Doesn't mean their opinions are any less valid.
Your faith in Gran Turismo - has it been permanently damaged?
- Thread starter Razamataz
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Scaff
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- He/Him
- ScaffUK
It doesn't affect my job at all (because this isn't my job, I work in the Motor Industry), and as has been said it's perfectly reasonable to complain about a substandard product that was mis-sold, that doesn't make someone a 'kid' or 'childish', and as such inferring that is the case is an unacceptable personal attack, on this the AUP is quite clear.
What makes you think anyone is taking this "so seriously"? This is an online forum for a video game, of course people are going to talk about it here. Doesn't mean it's a pressing point in their overall life.
- 882
- Spain
- 263
- Munich
- Hitokiri-666
No, I can not agree that I have either lost faith in PD or in the franchise itself. Peole say, that it is half-baked and unfinished. I see it more like a citiy. When did London got finished? Or Berlin, or New York... exactly.. never! The always work on it, the always replace and add ne buildings (content) etc. Same with GT7. Of course it is not finished, it will be when GT8 is launched.
However, this feeling of beeing ripped of because you paid the full price, comes unfortunately with the general posibility of online and patching posibilities. We can complain about this, but it want change, because studios, publisher want to bring the titles asap on market, no matter what.
Back to GT7. I don't understand the complains. First of, we have a classic GT-campaign. Call it fan-service, but I really like and appreciate it! (the menu songs!!!) Then also some classic elements as the world map, GT-auto etc. come back but also ne things like the café which I really like because it represent the attitude of a gentleman driver
Relax, take a break, have some motor-talks, learn something new.
The graphics are awesome, even better as sport (I play it on the PS-4 pro), the sound improved a lot and the physics are also really good, (ok... I hate the wood-like comfort tyres).
The thread writer complained, that GT is on its and, it is "outdated".. Well... than tell me, what would you change? What would you add?? I mean we talk about a racing simulation. Racing is "just" try to be first, before all other. Thats it!
Ok, the economy with price-tags and prizes sucks a lot! I see that and I don't like it either. This is the test from PD and Sony, how willing the GT-fans are to take the pill and pay "micro"transactions to get some rare, expensive cars. And yes people complained, already and PD reacted. Its a good sign But besides this topic.. I can not understand the rant against PD and Kaz.
Some people mention, that a open world mode would be a new good way for GT... maybe... It would be great if PD would create a kind of an nice island, where you can choose to cruise, to meet with your friends, show the car, have some drag races, or landside races, even some people could be the cops... etc. But... I don't need this, and I don't know if we talk just about a new mode or a whole new spin-off game?
Anyway...the past shows, that PD is constantly delivering new content (I hope for the VR-mode and track-editor). So... I still have faith with PD and GT!
However, this feeling of beeing ripped of because you paid the full price, comes unfortunately with the general posibility of online and patching posibilities. We can complain about this, but it want change, because studios, publisher want to bring the titles asap on market, no matter what.
Back to GT7. I don't understand the complains. First of, we have a classic GT-campaign. Call it fan-service, but I really like and appreciate it! (the menu songs!!!) Then also some classic elements as the world map, GT-auto etc. come back but also ne things like the café which I really like because it represent the attitude of a gentleman driver
Relax, take a break, have some motor-talks, learn something new.The graphics are awesome, even better as sport (I play it on the PS-4 pro), the sound improved a lot and the physics are also really good, (ok... I hate the wood-like comfort tyres).
The thread writer complained, that GT is on its and, it is "outdated".. Well... than tell me, what would you change? What would you add?? I mean we talk about a racing simulation. Racing is "just" try to be first, before all other. Thats it!
Ok, the economy with price-tags and prizes sucks a lot! I see that and I don't like it either. This is the test from PD and Sony, how willing the GT-fans are to take the pill and pay "micro"transactions to get some rare, expensive cars. And yes people complained, already and PD reacted. Its a good sign
But besides this topic.. I can not understand the rant against PD and Kaz. Some people mention, that a open world mode would be a new good way for GT... maybe... It would be great if PD would create a kind of an nice island, where you can choose to cruise, to meet with your friends, show the car, have some drag races, or landside races, even some people could be the cops... etc. But... I don't need this, and I don't know if we talk just about a new mode or a whole new spin-off game?
