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2014 Pirelli Hungarian Grand Prix
- Thread starter SVT Cobra GT
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- GTP_JTV
To be fair with the drivers running each other off the track, it's not just one or a handfull of drivers, it seems to be the majority of them. Even Kimi came close to running Vettel off the track today which I don't think he would have done 2 years ago(Monza '12 comes to mind). I would like to see them give the car on the outside a bit more room more often instead of just driving across the track to block them.
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- 6,146
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I do agree with you, it's racing, but it still has to stay fair and not put another driver in unneccesary risk of crashing.
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- Peasantslayer
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- HamiltonMP427
I feel really gutted for Jenson because now I see (as Bruno explains it) that if that tire choice wasn't done that could have been his race win potentially.
It depends on your definition of competitive. As a mid pack car sure, they've done a stellar job being third rate or less. I mean I hope that 250 million dollar budget is untrue as the horse whisper tried to denounce because that's a lot of money down the drain.
Sure there is, do you want to spend weeks hashing out track times, stint runs from each of the past races? We do have 4 weeks until Spa. Simply let's look at the points for the WCC for instance there is a 77 point gap to RBR. I'd hardly call that tied for second. Let's take the best drivers from each team at this moment 16 points ahead of the Ferrari and that's with the car being stripped of a podium in Australia (WDC and WCC) and a retirement the next race for DR.
We take the second drivers Vettel and Kimi. Vettel has had 3 DNF due to reliability and Kimi has only had one DNF (obviously we remember how). So how are they tied for it really? The other non-merc teams are nobodies since they aren't Factory like Scuderia Ferrari is. The team and the car are crap and Alonso did a great job today despite whatever "luck".
It depends on your definition of competitive. As a mid pack car sure, they've done a stellar job being third rate or less. I mean I hope that 250 million dollar budget is untrue as the horse whisper tried to denounce because that's a lot of money down the drain.
Sure there is, do you want to spend weeks hashing out track times, stint runs from each of the past races? We do have 4 weeks until Spa. Simply let's look at the points for the WCC for instance there is a 77 point gap to RBR. I'd hardly call that tied for second. Let's take the best drivers from each team at this moment 16 points ahead of the Ferrari and that's with the car being stripped of a podium in Australia (WDC and WCC) and a retirement the next race for DR.
We take the second drivers Vettel and Kimi. Vettel has had 3 DNF due to reliability and Kimi has only had one DNF (obviously we remember how). So how are they tied for it really? The other non-merc teams are nobodies since they aren't Factory like Scuderia Ferrari is. The team and the car are crap and Alonso did a great job today despite whatever "luck".
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Yeah, but still it looked very much like that Lewis purposely closed the door aggresively. I don't want to imply that he did it 100% on purpose, his tyres where pretty much gone, but it still had a very weird taste to it, if ykwim.
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- HamiltonMP427
Just a few posts below your post that I'm quoting now, I actually stated that I feel Rosberg shouldn't have done so either. I haven't seen the race yet as I don't have Sky, which is why I already said in regards to the Hamilton/Rosberg incident, I'll wait to see it before making a final judgement on it. Same goes for any other incidents. I can only comment on what has been said to have happened on here, and other forums, at the moment. Which again, is why I have basically said I'm not making my mind up about it yet.
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I've watched F1 for too long to be surprised by a single car dominance or be offended by it.
Disregarding Kimi's struggles and his random spins is as far from being objective as can be.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Formula_One_World_Constructors'_Champions
Yaaah. No.
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- Third_Reign
There is defending a line and there is forcing a driver off track. One I call racing, the other is unsportsmanlike-like conduct that should be prevented.
Rosberg-Bottas at T1 was Rosberg staying on the racing line and he was right next to Bottas on turnin. As such I see no need for action.
Rosberg-Hamilton looked like Hamilton left the "ideal" line to force Rosberg wide. Is it racing? Sure it is, and nothing happened, but I firmly believe he should get a slap on the hands for it (from the team, not FIA) because such conduct is not alright. Breathing room should be granted at all times.
Rosberg-Bottas at T1 was Rosberg staying on the racing line and he was right next to Bottas on turnin. As such I see no need for action.
Rosberg-Hamilton looked like Hamilton left the "ideal" line to force Rosberg wide. Is it racing? Sure it is, and nothing happened, but I firmly believe he should get a slap on the hands for it (from the team, not FIA) because such conduct is not alright. Breathing room should be granted at all times.
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- HamiltonMP427
Why he was faster and there, Bottas was never going to beat him and he tried to play chicken with Rosberg and lost. It was great, to be honest with you, I had to shake my head at Bottas cause he only hurt himself. Also if you haven't seen the race then why comment like you have...it's almost not contributing to talk on a subject that you only know or are talking about second hand.
Yeah not sure how that answers anything I said but okay...
How? We know the struggles of a second driver at Ferrari, some rise to is and challenge their team mate and then are nerfed by the team and others just fall to the wayside. Kimi doesn't seem to really want to be in it, especially when you see him already planning his retirement ice cream party. Also either way if you want bring that up you probably should just concede and say "well Kimi is struggling and thus the car and team isn't good like you've said, but it's still not that bad". I mean do you want to make the point for me?
Yeah a page I've seen hundreds of times...what's the point?
