Poll: what would you do with standards?

  • Thread starter Fogerty_Jr
  • 202 comments
  • 11,246 views

What would you do with standard cars in GT6?

  • Keep them all: quantity over quality

    Votes: 122 35.9%
  • Thanks for your service, goodbye: trash 'em all. Quality over Quantity.

    Votes: 26 7.6%
  • Select some of them (like 70-100) to be made premium, and trash the rest

    Votes: 149 43.8%
  • Keep them all, but only as a "vintage" backup option: they're not used by AI, so they appear in the

    Votes: 43 12.6%

  • Total voters
    340
Especially if, as in GT5, Standards are unavoidable for completing GT Mode.

That's a completely different issue from the standard cars themselves though, and if this is what people are worried about removing the cars is completely unnecessary.

Except when a lot of people share that opinion and it could gain momentum and be listened to by the game developers.

And then the game would be ruined for a lot of people who enjoy the standard cars.

If desires are listened to blindly, possibly. If desired are interpreted (or better yet questioned until they are understood fully) to find what people actually want, then listening is not a bad thing.
 
If your opinion makes no sense, yes.

If you don't like standards you can just not use them. They do not have to be removed from the game. Like I said earlier, it's like going to a restaurant and telling them they should remove all of the menu items that you don't personally like.

Who are you to decide what does and doesn't make sense? If I came out here and proposed something ridiculous like, say, GT6 should have circuits on the moon with floating cars, then yeah, be sure to call me out on it. But this?

And I could spend a century explaining why that analogy doesn't work at all (and I probably should, because that's the second or third time you've used it), but I'm not going to waste any more time on this. Especially when I'm being told what I can and can't say.
 
What would I do with standards? Well... I would probably collect them all, and never use them, like in GT5.
 
It's like going to a restaurant and telling them they should remove all of the menu items that you don't personally like.

No, it's more like going to a restaurant who is so scared of anyone not liking their establishment that they make a meal to suit everyone - kosher, halal, vegetarian etc. Of course, this approach take a lot of time and resources so other areas of the restaurant suffer. Service is poor, meals never come on time, quality of ingredients is sub par, no leaderboards or qualifying.....
 
I am glad there are no leaderboards on the game because leaderboards kill video game communities.

Nobody plays for fun any more, they just hack and cheat so they can feel good about being on a list that will be irrelevant in 3 years.

And having standard cars in the game doesn't affect those things anyway. All video game companies cut back on service to make more money, it's not exclusive to Polyphony and it has nothing to do with having standard cars.
 
I am glad there are no leaderboards on the game because leaderboards kill video game communities.

Saying that is fine but god forbid somebody says standards are bad for the game. Apparently only your views make sense, even when they don't.
 
I am glad there are no leaderboards on the game because leaderboards kill video game communities.

Nobody plays for fun any more, they just hack and cheat so they can feel good about being on a list that will be irrelevant in 3 years.

And having standard cars in the game doesn't affect those things anyway. All video game companies cut back on service to make more money, it's not exclusive to Polyphony and it has nothing to do with having standard cars.

Just like we don't have to use standard cars, you don't have to participate in leaderboards.
 
Saying that is fine but god forbid somebody says standards are bad for the game. Apparently only your views make sense, even when they don't.

I am against anything that would ruin the gaming experience.

Eliminating unique cars would ruin the experience. Adding leaderboards would ruin the experience.

They are logically coherent opinions.
 
I am against anything that would ruin the gaming experience.

Eliminating unique cars would ruin the experience. Adding leaderboards would ruin the experience.


Standard cars ruin the gaming experience. Not having leaderboards ruins the gaming experience.


Yup, I can do it too.

They are logically coherent opinions.

No, they are just opinions which you are trying to force down everyone's throat as if they're something more.
 
I am against anything that would ruin the gaming experience.

Eliminating unique cars would ruin the experience. Adding leaderboards would ruin the experience.

Oh god, my sides.


Come on down off that high horse so you can stop being such a hypocrite. I'm almost afraid to ask what else would "ruin the gaming experience." A livery editor? Matchmaking?




They are logically coherent opinions.
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Who are you to decide what does and doesn't make sense? If I came out here and proposed something ridiculous like, say, GT6 should have circuits on the moon with floating cars, then yeah, be sure to call me out on it. But this?

It's not hard. If people who don't like standards don't use them, it's as if, for them, they don't exist. The people who like standards then get to use them. Remove the standards and one group loses out for no reason.

