sirion) I would want my experiences with it not to be the exact same each time, especially if, to me, it's pretty uninteresting.

Which is why the lack of clarity on the topic of a livery editor is very concerning at the moment. Being able to transform a dull car into a club racing car (visually) would actually encourage me to drive cars like the Sirion, as I did with racing modifications in GT2.

But the experience hasn't been the same every time. Physics have continually been updated. But I see what you mean. I would love that level of customization as well.

 

[HKS racer]

Dear Yamauchi, end of journey for the Hype Train.
Livery editor or no buy.

 

[Spagetti69]

I'd be fine with SRF being removed entirely (because, if GT5 is anything to go by, all leaderboards will be riddled with it for top times), but if we are getting leaderboards, I'd hope the bare minimum we get in relation to information about the laps is which aids the user had on when they set their time.

Don't think leader boards will be in. If they are, every time PD change the physics they should wipe all the boards.
They need to put out a physics model and stick by it. That's the problem.

 

[SlipZtrEm]

Don't think leader boards will be in. If they are, every time PD change the physics they should wipe all the boards.
They need to put out a physics model and stick by it. That's the problem.

Agreed. The endless fiddling with the physics needs to go; it doesn't speak highly of PD's confidence in the engine, and it makes it almost impossible to accurately judge how cars are over the life of the game.

Just like so many other aspects of GT5; consistency is important here, and we could use some in GT6.

 

[alonsof1fan91]

It would be nice if they tweaked ABS to something similar in Forza, I have it off for that game, its still easy to feel when the brakes lock up and there is a good range of brake pressure you can apply before they lock up.


Jerome

It would be nice if they tweaked ABS so it works like real AB-systems. GT5s does not.

ABS in GT5 makes treshold braking obselete.

 

[Earth]

You are delusional my friend. But really.

Your expressed *hate* comes from a fact how this particular game does not have some cars of your subjective preference, while some other game have them. And that is basically it. You have to be kidding.

You are setting the "laziness" trap for the people that have presented the crazy list of improvements for the sequel over previous game that will especially emphasise community and simulation aspects of the game, among other improvements.

You are bashing over GTAcademy because you personally do not like it while you don't want to accept it actually serves its purpose on as many levels imaginable, most notably on development of physics, gameplay and game features.

And yet - with surprising twist - you are implying they should *learn* for studio that can't even influence their principal to allow for normal force feedback wheel support on their platform for three generation in the row, that sacrifice driving model in favouring controller over wheels, that deliberately downplays all simulation-aspects of its game because of the casual players (Simulation mode, have you ever seen it in Rivals, Matchmaking or in filtering for official venues?), that can't offer variety in surfaces or proper open-wheel vehicles for 4 consecutive games without any meaningful explanation, that totally missed opportunity to introduce variable weather and day/night changes, that deliberately killed endurance racing form their single-player and matchmaking while in the same time preaching about being the ultimate simulation, that does not offer any real new, groundbraking functionality or options for 10 years (in fact, they're killing-off all improvements they've achieved through sequels: no city tracks at all anymore, less and less big point-to-point stages, dumbing down physics and mechanical-physics, scrapping Drivatar development after the very 1st sequel, no real improvements in bridging the gap among controller and wheel players handicap, almost never releasing any substantial updates for buggy and problematic part of their games..).

What should PD learn from T10? Sounds? They are absolutely equally incorrect in both games. Online? Online functionality is much better in GT5 then in FM4. Rivals? Stolen from EA's Autolog, so no real "Forza invention" there. Livery Editor? Yeah, livery editor. And engine swapping. Okay. Two points, I agree.

But somehow I think how both Livery Editor and Engine Swapping should be traded for all things that GT series does miles better then Forza and where Forza still have so damn too much to learn from PD. Which will never happen unfortunately, because it is easier to create a positive mindset with serving people with Porsches and some fancy cars in game with 700+ cars then to actually improve over substantial things that could elevate the true essence of your game.

But everybody has a right to opinion, you and me equally, and I am taking my liberty to say how I still wait the day when some driving game will come that will meet all things that GT series does right and unique on top of basic things it delivers as driving simulation. Gaming and driving-genre in general would be much more beautiful place if more developers would be enough brave to take onto voyages that PD is embarking for 15 years now.

