The 2012 Driver transfer discussion/speculation thread

F1 fan · Jul 14, 2011

Really? It's only July. However, I feel that there is much to discuss on this subject and it has been spilling into other threads.

The aim of this thread, is to give us a specific place to discuss who will be going where and also who will be staying at their current teams. There has been a lot of discussion recently about whether the likes of Nico Hulkenberg, Romain Grosjean and Bruno Senna will get another chance at F1. There is also the debate about whether or not Massa will stay at Ferrari. Ferrari have announced that Sergio Perez and Jules Bianchi will test the Ferrari F60 at Mugello or Fiorano later this year.

Who will retire? Who will return to F1, will any rookies debut?

Edit: Thread closed The latest thread can be found here.

MagpieRacer · Jul 14, 2011

Perez to Ferrari!

Brend · Jul 14, 2011

I think Di Resta will get a move to Mercedes, just got a hunch that Nico will leave and open the door. However, he has said that he wants to stay loyal to Force India. (Di Resta)

F1 fan · Jul 14, 2011

Chariots0fFire
I think Di Resta will get a move to Mercedes, just got a hunch that Nico will leave and open the door. However, he has said that he wants to stay loyal to Force India. (Di Resta)

Where will Nico go? I don't think he's going to leave Mercedes unless Red Bull, Ferrari or Mclaren make him an offer.

MildAshers
Perez to Ferrari!

I know Perez has done well and is a part of Ferrari's young driver program, but I'd rather see Kobayashi be given the nod by the scuderia.

astrosdude91 · Jul 14, 2011

I was just contemplating starting this very thread minutes ago.

Plenty of speculation surrounding much of the field. Raikkonen rumored to replace Webber; Adrian Sutil talking about moving to NASCAR if he gets the boot from Force India, which looks pretty likely since he's been under-performing. And Lewis Hamilton rumors which might see him going to Red Bull or Ferrari.

That's all I can think of off the top of my head.

As far as retirements go, Trulli is the only one I can think of that would be on the way out at the end of the season.

F1 fan · Jul 14, 2011

astrosdude91
I was just contemplating starting this very thread minutes ago.

Plenty of speculation surrounding much of the field. Raikkonen rumored to replace Webber; Adrian Sutil talking about moving to NASCAR if he gets the boot from Force India, which looks pretty likely since he's been under-performing. And Lewis Hamilton rumors which might see him going to Red Bull or Ferrari.

That's all I can think of off the top of my head.

As far as retirements go, Trulli is the only one I can think of that would be on the way out at the end of the season.

I've been contemplating it for weeks now. I doubt Sutil would go to Nascar, but it would leave the Force India space nicely occupied for Nico Hulkenberg. He may be getting out performed in qualifying, but thanks to a little luck (Di Resta's bad luck that is), he's ahead in points. Lewis at Ferrari? No chance. That will be veto'd very quickly.

Ardius · Jul 14, 2011

The market could go many ways, unfortunately, the most likely one currently is not much change at all.
The only drivers with worry on seats are:
Webber
Massa
Schumacher
Heidfeld
Sutil
Trulli
Alguesuari/Buemi

Webber is now looking likely to sign again with Red Bull.
Massa already is contracted for 2012 and isn't doing so bad that he deserves the sack - Ferrari need to worry about making a more competitive car first.
Schumacher and Mercedes seem happy at the moment despite his continued disappointing performances.
Heidfeld is only on a race-by-race contract and isn't exciting anyone again..he was only ever hired as a stand in for Kubica though now Grosjean is looking a better stand-in to try.
Sutil surely must want a better seat now but can only really look to Renault which isn't much of a step up currently.
Trulli is struggling at Lotus though he is still racing just as good as ever, I don't really get the vibes of retirement just yet but you never know. I'm not sure he's happy to sit around for the number of seasons it will take Lotus to get to the front of the grid. I think he will be in for 2012.
Alguesuari surely has to be the weaker of the two STR drivers, so presumably Ricciardo will be in.

