A better view of Gran Turismo 7's Economy... And Grind
- Thread starter Grimm6Jack
- 150 comments
- 19,825 views
If you want to challenge my assertion that the entire game design is based around MTX then answer me a couple questions.
1. Why was the entire economy revised exactly when MTX were introduced?
2. Why do roulette tickets exist instead of just giving you a random prize?
3. Why do Brand Central invitations exist? This doesn't even make sense in the context of the real world.
4. Why are the cars in the LCD not there permanently? What gameplay element does this purposely serve?
5. Why don't events pay more?
6. Why can't you sell cars?
Surely, instead of dismissing valid arguments that these core features of the game are designed around the inclusion of MTX, you have some answers of your own. Nobody is dealing with absolutes and that is why this is a discussion. If we knew everything PD was thinking, we wouldn't be discussing it. I for one, gave my opinion on why the MTX are so bad for this game even if you choose not to engage with them.
I will say that the MTX are by far not the biggest issue I have with the game, personally.
- 408
- Canada
- Zero_to_oblivion
You can't buy a brand new Ferrari direct from Ferrari unless they approve you AND you've owned a Ferrari before (you have to buy second hand to start).
You had to apply to buy the Ford GT, at which point Ford then reviewed your application. If approved you had to sign various agreements, including the infamous "no resale for 2 years" agreement.
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Scaff
Moderator
- 29,541
- He/Him
- ScaffUK
Only true for certain models, the majority of the range your can walk right in and buy.
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Scaff
Moderator
- 29,541
- He/Him
- ScaffUK
And I would disagree with them, the title is designed around MTXs and they are a string element of it, but it's not in every element of it.
Grimm6Jack
(Banned)
- 1,535
- Setubal, Portugal
- Grimm66Jack
Option 1. 50 Hour Campaign + 500 Hour Grinding for other cars
or
Option 2. 500 Hour Campaign + 50 Hour Grinding for other cars
I certainly know the choice I would make. And as a matter of fact, so do most people, by the simple fact of:
-How people are negatively reacting to GT7 (option 1)
-How people loved GT4 (option 2)
PD has proved that they can make an engaging game, that almost borderlines storytelling, that also doesn't leave much room for the player to have to grind by repeating the same events over and over for overly exagerated periods of time.
It's there in the franchise in GT4. They know the formula. So why?? Why have they messed up so bad after the HD era?
And why, with this specific game, GT7, where they even pay a homage to GT1 through GT4 in the trailer, as a "back to its roots" or a "return to form" game, did not follow the same formula they did with GT4 and the other GTs?
That's the question... Why?
Was it time????
After GT3 was released, they took exactly 3 years and 8 months to release GT4. (PAL versions)
After GT6 was release, they took exactly 8 years and 3 month to release GT7.
Clearly time wasn't an issue.
Budget???
They have the backing of Sony and have grown considerably since those PS2 era games. Budget is far from being an issue here either.
Staff???
It doesn't look like they have decreased in staff since GT4 days either, and while physics and graphics do get more complicated, likewise, computational power has also vastly increased since those days. The amount of staff PD currently has, which by the sources I've checked, is ~300, is plenty enough for this game.
So why?? Why did the game turn out to be this incomplete mess???
With all of their resources, with all of their staff and budget backed up by Sony, with the plentiful amount of time they had, and with quite clearly the knowledge to actually make a pleasant single player campaign as they have demonstrated in the past, how did GT7 end up like this?
I'm only focusing on the grinding aspect here...
How could they come up with a "career mode" where its 100% completion is about collecting cars, have a campaign that lasts about 50 hours (after 6 months of updates, let's not forget about this, as it was much worse at launch) and where after said campaign is completed, you only get about 15 % of the value of all of the cars in the game and then the other 85% have to be grinded through repeating events over and over for hundreds of hours? Far more time grinding than completing the main event series... lol
What is the point??? Is it because of their pretentious way of designing the LCD cars as something "exclusive"? Don't make me laugh... This is a game for crying out loud. Why the hell would these cars be something to brag on about? Aren't they in the game for the actual purpose of us, gamers, being able to drive them here where we simply can't, and likely never will for most of us, drive them in real life?
If they truly want the cars to feel "special" or "exclusive", instead of making us grinding the same race over and over for 10 or so hours to buy that 20 million classic car, why the hell can't we just get it as a PRIZE CAR from some hard/difficult event? Like GT4 did with the majority of its high-tier cars?
