Religion is contrived

  • Thread starter Danoff
  • 1,109 comments
  • 26,615 views
Tacet_Blue
Wow...the toys are out the pram now :lol:

Swift you claim to have a personal relationship with Jesus, but you don't seem very enlightened or gracious. You lose your temper quite quickly, not only here but in other threads.
Tell me again, what are the benefits of that personal relationship again ;)

...simply a scientist :lol: whereas you are? Simply a sheep.

The Lord is my Shepherd, he maketh me lay down to die,
He hangs me in high places and releases my soul with sharp steely knifes.

Oh no...that's lamb cutlets :lol:

JParker...ahem...man and the Ape share a common ancestor, but that's obviously way above your head and it's much easier to believe that we all came from Adam despite the obvious incest problems ;) Besides it should be in the evolution thread, not here...
Click to expand...

You make fun of the Holy scriptures and I'm supposed to be cool with it? When the money changers were in the Temple, Jesus was not cool with it. Grace is underserved love. I've talked about it in other threads as well. And I've displayed plenty of it. Though not in a way you would probably see as "love"

You say I've lost my temper? Perhaps, but I'm willing to bet that each time someone was going directly against or making fun of God's word. So, yeah, I'm going to get a bit heated over that just like everyone else seems to get heated at the notion that evolution is not true.

I'm very enlightened. But to a simple gospel. It doesn't take years of study to figure it out. I'm not downplaying education or the study of science and medicine. But that has zero to do with my faith. Jesus died on the cross to save me from sin and rose on the third day in victory. That's the simplicity of the gospel. It's been turned and twisted by many. But that's it. A very simple clean message.
 
Swift
You make fun of the Holy scriptures and I'm supposed to be cool with it? When the money changers were in the Temple, Jesus was not cool with it. Grace is underserved love. I've talked about it in other threads as well. And I've displayed plenty of it. Though not in a way you would probably see as "love"

You say I've lost my temper? Perhaps, but I'm willing to bet that each time someone was going directly against or making fun of God's word. So, yeah, I'm going to get a bit heated over that just like everyone else seems to get heated at the notion that evolution is not true.

I'm very enlightened. But to a simple gospel. It doesn't take years of study to figure it out. I'm not downplaying education or the study of science and medicine. But that has zero to do with my faith. Jesus died on the cross to save me from sin and rose on the third day in victory. That's the simplicity of the gospel. It's been turned and twisted by many. But that's it. A very simple clean message.
Click to expand...


every few pages or so u just dismiss whatever was said before u, re-state the jesus story, then it all starts all over again with the debate. "all i know is that jesus died on the cross", we know what u know, but what we know is different.
 
sicbeing
every few pages or so u just dismiss whatever was said before u, re-state the jesus story, then it all starts all over again with the debate. "all i know is that jesus died on the cross", we know what u know, but what we know is different.
Click to expand...

Yep, guess you're right. I forget that phrase that famine kept saying. But I know that it meant to not complicate things more then you have to. Amazing how that applies to what I just posted.
 
Swift
You make fun of the Holy scriptures and I'm supposed to be cool with it?
Click to expand...
Yes.
Swift
When the money changers were in the Temple, Jesus was not cool with it.
Click to expand...
I didn't know Jesus was ever Cool :cool: I thought it was a serious subject
Swift
You say I've lost my temper? Perhaps, but I'm willing to bet that each time someone was going directly against or making fun of God's word. So, yeah, I'm going to get a bit heated over that just like everyone else seems to get heated at the notion that evolution is not true.
Click to expand...
Hmmm...not very mature really.
Swift
I'm not downplaying education or the study of science and medicine.
Click to expand...
Yes you are...shall I quote you?
Swift
Jesus died on the cross to save me from sin and rose on the third day in victory. That's the simplicity of the gospel. It's been turned and twisted by many. But that's it. A very simple clean message.
Click to expand...
Twisted by many, but of course, not by you ;)

Learn to relax Swift, look back at your posts and ask yourself why you've had to apologise for so many things that you've said...think first...post later ;)
 
Tacet_Blue
Learn to relax Swift, look back at your posts and ask yourself why you've had to apologise for so many things that you've said...think first...post later ;)
Click to expand...

I remeber apologizing to scibeing for taking a stance on doctrine when this is clearly not the place for that.