Of course, all above is strictly my subjective opinion.

They can learn from Turn 10 but they wont. This article highlights the probable reason

http://www.gamespot.com/news/pride-clouds-vision-for-japanese-devs-says-inafune-6406367

Gran Turismo has serious car list issues. If (sub)standard cars died with the PS2, you would maybe have 20 racecars in GT5, with a majority of those being Super GT or NASCAR.

GT5's Le Man's 24 hours entry list if the car lineup wasn't artificially boosted by (sub)standard cars:

1. Audi R10 '06
2. Peugeot 908 HDI FAP '10
3. Ford GT LM Spec II Test Car

Go ahead and throw the DLC Jaguar XJR-9 premium if you wish, but that only pushes the total to 4, even though its a car from another era. Knowing Polyphony Digital they would have filled the field out with Super GT or even NASCAR. Hopefully this highlights the colossal failure that was GT5's car list.

All they had to do was model the Dome S102, the R15, A GT2 458, a GT2 Spyker, a GT1 C6R, and a GT1 DBR9. 6 cars. Thats it. And the Le Mans race could have been all premium cars with enough diversity for the 11 AI limit.

Of course you will say these are just cars I want. Are they? Nobody wants to race a GT1 Corvette or Aston Martin? or a GT2 Ferrari 458? A Le Mans winning R15? Or Japan's own Dome S102?

Beating down Forza doesnt really build the GT series up. In fact theres a myriad of issues I could bring up with GT5, many of which look to remain in GT6. I know Forza does car customization very well...but I struggle to think of something Gran Turismo 5 does very well. Truly a jack of all trades and a master of none.

The (sub)standard cars truly are despicable and a crutch for Polyphony Digital. They're there to hide the tiny amount of premium cars in the game when compared to the closest rival, Forza. Once again they'll hold the entire game back. Yes, it will be stupid watching them race in the rain without using their 3 polygon windshield wipers. But the consequences are much more serious then that. How will Polyphony Digital develop a serious crash damage engine as long as the standards not only exist, but make up a majority of the cars?

2 most requested features since GT5: Livery editor and sound improvement. Both look to not be happening. What does that say about Polyphony Digital?

 

[The_Rpg_Moogle]

@amar: Fair point about Horizon. It is indeed different from FM. But the reason I brought it up is because that game uses a lot of things from FM4, including the physics. I would assume Turn 10 can take the off road behavior of cars from Horizon, improve on it, and then we'd finally have rally in FM.

But that way FM would again be copying from GT! Don't get me wrong, I love the game for what it is, yet I still see it as a (albeit very good) copy of GT. I agree with Amar on what he said about FM's evolution though. It's been very stale. PD at least sticks their neck out. Those who take risks do take the blame sometimes. I know the phrase 'if it ain't broke, don't fix it' but at least they try to change things up, something which will hopefully also be done with FM5, for which I'm very curious. But then again, if it turns out to again be a FM3.9 or something, I'm done with if for a while...

 

[Exorcet]

FM's evolution though. It's been very stale. PD at least sticks their neck out.

I can't see this at all. Forza could do a lot more in terms of innovation, but I feel it leads GT. GT has even gone backwards a lot. Removing qualification, dumbing down the tuning menu since GT1, introducing damage in GT2 only to cut it, removing RM's from 4, removing N2O from 5, etc. GT has made no significant stride to replicating real racing besides maybe increasing average race length and adding fuel/tire wear for everything in GT4 (which was not followed in GT5). The tuning in GT, at best, is at a standstill. Yes, they've done some shuffling and added a couple things, but also taken away. All the weight reductions and engine parts are simple multipliers. There is so much that PD could have done, but don't seem to have even considered.

 

[SlipZtrEm]

But that way FM would again be copying from GT! Don't get me wrong, I love the game for what it is, yet I still see it as a (albeit very good) copy of GT. I agree with Amar on what he said about FM's evolution though. It's been very stale. PD at least sticks their neck out. Those who take risks do take the blame sometimes. I know the phrase 'if it ain't broke, don't fix it' but at least they try to change things up, something which will hopefully also be done with FM5, for which I'm very curious. But then again, if it turns out to again be a FM3.9 or something, I'm done with if for a while...

