W.M.A. International Touring Car Championship-Season Wrap-Up!

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How much horsepower should cars have?

  • 230

    Votes: 2 3.8%

  • 240

    Votes: 1 1.9%

  • 250

    Votes: 6 11.5%

  • 260

    Votes: 8 15.4%

  • 270

    Votes: 35 67.3%
  • Total voters
    52
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There should be enough spots for you, Sakery. I mean, there's enough cars to choose from, and as long as your in before the room fills you won't need to be a reserve.
 
Sorry for the confusion guys. But my lap times yesterday were done in the S2K. Havent done any testing on the Volvo itself. I think I can shave a tenth or two off my time. Specs are 266/1100.
 
Oh, I see...

Just trying to break the Integra in right now, and so far its at 211 bhp and 1200kg. With 3 lap old tyres, the car hit 1:10.964. The car's handling is amazing, I've dumped the ballast right at the back for 53/47 weight distribution, stiffened the cars suspension, and it takes the corners with poise. I think it rivals the Scirocco's handling for sure.
 
Maybe I just know how to get a lot from the FF's, but the Volvo is quick as well. I DON'T have all the upgrades on the Scirocco. I just use sports exhaust and Turbo stg. 2 with the LSD and transmission/clutch upgrades. I gave my tune out already, theres no secret to it. If someone can only get 1:08's with the same car with better hp, that's not my fault. Maybe it's the tracks that suit me, or how the car drives. We'll have success ballast anyway to penalise the drivers, don't neuter the car, find your own that suits you and you're fast in.
 
freshseth83
Maybe I just know how to get a lot from the FF's, but the Volvo is quick as well. I DON'T have all the upgrades on the Scirocco. I just use sports exhaust and Turbo stg. 2 with the LSD and transmission/clutch upgrades. I gave my tune out already, theres no secret to it. If someone can only get 1:08's with the same car with better hp, that's not my fault. Maybe it's the tracks that suit me, or how the car drives. We'll have success ballast anyway to penalise the drivers, don't neuter the car, find your own that suits you and you're fast in.
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Maybe you are better with FFs but ironically we've raced on GVE before, in the same car, and there wasn't much difference in our times, and I ended up winning that race... just saying.

Also, did you NOT read my post? I was getting 1:07.6 with 258 bhp, not even broken the car in yet, on a decent (as in, OK BUT COULD BE BETTER) lap, no turbo, no real major tweaks to make the car better aside from my usual stiffen dampers and springs and even out ballast. (which you can't do anyway because 1169kg is the lowest the Scirocco was able to go.)

Don't automatically assuming I'm trying to ruin your chances of winning or attacking your ability as a driver. I'm not neutering the car, I'm testing it and trying to get it racing evenly with other cars. If you think otherwise, I have but one sentence for that... get your head out of your ass, I'm not in the mood for people talking crap today.
 
You're a joke. Get your head out YOUR OWN ass. I was saying don't neuter the car, because there are cars just as fast if not faster. I wasn't bragging about my times. Your 1:07 is great and all but any car decent enough can get that time too. Maybe it's time you realise no one is out to get you or whatever it is you're going on about. Don't come at me over some forum being mr. moody thinking and assuming things. I don't even need the Scirocco to be competitive. FWIW, I don't remember racing you anywhere besides Grand Am and here. And my last statement wasn't just for you, it was for anyone here who has yet to find that good competitive speed. Take a step back there Stormy, your comments might turn people away.
 
Rx-8 testing...Just bought the Mazada so its not broken in yet. Was able to turn 108.2 to 1.08.6 lap times with the Rx-8 at 248/1200, dropped the weight to 1100 and was turning 1.07.5 to 1.08. This is at GVE reverse with a basic suspension tune on the car. Going to open a lobby up later to do some further testing and tunning if anybody wants to join
 
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freshseth83
You're a joke. Get your head out YOUR OWN ass. I was saying don't neuter the car, because there are cars just as fast if not faster. I wasn't bragging about my times. Your 1:07 is great and all but any car decent enough can get that time too. Maybe it's time you realise no one is out to get you or whatever it is you're going on about. Don't come at me over some forum being mr. moody thinking and assuming things. I don't even need the Scirocco to be competitive. FWIW, I don't remember racing you anywhere besides Grand Am and here. And my last statement wasn't just for you, it was for anyone here who has yet to find that good competitive speed. Take a step back there Stormy, your comments might turn people away.
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The race I was on about was with you, Mel, PAWEL and myself. We were both driving a CR-Z TC, Mel drove a RM Integra, PAWEL drove a Roadster TC. I can't remember what series it was for though, sadly.