And that's the thing, PD did precisely that with some of the cars. After we beat the gold times for the final set of missions (before the "The Human Comedy" update) we would get a nice shiny new Chaparral 2J that we would've otherwise have to pay 2.5 million for it, and worse even, potentially not have it available in the LCD for days or months, money that would otherwise be better spent on tuning other cars, which is also quite expensive in this game.
It actually gives us a sense of accomplishment and it's faaaar more engaging than having to repeat an event we've already beaten dozens of times over.
So why? Why did PD stopped there? Why did PD went through such drastic measures to make the economy in this game to be so unforgiving and borderline broken? It's like we have to make GT7 our 2nd job after we get off from work... It's ridiculous.
Just for context, we had better ways of earning money in GT Sport, a game where money was worthless!!! A game where the focus was on the online aspect and the single player was an after thought. Tuning didn't even cost money in that game for crying out loud, it cost mileage points that you could get just by driving.
To rub salt into the wound, you could, of all things, SELL CARS in GT Sport... SELL CARS in a game where literally every car can be won via a roulette ticket from the daily mileage. They even added a DLC where we could win 120 million+ credits for beating it lol.
Then comes GT7, a main title, where credits actually matter and have huge impact on the overall experience of the single player part of the game, and they not only make it miles worse than GT Sport, they also remove the ability to sell cars and even went as far as to try and even HALVE the already pitiful payouts via an update because they thought we were gaining too much at a pitiful 1.7 million per hour via the single atrocious Rally race at Fisherman's Ranch.
So again, I ask... Why?
It's obvious... MTXs...
or
Option 2. 500 Hour Campaign + 50 Hour Grinding for other cars
I certainly know the choice I would make. And as a matter of fact, so do most people, by the simple fact of:
-How people are negatively reacting to GT7 (option 1)
-How people loved GT4 (option 2)
PD has proved that they can make an engaging game, that almost borderlines storytelling, that also doesn't leave much room for the player to have to grind by repeating the same events over and over for overly exagerated periods of time.
It's there in the franchise in GT4. They know the formula. So why?? Why have they messed up so bad after the HD era?
And why, with this specific game, GT7, where they even pay a homage to GT1 through GT4 in the trailer, as a "back to its roots" or a "return to form" game, did not follow the same formula they did with GT4 and the other GTs?
That's the question... Why?
Was it time????
After GT3 was released, they took exactly 3 years and 8 months to release GT4. (PAL versions)
After GT6 was release, they took exactly 8 years and 3 month to release GT7.
Clearly time wasn't an issue.
Budget???
They have the backing of Sony and have grown considerably since those PS2 era games. Budget is far from being an issue here either.
Staff???
It doesn't look like they have decreased in staff since GT4 days either, and while physics and graphics do get more complicated, likewise, computational power has also vastly increased since those days. The amount of staff PD currently has, which by the sources I've checked, is ~300, is plenty enough for this game.
So why?? Why did the game turn out to be this incomplete mess???
With all of their resources, with all of their staff and budget backed up by Sony, with the plentiful amount of time they had, and with quite clearly the knowledge to actually make a pleasant single player campaign as they have demonstrated in the past, how did GT7 end up like this?
I'm only focusing on the grinding aspect here...
How could they come up with a "career mode" where its 100% completion is about collecting cars, have a campaign that lasts about 50 hours (after 6 months of updates, let's not forget about this, as it was much worse at launch) and where after said campaign is completed, you only get about 15 % of the value of all of the cars in the game and then the other 85% have to be grinded through repeating events over and over for hundreds of hours? Far more time grinding than completing the main event series... lol
What is the point??? Is it because of their pretentious way of designing the LCD cars as something "exclusive"? Don't make me laugh... This is a game for crying out loud. Why the hell would these cars be something to brag on about? Aren't they in the game for the actual purpose of us, gamers, being able to drive them here where we simply can't, and likely never will for most of us, drive them in real life?
If they truly want the cars to feel "special" or "exclusive", instead of making us grinding the same race over and over for 10 or so hours to buy that 20 million classic car, why the hell can't we just get it as a PRIZE CAR from some hard/difficult event? Like GT4 did with the majority of its high-tier cars?