Right, I'm not mature? A few pages ago I asked you what you would like to discuss. You had no reply until you posted about something I said to Famine. Why no questions or even statements on that?
 
ledhed
I only included Christianity since most of the pot-shots are being taken at it. But yes your are correct, scientific explanations do "try" to explain away many religions.
Sure both sides have been chastized by the other from the beginning.
Don't get me wrong I'm not one to shove something down someone's throat. But as I said in my 1st post just amazed.
I'm no saint. Not a member of a "denomination". I've attended many churches of different denominations and even one year of Methodist private school, when caught going to school out of district. At this Methodist school I had a young 20'ish year old teacher that taught a open minded study of religion. It taught me one thing about Christianity and denomination. The different denominations are basically groups of people with different understandings on the interpretation of the Bible. Some don't agree with portions of it, and simply don't teach that portion. Some in my opinion put way too much emphasis on the mother of the Christ. Some use objects to focus their prayer through. Some believe that if they are bitten by one of the snakes they are wielding and survise they are blessed by God. Other religions believe it is OK to kill in the name of their God.

So I'm just simply a believer in Christ, or a Christian if you will. I believe what the Bible has to say. Many Christian scientist include Christianity in their evolutional theories. Many of those make sense to me. The Bible was obviously rewritten at some point. The Old Testament reads like Cliff's notes, and it wasn't originally written in English. Not to mention that it has been rewritten in in my lifetime in modern English, to be so called, better understood. It isn't something to be taken literally, but spritually.
That's enough for now.

JParker
 
Swift
Right, I'm not mature? A few pages ago I asked you what you would like to discuss. You had no reply until you posted about something I said to Famine. Why no questions or even statements on that?
Click to expand...
I can't see what that has to do with maturity
...but to answer your question

I have a life...my girlfriend doesn't like me spending too much time on my laptop ;)
 
JParker
If you want to be the decendant of an ape, be my guest.
Click to expand...

Again, wanting or desiring does not enter into it. Science is not conducted with preconceived ideas or wishes.

Swift
You make fun of the Holy scriptures and I'm supposed to be cool with it?
Click to expand...

Matthew 5:39
But I say unto you, That ye resist not evil: but whosoever shall smite thee on thy right cheek, turn to him the other also.
Click to expand...
 
skicrush
Well, it IS rather extraordinary that those hallucinations panned out just like they wrote them down several hundred years later.
Click to expand...
I would dearly love to hear about some of these, at length, from a source outside the Bible itself. Please do elaborate, I'm all attention.
 
Tacet_Blue
I can't see what that has to do with maturity
...but to answer your question

I have a life...my girlfriend doesn't like me spending too much time on my laptop ;)
Click to expand...

Wow, that was a trip. You trivialize that time spent on the internet by making your life sound important. I agree, this is not the end all and be all of existence. However, you're here and here quite often. So you just try to get on when your girlfriend's not around?

I have a fiancée. When I get online I get online. Granted, she's the more important player, but as a mod I have to be online for a decent amount of time a day to take care of the things that are my responsibility.

So, if you really have a life....why do you spend so much time here?


Famine: No, don't use scripture on my conduct. You will NOT let me use it to justify anything else, so why should I let you use something that you don't believe in to govern my actions? As you've told me. Find another way, besides a self fulfilling prophecy, to critique me.
 
Swift
So, if you really have a life....why do you spend so much time here?
Click to expand...
Yep I'm pretty sure I have a life...and without straying to much further from the thread...

Tacet_Blue
Member Since: Jun 01 2004
PostsTotal Posts: 1,029 (2.98 posts per day)

It may seem like I'm here a lot but it doesn't take long to make three posts a day ;)
 
Famine
Again, wanting or desiring does not enter into it. Science is not conducted with preconceived ideas or wishes.
Click to expand...

Uh, then I'm really confused as to what a hypothesis is.:dunce:
 
Swift
Famine: No, don't use scripture on my conduct. You will NOT let me use it to justify anything else, so why should I let you use something that you don't believe in to govern my actions? As you've told me. Find another way, besides a self fullfilling prophecy, to critique me.
Click to expand...

Sauce for the good, Swift.

You believe in "Holy Scripture" wholeheartedly, yet trample on it when someone upsets you by simply questioning it. You either live by it or you don't - or you live by select parts of it (which is as bad as being a vegetarian because you "don't like the taste"). If you live by it, Matthew says you're not allowed to throw a hissy-fit. If you don't, what's the point of your contribution in this thread? If you live by bits of it, how do you decide which bits are worthy of it and which bits aren't.

Whether or not I believe in it is irrelevant. Could you abandon the KJV Ten Commandments if an unbeliever upset you?

Swift
Uh, then I'm really confused as to what a hypothesis is/
Click to expand...

I've noticed.
 
Famine
I've noticed.
Click to expand...

And that's exaclty what I'm talking about. A time when your technical knowledge could really help. You just thow a one liner in. It must be hard beeing that smart.
 
Well, I've tried to explain it to you several times. I don't know, maybe my delivery is off or something.


It isn't hard being smart - especially with all the money and sex I get from it. All you have to do is stop believing in fairy tales, that paintings must have painters and everything happens because the Keebler Elves made it happen. Then, once you're receptive to new ideas, you can develop an understanding of how things work.
 
