2009 Nissan GT-R - Zero tolerance for asshattery

[Jim Prower]

Oh I'm sure it's a great material to use, I just don't think it looks all that great. I wouldn't want four blue things sticking out of the back of my car...especially if I had a GT-R, which I don't feel is a particularly good looking car to begin with.

Not like you can really control that: Ti just does that at the tips of exhaust pipes for some reason. Maybe it's the carbon-rich, high-temp atmosphere. it doesnt' help, much, that manufacturers like to take a torch to it, no, but it'd get that way eventually with use.

 

[niky]

Hmmm... I finally spotted money on a brand new Evo just because this thing was on the cover.

Not really because I think it's the neatest thing since sliced bread... honestly, I think I'd like an M3 or a C63 better... but simply because I was aching to find out what they thought.

Meh. Kind of confirms what most have been saying... terrific car, terrible soundtrack... a little too easy to drive... *sigh*... I just hope they get a head-to-head comparo with the 997 911 Turbo soon...

Man, I go away for two weeks for a dental operation and I miss all the fun...

 

[Tornado]

For the record, Car and Driver said the GT-R has "more than 176 pounds of downforce at 186 MPH."

 

[Joey D]

Not like you can really control that: Ti just does that at the tips of exhaust pipes for some reason. Maybe it's the carbon-rich, high-temp atmosphere. it doesnt' help, much, that manufacturers like to take a torch to it, no, but it'd get that way eventually with use.

And I understand that, I just think it looks awful.

 

[Perfect Balance]

I'm sure that's just a quickly fabbed exhaust because the pipe wasn't actually bent. All those little angles would hinder flow the tiniest bit. They'll probably bend up a bunch of sections and weld them together rather than making it piece by piece for production.

I don't think you can mandrel bend an exhaust to that angle, and it might have something to do with the characteristics of titanium which doesn't let them bend it easily.

Either way to me it looks more like they got a lot of little bends and welded them together, not just pieces of straight pipes cut and welded in angles.

Mine's makes some very good parts, at least I would trust them doing any kind of work on my car. I do think they know what they're doing.

 

[skylineGTR_guy]

Found this online quite interesting:

R35 GTR original parts prices

A hefty $29,267 for the GT-R's Engine Assembly alone.


Engine Assembly-------------------------$29,267
Turbocharger Assembly---------------------$2,286
Inter Cooler---------------------------------$7,865
Transaxle Assembly + Transfer------------$14,359
Front brake calipers------------------------$1,234
Front brake Disc rotor-----------------------$689
Front brake Disc pad------------------------$825
Front Wheel-------------------------------$1386
Rear Wheel--------------------------------$1377
Front bumper------------------------------$1097
Rear bumper-------------------------------$1097

Engine parts prices

-------------------------------------R35GT-R------- Q'ty

Camshaft-----------------------------$193----------4
Timing Chain---------------------------$40----------1
Connecting Rod-----------------------$109----------6
Piston---------------------------------$40----------6
Piston Ring set------------------------$138----------1
Crank Shaft Bearing set-----------------$61----------1
Injector Assembly---------------------$105----------6

 

[YSSMAN]

ZOINKS!

Still no word on that "plasma" thing eh?

I can't remember where I was reading it, but I think Car and Driver was saying that the price moved north of $70K here in the US (thanks weak dollar!), which kinda sucks. Oh well. I'm looking forward to (hopefully) seeing it in person either in Detroit or Chicago in the coming weeks...

 

[skylineGTR_guy]

ZOINKS!

Still no word on that "plasma" thing eh?

I can't remember where I was reading it, but I think Car and Driver was saying that the price moved north of $70K here in the US (thanks weak dollar!), which kinda sucks. Oh well. I'm looking forward to (hopefully) seeing it in person either in Detroit or Chicago in the coming weeks...

Who the heck brought up the "Plasma" thing anway? I see absolutely nowhere that says anything whatsoever about it having to be redone. The GTR uses a plasma sprayed iron coating, its not like its liquid or something, its actually iron, just sprayed on. The only thing I've run across with regards to anything is with Wink on GTR.co.uk who is an engineer who worked on the development of the GTR engine, according to him the GTR engine was optimized for 600 horsepower. So the plasma coating should stand up fine. Now granted there is a gap between optimum and maximum power, but a reliable (as in DD) 600 hp is not bad at all. If you were to tune it much higher I'd still go on the safe side and bore it out and have it sleeved.

 

[Gashlycrumb]

I presumed the plasma-sprayed bores referred to the Plasma treating of the bores to improve barrier layer integrity, thus ensuring the durability of the engine block.

Plasma treating is used in the steel industry on porous low-K material to remove the resist layer and increase a surface density of the insulating dielectric layer within the etched opening; and, blanket depositing a barrier layer over the etched opening. - apparently.