And that's the thing, PD did precisely that with some of the cars. After we beat the gold times for the final set of missions (before the "The Human Comedy" update) we would get a nice shiny new Chaparral 2J that we would've otherwise have to pay 2.5 million for it, and worse even, potentially not have it available in the LCD for days or months, money that would otherwise be better spent on tuning other cars, which is also quite expensive in this game.
It actually gives us a sense of accomplishment and it's faaaar more engaging than having to repeat an event we've already beaten dozens of times over.
So why? Why did PD stopped there? Why did PD went through such drastic measures to make the economy in this game to be so unforgiving and borderline broken? It's like we have to make GT7 our 2nd job after we get off from work... It's ridiculous.
Just for context, we had better ways of earning money in GT Sport, a game where money was worthless!!! A game where the focus was on the online aspect and the single player was an after thought. Tuning didn't even cost money in that game for crying out loud, it cost mileage points that you could get just by driving.
To rub salt into the wound, you could, of all things, SELL CARS in GT Sport... SELL CARS in a game where literally every car can be won via a roulette ticket from the daily mileage. They even added a DLC where we could win 120 million+ credits for beating it lol.
Then comes GT7, a main title, where credits actually matter and have huge impact on the overall experience of the single player part of the game, and they not only make it miles worse than GT Sport, they also remove the ability to sell cars and even went as far as to try and even HALVE the already pitiful payouts via an update because they thought we were gaining too much at a pitiful 1.7 million per hour via the single atrocious Rally race at Fisherman's Ranch.
So again, I ask... Why?
It's obvious... MTXs...
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- 4,961
- Connecticut
- Ridley-X4
When it comes to GT7's economy, I feel like there are at least two "X-Factors" that we don't know about yet. That's selling cars, and the supposed seasonal events that are coming. (I don't think they were referring to the Online Time Trials, either.) I personally hope that when it comes to selling cars, it's something fun in itself, rather than simply receiving credits in exchange for removing a car from your garage.
Grimm6Jack
(Banned)
- 1,535
- Setubal, Portugal
- Grimm66Jack
- 2,099
- Zimbabwe
Bet PD would make it so that you can only trade cars in for roulette tickets.
Grimm6Jack
(Banned)
- 1,535
- Setubal, Portugal
- Grimm66Jack
Something like that still wouldn't warrant a 7 month (and still pending) time period...
I won't mind if the trade is for 6* tickets... That's a guaranteed 500k or even 1 million per car, alongside the possibility to get even more expensive cars from those roulettes. Even just a 5* wouldn't be bad as that's an almost guaranteed 100k. This would suck for LCD expensive cars though.
But if it's for any random tickets (1 to 4*), then yeah, that's, needless to say, not good enough, and I would even say, insulting, holding on to such a feature for so long to just implement it in such a manner.
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- 205
- New Zealand
- Sh33p
- None
Lol, dude.
Just take a second and have a look at how this game is designed and compare it to previous GT titles…. A lot of the work has been done for you in the OP.
Have a look at popular f2p games while you’re at it and sure, there may not be any flashing red ‘BUY CREDITS’ everywhere in GT7 but the rest of the systems are in clearly in place…
(All though- if I hover over GT7 in my ps5 menu - the add on packs show up - the first one being a bright red…)
The game is blatently designed to PUSH people to mtx. No one here is saying that people are forced. I’ve never purchased them, I never will and I have 100% completed the game in terms of races / events and car ownership.
If you cannot see the obvious, even with people pointing it out to you with giant red arrows…. That’s the embarrassing part of this entire thread.
There is no point in me re-telling the obvious ploys that PD have taken up for push mtx in gt7 - you can have a re-read of everything else above if you wanted to enlighten yourself….
It’s not really a question of ‘Is GT7 designed to push mtx?’ It’s more of an obvious fact.
The best way for you to see this for yourself is for you to actually play the game and try to complete the car roster for yourself. Only then someone like you will you understand the clear and obvious tactics implemented to get you to open your wallet. Just try grinding the 1-2 races that actually give a decent payout for 8 hours… then imagine doing that another 24 times… (over 1 months of full time employment) then try buy the car that just left the LDC… or the cars that you don’t have invites for….
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- 29,991
- Cuddington, Cheshire
- JDA1982
Perhaps I misinterpreted what you were getting at. Of course in a completley literal sense, absolutely, the entire game is not designed completely around MTX's, they are not present at all in the Music Rally for instance, so a person cannot reasonably claim that mode is influenced by MTX's for instance.