Topic is:

Religion is contrived.

After much thought and consideration I have come to an interesting thought. Religion (in general terms) is contrived. Throughout the centuries it has been used as a means of control and of governmental power. The profound, spiritual message of Christ has been manipulated for personal gains in these examples. The legalistic institution of religion finds itself subject to all the corruptions that we as sinners have managed to indulge ourselves in. These practices, however, greatly differ from the practices of Christ’s examples and teachings. These religious crusades of “Submit or Die” is so disassociated from the church that Christ intended that it’s a real shame that they are still so closely tied together. The church was never designed to be a harbor of deceit and money collections or places of power and mind control, but rather a collection of Christ followers who’s fellowship together was to bring praise to God and to continue to grow spiritually as prescribed by Jesus’ message as described by Paul in his letter to the Galatians.

In short, religion bad. Christ’s message/promise good.

People ask if I’m a Christian, I prefer to be called a Christ follower.
 
Pako
Religion (in general terms) is contrived. Throughout the centuries it has been used as a means of control and of governmental power.
Click to expand...

Yep. As I said earlier, the roots of the word stem from the Latin "religio" (Taboo, Restrain) and "Re ligare" (To return to bondage/slavery).
 
Famine
If you live by bits of it, how do you decide which bits are worthy of it and which bits aren't.
Click to expand...
That was my point when talking about denominations. The denomination determines which "Bits" are worthy. Which doesn't necessarily mean that because you are a member of a particular denomination that you have to leave out or add in those "bits" that are or are not "worthy".
 
Pako
Topic is:

Religion is contrived.

After much thought and consideration I have come to an interesting thought. Religion (in general terms) is contrived. Throughout the centuries it has been used as a means of control and of governmental power. The profound, spiritual message of Christ has been manipulated for personal gains in these examples. The legalistic institution of religion finds itself subject to all the corruptions that we as sinners have managed to indulge ourselves in. These practices, however, greatly differ from the practices of Christ’s examples and teachings. These religious crusades of “Submit or Die” is so disassociated from the church that Christ intended that it’s a real shame that they are still so closely tied together. The church was never designed to be a harbor of deceit and money collections or places of power and mind control, but rather a collection of Christ followers who’s fellowship together was to bring praise to God and to continue to grow spiritually as prescribed by Jesus’ message as described by Paul in his letter to the Galatians.

In short, religion bad. Christ’s message/promise good.

People ask if I’m a Christian, I prefer to be called a Christ follower.
Click to expand...
Very well put.
 
JParker
I find it absolutely amazing that someone could partake in the wonders of this life, good and bad, and actually think it all happened by accident.
Click to expand...
Why? I love life. I love my place in it. I'm literally grateful every day that I've had the opportunity to be alive.

That doesn't mean I need some kind of Very Big Dad to be grateful to for giving me my allowance. I've got no problem with the idea that the universe is very, very big and very, very old, and that the odds of something like life occurring are very very large indeed.
Something exploded and millions of years later we have mankind, which by the way, is a decendant of a monkey.
Click to expand...
Creationists get hung up on the supposedly impossible odds of the world existing by chance. What they are confusing is the chance of life existing precisely as we know it with the chances of life existing at all. Ignoring that the chance of life existing as we know it is actually 1, it is true that the odds of life being precisely this way are quite small. But what they miss is the fact that this is only one way out of nearly infinite possible ways for life to exist. Even ignoring our existence, the odds of life appearing in some form approach 1 anyway.
If we are decendants of monkeys, why are there still monkeys?
Click to expand...
Because you've been taught a mistaken premise by your creationist teachers. This premise does not invalidate evolution; the premise invalidates itself.

Mankind is not descended from monkeys. That's why there are still monkeys. Man and the primates are descended from a long series of common ancestors, which - surprise! - are extinct because they failed to adapt to their environments as well as either humans or monkeys did.
May God have mercy on us all.
Click to expand...
May your God have mercy on you. I neither need nor want your God's mercy.
 
Pako
Topic is:

Religion is contrived.

After much thought and consideration I have come to an interesting thought. Religion (in general terms) is contrived. Throughout the centuries it has been used as a means of control and of governmental power. The profound, spiritual message of Christ has been manipulated for personal gains in these examples. The legalistic institution of religion finds itself subject to all the corruptions that we as sinners have managed to indulge ourselves in. These practices, however, greatly differ from the practices of Christ’s examples and teachings. These religious crusades of “Submit or Die” is so disassociated from the church that Christ intended that it’s a real shame that they are still so closely tied together. The church was never designed to be a harbor of deceit and money collections or places of power and mind control, but rather a collection of Christ followers who’s fellowship together was to bring praise to God and to continue to grow spiritually as prescribed by Jesus’ message as described by Paul in his letter to the Galatians.