Other than that, everyone else seems pretty happy where they are currently or don't have many realistic options. The only way the market was really going to move was if Webber or Massa left their teams. And that now looks unlikely.

F1 fan · Jul 14, 2011

Alguersuari is currently ahead of Buemi in the standings. It's only one point, but still. I think there's little between the two of them.

SaberFire · Jul 14, 2011

If Kubica hasn't recovered by 2012, then Heidfeld is their best bet. At the very least, he's very dependable. Renault simply haven't got anyone with enough experience for the main seat.

Perez to Ferrari? Very likely, depending on what happens to Massa. I also would like to see Kobayashi in a Ferrari or another top team, but I don't think his sponsors are rich enough.

Ardius · Jul 14, 2011

Why would Kobayashi need sponsors for a top team? Kobayashi just needs to show some podium promise and he's done enough to warrant a chance.

None of the top drivers have sponsor backing, its kind of the point. The problem with the top teams is a seat being open in the first place - currently all of them are fairly happy with their current drivers.

Perez is only likely in a couple of seasons, 2012 is far too soon to promote him. Although the same was said of Massa in 2005, so what do we know.

SaberFire · Jul 14, 2011

Perez has major oil backing, though; that's the sort of thing that would push him past Kobayashi. Money is money, after all, Ferrari or HRT :sly:

. If you look at both drivers and play their strengths against each other, Perez is great at keeping the tyres alive and staying out of trouble, whist Kamui is very good at overtaking. However, Kamui is a bit of a risk-factor, and in my opinion, Ferrari could probably market Perez easier, and be less scared of him smashing a car into pieces.

Just my opinion, though. I'd love for Koba to have a top seat, but I think Perez is gonna get one before him.

Although the idea of Kobayashi in a Ferrari at the Japanese Grand Prix... that would be something :dopey:

F1 fan · Jul 14, 2011

SaberFire
Although the idea of Kobayashi in a Ferrari at the Japanese Grand Prix... that would be something

That would be something.

SaberFire
However, Kamui is a bit of a risk-factor, and in my opinion, Ferrari could probably market Perez easier, and be less scared of him smashing a car into pieces.

Actually, this season Kobayashi has shown a lot of maturity and knows when to back down. Perez has rather clumsily smashed into a few people he's tried to overtake. Both are supreme talents, but right now, Kobayashi deserves it more.

SaberFire
Just my opinion, though. I'd love for Koba to have a top seat, but I think Perez is gonna get one before him.

I'm afraid you're almost certainly correct.

MagpieRacer · Jul 14, 2011

I reckon if we beleive the rumours we have heard in the past year we could get something like this:

Ferrari:
Sebastien Vettel
Sergio Perez/Vitaly Petrov

Red Bull:
Lewis Hamilton
Mark Webber

McLaren:
Fernando Alonso
Jenson Button

Lotus Renault:
Robert Kubica
Kamui Kobayashi/Vitaly Petrov

*Note, its based on a few rumours, old and new with the affected drivers moved to where I think they would go if this happened.

Brend · Jul 14, 2011

F1 Fan, I think Nico would replace Massa at Ferrari, a bit of a stretch but I don't see Massa staying favorable for much longer...

Alex. · Jul 14, 2011

If that happens I'll eat my own head. Why would Vettel abandon the best car?

Alonso not at Ferrari ( :lol:

) But at MCLAREN?! :lol:

MagpieRacer · Jul 14, 2011

Alex.
If that happens I'll eat my own head. Why would Vettel abandon the best car?

Alonso not at Ferrari () But at MCLAREN?!

Doesnt hurt to have a wild guess

Ardius · Jul 14, 2011

SaberFire
Perez has major oil backing, though; that's the sort of thing that would push him past Kobayashi. Money is money, after all, Ferrari or HRT . If you look at both drivers and play their strengths against each other, Perez is great at keeping the tyres alive and staying out of trouble, whist Kamui is very good at overtaking. However, Kamui is a bit of a risk-factor, and in my opinion, Ferrari could probably market Perez easier, and be less scared of him smashing a car into pieces.