 

[Jay]

Who the heck brought up the "Plasma" thing anway? I see absolutely nowhere that says anything whatsoever about it having to be redone. The GTR uses a plasma sprayed iron coating, its not like its liquid or something, its actually iron, just sprayed on. The only thing I've run across with regards to anything is with Wink on GTR.co.uk who is an engineer who worked on the development of the GTR engine, according to him the GTR engine was optimized for 600 horsepower. So the plasma coating should stand up fine. Now granted there is a gap between optimum and maximum power, but a reliable (as in DD) 600 hp is not bad at all. If you were to tune it much higher I'd still go on the safe side and bore it out and have it sleeved.

Thanks skylineGTR_guy 👍, I usually hang around local Skyline forums but after this post I checked up on this Wink member on GTR.co.uk, VERY interesting to say the least and now I have tons of insight on the VR38DETT.


BTW

Hong Kong

 

[Joey D]

Guess all the technology in the world won't prevent people from failing at driving.

 

[Jim Prower]

Who the heck brought up the "Plasma" thing anway? I see absolutely nowhere that says anything whatsoever about it having to be redone. The GTR uses a plasma sprayed iron coating, its not like its liquid or something, its actually iron, just sprayed on. The only thing I've run across with regards to anything is with Wink on GTR.co.uk who is an engineer who worked on the development of the GTR engine, according to him the GTR engine was optimized for 600 horsepower. So the plasma coating should stand up fine. Now granted there is a gap between optimum and maximum power, but a reliable (as in DD) 600 hp is not bad at all. If you were to tune it much higher I'd still go on the safe side and bore it out and have it sleeved.

OKAY!!!! I get it now, Kind of like a hi-temp ceramic coating or something. It makes absolutely no sense to get something like that refilled or whatever.

besides, last I checked, a Plasma is a superheated, ionized gas...it must be coated in that sort of atmosphere. Let's see if CAT gets a GT-R down at the Mossvile Tech Center...

 

[YSSMAN]

Well that makes more sense then... Previous postings and articles made it sound like these plasma coatings had to be re-applied every couple thousand miles. At least in my book, that sounded like something absolutely idiotic, and should the warranty go out, well... I don't think I would have been happy about an $8000 trip to the dealer (I made up that number).

 

[skylineGTR_guy]

Thanks skylineGTR_guy 👍, I usually hang around local Skyline forums but after this post I checked up on this Wink member on GTR.co.uk, VERY interesting to say the least and now I have tons of insight on the VR38DETT.
BTW
Hong Kong

image isn't working, what was it?

Yes Wink really knows his stuff eh?

Well that makes more sense then... Previous postings and articles made it sound like these plasma coatings had to be re-applied every couple thousand miles. At least in my book, that sounded like something absolutely idiotic, and should the warranty go out, well... I don't think I would have been happy about an $8000 trip to the dealer (I made up that number).

Yes its "plasma sprayed" not "plasma spray" the iron is injected into a plasma jet heating it up to 10,000K where it is then sprayed on the bores. I hardly think any auto manufacturer would make you have to do such a thing.

 

[Jim Prower]

So, it's a permanent CI coating, that has a finer surface finish....

Hang on, I have to call CAT Mossville...

 

[Joey D]

Dyno numbers

MINE'S GT-R exhaust makes 501 hp at the flywheel
Eric Hsu, one of the many men behind XS Engineering and also a veteran of A'PEXi and Cosworth, got a hold of the February 2008 issue of Japan's Option magazine in which the pub strapped the MINE'S-modified Nissan GT-R to a Dynapack and ripped off a couple of runs. The GT-R was equipped with the prototype catback exhaust we featured a couple of weeks back, and although the design is far from streetable in its current form, it still created just over 20 hp over the stock setup by reducing backpressure and allowing a 1.42 psi increase in boost. Although Hsu maintains that the Dynapack might skew the results by up to five-percent, the 507.9 ps (500.95 hp) rating at the flywheel is still impressive considering that nothing was done to the GT-R's ECU.

 

[Perfect Balance]

Inter Cooler---------------------------------$7,865

 

[exigeracer]

For the record, Car and Driver said the GT-R has "more than 176 pounds of downforce at 186 MPH."

Considering the GT-R is coming up with such astonishing figures across the whole board, I am actually really surprised at this figure. I guess this is where it finally gets separated from the men back into the boys category. I know for sure that I, regardless of the supercomputer running the thing, would much rather have a small elephant's weight of downforce on the tires when approaching 200mph than that of a puny pony.

 

[Keef]

Downforce creates drag and slows you down. Any amount of downforce makes a huge and very noticeable difference in a car's behavior. There are very few cars on the road that even have a neutral balance, much less downforce. The vast majority of cars create lift. With that amount of downforce the GT-R will probably feel more stable at 180mph than it does at 80.

 

[Joey D]

Epic cars require epic prices for things. But some how I do not think it's that far out their for an OEM part on a car like that.

 

[Keef]

The pistons are $40 a piece. That's like a freaking 25 cent candy machine! Let's all stock up and sell them for $100 per! We'll be RICH!!!!

 

[exigeracer]

Downforce creates drag and slows you down. Any amount of downforce makes a huge and very noticeable difference in a car's behavior. There are very few cars on the road that even have a neutral balance, much less downforce. The vast majority of cars create lift. With that amount of downforce the GT-R will probably feel more stable at 180mph than it does at 80.