I'd rather someone work on getting something implemented well before moving on to the next feature. GT5's a great example of trying to implement too many things, and doing so only partially for all of them. Focus is important.

It's strange that other games are accused of copying GT fairly often, but when it's the other way around, it tends to be overlooked.

"If it ain't broke, don't fix it" is pretty much the opposite of giving a game a few dozen tiny updates, each one fixing one error within the game in exchange for causing a new one

 

[Scaff]

But that way FM would again be copying from GT! Don't get me wrong, I love the game for what it is, yet I still see it as a (albeit very good) copy of GT. I agree with Amar on what he said about FM's evolution though. It's been very stale. PD at least sticks their neck out. Those who take risks do take the blame sometimes. I know the phrase 'if it ain't broke, don't fix it' but at least they try to change things up, something which will hopefully also be done with FM5, for which I'm very curious. But then again, if it turns out to again be a FM3.9 or something, I'm done with if for a while...

I have to say that I disagree that T10 don't stick their necks out, it simply in a different way to PD.

Moving to the use of actual tyre data rather than sticking to tried and tested modeling was a risk for T10 and for two games it had some quite big issues, only coming good with FM4. In that regard (and as I value physics over just about anything) PD were the ones playing it safe and sticking to the tried and tested.

Refusing to try and put in weather and night races because it would not enable a locked frame rate with V-sync was also a risk (given that it was known GT5 was aiming for just that) and one that was picked up by reviewers. Yet I applaud them for sticking to that principle as a locked frame rate is again something I think is vital (and back in the PS2 day so did PD) and no screen tearing makes a huge difference.

I also thing that amar is being uncharacteristically harsh in regard to T10 in these regards and I have to say that I personally find that quite disappointing, particularly in regard to chastising T10 for not being able to force MS to adapt a different protocol for FFB, that was never going to happen on the same platform and knowing MS is unlikely to change for the next Xbox either. A lot of what amar has said here is also utterly at odds with the far more balanced posts made on the subject in the past.

 

[Jason115]

I like how people think they can predict how GT6 is going to be by just a trailer. If you want to share your opinion on just that, be patient and wait for the demo. Don't waste your time!

 

[limesutam]

This thread should be re named " the I caught Gt6 sleeping with my wife and now I'm pissed " thread.

I have never read so much rage before over a video game that will for all intensive purposes not effect your lives in any way.

Ok maybe if you win gt academy but that's a bag of worms I don't care to get into.

Thanks for all the laughs guys, it has made my day.

 

[amar212]

I also thing that amar is being uncharacteristically harsh in regard to T10 in these regards and I have to say that I personally find that quite disappointing, particularly in regard to chastising T10 for not being able to force MS to adapt a different protocol for FFB, that was never going to happen on the same platform and knowing MS is unlikely to change for the next Xbox either. A lot of what amar has said here is also utterly at odds with the far more balanced posts made on the subject in the past.

When I start to talk about actual innovation and improvement I am harsh, yes. However, I will always give credit when deserved and I have no problem with that. Of course, I also do not expect to everyone know my positions on every thing, so thank you for this balancing with quoting me, very appreciated 👍

Regarding XID/HID, I have the same opinion for years now, as you know. I am absolutely blaming Microsoft for XID/HID but T10 has lots of blame on their shoulders. The development of findings made regarding steering buffer for 900-wheels - that happened for both FM3 and FM4 - was a showcase they are blaming everyone else for their own decisions.

When we discovered steering buffer early after FM3 was released, all our posts where we were asking for the explanation and asking for them to acknowledge the problem - especially in the light of then announced 900-wheel support which simply didn't work as it should - were simply erased from the official forums. After few days everything regarding that issue was permanently trashed. I didn't come back there for next 2 years.