I didn't say you needed the Scirocco to be competitve. *checks* nope defintiely didn't say that, but thanks for putting words into my posts.

Your backhanded praise of my time is nice but unecessary. I was only mentioning what that particular car was still capable of doing in less capable hands than yours, and without the same tune setup. (Personal tweaks as I call them.)

If there are cars that are just as fast or faster, then when it comes around to it we'll all sit down and discuss whether THEY should be "neutered" too.

If I mistook that as being directed soley at me, which couldn't really be helped since it came after I said something, then I apologise.

Thinking and assuming things is natural, I can't help that, but I usually back my thoughts and assumptions with some kind of results at some point though, be them ultimately correct or incorrect.

I don't need my head being taken out of my ass, as much as you like to think and assume that I do. Being Mr. Moody only affects my tolerance to what looks to me like someone passing off a car that strongly needs putting under the microscope as being something down to "maybe its luck, maybe its this, maybe its that..."

If it is down to all those things, then extra testing will find that out. To rule out that maybe the car is too powerful, and to pass it off as something like you are probably just better at tuning or with driving FFs or whatever, and so calmly, screams ignorance regardless of whether it was made to look that way or not. Also, in the grand scheme of the series, it doesn't really give us, the fellow competitors much feedback on the car apart from "I can drive this super quick with this setting".

"Are others testing it? And are other people going even remotely as quick as I am? Are they using it at a basic tune, or have they tried their damnest to get the most out of the car with their tune? Have they tried my setup? Have I tried theirs?" That's what I think when I'm testing a car; exploring every avenue, leaving no stone unturned.
 
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I answered all those questions before. Why don't you look back and read again? I gave my tune, Melan drove it fast but he wasn't quite as quick. I drove his Civic and they were only 4 tenths apart. Someone else here drove it as well, he has the gold car but he wasn't getting times close to what Melan drove. Don't say things like putting words in your mouth, I made my own statement. If you think the Scirocco has an unfair advantage I suggested you look at others times in it and other cars that get times just as fast. Now you have some long comment saying the same thing? That's why I said take a step back.
 
I'm guessing between the 455 - 465 mark, FH. I'll turn my PS3 back on and find out what my VW's at right now. Edit ~ 456pp currently.

Oh Seth....

Telling me you didn't need the Scirocco to be competitive IS putting words into my mouth, though, isn't it? I never once said you did. Take your own advice when it comes to looking back and reading first before you say that to others, please.

You only said to me is that you gave the tune in your previous post actually, you said nothing about other people trying your tune. I'll track through this thread hunting for the times Mel and others have posted in the Scirocco.

From the times I saw in the lobby the other day, given you were only using the car at 260 bhp instead of the 276 bhp it's still being registered at on the database, any other guy using the car at 276 bhp will be super fast purely by having the ability to keep the car on the track. Call me skeptical, but my skepticism has been right before.

My comments are all different, what ones are you reading?
 
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Room open #1472-6399-8537-0918-7794...CLOSED

Pretty much depends if I can get through turns 1 & 2 clean FlyinHawaiian, but when I do its in the high 1:07's
 
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I've tried your setup as you have it Seth, though my Scirocco is not broken in fully. I have 259 bhp / 1169kg, Sports Exhaust and St.2 Turbo. I don't think the setup works for me, but I'm getting a 1:07.3 at the moment. I'm not getting the same turn ability I felt with the car at stock on 258 bhp, but it seems faster in its acceleration. I'm still getting used to the car at your specs though, 20 mins of testing at 3am probably isn't the best way to test it though.
 
I'm gone for just over 24 hours, and all hell breaks loose? :scared:


Storm, Seth is a good tuner and a good driver. I have no doubt that he'll make any car I give him extremely fast.


Seth, please stop generally bragging, and, unless you want to try to balance ALL the cars over again, don't try to take the jobs of the Team of Stewards.

The ToS will review any and all claims of "unbalanced cars" through PMs only.
 
MrMelancholy15
I'm gone for just over 24 hours, and all hell breaks loose? :scared:

Storm, Seth is a good tuner and a good driver. I have no doubt that he'll make any car I give him extremely fast.