Anyway...the past shows, that PD is constantly delivering new content (I hope for the VR-mode and track-editor). So... I still have faith with PD and GT!
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Scaff
Moderator
- 29,445
- He/Him
- ScaffUK
Then it was very, very poorly worded on your part, as such I would strongly suggest it's an approach you avoid using in future.
Those raising valid concerns about GT7, it's launch state, and PD/Sony's behaviour as a result are not just kids, they are not acting childishly in complaining, and are not crying. Those are all terms you have aimed at members here at GT Planet, regardless of their actual age, if you can't see how that can come across as insulting, and as an attempt to undermine and belittle the position and view they hold, then I would suggest you re-evaluate the manner in which you approach this topic of conversation before you next post on it.
See what? It's text on a screen. You've no idea how "serious" people are taking things. Do you regularly discuss Gran Turismo with people in real life, face to face? I certainly don't. Yet here we are.
- 263
- Munich
- Hitokiri-666
PD alone has approx. 170 employee, than the (for us) unknown partner studios, other people who all have to be paid! There is a cost-price calculation and it surley would not work if the starting price is just at 40$ / € ! Later, (about 2 years) you can make a cash-cow price for GT7, but not at the start?!
Well, GT7 does NOT have unique races??? What about online races? And... GT-Sport did NOT had super expensive cars for 2O credits
- 13,865
- Adelaide
- Neomone
So people who are professionally attached to the game are allowed to take it seriously, but no one else? Interesting take. What other things are adults not allowed to take seriously? Toys? Sports? Food? Television and movies?
Please, spell out for all of us what exactly we're allowed to take seriously and what we're not. I wasn't even aware that there were rules.
This gets better and better. So you're insinuating that all the outrage is from kids, and that any adults who are also upset are because they've been influenced by children?
Pack it up folks, it turns out that the whole world is run by children. And no, not "children" as in politicians, actual children. Those short, noisy, poopy things.
How much can I buy London for? I already bought a bridge there, but I'd like to own the whole thing.
Agree! Amazing game!The amount of negative over-reacting for an obviously unfinished and half-baked game is astounding.
It is a game that should have come out months later, that's the main thing. Gotta have patience and wait for updates. Now in its current state its already quite good but it will end up being a really amazing game I'm sure.
But.....
ATTENTION.......POLYPHONY DIGITAL
ATTENTION.......POLYPHONY DIGITAL
PLEASE, PLEASE, PLEASE
INCLUDE MORE RACES IN SPORT MODE
FOR THE NEXT UPDATE..........PLEASE!
8-10 different races changed weekly
Different cars for different tracks
Tyre and fuel usage is good
Longer races for people who don't mind that
Daytona Oval - 30+ cars 20+ laps
THIS WILL BE A START TO A TRULY AMAZING ONLINE RACING EXPERIENCE
Its by far the at least necessary topic of the whole game!! When did London get sold as a complete finished City? It's not a good comparison.
There is SO much about the game that could evolve.
License tests are, essentially, identical in their format to GT1-6. They've never changed. They could be expanded into an ACTUAL racing school with a virtual assistant giving you live feedback as you drive and race. Give out license tests for repeated proficiency and experience, not going round 3 corners in 25 seconds after 56 attempts.
The career format has infinite possibilities for expansion and change. You could make it more like a linear motorsport career like Project CARS 2 building up through the ranks or you could throw in some management and progression elements that are found in modern F1 titles. You could attract sponsors, take manufacturer drives like you do online, you could build up affinities, etc etc.
The used car dealership, other than being online now, is the exact same basic format as every other game. It's not realistic to the modern world of buying used cars where millions of options are at your fingertips. So much they could do there with virtual showrooms, mimic online directories, thousands of little variations of cars available. They could have auctions (game powered, not sold by other players), so many fun ideas.