However, I don't think that was the key point, or at least didn't until the posters following message. The point I took was that MTX's have clearly influenced the design of the game, and that fact there is a game in there doesn't negate that at all hence my initial reply to you.
But certainly, I won't ague with your point on absolute statements, I am in full agreement with that point and the posters follow up post suggests your literal interpretation was more correct than mine in that instance.
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- 4,961
- Connecticut
- Ridley-X4
I'm hoping it'll be so that you can put your own cars on an online marketplace, where the price is determined by Sport Mode stats like how many times it's finished in the top 5, or perhaps how many gold/silver/bronze finishes it's scored in Online Time Trials. It'd give players a reason to use their own cars instead of always renting, but then it'd also give them a bit of an internal debate: do they put the car up for auction, or hold on it and cherish the memories they've made with that individual car? This same hypothetical update that'd introduce all this could also break down those Sport Mode stats for each and every car you have, so you can view a car and see how many times you've won Sport Mode races with that particular vehicle, for example.
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- 408
- Canada
- Zero_to_oblivion
The fact that you can rent cars kind of ruins the idea of running it like a marketplace however, or at least for any cars that can be used in online races (especially with BoP) - why pay credits for them when you could just "rent" it for free? Car pedigree is good and all, but that doesn't win races.
I mean I like the idea of cars history impacting its value, I just don't see how the ability to rent doesn't undermine it.
For rare cars that are harder to acquire, like the invitation cars, or cars with special parts, a marketplace would make sense, but then that is such a small range of cars that it would apply to.
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To clarify my response, no I don't think EVERY piece of the game was designed with MTX in mind, I meant in the broader sense the game philosophy clearly was otherwise many gameplay mechanics (outside of the actual racing itself) have no real reason to exist. The fact that they do exist exasperates the problems the game already faces such as lack of events. I probably articulated myself poorly, but my entire point is that these decisions are not arbitrary. Of course, we can't speak in absolutes so this is the point of discussion, but its obvious at least to me that MTX are very important to the structure of the game and aren't just chilling in the background for convenience. They are core to the game's design philosophy.
- 2,099
- Zimbabwe
An argument could be made that because Music Rally awards you literally nothing upon completion, PD is in fact pushing you to either spend more time to grind or buy MTX if you're tempted to actually own the expensive LCD cars featured in Music Rally (like the Cobra and the Barker Tourer for instance).
- 549
- Where i'm at
- xmalcolmpowderx
Quite the opposite. 6 months of thoroughly engaging play, with countless areas still to delve into. Of which car collection is but a small part.
Many of my all-time favourite titles, such as Battlefield & Bloodborne, involved periods of unlocking items, or building character strength. If there’s engaging gameplay or you’re improving your skills. It’s not a chore.
We all find entertainment in different ways. You have been posting about GT7 daily yet have never played it.
Your OP arbitrarily omits many hundreds of cars (in fact the majority) from GT5 & GT6. Which completely distorts the relative cost & effort to unlock all cars.
The total cost of cars in GT7 is heavily distorted by VGT’s and niche classics. I’m not against their inclusion. But they’re little more than collection pieces for completionists.
You can only ever speak for yourself. I’ve got more credits than I know what to do with. My current gameplay loop is Time Trials, Circuit Experience & tuning road cars. My next big purchase will be the 917. But that will be largely for liveries & photography.
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Grimm6Jack
(Banned)
- 1,535
- Setubal, Portugal
- Grimm66Jack
Find me the prices for all of the standard GT5 cars and I'll gladly make the calculations for that game.
I've already done the calculations with the standart cars in GT6, and it's still better than GT7, by quite a few dozen hours at that, even with the servers down. I'm just waiting on confirmation of the prices since I took those GT6 prices from someone else's list and I didn't made them myself while looking at the car prices in game.
VGTs and Niche classics? Aren't they still cars that were designed by PD to be in the game? I took into account the Niche classics and those VGTs for GT5 and GT6 as well mind you.
Yet, I don't see you bringing up the fact that Gran Turismo 4 is literally less than 1/10th of GT7's grind time. Where's the distortion here?
That's the way you play... You have more credits than you can do with it because you are not buying all the cars (and also not tuning all of them as well). This thread is specifically about collecting all of those cars, as is Gran Turismo's 7 main quest.
Go buy every car you don't have, and you'll soon find out how you are always out of credits and have to constantly grind for them. And again, I'm not even factoring tuning, where again, it would be another aspect that would impact its grind even more negatively than the other games.