Most cars capable of 180+mph consider the GT-R's 176lbs of downforce to be laughable. I've looked for downforce figures online, so I know that they aren't easy to come by, but there's always the Enzo's and S7's cliche "can drive upside-down at 200mph" claims.

This comes down to weight again. The power used to push that weight could be used to push wind-wall, creating more downforce.

 

[Jay]

image isn't working, what was it?

The crashed GTR posted on GTR.co.uk

Yes Wink really knows his stuff eh?

Indeed, I would love to talk to him in person and pick his brain on somethings.

 

[Keef]

Most cars capable of 180+mph consider the GT-R's 176lbs of downforce to be laughable. I've looked for downforce figures online, so I know that they aren't easy to come by, but there's always the Enzo's and S7's cliche "can drive upside-down at 200mph" claims.

This comes down to weight again. The power used to push that weight could be used to push wind-wall, creating more downforce.

Meh, I think the Enzo's maximum downforce was somewhere around 1200 pounds, whereas the S7 really could drive upside down at whatever speed. Of course, it would only be putting a few pounds of pressure on the cieling and would have no grip, but still.

Anyway, cars like the Z06, Viper, Turbo, Gallardo, and others like them don't make massive downforce. None of them were designed in a wind tunnel. They're designed to be stable at high speed, and you only need a pound of downforce at 180 to make the car more stable than it is at 15.

 

[exigeracer]

Anyway, cars like the Z06, Viper, Turbo, Gallardo, and others like them don't make massive downforce. None of them were designed in a wind tunnel.

Pretty sure they were. I think pretty much everything sees a wind tunnel these days.

 

[Joey D]

Pretty sure they were. I think pretty much everything sees a wind tunnel these days.

QFT, everything sees a wind tunnel.

 

[Dave A]

Yeah they will have been in a wind tunnel but Keef has a point, the GT-R isn't an Enzo, it wasn't designed like an Enzo, it isn't a £600k supercar. Compared to cars like the 911 Turbo, Viper, Z06, the GT-R is in it's element. Thoes downforce figures I get the impression exigeracer was expecting are not for cars in that class, they're for cars like the Enzo. At the end of the day the GT-R is one hell of a fast car, we've seen it, we know it. Downforce certainly doesn't seem to be a problem issue, no one that's driven the car has raised any concerns.

 

[Kent]

Personally, I think the GTR is a great car but at the same time I'm not going to ignore some of the competition and the advances that competiton is making.
For example, we compare the GTR (in general without any indication of the level of GTR such as the "evo") to cars like the Z06, Gallardo, and Viper. However, those cars are compared using specific levels, the "Z06" and not what is basically the same car only improved- the ZR1, we use the "Gallardo" but we don't really use the Gallardo's new form of SuperLeggera... When we begin to compare the GTR as specifically as we compare those cars I believe the place of the GTR will become more apparent.
Further, with Best Motoring taking the initiative to do something along those lines and compare the R35 to the SuperLeggera, I'm tempted to ask if the GTR deserves comparison to the F430, in which case I say the limitations of the GTR become more obvious due to the incredible F430 Scuderia (which is basically the newest form of F430).

All in all, I think the GTR is a great car at a good price but I don't think it is the be-all and end-all of supercar competition. Even though it runs well with some, I don't think it is the best of them all and I certainly don't think most comparisons made are fair due to the non-specific nature of hypothetical comparisons.

 

[Pupik]

R35 GTR original parts prices: ...
Front brake Disc rotor-----------------------$689
Front brake Disc pad------------------------$825

Eeep: Those are some expensive brake pads; especially when they cost that much more than the rotors. Are they ceramic?

The rest seems in-line with luxury and near-supercar part costs.

 

[Div is back]

Personally, I think the GTR is a great car but at the same time I'm not going to ignore some of the competition and the advances that competiton is making.
For example, we compare the GTR (in general without any indication of the level of GTR such as the "evo") to cars like the Z06, Gallardo, and Viper. However, those cars are compared using specific levels, the "Z06" and not what is basically the same car only improved- the ZR1, we use the "Gallardo" but we don't really use the Gallardo's new form of SuperLeggera... When we begin to compare the GTR as specifically as we compare those cars I believe the place of the GTR will become more apparent.
Further, with Best Motoring taking the initiative to do something along those lines and compare the R35 to the SuperLeggera, I'm tempted to ask if the GTR deserves comparison to the F430, in which case I say the limitations of the GTR become more obvious due to the incredible F430 Scuderia (which is basically the newest form of F430).

All in all, I think the GTR is a great car at a good price but I don't think it is the be-all and end-all of supercar competition. Even though it runs well with some, I don't think it is the best of them all and I certainly don't think most comparisons made are fair due to the non-specific nature of hypothetical comparisons.

I think it's quite unfair to compare the entry level GTR to the top entry "enhanced" versions of other cars.

I'll play your card and say let's be patient.