Same situation happened once FM4 was released. We discovered the steering buffer instantly, but this time their ignorance and deliberate will for deception went even further. First they said we're talking nonsense - even developers themselves, not only forum PR personnel - tried to minimize the obvious. Once they were faced with video-proofs they backed down and first begun to blame Fanatec. Then they went into smug-phase and stopped answering everything regarding that issue, which was even worse - because many of us invested into new Elite wheels and we were so damn pissed that promises that were clearly given prior to game release - about fully released 1:1 linearity physics in 900-mode - was not fulfilled. AGAIN.

Few weeks later the famous patch was introduced that finally solved the issue to some extent - because in order to activate proper 900-mode and 1:1 linearity we still have to have wheel on special profile, you have to turn-on console first and then the wheel and if anything is out of procedure - which was discovered by the community and never properly explained officially - 900-mode will just not work.

Also, they never tackled the greatest issue and that is disparity in performance between wheels and controllers, in both modes, Normal or Simulation. And that is something only GT does right in the complete genre. And yes, I blame T10 for that, because they absolutely know about it.

But in the same time, I am very positive about FM4 physics and many other aspects of the series. However, that does not change my opinion how many aspects of FM series that are universally praised are not that spectacular and how the overall impression of Forza is inflated. But thankfully, the more and more players are acknowledging shortcomings of FM and I hope how performance of both FM4 and Horizon will shake some heads there and move their focus to being more brave in actual development of innovations.

I hope that Forza 5 will be a gigantic step over all Forza games so far despite almost certain continuation of usage of Xinput (XID) protocol or force feedback devices and continuation of problems with countersteer. Tacking issue with disparity between controller and wheels should be their main concern IMO

Waiting for the May 21.

 

[Scaff]

But in the same time, I am very positive about FM4 physics and many other aspects of the series. However, that does not change my opinion how many aspects of FM series that are universally praised are not that spectacular and how the overall impression of Forza is inflated. But thankfully, the more and more players are acknowledging shortcomings of FM and I hope how performance of both FM4 and Horizon will shake some heads there and move their focus to being more brave in actual development of innovations.

Funny enough you could change Forza to GT in the above and it would sum up how I feel about GT5.

 

[interpolfan11]

I don't think T10 lying about various features of their game (which only affected a miniscule amount of its users in the first place) is a much different situation from the tens-of-thousands of us (tentatively speaking, as I actually think there are more) who bought a PS3 solely for GT5 — only to be strung along and lied to about release dates by PD. Both games' developers have been deceptive at times. Only you bought a really nice wheel thinking it would work well for Forza 4 (although at least you also have a nice wheel for the PS3 and PC now), while I bought a console I never would have bought had I known GT5 was going to take so long to be released. Neither of us were given what was advertised.

The difference between the two is that one of the developers made a much better game than the other one.

I know this is off-topic and I won't post about it again in this thread if the mods don't want me to.

 

[7Sins]

Hang on, so you're telling me we don't have to fork out money for a PS4 and GT6 is coming out on PS3 and it has many new features included that we complained about that were lacking in GT5 and it will still be supported with updates and DC??

As Brennan from Step Brothers would say..."ARE YOU _ _ _ _ ING HIGH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!"

 

[GranTurismo916]

Made a meme out of the Mailman on the Yahhh music video.

 

[PepeMickey]

Hang on, so you're telling me we don't have to fork out money for a PS4 and GT6 is coming out on PS3 and it has many new features included that we complained about that were lacking in GT5 and it will still be supported with updates and DC??

As Brennan from Step Brothers would say..."ARE YOU _ _ _ _ ING HIGH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!"

Hold on...I can hear something...like a vaccum of some sort....Oh, it's GT6 coming with....uhmm....Standards!!!!!....wait what?

 

[TokoTurismo]

Hold on...I can hear something...like a vaccum of some sort....Oh, it's GT6 coming with....uhmm....Standards!!!!!....wait what?

Looks like someone is high.

 

[LMSCorvetteGT2]

This thread should be re named " the I caught Gt6 sleeping with my wife and now I'm pissed " thread.

I have never read so much rage before over a video game that will for all intensive purposes not effect your lives in any way.

Ok maybe if you win gt academy but that's a bag of worms I don't care to get into.

Thanks for all the laughs guys, it has made my day.