Just my opinion, though. I'd love for Koba to have a top seat, but I think Perez is gonna get one before him.

Although the idea of Kobayashi in a Ferrari at the Japanese Grand Prix... that would be something

I don't see Kobayashi as that risky, people are still painting Kamui as a "banzai crashy Japanese driver" when he has very rarely actually taken anyone out of a race. Sure, his overtakes are quite extreme but usually successful, no more "risky" than say Hamilton or Webbers. Kobayashi has shown he can overtake, he can run different strategies, he can look after his tyres, he can finish in the points consistently and has shown a good deal of potential for improvement. The most impressive thing about Kobayashi is that he can run long into a race with the same tyres and still put in competitive laptimes (this is both in 2010 and 2011).
Like I said, all Kobayashi needs to do now is get into a car which is a potential podium contender and hit some podiums and mix it a bit more at the front, then he is all set for a top seat.

Sure Perez' Telmex money is handy, but its not necessary for a seat at Ferrari - its not like they need the money so much that they would never even give Kobayashi or Button or anyone else a second look. Ferrari will attempt to secure the best driver pairing for the team, even if it means paying both drivers quite a sizable salary.

The real reason Perez has a chance at Ferrari is because he is a product of the Ferrari Academy and its very obviously good for the Academy's image that Perez gets the seat. Perez still has a lot to prove though and he certainly can't buy his way into Ferrari.
Lets also not forget that another Ferrari Academy driver, Jules Bianchi, is not far behind Perez and Bianchi is managed by Nicolas Todt, who also manages Massa.

F1 fan · Jul 14, 2011

MildAshers
I reckon if we beleive the rumours we have heard in the past year we could get something like this:

Ferrari:
Sebastien Vettel
Sergio Perez/Vitaly Petrov

Red Bull:
Lewis Hamilton
Mark Webber

McLaren:
Fernando Alonso
Jenson Button

Lotus Renault:
Robert Kubica
Kamui Kobayashi/Vitaly Petrov

*Note, its based on a few rumours, old and new with the affected drivers moved to where I think they would go if this happened.

Rumours or not, some of them are ridiculous. Alonso to Mclaren? Reminds me of when the announcement that Fernando was going to Ferrari took so long, some people starting speculating he would go to Mclaren.

Furinkazen · Jul 14, 2011

I see Hamilton to Red Bull, and Webber to Mclaren. Webber won't like being anything more than Vettel's rear gunner, and Hamilton said that Mclaren's PR demands are getting too much...

AlphaAndius · Jul 14, 2011

MrMulsanne
I see Hamilton to Red Bull, and Webber to Mclaren. Webber won't like being anything more than Vettel's rear gunner, and Hamilton said that Mclaren's PR demands are getting too much...

That would make an interesting trade. Still, Hamilton and Vettel as teammates would be deadly, although if Vettel keeps up his performance, do you think Hamilton will tolerate playing second bananas?

therealEnzo · Jul 14, 2011

Hope that massa Will be replaced by either perez, koba or vettel. Massa lacks mentality and can't overtake. Would like to
See what vettel can do if Ferrari gives him a good car every single year. Maybe break schumachers records? Or would like to see koba as a world champion. That would be great

Mike Rotch · Jul 14, 2011

therealEnzo
Hope that massa Will be replaced by either perez, koba or vettel. Massa lacks mentality and can't overtake. Would like to
See what vettel can do if Ferrari gives him a good car every single year. Maybe break schumachers records? Or would like to see koba as a world champion. That would be great

I dont think this is the fantasy driver transfer thread.

I personally can't see any of Ferrari, McLaren, RBR or Merc changing their line-ups for next year. Renualt might ditch Heidfeld and or Petrov if they continue their unimpressive run and Kubica isnt back.