Now I suppose there is an issue in GT5 if you consider 100%ing GT Mode necessary, but that isn't the standard cars' fault. Do you even get anything for 100% anyway?

No, it's more like going to a restaurant who is so scared of anyone not liking their establishment that they make a meal to suit everyone - kosher, halal, vegetarian etc. Of course, this approach take a lot of time and resources so other areas of the restaurant suffer. Service is poor, meals never come on time, quality of ingredients is sub par, no leaderboards or qualifying.....

How did standard cars prevent those things? Catering to everyone isn't going to automatically lower quality. And if business happens to do better as a result, it's going to do the opposite.

I am against anything that would ruin the gaming experience.

Eliminating unique cars would ruin the experience. Adding leaderboards would ruin the experience.

They are logically coherent opinions.

I could follow you until this. What you're saying with leaderboards is what you're trying to fight against in the standard car debate. Options, the end.
 
I am against anything that would ruin the gaming experience.

Eliminating unique cars would ruin the experience. Adding leaderboards would ruin the experience.

They are my personal opinions.

Fixed.
 
You can't simply opt out of a leaderboard.

When video games give you the option of choosing between playing for fun and playing for a spot on the leaderboard, almost nobody chooses to play for fun and the entire mode becomes irrelevant.

And at least half of the people who get on the top of the leaderboard end up being people who hacked the game or people who just played against their friends a thousand times and boosted their stats.
 
You can't simply opt out of a leaderboard.

When video games give you the option of choosing between playing for fun and playing for a spot on the leaderboard, almost nobody chooses to play for fun and the entire mode becomes irrelevant.

And here I thought just playing the game at all was supposed to be the fun part. I do find it interesting that a game having leaderboards forces you to take part in them, too. Glad you were here to set the record straight.



Which menu option in your restaurant analogy is leaderboards, by the way?
 
It's not hard. If people who don't like standards don't use them, it's as if, for them, they don't exist. The people who like standards then get to use them. Remove the standards and one group loses out for no reason.

Now I suppose there is an issue in GT5 if you consider 100%ing GT Mode necessary, but that isn't the standard cars' fault. Do you even get anything for 100% anyway?

How did standard cars prevent those things? Catering to everyone isn't going to automatically lower quality. And if business happens to do better as a result, it's going to do the opposite.

Can't speak for machschnel, but my reasoning is that there are three problems with standard cars:

1) They limit what the player can do (limited customization, no racing modifications, no in-car view, etc.).

2) They create a functional and aesthetic divide that fundamentally breaks the realistic ideal Polyphony is going for.

3) They come at the expense of other features that would be more desirable in a modern, next-gen racing simulator (some of which machschnel mentioned, though there are of course many more). Time spent doing one thing is time not spent doing something else, it's that simple.

Lastly, as has been said numerous times, you must use standard cars to compete in GT Mode. There's no debating that. Whether or not I want to 100% it or not, I will, at some point, have to use them. And even if I choose to drive premium cars instead, standards are still present in my races and in the game data, so points 2 and 3 still apply.
 
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You can't simply opt out of a leaderboard.

When video games give you the option of choosing between playing for fun and playing for a spot on the leaderboard, almost nobody chooses to play for fun and the entire mode becomes irrelevant.

And at least half of the people who get on the top of the leaderboard end up being people who hacked the game or people who just played against their friends a thousand times and boosted their stats.

Forza 4 is a leaderboard I've opted out of since I got the game. If I want competition, I go online.

1) They limit what the player can do (no customization, racing modifications, in-car view, etc.)
Well, compare to the case where they don't exist, did you lose anything? Also they can be customized. They can be painted and have wings added as the premiums do. They lack RM, but honestly so does most of the premium line up.

For GT6 it seems like the differences here will be completely gone.

2) They create a functional and aesthetic divide that fundamentally breaks the realistic ideal Polyphony is going for.
The aesthetic divide is there, though I hardly notice. What is the functional divide? The standard cars run on the same physics (though perhaps their perameters were in many cases lazily carried over from GT4) and as mentioned above, you can customize them.

3) They come at the expense of other features that would be more desirable in a modern, next-gen racing simulator (some of which machschnel mentioned, though there are of course many more). Time spent doing one thing is time not spent doing something else, it's that simple.
More desirable is an opinion. Also who spends time doing what is the question, as is what time they're spending. Example, premium modelers are in the process of modeling Porsches. Then a license issue comes up with Porsche and they need to stop. Should they do nothing, or maybe work on standard cars? They can't help with physics programming or anything like that since they're modelers.