And no... I'm not speaking for myself. It's mathematical facts. Gran Turismo 7 is legit the worst grind of all Gran Turismos.
- 714
- Chile
- cristobal458
Good post! Months ago I made this comparison about the grinding time needed to get the most expensive car in each game.
Gran Turismo 4
The fastest way to get money was by doing the Deutsche Touring Car Meisterschaft. According to this, it takes 50 minutes to win the championship. You can also use the B-Spec mode and win the championship at 2x Speed (It should take 25+ minutes aproximately)
15,000 Cr per race
75,000 Cr championship prize
793,000 Cr Mercedes Benz CLK-LM used price
15,000 Cr x 5 + 75,000 Cr + 793,000 Cr = 883,000 Cr. or 2,119,200 Cr/Hour (it would be 9,418,666 Cr/Hour today, since the most expensive cars on current GTs cost 20M)
It takes 2 hours to get the most expensive cars which cost 4,500,000 Cr
Gran Turismo 5 (Prime)
The fastest way to get money was by doing the Expert Level Ferrari Formula Challenge - Nurburgring 24H. According to this, it takes 13 minutes 35 seconds to win the race.
452,700 Cr + 200% Bonus = 905,400 Cr. per race
905,173.5 Cr + 200% Bonus = 1,810,347 Cr. Performance Difference Adjustment
905,400 Cr. + 1,810,347 Cr. = 2,715,747 Cr or 12,069,987 Cr/Hour
It takes 1.66 hours to get the most expensive cars which cost 20,000,000 Cr
Gran Turismo 6 (Prime)
The fastest way to get money was by doing the Red Bull X2014 Standard Championship. According to this, it takes 27 minutes to win the championship.
130,000 Cr. + 200% Bonus = 260.000 Cr per race
500,000 Cr. + 200% Bonus = 1,000,000 Cr championship prize
260,000 Cr x 5 + 1,000,000 Cr = 2,300,000 Cr or 5,111,111 Cr/Hour
It takes 4 hours to get the most expensive cars which cost 20,000,000 Cr
Gran Turismo Sport
The fastest way to get money was by doing the Group 1 Cup - Monza. According to this, it takes 9 minutes to win the race
330,000 Cr per race or 2,200,000 Cr/Hour
It takes 9 hours to get the most expensive cars which cost 20,000,000 Cr
Gran Turismo 7
There is no consensus on what is the fastest way to earn credits. However, many mention that Dirt Champions is the fastest way to earn money.
60,000 Cr per race (including clean race bonus + 30 second menus) or 818,181 Cr/Hour
It takes 24.4 Hours to get the most expensive cars which cost 20,000,000 Cr
Comparison of money percentages per hour
GT4: 47% per hour
GT5: 60% per hour
GT6: 26% per hour
GTS: 11% per hour
GT7: 4% per hour
Gran Turismo 4
The fastest way to get money was by doing the Deutsche Touring Car Meisterschaft. According to this, it takes 50 minutes to win the championship. You can also use the B-Spec mode and win the championship at 2x Speed (It should take 25+ minutes aproximately)
15,000 Cr per race
75,000 Cr championship prize
793,000 Cr Mercedes Benz CLK-LM used price
15,000 Cr x 5 + 75,000 Cr + 793,000 Cr = 883,000 Cr. or 2,119,200 Cr/Hour (it would be 9,418,666 Cr/Hour today, since the most expensive cars on current GTs cost 20M)
It takes 2 hours to get the most expensive cars which cost 4,500,000 Cr
Gran Turismo 5 (Prime)
The fastest way to get money was by doing the Expert Level Ferrari Formula Challenge - Nurburgring 24H. According to this, it takes 13 minutes 35 seconds to win the race.
452,700 Cr + 200% Bonus = 905,400 Cr. per race
905,173.5 Cr + 200% Bonus = 1,810,347 Cr. Performance Difference Adjustment
905,400 Cr. + 1,810,347 Cr. = 2,715,747 Cr or 12,069,987 Cr/Hour
It takes 1.66 hours to get the most expensive cars which cost 20,000,000 Cr
Gran Turismo 6 (Prime)
The fastest way to get money was by doing the Red Bull X2014 Standard Championship. According to this, it takes 27 minutes to win the championship.