Yes, when it comes to the track every racing game is the same, it's cars on a track that you drive around and try to finish as best you can. What you wrap around that however can be so many things, and the difference between keeping people interested in opening those races or not.
- 263
- Munich
- Hitokiri-666
Well it is, because parts of London (houses, appartments) would be less worth, if the whole infrastrukture wouldn't be maintained and added. And these parts will be sold. But take it even just for a house. When is a house finished?? There is moment when you get the keys for a new build house, but this status won't last for ever! You will improve it from time to time and you will get new parts (heating, floors etc).
Not really relevant. When you buy a house (or anything) you expect to get what you paid for, it's that simple. What you do afterwards to it is up to you, but if you buy a house on the advertisement of it having all mod-cons, connected water/gas, internet connection or whatever, that is what you expect to receive.
In terms of Gran Turismo, we were promised the "most complete GT game to date". We were promised a return to the quality and quantity of the old games.
We were never once promised a work-in-progress. We were not sold a game as a service. We were not told the game would take months to finish.
Nothing wrong with PD improving the game even further beyond what was initially promised, but that's not the case here. They're just adding the rest of the game they sold us on.
- 4,867
- Kentucky
- barrett5
- BarrettMopar
I didn't see this thread until now because I've went back to playing Forza Horizon 5. Anyway, I have gradually lost faith in PD since GT6 which was only a small change from GT5 and had quite bad online servers. It was also the first GT game with microtransactions, yet somehow the series just went downhill from there. GT Sport releasing with less than 200 cars and no career, the Sport Mode penalty system never being good, ending GT6 online without letting players preserve created tracks, the FIA world finals always seeming to have the cars of the official sponsors be overpowered. Then GT7 released with many glitches and being built around Macrotransactions, lower the event winnings, screw up fixing most of the glitches causing the online only game to be almost unplayable for over a day, finally giving an "apology" that made even more people mad and in return revert payouts back to where they were and add endurance races with a presumed one time payout that we still don't have yet.
I still have faith that PD can at least make new games and keep the current game relevant enough to keep people playing and making content at a level where it is possible to get something positive from it. Watching videos, racing online, tuning, making liveries, improving lap times, creating stupid scenarios with custom races, whatever, but I don't have much faith that PD can make a great game anymore.
Gran Turismo is becoming like Madden or NBA 2K where it is most relevant because it is bad. Most content for the latter consists of no money spent where the goal is to prevent buying the predatory and overpriced Macrotransactions and/or raging at how bad the game and/or other players are (like Ishowspeed who is becoming one of the fastest growing content creators ever because of raging on 2K originally). I'm sure a lot of people have noticed that GT7 gets the most attention when people talk about how bad it is and/or how dirty other players drive, and I think PD is noticing as well.
It is an old saying that people will act towards you how you act to them and it has been seen as true with Madden and 2K. Borderline illegal pay to win mechanics were added, the spokesperson gives a scripted and vague apology, former fans boycott and review bomb, content creators make as much out of the situation as possible, more people see this, the company notices the attention and does everything possible to profit which includes making all games from then on bad to continue the snowball effect of rage (fan rage, content creators make videos, more people know of the situation and rage, repeat). Making an average game wouldn't make any interest for it and making a good game is expensive, but making a game with enough slightly tweaked content that people will continue to buy Macrotransactions throughout its lifespan just to experience what the content creators have been complaining about is easy, so easy that other companies are starting to copy the formula...
To be fair, I don't think PD can get away with releasing a game on such low levels as Madden or NBA 2K because they are tied to sports organizations with massive appeal, so some people will always buy the Macrotransactions just to get their favorite players, but at best the FIA doesn't have this appeal for GT and right now the FIA doesn't seem to be involved at all.
In summary, PD has gotten their community to act in the way that has made other companies billions, by making their game toxic and controversial, but I feel that we as a community over time will not let the company profit like this from us, but for now I still don't have faith that the company will truly listen to us.
