Think positive: why we should be glad GT5 is delayed till spring '10?

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I don't think she would mind because she was the one who bought me the G25. You know she's the right one when she buys you a G25 for Christmas because she knows you love playing Gran Turismo.:D
 
Damn, after reading the news, im a bit angry :?

I hate this "damage hype". I wish PD would make dynamic weather or stuff like that, till march 2010. Thats so much more important than damage...
 
serversurfer
So are you now saying the March release isn't the result of them adding damage to the standard cars at the last minute, contrary to what you've claimed so vehemently in the past, or do you just reflexively contradict anything vaguely positive/hopeful that might be said about GT? :P
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Nope, I am saying that after this long in development they should not just be realizing that their half finished damage system was going to be poorly accepted just like a chef shouldn't realize 30 minutes into cooking the cold food won't be accepted well.

The analogy isn't perfect for the situation but the point is sometimes waiting logner doesn't get you anything better.
 
I think it will be better as well. Kind of like tuning/building a car. If you spend a little more time, you may be able to get it to output a little more power, run a little safer or handle a little better. You could also blow your engine aka GT5 cancelled.:D
 
I would rather just have the whole of GT4 ported to ps3 but made 1080p than have to wait this long, we could have had the port 3 years ago and still have GT5/6 in 2010.
 
Quiet_Storm
I think it will be better as well. Kind of like tuning/building a car. If you spend a little more time, you may be able to get it to output a little more power, run a little safer or handle a little better. You could also blow your engine aka GT5 cancelled.:D
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Dont even say so! :lol: Please, i don't want GT to become Duke Nukem!! :yuck:
 
SETWAVE
I would rather just have the whole of GT4 ported to ps3 but made 1080p than have to wait this long, we could have had the port 3 years ago and still have GT5/6 in 2010.
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Look at it this way. With PD building GT5 from the ground up, we won't have to wait that long for GT6. They're getting the base features and everything else set for GT5 so when GT6 comes out, all they have to do is fine tune it everything, add more cars/tracks and maybe a few more features.
 
Devedander
Nope, I am saying that after this long in development they should not just be realizing that their half finished damage system was going to be poorly accepted just like a chef shouldn't realize 30 minutes into cooking the cold food won't be accepted well.
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Which assumes there was ever a chance it would've been served cold, or be served any sooner than it actually will be.

Of course, you assume both of those things, so I guess we're done here. :)
 
serversurfer
Which assumes there was ever a chance it would've been served cold, or be served any sooner than it actually will be.

Of course, you assume both of those things, so I guess we're done here. :)
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Yes that's just my point of view, but I feel they are the most reasonable assumptions based on the evidence available. Check the news page, Jordan agrees... when the march 2010 date was announced he said it was a surprise and recently he has said the recent interview strengthed his feelings that this delay was just due to the response to damage at GC.

Without getting into the whole page long walls of text again, the whole issue I had with your stance before was that it was taking the least reasonable meanings and going with them in the face of a more reasonable meaning.
 
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4 months should be enough to finish Modern Warfare 2, Uncharted 2 and Assassin's Creed 2, so I'm not too bothered by the release date.

However, every time I play a racing sim or game it just makes me want GT5 quite a lot, so I don't any more...
 
To be honest, since the game was actually never delayed, I don't think we can expect anything else than what we originally expected: a very good game.
 
Devedander
Yes that's just my point of view, but I feel they are the most reasonable assumptions based on the evidence available. Check the news page, Jordan agrees... when the march 2010 date was announced he said it was a surprise and recently he has said the recent interview strengthed his feelings that this delay was just due to the response to damage at GC.

Without getting into the whole page long walls of text again, the whole issue I had with your stance before was that it was taking the least reasonable meanings and going with them in the face of a more reasonable meaning.
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I'll try to keep my reply just as short. :)

We've known since E3 that damage would be procedural*, and we know procedural modeling applies to all models, so we have no reason to think that two months later they instead decided to hand-model damage on a tiny fraction of cars, and even less reason to think they went back to procedural modeling a month later after GC.