Seth, please stop generally bragging, and, unless you want to try to balance ALL the cars over again, don't try to take the jobs of the Team of Stewards.

The ToS will review any and all claims of "unbalanced cars" through PMs only.
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When the boss is away... And the dude in charge has school all day, and has a dermatologist appointment... Everyone goes nuts!
 
polarbear345
When the boss is away... And the dude in charge has school all day, and has a dermatologist appointment... Everyone goes nuts!
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True true... :lol: these appointments and important things... they're just an excuse for Seth to come looking for things... not specifically limited to arguments.


Anyways, I've updated the Registered drivers again. Two drivers have arrived, for whom there may not be room, officially. Therefore, James6653 and elite_sniper414 are on the official "chopping block" and will be removed from the registered drivers list, unless they come to this Saturday's race at Grand Valley East reverse.

And, people are running 1:07s? 👍 guys, good job! I'm seeing some good times spread about on the last page. I know that the Honda Civic Type R '08 (FN) that I'm running sees 1:08s as an impressive time, and the rare 1:07s... So, our main target will be 1:07s. Most cars should be able to run those times here, especially a well tuned FR or MR, since it's such a winding little track, but the corners are somewhat high speed.


Storm, I'm going to update the car list soon. I'll try out the cars in the specs you've given (to see how they handle and such) and what lap times they run. 👍 to Storm for requesting such nice cars, though!

Finally, Storm and Seth, the cars you mentioned (CR-Z TC etc.) was for the VLN series that a man named nitrorocks (whose internet has recently died and blocked him from the PSN etc.) was running. Once his internet tanked, so did that entire series. I don't at all think that those cars were even remotely closely matched. And, the TCs weren't exactly perfect handling, either. Some people could get SO much more out of their cars.
 
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I'm not bragging. Saying my times isn't bragging. Nor is saying that I don't need the Scirocco to be competitive putting words in someone's mouth. This series is fun, and I don't want to see people bicker about a single car being that much faster than other cars. This happened before when I had the TVR Tamora. People thought it was too fast. So I cut the HP back and added weight to it. It was still just as fast as all the others. So I switched to the VW, it's even faster. I cut it back by 16hp and it's still going too fast? What car should I use? I'm giving up the Scirocco so I don't make people think I'm getting some unfair advantage. If you are going to use it, I'll give you my tune and have at it. I think what some of you guys are getting is close. My first lap on Softs at GV was 1:07.0xx and after the first pit stop from 5 laps, it was 1:06.4xx. There's more to my tune than it being fast. I set it up to the way I like the FF's to handle. Here is my secret- Higher rear brake bias and close ratio 6-speed transmission, not the fully customizable one. It lets you rev way up in the red and gets you a good top end power even when you're running a midrange turbo. I can set all the FF cars up and try to get the best setups for them if that's what you guys want. But just because my tune works for me, doesn't mean it'll work for you all. That's why I said maybe I just click with certain cars or certain tracks.
 
Read above ^^


Also read this:

I'm planning on running a few more points championships.


Manufacturer's: all drivers from a manufacturer (Nismo & Nissan considered one) (Honda getting split into Honda FF and Honda FR)

Teams: all two-member teams

Independent: Independent drivers (not directly a member of a team, or One-Driver-Teams)

And, all three championships will be scored together.

Damu has an equal chance at winning Independent, for example, but, might still win the Manufacturer's. The only thing, is that an independent can't win Team's championship, and Teams can't win Independent.
 
Seth its not bickering, what we ended up doing after I called the car into question was bickering. The benchmark was originally 1:08's around here, no? Now the benchmark is 1:07's because we're all going a lot faster than before, or at the very least the few of us. Soon we'll be reaching a 1:05 benchmark, which is just plain silly, just because a few of us are running super quick in super quick cars given the most fitting tuning setup.
 
Storm, and Seth, I'm going to ask you to let it be.

Honestly, if anyone runs any faster than a 1:06, they're immediately signing their car up for performance balancing. Seth's Scirocco is quite fast, at some tracks, (mainly Cape Ring Inside and Grand Valley East Reverse so far) and that could cause irritation.

The problem is, that his tune is worth two seconds over Harrison, in the same car, at higher specs. I know Seth's a fast driver, but, putting Seth in a well tuned car, usually leads to Seth... hmmmm, winning like 4 races in a row in the Rolex Series, and doing incredible lap times in the ITCC.