I still have faith that PD can at least make new games and keep the current game relevant enough to keep people playing and making content at a level where it is possible to get something positive from it. Watching videos, racing online, tuning, making liveries, improving lap times, creating stupid scenarios with custom races, whatever, but I don't have much faith that PD can make a great game anymore.
Gran Turismo is becoming like Madden or NBA 2K where it is most relevant because it is bad. Most content for the latter consists of no money spent where the goal is to prevent buying the predatory and overpriced Macrotransactions and/or raging at how bad the game and/or other players are (like Ishowspeed who is becoming one of the fastest growing content creators ever because of raging on 2K originally). I'm sure a lot of people have noticed that GT7 gets the most attention when people talk about how bad it is and/or how dirty other players drive, and I think PD is noticing as well.
It is an old saying that people will act towards you how you act to them and it has been seen as true with Madden and 2K. Borderline illegal pay to win mechanics were added, the spokesperson gives a scripted and vague apology, former fans boycott and review bomb, content creators make as much out of the situation as possible, more people see this, the company notices the attention and does everything possible to profit which includes making all games from then on bad to continue the snowball effect of rage (fan rage, content creators make videos, more people know of the situation and rage, repeat). Making an average game wouldn't make any interest for it and making a good game is expensive, but making a game with enough slightly tweaked content that people will continue to buy Macrotransactions throughout its lifespan just to experience what the content creators have been complaining about is easy, so easy that other companies are starting to copy the formula...
To be fair, I don't think PD can get away with releasing a game on such low levels as Madden or NBA 2K because they are tied to sports organizations with massive appeal, so some people will always buy the Macrotransactions just to get their favorite players, but at best the FIA doesn't have this appeal for GT and right now the FIA doesn't seem to be involved at all.
In summary, PD has gotten their community to act in the way that has made other companies billions, by making their game toxic and controversial, but I feel that we as a community over time will not let the company profit like this from us, but for now I still don't have faith that the company will truly listen to us.
- 263
- Munich
- Hitokiri-666
I am not sure if GT6 had the track logger, were you can see time of acceleration, gear, braking etc. Futhermore, sure a kind of a driving analyse of your track performance would be interesting, but I have no idea how complex that would be to integrate.
A race-team mode, where you handel a your own team, with making new driver contracts (one or none steered by your avatar), sponsor contracts etc. would be cool! Maybe also some "dramatic" story twists like you re second driver will have a severe crash and dies or be in hospital for some months and you suddenly have to look for a new talent to give him the chance to drive in the (ingame) league for points... I hope PD will bring this kind of a carrer/story mode in GT. But he honest... people cry always for new content, but dare (as a studio) not to deliver content that fans relate on for "decades" and will cry even louder if this parts won't be in the new game.
Well is GT a racing simulator or a used car simulator?? I don't see the benefit of having "millions" of options for all cars. You might care if the seats of your Honda Jazz are red or grey, or fabric or leather, or if you have a park-distance-controll..., I don't care, I most likely will drive that Honda Jazz the 2-3 times I need it for a menu book, and than never again.
Like what...?
Well personally I just want them to keep trying new things, even If I don't like them. I don't like online gaming, never will, so GTS was pretty limited for me. I still commend PD for trying something new. The Cafe idea in GT7 was decent, and could be worked into something even better over time. I just didn't expect that to be all that was on offer for single player content.
You don't get anywhere without even trying, even if you fail sometimes.
Weird argument. Is GT a photography simulator? The game offers a lot more than just driving/racing, always has. So if you're going to include these functions, why not change them up every once in a while? OK literally millions might have been an exaggeration but right now GT7 offers every player the same 15 cars for sale every day. Not very interesting, nor realistic.
Buying a used car is not ever going to be massively fun, engaging gameplay but you can for sure make it more interesting than what they've offered in every game so far.
Er, like the things I mentioned for a start?
- 1,390
- <--- This place
- CHALLENGER1ON1
Yeah this whole rollout of Gran Turismo 7 felt like a gut punch, and I don't really have the enthusiasm for the game like I thought I would.