Now we've both restated our reasoning. Are you convinced yet? :P

*We saw the procedural modeling "in action" at E3, but it wasn't confirmed to be procedural until TGS.**

**Footnotes don't count towards my wall, do they?***

***Because if they do, that hardly seems fair.****

****Like, totally unfair.

-----------------------------------

Now, I will agree that damage modeling may be taking a lot longer than they expected, and based on some of Kaz's comments at TGS, it seems probable it will be their primary focus between now and March, but it's not talking longer because they're finally adding it to the other cars due to nerd range as you asserted. As I've explained to you very clearly, their methodology has always applied equally to all cars, so there quite literally is no process for "adding it to the other cars"; it's already as done for those cars as it is for any.

So, truce? :)
 
serversurfer
I'll try to keep my reply just as short. :)

We've known since E3 that damage would be procedural*, and we know procedural modeling applies to all models,
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We know procedural modeling CAN be easily applied to all models. Licensing and other factors however can trump that and prevent that from being a known. His previous quote about not all cars having damage and only race cars having damage followed by the recent "brand new damage modeling" quote from KY seems to hint that it may well have.

No need to call truce, I don't mind continuing to disagree, but I think everyone (including you and I) will be happier if we keep the WOT's down a bit. Deal?
 
NO TRUCE please! this is so entertaining and informative. There is alot of knowledge in both of your rants if ya just pick through all the crap. (and there is alot of that) but still fun for me guys.
 
Devedander
No need to call truce, I don't mind continuing to disagree, but I think everyone (including you and I) will be happier if we keep the WOT's down a bit. Deal?
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Sure, I can do that, now that I realize wot a WOT is. :)

We know procedural modeling CAN be easily applied to all models. Licensing and other factors however can trump that and prevent that from being a known.
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So you're suggesting he's actually going to spend the next six months negotiating with Honda for the right to damage their cars, and as recently as GC, he hadn't gotten anyone's permission at all? And I was right about the meaning of "sets" in the IGN interview, and it was always going to be "all cars, save those manufacturers who won't allow it"? ;)
 
serversurfer
So you're suggesting he's actually going to spend the next six months negotiating with Honda for the right to damage their cars, and as recently as GC, he hadn't gotten anyone's permission at all? And I was right about the meaning of "sets" in the IGN interview, and it was always going to be "all cars, save those manufacturers who won't allow it"? ;)
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No, I am going to suggest that POSSIBLY (and this is ALL speculation on very little fact as to the why): up until GC PD severely underestimated the demand for damge and didn't want to deal with the licensing issues for what they mistakenly thought was a minor issue.

Or possibly KY wanted his top level of damage on all cars and when he coudln't meat the xmas release date Sony wanted (for obvious marketing reasons) drew the line somewhere which is why he mentioned race cars and sets likely in this case even referred to which race cars and maybe some race cars would be left out of damage as well as standard.

Either (any) way, 2 months of working on damage in 5 years of dev seems irresponsibility low.

cletus 669
NO TRUCE please! this is so entertaining and informative. There is alot of knowledge in both of your rants if ya just pick through all the crap. (and there is alot of that) but still fun for me guys.
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You have to be kidding me... you WANT more WOTs? I don't even think we like them, heck half way through one I have to open the thread in a nother window just to look back and remember what I was saying!
 
I am serious, learning alot from you two! great debate guys.



EDIT: What is a "WOT" by the way? I suck at figuring those out.
 
Thanks for the help!:sly: I googled it. But seriously back to the op; positive thought, um...well....that gives me 6 more months of reading posts and answering useless polls! Yipee...whoohoo...zip-dang!
 
Prologue looks fine for me already, except this penalties in S events are kind of dumb and annoying. Would be better to replace them with something real like damage

From the other side ability to try some WRC and NASCAR races wouldn't hurt
 
I own a PS2 just so I can play Gran Turismo, and I'd almost give up a limb(OK - both pinkies, or maybe just a few toes!) if I could play GT4 on a PC along with some extremely needed bug-fixes. I truly despise the entire concept of a proprietary computer that only runs approved software, and of exclusive titles too for that matter - but I will be swallowing my pride and buying a PS3 when it can be used to play GT5.