We can't tell him "drive worse, you're too fast." so, we will have to see, in the proper racing, this week, if anyone's car actually has a proper advantage.
 
I'm not bickering. I'm telling everyone to get on with a car they are comfortable with. Who cares how fast you are, be consistent, you'll get a draft and the top finishers will get success ballast (if were doing that). I'm going to choose another car and let some of the 'not as quick' guys try out the VW.
 
freshseth83
I'm not bickering. I'm telling everyone to get on with a car they are comfortable with. Who cares how fast you are, be consistent, you'll get a draft and the top finishers will get success ballast (if were doing that). I'm going to choose another car and let some of the 'not as quick' guys try out the VW.
Click to expand...

We're reserving the option of success/performance ballast. We just haven't worked out an official system yet.

In the mean time, I should re-instate the point I made earlier: I don't care how many teams use the same car. There are 3 people in the Volvo C30; split across 2 teams. The point is, I don't want to see 3 people on a team, and I don't want to see 3 teams (6 drivers) with the same car.

Anyone and everyone is welcome to test with the Scirocco, regardless of who signed up for it above, except in the cases I just outlined.



Anyways, talking points:

Welcome to Sakery and NizmoDR3.

Points system updated (?)

Grand Valley East Reverse lap times are 1:07 to 1:08.

Success ballast ideas?!
 
I gave my idea a few pages back. 10KG per win, 5kg for podium finish. Keep all ballast until you do NOT podium (per weekly race). So Seth wins GV reverse Rd1. 1169kg +10kg for rd two. Rd2. Seth has 1179kg, I podium 2nd or 3rd- 1179kg +5kg for rd 3. Rd 3 Seth has 1184kg I don't podium so no ballast added. The next week I keep the ballast and if I podium again more is added. If I do not podium AT ALL, then ALL of the ballast is erased and I'm back at stock weight.
 
Interesting idea. Also, just to clarify; races are the three organized events per round, and there are ten rounds. Therefore, thirty races, ten rounds.

I haven't thought of any concerns with that system yet, and, therefore, it seems like a valid option.


Anyways, guys, post up your thoughts of ballast system please, and I'll message everyone soon, reminding the "less-than-often" racers, of just when the races are.
 
First I have to say following Cars are gonna be detuned to not outperform everybody:
Z4, 190E, Nismo, Sileighty and 240SX (S14)

But I start my findings and first test-session with the SPOON Civic.

1.
It´s a great little Car very nice to drive and really good with Tires. But its max power is 211kw (maybe a few more due to running in) and 1020kg means 200kg of Ballast.
Result of that is a 1:07.563 (with RS-Tires and a FWD-Base tune from myself).

Well I thought spot on with the others here (Scirocco for example).
Then afterwards I tested the SPOON with normal weight 820kg.
1:06.355 with RS and same tune.

2.
But then I switched to the BMW Z4 ´03.
276kw and 1131kg RS and FR-Base-Tune ---> 1:05.653

Good with Tires too.
Feels great but needs some ballast and less power. 1150kg and 256kw for example or less power.

3.
Silvia armada (Sileighty, S240SX and 270R are almost the same Cars just minor differences):
Nismo 270R// 276kw 1100kg RS and QT ---> 1:05.887
Sileighty// 276kw 1100kg RS and QT ---> 1:05.639
240SX // 276kw 1100 kg RS and QT ---> 1:05.495

=> All three need less power and more weight. They would benefit from too much added ballast due to weight distribution => 1150kg and 256kw for example

4. Finally the Benz 190E.
276kw 1118kg RS and QT ----> 1:05.487
It´s asuperb Car really. Turns in sharp and has Traction. Adding weight and limiting power is needed. 1150-1200kg and 256kw is my suggestion.


Will test them today with the suggested specs and post my times again.
If anybody wants me to test other Cars, tell me which ones and I will do it.
At the moment I have plenty of Time (outward and inward bound crack in ankle).

Little ashamed that I posted them Times but will try to get them to a low 1:07 at GVE(R).
 
Danke für die Hilfe, Sakery! Thanks for the help, Sakery!

Ja, schöne Idee. Yes, great idea.

Ich werde helfen, aber, später... Schlafenszeit... I'll help, but, later. Bedtime. :)

Ausserdem, guten Morgen man. Otherwise, good morning man. :D
 
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