In short, religion bad. Christ’s message/promise good.

People ask if I’m a Christian, I prefer to be called a Christ follower.
Click to expand...


No argument here. I don't like the fact that Christian's have such a bad name due to what you sited.

But I said a very similar statement way back somewhere. Glad it was said again. :)
 
Swift
Uh, then I'm really confused as to what a hypothesis is.:dunce:
Click to expand...
Hypothesis: A tentative explanation for an observation, phenomenon, or scientific problem that can be tested by further investigation. [emphasis mine]
 
Duke
Hypothesis: A tentative explanation for an observation, phenomenon, or scientific problem that can be tested by further investigation. [emphasis mine]
Click to expand...

Right, so its an expected turnout out but they won't know until they run the experiment. Right?

Edit:

Famine
Well, I've tried to explain it to you several times. I don't know, maybe my delivery is off or something.


It isn't hard being smart - especially with all the money and sex I get from it. All you have to do is stop believing in fairy tales, that paintings must have painters and everything happens because the Keebler Elves made it happen. Then, once you're receptive to new ideas, you can develop an understanding of how things work.
Click to expand...

And that is so mature that it's scary.
 
Expected has certain connotations; I'd say "probable" instead, but that's splitting hairs. The point is that it's NOT considered a FACT and it is contingent upon TESTING.

[edit]

JParker
Which doesn't necessarily mean that because you are a member of a particular denomination that you have to leave out or add in those "bits" that are or are not "worthy".
Click to expand...
As an aside, this perfectly explains why Brian tried so hard to tell us Libertarians exactly what we believed. He couldn't conceive of being able to accept part of a party's position without accepting all of it. But I don't mean to take this off-topic.
 
Duke
Expected has certain connotations; I'd say "probable" instead, but that's splitting hairs. The point is that it's NOT considered a FACT and it is contingent upon TESTING.
Click to expand...

Ok, Then this statement should be slightly ammended then.

Again, wanting or desiring does not enter into it. Science is not conducted with preconceived ideas or wishes.
Click to expand...

Edit: Because there is a preconceived idea before the testing. If there wasn't, why do the testing? That's all I'm saying.
 
Swift
Ok, Then this statement should be slightly ammended then.
Click to expand...
No, not really. Certainly there is an idea in place in the hypothesis or else there's no point in conducting an experiment. The point of Famine's statement is that scientists do not let what they want to believe color the actual results.

If they do, then they are not good scientists, just like spiritual people always claim that capital-R Religion is not good religion (see Pako's post above, which many of you affirmed).

You think the guys who thought they discovered desktop fusion didn't WANT to believe it worked? Sure they did. But when the results didn't agree, they changed their hypothesis. That's the crucial difference.
 
Duke
No, not really. Certainly there is an idea in place in the hypothesis or else there's no point in conducting an experiment. The point of Famine's statement is that scientists do not let what they want to believe color the actual results.

If they do, then they are not good scientists, just like spiritual people always claim that capital-R Religion is not good religion (see Pako's post above, which many of you affirmed).

You think the guys who thought they discovered desktop fusion didn't WANT to believe it worked? Sure they did. But when the results didn't agree, they changed their hypothesis. That's the crucial difference.
Click to expand...

Well, why would you change the hypothesis? You can just say we were wrong and it turned out this way....

I did it all the time in science classes in high school and college all the time. Now, maybe I missed it in one of famine's many exlpainations of the scientific method. But wouldn't that make more sense?
 
Correct me if I'm wrong, but they didn't change their hypothesis. Their hypothesis simply didn't hold true, and they had to try another one. I"m pretty sure it goes:
Hypothesis
Test
Results (which either confirm the hypothesis or disprove it.)

If it is disproved, or gives you new ideas for your next hypothesis, you start again. And then you see if THAT one worked.
 
Swift
No argument here. I don't like the fact that Christian's have such a bad name due to what you sited.

But I said a very similar statement way back somewhere. Glad it was said again. :)
Click to expand...


👍


I think I have also said that before as well. I just found myself defending "religion" when in fact what I thought I was defending was Christ. HUGE difference there, and in light of that subject...I need to make sure that it is a understood difference not meant to confuse anyone.

:)
 

Similar threads

Z
Trying to put together my first rig. Mid price - pay once, cry once. Have questions.
Replies
3
Views
935
dcmo3
D
GlamFM
GT4 is out on PS4
Replies
8
Views
5K
aaron0288
aaron0288
Andy Lapi
Sportmanship visibility is necessary
Replies
0
Views
590
Andy Lapi
Andy Lapi
unfairlane
Trouble beating the unbeatables?
Replies
7
Views
2K
unfairlane
unfairlane
Andy Lapi
Lobby we need to know if quali/race has started
Replies
1
Views
674
mattikake
M

Latest Posts

Back