So!

1. The longer it takes for KY to finally decide that GT5 is finally ready and that it's going to totally blow our socks off, the cheaper my future PS3 purchase becomes. PDD - The Polyphony Digital Discount has already saved me $400, here's hoping that number goes up a bit more before it's time.

2. Time is the only thing that can save us from another bug-fest that takes you to hell and back with annoyances just as often as it takes you to the most heavenly places imaginable with MAJOR FUN. MAKE IT _ALL_ FUN!!!
 
imtheleprechaun
1. The longer it takes for KY to finally decide that GT5 is finally ready and that it's going to totally blow our socks off, the cheaper my future PS3 purchase becomes. PDD - The Polyphony Digital Discount has already saved me $400, here's hoping that number goes up a bit more before it's time.
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not to mention wheel prices.

by the time GT5 launches, the Logitech g27 won't be commanding full retail anymore, and g25's will probably be close to free.*

*resisted hilarious joke about G31 prices.
 
@ PD has more time to include great new cars in the game such as the new Toyota Celica (FT86), Opel Calibra and Ford Capri.
This will be done anyway and be released as DLC. At least thats what the rumours say.
@ we have more time to expore other racing games (only to find that for PS3 GranTurismo is the real thing after all).
We already know that so why spend even more money on other games?
@ you can save up more money to buy that all new Logitech G27 wheel, wheelstand or Playseat.
Read above ^
@ its a good thing as things can only get better and be improved, and new features may be added that would of been left out.
That's a good point! Damage need "a bit" of work :P
@ it leaves us knowing that they will have the time to smooth out any issues, possibly add new cars and implement new features.
Isn't this the same as the last one?? Read above ^
@ we now actually have a release date.
...that could be changed very easily
@ gives PD time to look at what will make Forza 3 so popular, and consider including elements of it...
Kaz has never played it, some of the PD Crew looked at it once, thats it. We want GT, not Forza.
@ 6 months worth of improvements in quality.
Quality is good already. That's not the point.
@ another 6 months of having a life.
No argue on that one :)
@ gives PD time to improve the physics, collision physics, A.I. and scenery.
It's 6 months, not 6 years... just focus on damage.
@ I rather have a polished game stuffed with things the developers wanted included, than a rushed buggy game.
There is no way any full GT game would be released as a rushed buggy game.
@ the 6 month time period they have until release is a great amount of time to fully improve, adjust, and tweak [those] issues.
What issues? FOCUS ON DAMAGE!!!
@ if GT5 came out end of December my semester exams would have been a disaster.
You should be more mature than that, I know I would do the same though... :P
@ there's going to be some more cars say about an extra 30-50 cars which would bump it up closer to 1,000 or a bit less.
Read my first comment ^^^^
@ I have no vacation time left for 2009. So, if GT comes out in 2010, then I will have a more vacation time to take when the game comes out. I plan on taking a few days off.
Planning a vacation after a game...... THATS A GREAT IDEA!!!!
@ less bugs, more features, a finished game. Doesn't get much more positive than that.
Yes but it's still 6 months... I want a Gran Turismo game, thats it!
@ you have time to polish or acquire your driving skills so you will be ready to fully enjoy the game.
I think I would enjoy GT5 if it came out today...
@ I hope it doesn't come out next year because if it comes out in 2012 it will be absolutely awesome as they will of had loads of more time to perfect stuff and include even more cars and tracks etc.
Tracks and cars will be DLC. Bla bla bla... RELEASE IT!!!
@ time to learn the curves of Nordschleife.
That can be done in GT5. But I must say I need a little practice by the Pflanzgarten. It's very bumpy and hard to predict the road.
@ I won't get yelled at and nagged by my fiancee until next spring for spending too much time playing games and not enough time with her.
If only it would be that simple. I get that everyday now....
 
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