2009 Chinese Grand Prix – Can anyone stop Brawn?

[Alex.]

Get In

 

[prisonermonkeys]

wow, Red Bull got the pace, or Brawn sandbagging?

Why would they sandbag in qualifying?

Looks like Alonso's diffuser is paying off. Interesting that they only made one; I suppose you could argue they wanted to run a comparative study of the effects of a new diffuser compared to an old diffuser, but I find it significant that Alonso was the one to have it and Piquet is not.

A lot of work for the Brawns to do, but if some of their passes in Malaysia were anything to go by, they're more than up to the challenge.

 

[[FPV]Rusty]

Why would they sandbag in qualifying?

Looks like Alonso's diffuser is paying off. Interesting that they only made one; I suppose you could argue they wanted to run a comparative study of the effects of a new diffuser compared to an old diffuser, but I find it significant that Alonso was the one to have it and Piquet is not.

A lot of work for the Brawns to do, but if some of their passes in Malaysia were anything to go by, they're more than up to the challenge.

I'm pretty certain that Brawn have even more pace than they have shown in any session this season, I posted that during Q2, maybe hoping that other teams would think they can take on more fuel in Q3 and still have a shot at pole.

Alonso is light, his Q2 and Q3 times are half a second apart, while the rest of the top 5 are about a second or more apart.

 

[Smallhorses]

"Observetating" - Even if Vettel doesn't finish tomorrow and scores no points, he still gets the prize for the best new word of the weekend in the post-qualifying interviews.

 

[prisonermonkeys]

I'm pretty certain that Brawn have even more pace than they have shown in any session this season, I posted that during Q2, maybe hoping that other teams would think they can take on more fuel in Q3 and still have a shot at pole.

Alonso is light, his Q2 and Q3 times are half a second apart, while the rest of the top 5 are about a second or more apart.

Yeah, the devil is always in the details. I'm waiting to have a look at the fuel loads, because there's simply no way a diffuser would allow that much pace so quickly. Brawn's innovations aren't just limited to the rear end: for example, their brake callipers are on the bottom of the brake disc as opposed to the side, which lowers the centre of gravity. Minor things, but they all count for a little bit here and there.

"Observetating" - Even if Vettel doesn't finish tomorrow and scores no points, he still gets the prize for the best new word of the weekend in the post-qualifying interviews.

What does that mean? Having a look down the inside to see if there's a chance of overtaking?

 

[Alex.]

 

[prisonermonkeys]

Is that a joke I'm not getting?

 

[corporatesteve]

yeah when vettel said that , i was like wait what....

 

[mustang245]

I wonder if Fernando Alonso is fully fueled, but 'light' because the KERS system has been removed from his R29? Nice of Flavio to give up his seat on the team jet for the Spaniards' diffuser. Enjoy the Grand Prix!

 

[prisonermonkeys]

I wonder if Fernando Alonso is fully fueled, but 'light' because the KERS system has been removed from his R29?

Not a chance. Even when the R29 has been light on fuel in the races, it hasn't had a patch on the competition. The diffuser is giving it a boost for sure, but no doubt it's going to be one of the lightest in the top ten.

 

[senamic]

Q3 Results:
1 Sebastian Vettel 15 Red Bull-Renault 1:36.184
2 Fernando Alonso 7 Renault 1:36.381
3 Mark Webber 14 Red Bull-Renault 1:36.466
4 Rubens Barrichello 23 Brawn-Mercedes 1:36.493
5 Jenson Button 22 Brawn-Mercedes 1:36.532
6 Jarno Trulli 9 Toyota 1:36.835
7 Nico Rosberg 16 Williams-Toyota 1:37.397
8 Kimi Raikkonen 4 Ferrari 1:38.089
9 Lewis Hamilton 1 McLaren-Mercedes 1:38.595
10 Sebastien Buemi 12 Toro Rosso-Ferrari 1:39.321
11 Nick Heidfeld 6 BMW Sauber 1:35.975
12 Heikki Kovalainen 2 McLaren-Mercedes 1:36.032
13 Felipe Massa 3 Ferrari 1:36.033
14 Timo Glock 10 Toyota 1:36.066
15 Kazuki Nakajima 17 Williams-Toyota 1:36.193
16 Sebastien Bourdais 11 Toro Rosso-Ferrari 1:36.906
17 Nelson Piquet Jr 8 Renault 1:36.908
18 Robert Kubica 5 BMW Sauber 1:36.966
19 Adrian Sutil 20 Force India-Mercedes 1:37.669
20 Giancarlo Fisichella 21 Force India-Mercedes 1:37.672

 

[senamic]

OK then, the predictions...