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And thus Lewis confirmed it, he did it all to make sure Nico didn't gain any more points. Thus what we can say is that last move was for sure on purpose. If he wins the championship I may say good job for doing moves like that, for now I'd say that's quite naughty.
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Except when your on the racing line?
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- HamiltonMP427
To be honest I say he did it on purpose only based on the view we saw and then the post race view from Rosberg's in car. It seems like Lewis purposely lets the car step out and drive up the track, but then you have to give the benefit of the doubt and factor in the tires, so I have to say in my opinion and defend it as such.
How on earth am I commething like I have seen the race? What part of 'I will only make my final judgement about these incidents when I have seen them', do you not understand? I've even been saying along the way that my views so far are only based on what I have seen online, and that I can only make up my mind about the incidents later, once I have seen them.
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- Peasantslayer
IIRC Rosberg certainly could have kept further to the inside in the Bottas move just as Hamilton could have, trying around the outside of T2 against a championship rival is asking for trouble.
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You can't have it both ways. You adjust your judgement on the Williams car because it has less impressive driver line up and you adjust your judgement on Red Bull car despite a struggling 4 time WDC in their line up but when it comes to Kimi his results are direct indication of how good the car is?
You're angry that Ferrari arent contesting for the title. But that's not my point at all. My point is that they are clearly contesting for being 2nd best car in the field, and 2nd place in WCC, if Kimi puts up more performances like today. You're arguing where Ferrari should be, i'm arguing where Ferrari are.
HKS racer
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Stop crying please. It's never easy passing Lewis, if Nico want to pass him he need to learn from Ricciardo.
It's called defending position and yes he did it on purpose. And no it shouldn't be penalized for that.
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Of course they did it on purpose. Hamilton was genuinely having issues with his tyres but went wider than he would've had Rosberg not been there, Rosberg on the other hand had good tyres, wasn't fighting the car yet drove Bottas off the track whilst Bottas had at least half his car alongside Rosberg. Also had Rosberg continued with the move on Hamilton there was still ample room for him to keep 2 wheels on the track.
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- Lewis_Hamilton_
I see where the misunderstanding could come from though as this:
sounds like you've already made a judgement. Once a judgement is already in place, it's harder to shift that view on something, someone or a situation despite whatever counter evidence may come up.
It's like if you start a new job and someone says to you "Watch out for him, he's an A-hole", chances are most of the things that guy will do you will see as him being an A-hole, and yet someone else could do the exact same thing and you'd be ok with it. 'Tis human nature.
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pitlane to spin to broken wing to iffy brakes to 4th still more impressive.Much more impressive considering the car disadvantage they had to deal with.
They didn't have to resort to running a team-mate off the track either
Well to be fair Rosberg ran himself off. He was, rightfully, afraid of crashing into Lewis so he left a gap about a bazillion times bigger than Vettel left vs Raikkonen. But if you're not willing to commit to being air-tight, why go there.
- 2,998
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- Peasantslayer
Give it up Kravitz, Lewis could have dropped right back to let Rosberg through but Nico clearly had the better tyre strategy.
Okay, so here is the rest of that post...
See where I say 'it could have been an honest mistake from Hamilton. So I will wait to see the incident myself, before I make a final judgement'. I think that indicates that I am perfectly willing to change my views, should I feel I was wrong upon seeing the incident.
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- HamiltonMP427
I'm not having anything both ways. Where did I talk about the Williams car???
Also I don't think you realize how much you compromised your argument, you say the car isn't a dog and people need to quit and yet now you've just said it is and Kimi's driving reflects that it is a bad car. You also indirectly by doing this make it sound that Alonso had an amazing drive in a dog of a car to finish second. Also yes Vettel isn't driving well and I don't think Kimi is either both WDC drivers but Vettel is still making something out of the car to show it is leaps and bounds ahead of Ferrari.
I am? I don't care if they ever win a title again and to be honest I find it strange you're able to convey tone somehow...
No they're not contesting for 2nd in WCC there is a three race deficit to RBR right now. The chances of McLaren catching Ferrari and passing them is more likely than Ferrari on RBR. Um, you're the one that just said "if Kimi" and "if" that which indicates hypothetical talking. I'm arguing where Ferrari are at this moment and why people can say the Ferrari is a horrid car for what they put into it. I mean not to be rude but are you confused?
Other than you finally saying you haven't seen it before that who is to know? You didn't initially come out and say it and if you did (show me) then sorry but I didn't see it. People come here commenting on the race because they've seen it, and actually know what's going on.
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- Spurgy777
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- OutlawQuadrant
As an funny correlation, around the same time span as the F1 race, the leading BMW in the Spa 24 Hour race was also squeezing his competitor off the track trying to defend his position. The stewards didn't penalize him, only issued a warning.
What I saw was naughty but considering it's the last lap and it meant being on the podium and gaining ground in the driver points against your chief rival, which driver wouldn't do the same?
What I saw was naughty but considering it's the last lap and it meant being on the podium and gaining ground in the driver points against your chief rival, which driver wouldn't do the same?
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You don't seem to realize how much you compromise your argument by ignoring how much more weight(in a vaccum) a reigning 4 time WDC struggling carries than 2007 WDC struggling carries.
If WDCs struggling is the core of your argument RBR is clearly the :censored:iest car in the field.
Also i never said that Kimi's driving reflects it is a bad car. lol.
Kimi's problems are between him and his throttle foot.
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