The biggest movement will be in the bit teams - Virgin, HRT, maybe STR, where paid drivers and racing academy products can get a look in.

therealEnzo · Jul 14, 2011

Mike Rotch
I dont think this is the fantasy driver transfer thread.

I personally can't see any of Ferrari, McLaren, RBR or Merc changing their line-ups for next year. Renualt might ditch Heidfeld and or Petrov if they continue their unimpressive run and Kubica isnt back.

The biggest movement will be in the bit teams - Virgin, HRT, maybe STR, where paid drivers and racing academy products can get a look in.

Agree that we won't see any big changes, red bull and McLaren don't need to. Ferrari however should replace massa to go for the constructors championship. They have always done well in that, but with massa they don't stand a chance

Peter. · Jul 14, 2011

astrosdude91
I was just contemplating starting this very thread minutes ago.

Plenty of speculation surrounding much of the field. Raikkonen rumored to replace Webber; Adrian Sutil talking about moving to NASCAR if he gets the boot from Force India, which looks pretty likely since he's been under-performing. And Lewis Hamilton rumors which might see him going to Red Bull or Ferrari.

That's all I can think of off the top of my head.

As far as retirements go, Trulli is the only one I can think of that would be on the way out at the end of the season.

Only thing you said I see possible is Raikkonen to Red Bull. Sutil is quite comfortably ahead of di Resta in points, and has only been losing to him in qualifying. Overall, Sutil is doing better than di Resta at the moment. And Lewis is not going anywhere. If he goes to Red Bull, he'll be number 2, which he really doesn't want, if he goes to Ferrari, same thing, besides, Felipe's confirmed for 2012, though they could buy him out of it.

As for Trulli, he might be demotivated if Kovy keeps outperforming him, and may just stick around for Lotus for 1 more year then retire, however, if he can equal or better Heikki, he'll probably stay for 2 more. Love to see Karun get a seat once more.

therealEnzo · Jul 15, 2011

Peter.
Only thing you said I see possible is Raikkonen to Red Bull. Sutil is quite comfortably ahead of di Resta in points, and has only been losing to him in qualifying. Overall, Sutil is doing better than di Resta at the moment. And Lewis is not going anywhere. If he goes to Red Bull, he'll be number 2, which he really doesn't want, if he goes to Ferrari, same thing, besides, Felipe's confirmed for 2012, though they could buy him out of it.

As for Trulli, he might be demotivated if Kovy keeps outperforming him, and may just stick around for Lotus for 1 more year then retire, however, if he can equal or better Heikki, he'll probably stay for 2 more. Love to see Karun get a seat once more.

Hope that trulli will retire soon. He hasn't performed a thing And only held up people. A young driver should get the chance instead of this old clown. Remember a race in silverstone when hè started 2nd and finished 9th. Really terrible driver.

Ardius · Jul 15, 2011

Peter.
As for Trulli, he might be demotivated if Kovy keeps outperforming him, and may just stick around for Lotus for 1 more year then retire, however, if he can equal or better Heikki, he'll probably stay for 2 more. Love to see Karun get a seat once more.

therealEnzo
Hope that trulli will retire soon. He hasn't performed a thing And only held up people. A young driver should get the chance instead of this old clown. Remember a race in silverstone when hè started 2nd and finished 9th. Really terrible driver.

Qualy - Trulli score against Kovy = 1 - 9
Race - Trulli score against Kovy (where both finished) = 2 - 2

Outperformed? Old Clown? Terrible Driver?

Trulli has genuine issues with the power steering at Lotus, even Kovy has admitted they are real issues. But this has only affected Trulli's qualifying form, his race pace is actually better than it ever was!

Trulli is the one with two 13th place finishes and is matching Kovalainen in all sessions. Even if he isn't qualifying ahead, he is not usually far off. When they finally solve his power steering issues, I think its fair to assume he will be qualifying ahead more regularly. His race pace is actually as good as if not better than Kovalainen's.

Chandhok is completely unproven and binned the car at the start of the year. You really think he is better than Jarno Trulli, the man who won the Monaco GP and gave Fernando Alonso a good run for his money? Try again.