Lastly, as has been said numerous times, you must use standard cars to compete in GT Mode.
This is a design decision by PD, not a consequence of standards. I also kind of don't really get it since 100% is nothing but a platinum trophy. If the standards didn't exist, GT5 could have just been GT5 without the standard car events (you could argue that PD could have added more events, but that's true even now, with the standards). You can easily replicate this.

In any case, if this is the main issue, I would understand a desire to have the option to play GT Mode without standards. But this point doesn't require the removal of the cars.


There's no debating that. Whether or not I want to 100% it or not, I will, at some point, have to use them.
Well if you want 100% yes. If not, I don't see why you would have to bother with standard cars, but I don't remember GT Mode very well.

And even if I choose to drive premium cars instead, standards are still present in my races and in the game data, so points 2 and 3 still apply.
Being in the game data doesn't matter, you'll never notice.
 
You can't simply opt out of a leaderboard.

When video games give you the option of choosing between playing for fun and playing for a spot on the leaderboard, almost nobody chooses to play for fun and the entire mode becomes irrelevant.

Or perhaps, almost everyone chooses to play for fun because they find competing with their friends on leaderboards fun?

I remember one weekend when my internet wasn't connected. My friend lives on the other side of town, so we texted each other that we'd do hotlaps on Tsukuba with an MX5. We then spent the entire afternoon texting each other faster and faster lap times as we competed to see who could go the fastest.

It was great fun.

But it wasn't FUN. Oh, lordy no. And nothing like a leaderboard. No one could have fun like that. I'd rather have a poke in the eye with a sharp stick.

If you don't find a leaderboard fun, you don't have to play. Most of us like seeing how we stack up against others. That sense of competition is sort of what makes racing exist in the first place, ya know?
 
Or perhaps, almost everyone chooses to play for fun because they find competing with their friends on leaderboards fun?

I remember one weekend when my internet wasn't connected. My friend lives on the other side of town, so we texted each other that we'd do hotlaps on Tsukuba with an MX5. We then spent the entire afternoon texting each other faster and faster lap times as we competed to see who could go the fastest.

It was great fun.

But it wasn't FUN. Oh, lordy no. And nothing like a leaderboard. No one could have fun like that. I'd rather have a poke in the eye with a sharp stick.

If you don't find a leaderboard fun, you don't have to play. Most of us like seeing how we stack up against others. That sense of competition is sort of what makes racing exist in the first place, ya know?

Really? That sounded fun and exciting. I honestly hope there is leaderboards in GT6, will be very diasppointed if there isn't because it's fun competing against your friends.
 
i dont drive standards....EVER!!!!!

So convert as much as you can to premium and just trash the rest. The only reason ill ever buy a standard in gt5 is if i want the paint. that is the only reason. After i get the paint ill turn around and sell the car because its taking up space.
 
There's no a good answer for me in this poll...

My answer would be... Pick 100-150 of them to be made premium and leave the rest as "a vintage backup option". That's for GT6 on PS3.

For GT7 on PS4 pick some more (50-100) of them to be made premium.. and get rid of the rest of them.
 
I'm fine with them. Cockpit is a good bonus, but I drive with bumper camera so I don't care about them too much.

And in GT6, is even better, since PD (hopefully) improved exterior of them and maybe mainly they are now fully functionable - working wipers and beams, which makes me think that cockpits could be also improved in some way. Basically, any improvement made on them will be a plus for me.

In general, if PD deleted standards, it would be a very big mistake cuz some of standards don't even exist (could be wrecked or so).
 
For GT6, once PD have finished all the new cars they want I would make a selection of popular cars premium or semi-premium. So that would be things like race cars, vintage muscle cars, Supra RZ etc. Once the popular cars were done, then I would look at changing some of the less popular cars, because some people do enjoy them.
As for duplicates only one would need to be premiumified. The others can either be dropped or make use of the premium model, suitably modified.
 
Keep them all. Not because i purely prefer quantity over quality, i would rather have them all premiumized. But the more cars the better!

It will be disappointing to see ps2 cars in a 2013 game, but i can understand they can't model 'em all. But that doesn't mean they have to delete them. If they would, a big part of the gaming experience would be taken away imo.
 
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