I'm not going to pretend that the game is bad, because it really isn't. It's a beautiful game and honestly barring GT4, it's one of the best Gran Turismo titles to date. I'm sure the game will get better as time goes on thanks to the updates.
But why? Why introduce completely predatory videogame industry practices in a franchise as storied as Gran Turismo, from a studio as beloved as Polyphony Digital? Yeah you could purchase credits in Gran Turismo 6 and Sport, but lowering the race payouts in GT7 across the board to comically low amounts and making seemingly normal cars cost ridiculous amounts doesn't feel "real" at all.
I want to give PD the benefit of the doubt and say that maybe Sony had a hand in all of this. But this is just unfounded conspiracy-crafting at best and I really don't want to demonize PD anymore than what they deserve. But man...it sucks.
I'm not going to pretend that the game is bad, because it really isn't. It's a beautiful game and honestly barring GT4, it's one of the best Gran Turismo titles to date. I'm sure the game will get better as time goes on thanks to the updates.
But why? Why introduce completely predatory videogame industry practices in a franchise as storied as Gran Turismo, from a studio as beloved as Polyphony Digital? Yeah you could purchase credits in Gran Turismo 6 and Sport, but lowering the race payouts in GT7 across the board to comically low amounts and making seemingly normal cars cost ridiculous amounts doesn't feel "real" at all.
I want to give PD the benefit of the doubt and say that maybe Sony had a hand in all of this. But this is just unfounded conspiracy-crafting at best and I really don't want to demonize PD anymore than what they deserve. But man...it sucks.
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- 717
- Pennsyltucky
- mellofello9
Didn't read all ten pages, so not sure if it was mentioned before or not but this is EXACTLY why I've nixed the whole 'early adopter' approach. This is not to disparage anyone who is, don't get me wrong, it's a personal thing. Also, I'm a casual racer, so the wait is worth it.
I got into GTS late, well after all of the bugs-n-bitchin days. So, my experience in GTSport has been pretty freakin' amazing. It was the first version I came back to after GT1 - 3, never touched 4 - 6. Point is, and for me, that launch day/early adopter experience would have tarnished the rest of my time in the game.
Being with GT from the start, they will never completely lose my support. Through the iterations over the years there's high and lowlights, just like most things....I mean, Ford made it out of the dark days of the Mustang II and that was FAR worse than anything PD has on offer.
I got into GTS late, well after all of the bugs-n-bitchin days. So, my experience in GTSport has been pretty freakin' amazing. It was the first version I came back to after GT1 - 3, never touched 4 - 6. Point is, and for me, that launch day/early adopter experience would have tarnished the rest of my time in the game.
Being with GT from the start, they will never completely lose my support. Through the iterations over the years there's high and lowlights, just like most things....I mean, Ford made it out of the dark days of the Mustang II and that was FAR worse than anything PD has on offer.
- 1,701
- UK
Custom races pay poorly,so no incentive really,we need credits to buy the cars we WANT or had that slipped your mind.Like I said,keep flogging it mate.
As for your comment about Driveclub being unplayable because its 30fps thats just a stupid thing to say.Playable then and still playable today.
- 284
- London
- azzabry86
DriveClub, such an underrated masterpiece and proof 30 fps isn't the be all and end all of racing games. Not perfect at launch admittedly, but even the vanilla campaign experience was still rewarding. Awesome tracks and superb dynamic weather and time of day.
Judging by @Magog's logic, Ridge Racer Type 4 would be absolute garbage, which is funny considering it's widely regarded as one of the greatest racing games of all time. Heck even GT6 had some serious frame rate issues.
- 1,701
- UK
Once someone's mind is set on an opinion you in never change that unfortunately.
Regarding Driveclub,it's one of those games you think "ll have a quick session for 20 mins'and still be on it 4 hrs later.If there were a ps5 upgrade it would be great.Maybe not a direct competitor to GT but as good all the same,loads of content races.
Regarding Driveclub,it's one of those games you think "ll have a quick session for 20 mins'and still be on it 4 hrs later.If there were a ps5 upgrade it would be great.Maybe not a direct competitor to GT but as good all the same,loads of content races.
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