Red Bull-Renault
What a session! Last years midfielders are on a high, with Vettel on Pole, and team mate Mark Webber starting behind him in 3rd. IF they can fight off the two Brawns, and Webber catches onto the tail of Alonso, they could have a very profitable weekend.

Renault
Alonso put in a solid qualifying to move to the front row in Q3, but expect him to be fueled light. Piquet continues to be Renault's guinea pig, but he must improve if he expect's Renault to start treating him as a race driver, not a race day test driver. Still, Alonso is Alonso, expect a spirited drive from him, and a points finish. Expect Piquet to be passed by Kubica at turn 9, and finish the race in clean air between Force Indias and Torro Rossos.

Brawn-Mercedes
People may say that Brawn have underperformed by only lining positions 4 and 5, but they put in a decent qualifying, and should be strong on race day. If they can fend off Trulli and Rosberg into turn 1, the BGP001 could be a potential GP winner, even though neither car is on the front row.

Toyota
Trulli puts in another good performance, and as mentioned above, may challenge the Brawn's for 3rd, 4th, and 5th. Glock will probably finish midfield, but don't discount the German; he shows unique race pace.

Williams-Toyota
Gee, you could say the same things for Williams as you could about Toyota. Nico is 1 place behind Trulli, and Kazuki is 1 place behind Timo. Read the comments on Toyota and substitute the names of the drivers, although Toyota stand better chances with a more reliable car and more consistent drivers.

Ferrari
Now known as timid filly, Kimi put the F60 in the point scoring positions for race day. Felipe may attempt a charge, but he is unlikely to make a points finish. As for Kimi, well, we all know how much of an enigma he is.

McLaren-Mercedes
Expect a battle between Kimi and Lewis into turn 1, a lap 1 retirement for Heikki, and Martin Brudle telling us if Hamilton looks up at the commentary box as he drives past. Or something obscure. Where there is a fanboy on commentary, there will be a mention. Or eighty. Expect Hamilton between 7th and 10th, and Kovalainen between 10th-DNF.

Torro Rosso-Ferrari
Buemi, what a star. Q3 in his third race. Bourdais, not so. P16. Oh well, the sister team to the pole sitters may have a point within reach... But in reach isn't in the bag.

BMW Sauber
Clearly hit problems. Team, drivers, who knows? Expect an uncompetitive race, 0 points for the team.

Force India-Mercedes
Yep, back row again. Oh well. Force India fans may as well stop reading these predictions and stock up on merchandise for the 2010 season.

 

[Ardius]

Brawn are still going to be strong contenders for the win purely because they are easier on the tyres than the rest and I don't think anyone will be surprised if they are fueled fairly heavy.
Keeping in mind Horner admitted they went "quite aggressive in Q3" suggesting RBR went on low(er) fuel.

Alonso certainly went on fumes, lol, look at the difference between his Q2 and Q3 times!


Also - I hope Vettel isn't penalised for holding up Kovalainen but I won't be surprised if he is and I kind of expect it for the rules to be consistent at least.

McLaren-Mercedes
Expect a battle between Kimi and Lewis into turn 1, a lap 1 retirement for Heikki, and Martin Brudle telling us if Hamilton looks up at the commentary box as he drives past. Or something obscure. Where there is a fanboy on commentary, there will be a mention. Or eighty. Expect Hamilton between 7th and 10th, and Kovalainen between 10th-DNF.

I'm sorry, what??? This isn't ITV anymore...BBC don't have such a silly bias. Certainly not Martin Brundle of all people! Perhaps you are mistaking him for James Allen?

At least we get interviews from all the drivers now (including test drivers!) and actually hear from all 3 drivers in the press conferences....we didn't have that before. Also, many of the features they have been showing (such as the drivers talking about the current circuit) feature almost exclusively foreign drivers...barely any Button or Hamilton at all. In fact, other than coverage talking about race wins, pole positions, general "news" etc the BBC haven't really done a lot on Button. And Hamilton has only been mentioned a lot well, because of pretty obvious reasons.

 

[senamic]

I am a Brawn fan Ardius, but let's face it: Newey designed one hell of a car. Maybe this weekend it has come good.