It sounds to me like people who don't like him are trying to get rid of him from F1 by spouting all kinds of rubbish about his motivation and claiming he is underperforming. Whereas the facts are he is performing as good as ever and has only lost a little qualifying pace due to power steering issues. The team are happy with him and Jarno has repeatedly said he is happy (apart from the power steering obviously). Leave the guy alone!

Oh and there has never been such a British GP where Trulli qualified 2nd finished 9th. Perhaps you are referring to the 2003 British GP where he started 2nd and finished 6th. Considering he was driving a Renault at a time when Ferrari, McLaren, Williams and sometimes even BAR were usually faster..its not surprising that his impressive qualifying led to not so impressive finishing position. Funnily enough, that race was one of Trulli's highlights as he held up much faster cars for several laps in an inferior car.
Trulli's entire career looks like this, he keeps putting slow cars at the front and consequently being unable to hold the drivers behind. This is not something he does wrong in the races, he isn't excessively slow compared to his teammates, its just he is that amazing (or was anyway) in qualifying. The "Trulli Train" was always a result of this, his great defending skills plus his qualifying ability kept putting slow cars at the front which he couldn't drive any faster in race trim. It wasn't till 2004 when he got a car that he could drive just as fast in the races...and then he made one mistake and Flavio disposed of him.

prisonermonkeys · Jul 15, 2011

F1 fan
Ferrari have announced that Sergio Perez and Jules Bianchi will test the Ferrari F60 at Mugello or Fiorano later this year.

Both Perez and Bianchi are a part of Ferrari's driver development program. Given that Ferrari keep insisting Massa's place in the team is safe, it's more likely that this is simply Perez and Bianchi getting experience in the driver programme.

YellowG1 · Jul 15, 2011

Mike Rotch
I dont think this is the fantasy driver transfer thread.

I personally can't see any of Ferrari, McLaren, RBR or Merc changing their line-ups for next year. Renualt might ditch Heidfeld and or Petrov if they continue their unimpressive run and Kubica isnt back.

The biggest movement will be in the bit teams - Virgin, HRT, maybe STR, where paid drivers and racing academy products can get a look in.

I would say McLaren and Mercedes are pretty much set in stone. In a perfect world, I would think Ferrari would let go of Massa and RBR of Webber but with Massa locked up for 2012 as Ardius said, that leaves only Webber. But we still have 12 races to go. Things could change...

LMSCorvetteGT2 · Jul 15, 2011

It was said the other day by Dietrich Mateschitz that RBR will be keeping Webber if he decides to stay in F1 after this year. So I don't know where people are getting these dreams of granduer about Hamilton or Nico or anyone else. Furthermore, Nico would most likely stay with Merc GP and I imagine MS would be leaving this year or next. Then we look at Williams who will be keeping Rubens for next year but I doubt it will go much longer beyond 2012, but I could be very wrong. Perez may very well go over to Ferrari but it is a test, remember it's not only Perez that will be testing with Ferrari in September but GP2 driver Bianchi. Also I wouldn't fully believe Ferrari their track record for saying compared to doing isn't the best. Hamilton seems to just be making a storm of things or British media for that matter to help McLaren kick it into gear. And they even claim that Whitmarsh might be removed as team principle. I really don't see much opennings next year. I think maybe when all the older drivers from the 90s and early 00s move on then new drivers or the younger current drivers will be moved around. I'm talking about older drivers like Shumacher, Rubens, Trulli, and Webber.

F1 fan · Jul 15, 2011

interludes
Both Perez and Bianchi are a part of Ferrari's driver development program. Given that Ferrari keep insisting Massa's place in the team is safe, it's more likely that this is simply Perez and Bianchi getting experience in the driver programme.

I know they are part of their development program. Was just stating the facts. As for Massa, it's not 100% out of the question that they could farm him out to Sauber or buy him out of his contract.

The 2012 Driver transfer discussion/speculation thread

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