130,000 Cr. + 200% Bonus = 260.000 Cr per race
500,000 Cr. + 200% Bonus = 1,000,000 Cr championship prize
260,000 Cr x 5 + 1,000,000 Cr = 2,300,000 Cr or 5,111,111 Cr/Hour
It takes 4 hours to get the most expensive cars which cost 20,000,000 Cr
Gran Turismo Sport
The fastest way to get money was by doing the Group 1 Cup - Monza. According to this, it takes 9 minutes to win the race
330,000 Cr per race or 2,200,000 Cr/Hour
It takes 9 hours to get the most expensive cars which cost 20,000,000 Cr
Gran Turismo 7
There is no consensus on what is the fastest way to earn credits. However, many mention that Dirt Champions is the fastest way to earn money.
60,000 Cr per race (including clean race bonus + 30 second menus) or 818,181 Cr/Hour
It takes 24.4 Hours to get the most expensive cars which cost 20,000,000 Cr
Comparison of money percentages per hour
GT4: 47% per hour
GT5: 60% per hour
GT6: 26% per hour
GTS: 11% per hour
GT7: 4% per hour
Grimm6Jack
(Banned)
- 1,535
- Setubal, Portugal
- Grimm66Jack
Nice effort there. But some numbers are clearly off. The GT4 B-Spec event earns you more per hour by skipping one race (the longest to save time, I think it was Opera Paris) and it takes about 12 minutes using the Abt Audi TT or the CLK Touring Car fully tuned in B-Spec. About 3 minutes per race or less with B-Spec x3.
The GT6 Red Bull, you also need to skip a race to be more effective, I would always skip Silverstone as it was the longest, and it didn't take anywhere near 27 minutes...
I never heard about that Ferrari race in GT5 earning you more credits... In fact, aside from endurances and seasonal events, I don't remember any single race in GT5 paying anywhere near 400k. You maybe confused?
I didn't bother with GT Sport because it's not a main title and credits hardly made a difference in the game. It's still funny how you can earn them easier there and even sell cars.
EDIT: That Ferrari race was a seasonal event. I didn't count those because they are dead. But I should've taken them into account in terms of grinding during the game's prime. Unfortunately I don't have any seasonal races documented.
This again, would make GT7's grind look even more like a joke in comparison.
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- 13,879
- Adelaide
- Neomone
Invitations to buy limited edition cars are absolutely a thing in real life. That doesn't mean it's a good gameplay mechanic.
In real life there's only a limited number of Ferrari 250 GTOs, but the game wouldn't be better if it limited the number of 250 GTOs that could be in circulation amongst all players. Realism with regard to driving mechanics is one thing, but in a video game that is supposed to be entertainment realism with regards to the difficulties of car purchase and ownership isn't really helpful.
Especially since real life invitations aren't usually random, you'll be specifically chosen. That would track with things like having certain cars unlocked at a given collector level or after completing certain achievements. If you couldn't buy a La Ferrari until you'd won at least three races in a Ferrari, that might be kind of cute.
Don't do this. As much as people seem to like to pretend that GTS wasn't a real release, it's as much a mainline title as GT1 or GT3. The only argument against it is it was called "Sport" instead of a number, which is weaksauce.
Realistically, GT7 took about 4 years and 4 months to release after the last major series iteration. And given that some part of the company's resources during that time went into continued support of GTS, I'd suggest that the man hours that went into making GT7 are probably not so dissimilar to what went into making GT4.
I'd suggest if you're doing it while watching TV it's not that engaging, and if you're only using half your attention to play the game it's unlikely to be stretching your skills to the point of improvement either.
Don't get me wrong, I've absolutely done this with games too in order to get through boring sections or grind out the necessary resources. I'm just not arguing that those games are being engaging or improving my skills. It's something that needs to be done to get to the more fun things, which is what some people might call a chore.
Grimm6Jack
(Banned)
- 1,535
- Setubal, Portugal
- Grimm66Jack
Except that most (the core aspects especially) things done for GT Sport were ported over to GT7... HUD and most of the UI, physics were just improved upon GT Sport, same for graphics and especially the cars ported that again received better modelling as well.
GT7 was already in development even with the release of GT Sport.
GT Sport was basically a prologue. And strictly speaking, just look at how it was at launch. Barebones pretty much.
The only argument that can be used is the extra effort PD put into making the SINGLE PLAYER events in GT Sport because of playerbase demand. All rest that was developed for GT Sport, is basically what is in GT7 but further polished. I'm the one who should tell you to not be fooled by GT Sport being a main title release. It wasn't... That's why it was called Sport in the first place. Still, making events should not take that much time from those years they had. So, not really an excuse.