 

[Ardius]

Yes, the RBR has pace but ahead of the Brawns just yet? I'm not so sure and the general consensus at the moment is that its best to run at least 1 short stint on the super-softs because they don't last long. I'm thinking perhaps Brawn are planning on leaving this stint to the end like in Melbourne and/or planning for the forecast rain.

It will be an interesting race though....."for sure"

 

[senamic]

I'm sorry, what??? This isn't ITV anymore...BBC don't have such a silly bias. Certainly not Martin Brundle of all people! Perhaps you are mistaking him for James Allen?

At least we get interviews from all the drivers now (including test drivers!) and actually hear from all 3 drivers in the press conferences....we didn't have that before. Also, many of the features they have been showing (such as the drivers talking about the current circuit) feature almost exclusively foreign drivers...barely any Button or Hamilton at all. In fact, other than coverage talking about race wins, pole positions, general "news" etc the BBC haven't really done a lot on Button. And Hamilton has only been mentioned a lot well, because of pretty obvious reasons.

I applaud the Beeb for doing so, but I live in Australia and the only real BBC stuff we get is the race commentary. And Brundle is still a fanboy. We need Damon Hill to replace Brundle, he did some races last year and he was much better

 

[Alex.]

Is that a joke I'm not getting?

I was talking about where it says 'Kate's dirty sister' on the steering wheel.

 

[Only_in_f1]

Pen for Vettel?

Not confirmed or an investigation just, will it happen?

 

[Ardius]

I'm not so sure McLaren will go to the stewards about it - they probably want to keep their heads low, but the stewards can always launch their own investigation. (and have done in the past)

From what I saw on the BBC coverage, Vettel and a Williams driver held Kovy up at turn 14, just before that though, Kovy was clearly expecting them to pull over earlier.
Both Vettel and the Williams driver were on in-laps too and were clearly on the racing line, in the way. It was also Kovy's last flying lap, so it is an incident worthy of a penalty, there was no reason for Vettel not to pull over and let him through, he can't claim to be held up by the Williams driver as neither were on a flying lap - thus didn't even need to be on the racing line.

 

[prisonermonkeys]

I was talking about where it says 'Kate's dirty sister' on the steering wheel.

That's what I meant. Who is Kate, why is her sister dirty and what does it have to do with Formula One? At first I thought it might have been a KERS joke, but I'm coming up with nothing.

 

[Blake]

 

[Metar]

Quali weights up, so I gave it a shot. This assumes slightly higher minimum weight to account for the warmup lap, and 2.7kg per lap, which was the estimate most F1 sites give for Shanghai.

 

[Alex.]

Cheers Metar, Alonso 10 lap stint? Ouch

 

[prisonermonkeys]

Oh yeah, he's as dry as a martini.

 

[daan]

Alonso will be using the super softs at the start to get them out of the way.

Still looking good for the Brawns to come through.

 

[Metar]

Thing is, the RBRs and Alonso are on fumes - but that might be a sensible strategy for a change, unlike last year.

Teams can't run more than 10-12 laps on the Supersoft compound - this was shown at Australia. So, for a change, starting super-light on the Option compound makes sense - you're gonna use them for 10 laps anyway, and then you've got them out of the way, and in case of a safety-car, that's a very big plus. Even if not, it's not the huge disadvantage it used to be.

EDIT: Daan-tree'ed.

 

[Alex.]

yes, he did mention they would only last for handful of laps anyway.

Any chance of rain for tommorow's race?

 

[Metar]

yes, he did mention they would only last for handful of laps anyway.

Any chance of rain for tommorow's race?

Not big.

 

[Blake]

Not big.

Weather underground disagrees. 30% chance of rain at 2pm, increasing to 60% at 5pm (race start is at 3pm).

 

[Tired Tyres]

Thing is, the RBRs and Alonso are on fumes - but that might be a sensible strategy for a change, unlike last year.

Teams can't run more than 10-12 laps on the Supersoft compound - this was shown at Australia. So, for a change, starting super-light on the Option compound makes sense - you're gonna use them for 10 laps anyway, and then you've got them out of the way, and in case of a safety-car, that's a very big plus. Even if not, it's not the huge disadvantage it used to be.

EDIT: Daan-tree'ed.

There probably won't be a Safety Car because of the extensive run off areas.

The super soft tyres are lasting a lot longer than in Melbourne.