Ah, so if it doesn't effect are lives in the subjective manner you think it should, no one has the right to complain.

Thanks for your irrational banter, it made me laugh as well 👍

 

[KinLM]

Ah, so if it doesn't effect our lives in the subjective manner you think it..

So does people's English. Why do I even go to school..

 

[Tenacious D]

You really can't help yourself, huh?

What I was referring to was that weird little critter called Rewind. The assists in Forza run from helpful to weird to downright dysfunctional, such as ABS which isn't even working. I still don't understand that. The driving assists fiasco, I never really got into. I deferred to the technically knowledgeable on the subject such as amar212. I will say though that the heavy handed modding of the official Forza boards has made me reluctant to ever participate again, and to date I haven't.

Ah yes, because once again having actual criticism on an open thread and not blind loyalty makes one a "bad person", sorry if people giving actual factual rhetoric hurts your feelings and ego when it comes to GT.

No, what I take issue with is the double standard which inevitably rears its ugly head when certain Forza fans get involved in the discussions here. I want to have Forza discussed here. Mulling over it strengths and weaknesses has a lot of merit, as well as dragging in any other racer or sim into the mix. You may mess your shorts to know that even though I have a dislike/hate relationship with Forza 4 lately, I have also heaped a good deal of praise on it and the work that T10 has done in it.

In fact (Forza 4) may be the most realistic racer on the market.

Oh gee, did I say that?? Oh yes I did say that.

Now I will also criticize it, but I'm unaware of any rule that says "Thou shalt only praise Forza." Maybe you have amar212 on ignore, but he brings a pretty heavy hammer, and some authority behind it. He doesn't do it with anger and hatred, but because he wants to see the genre always moving forward and becoming more realistic and involving. And he does it because like me, he doesn't take hypocrisy or double standards well.

In case you missed it, I myself participate in the criticism of Gran Turismo and what GT6 on PS3 might mean. I just don't join in with the politically correct derision, spittle and overstated flaws like "every car sounds like a Hoover."

Just so you know.

 

[Earth]

Hang on, so you're telling me we don't have to fork out money for a PS4 and GT6 is coming out on PS3 and it has many new features included that we complained about that were lacking in GT5 and it will still be supported with updates and DC??

As Brennan from Step Brothers would say..."ARE YOU _ _ _ _ ING HIGH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!"

What new features does it have that we wanted?

So far I've counted

___Livery Editor
___All "premium" cars
___Better AI
___PS4 share and live stream functions / PS3 youtube upload
___Event/championship editor
___Better Sound
___Multi-class Racing support
___Around 200 A-Spec events
___Proper course creator, not "generator"
___Fleshed out Super GT, NASCAR, WRC championships
___Decent Damage modeling
___Decent crash physics
___New tuning techniques (air pressure, 4 point tuning)
___New HUD with digital readout of fuel, tire temps, etc
_x_More rims, wings etc
_x_Improved menus
_x_Improved physics
_x_Cleaned up graphics
_x_Online Club and Championship Features

Really, Im not asking for too much. If in some very, very unlikely way GT6 improves greatly upon the sound of GT5, and offers a livery editor, I might, just might consider it. I'll stomach the whole bumper car crash physics ordeal again, for the 15th straight year. I'll beat the 2nd place cars in the events by 2 laps again, for the 15th straight year. I'll even race against or as the (sub)standard cars, for the 9th straight year.

So far Polyphony Digital said they have better physics, menus, as well as more rims and wings. Not enough. There needs to be way more. Considering the disappointing jump in car and track count.

edit: added online features

 

[Encyclopedia]

Edit: Nevermind.

 

[LMSCorvetteGT2]

So does people's English. Why do I even go to school..

Ah yes, cause a typo doesn't exist on the internet . I too wonder why you even bother, if you're going to grasp at straws with a typo, but that is your right I suppose. I mean as smart as you try to act, you only seem asinine by pointing out a non-issue to the subject at hand that can easily be equated to a mistake by a fellow human on the net. Or can it not?

 

[ShiftingGears]

What I was referring to was that weird little critter called Rewind.

I'd rather rewind than SRF.