I would even go as far to say GT Sport was a test bench for GT7.
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- 2,099
- Zimbabwe
Pretty much this.
The invitation concept itself would have been fine if the roulette wheel weren't the only way to receive them.
1. Make the invitations effort based (could be own a certain number of cars, win a certain number of races, or drive a certain distance, or hey why not go the extra mile and add manufacturer events that take inspiration from the real life racing history of these marques)
2. Make the invitations permanent once earned and remove the FOMO timer
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- 7,130
- Jakarta
Was this before the big 4 high paying events?
I've played every generation of GT and GT7 is definitely on a different level when it comes to grinding. You literally have to play the same few races over and over again for months to collect the cars because the others don't pay well.
And once you collect certain cars you end up not driving them because they don't win races so you can continue to grind for more cars. Without glitches, some features like engine swaps are simply not possible due to the extremely poor odds.
And once you collect certain cars you end up not driving them because they don't win races so you can continue to grind for more cars. Without glitches, some features like engine swaps are simply not possible due to the extremely poor odds.
- 13,879
- Adelaide
- Neomone
And GT6 was mostly just an improved GT5. And GT4 was mostly just an improved GT3. And GT2 was mostly just an improved GT1.
So are we writing off GT6, 4 and 2 as well as Sport?
Development of any long running series like this is always going to see technology and assets shared between games to a greater or lesser degree. It's generally to a greater degree on games that share a platform, like GTS and GT7 do.
That doesn't make GTS a prologue. It is and was a full game.
You might feel like that if you're comparing it to GT6 or GT4. But if you were comparing it to GT3 and GT1 you might think that it's a reasonable release of an online focused game. And if you compared it to GT4P, GTHD and GT5P Spec I, you'd have a real hard time making a strong comparison between what were basically big demo discs.
When was the last time you actually played one of the Prologues or Concept discs? I love GT5P, I think it's one of Polyphony's best releases. But it is tiny, and it's the biggest one. 37 cars and 6 tracks at release.
Is this really the totality of your reasoning? It has "Sport" in the name and feels small?
Despite it being the sole release from the studio for several years?
Despite Kaz himself saying "GT SPORT is a regular title of the GT Series. The gaming contents is so ample that you can consider it as ”Gran Turismo 7“. It is titled ” GT Sport“ because the “Sport Mode” of the game is important. If I have to change a statement，maybe “Gran Turismo 7 Sport” is more correct name" and "For me, Gran Turismo Sport is Gran Turismo 7. Gran Turismo Sport is something that marks the beginning of a new generation or era. When you consider Gran Turismo 1-6 as the first era, GT Sport marks a new generation moving forward"?
I'm sure you know better than the guy who made the game. GTS is and was intended as a full release, and has more than enough content to be fairly considered as such. Stop being butthurt that we went from 1200 cars to 168.
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1. I haven't a clue. But was the "entire economy" really changed? I don't recall that.
2. What have roulette tickets go to do with MTX? I don't feel remotely influenced by them to spend more
3. Who knows? To give the game an element of randomness? To make you work for your rewards?
4. See 3.
5. See 3
6. Supposedly coming soon. Eventually. Some time.
"Nobody is dealing in absolutes?" Ahem. That itself is an absolute statement.
MTX are a fact of life. If they are done well they allow the player a chance to buy something which isn't essential to complete the game but which improves the experience. That can be a rational decision where we can make a grown-up decision which isn't being forced on us.
But they can also be done badly. Multiplayer games where MTX allow you to buy an uber character or weapon. Games where you need an MTX to make progress or avoid an extreme grind. MTX aimed at kids. Manipulative MTX.
Which category does GT7 fall into? Personally, I think it's a little bit of the good and a little bit of the bad. As far as I can tell, almost every race can be won with a car that doesn't cost a ridiculous amount. I've never felt compelled to grind or use MTX to make progress in the game.
That said, it is a pain that you can't "complete" the game without grind/MTX, if you consider getting all the cars to be completing the game. Does that make GT7 a "bad" game? Not for me, but YMMV. I ignore the bits I don't like and focus on the elements that I do like.
As an example I don't like the way that rallying is done in the game, but that doesn't ruin the game for me. I do the bare minimum of rallying to get by and no more.
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