Aliens

  • Thread starter Exorcet
  • 2,385 comments
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Is there extraterrestrial life?

  • Yes, and they are not Earth like creatures (non carbon based)

    Votes: 19 2.5%
  • Yes, and they are not Earth like creatures (carbon based)

    Votes: 25 3.3%
  • Yes, and they are not Earth like creatures (carbon and non carbon based)

    Votes: 82 10.8%
  • Yes, and they are humanoid creatures

    Votes: 39 5.1%
  • Yes, and they are those associated with abductions

    Votes: 19 2.5%
  • Yes, but I don't know what they'd be like

    Votes: 379 49.8%
  • Maybe

    Votes: 151 19.8%
  • No, they only exist in movies

    Votes: 47 6.2%

  • Total voters
    761
Since they discovered Water on the Moon, their could be some amoebic-style life forms in a small lake there. However, if they bring back a sample they need to be careful that they don't bring over a super-deadly virus that could kill the whole of humanity.
 
I think it's likely aliens exist on other planets, but it's unlikely they have visited Earth due to the vast distances and energy required to visit.

The real question is, after accounting for hoaxes and mis-identifications, what is the explanation for UFO's, and the life-like behavior they sometimes seem to exhibit?

Most UFO's are seen as balls of light, often orange, sometimes multi-colored, which appear mysteriously, move around in apparently intelligent fashion, then disappear just as mysteriously. Sometimes UFO's like this are seen to rise periodically from a particular place, like a mountain, ridge-line, fjord or other body of water. I have had such a sighting. It was long ago, and numerous other people also saw it, so it was real.

My own explanation is that these are not aliens, but life-forms native to the Earth, and preceding Man in seniority. My understanding is that they are made of plasma.
 
I think it's likely aliens exist on other planets
But then they'd be indigenous—until they get here.

My own explanation is [...] that they are made of plasma.
Err, that's like saying you think fish are made of water or humans are made of sand.

And while inscrutably, humans are mostly water (and carbon), plasma in the context you use it—is essentially meaningless.
 
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UFO's are seen to change shape on occasion. They will split into pieces, or divide off into multiple objects, morph or change shape completely. This quality of shapeshifting might be better understood by invoking the 4th state of matter, plasma.

A friend of mine in the American midwest had an encounter with ball lightning once. Lightning is a form of plasma. She was standing in the kitchen of her farmhouse after a thunderstorm. A ball of glowing blue light, about the size of a grapefruit, came bouncing and rolling across her yard. It came right through the door as if it wasn't there, then bounded into the oven where it exploded with a loud bang. No damage at all was done.
 
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The only evidence we have that points to what alien life might be like is what has happened here. I'd imagine life would be identifiably similar to Earth life, in terms of chemical makeup. There seems to be a fairly narrow band of appropriate environments that can sustain life, seen by it's absence in the immediate solar system, and how easily species can become extinct during very subtle climate or ecological shifts. There might be far more wild non-carbon forms of life, but that is drawing an infinitely longer bow.
 
Absolutely true, mate!

Evidence and proof of most wild claims are sadly lacking.

Anomalies and one-time irreproducible events can never be considered as science.
 
Why would life on other planets need to have conditions similar to Earth? Just because that's all we are aware of doesn't mean that's the only conditions life can exist.
 
Why would life on other planets need to have conditions similar to Earth? Just because that's all we are aware of doesn't mean that's the only conditions life can exist.

Similar? Maybe not-- but almost certainly providing similar foundations. Similar foundations, thusly, are not unreasonable to assume to provide similar outcomes.

Furthermore, the closest hypothesized alternative to carbon-based lifeforms is often silicon based lifeforms; problematically, however, silicon is oxidized into sand. . .

UFO's are seen to change shape on occasion. They will split into pieces, or divide off into multiple objects, morph or change shape completely. This quality of shapeshifting might be better understood by invoking the 4th state of matter, plasma.
Unidentified Flying Objects and alien life are not to be conflated with each other.

A friend of mine in the American midwest had an encounter with ball lightning once. Lightning is a form of plasma. She was standing in the kitchen of her farmhouse after a thunderstorm. A ball of glowing blue light, about the size of a grapefruit, came bouncing and rolling across her yard. It came right through the door as if it wasn't there, then bounded into the oven where it exploded with a loud bang. No damage at all was done.

. . . And what you describe here sounds like it was neither flying nor a lifeform, let alone alien.

(And life-forms, after all, are cellular beings capable of reproduction & requiring sustenance—not abstract quasi-sentient blobs of gasseo-liquified matter.)
 
Why would life on other planets need to have conditions similar to Earth? Just because that's all we are aware of doesn't mean that's the only conditions life can exist.

Of course, vastly different forms of life may well exist, but its far more scientifically likely that given the data we have (Earth), that other planets that support life would be similar. Of course, if you have a data set of various other types of planets that are known to support life, you have yourself an argument.

We could say that its actually quite likely that given what we know, life similar to what is on Earth probably does exist somewhere else, but we can't make such a statement regarding life of other types, regardless of the reality. Earth-like life might be really rare, and crazy non-carbon life forms far more common, but we just can't assume that going by what we know.
 
Of course, vastly different forms of life may well exist, but its far more scientifically likely that given the data we have (Earth), that other planets that support life would be similar. Of course, if you have a data set of various other types of planets that are known to support life, you have yourself an argument.
Life vs life as we know it is what Joey is pointing out. To think life must be life as we know it is very specist, and the fact that it is what we mostly look for leaves a large chance that we may miss other life.

An example of this is that we once believed all life forms had to be part of a cycle that derived its initial energy from a source similar to the sun. Then we managed to be able to explore deep enough in the ocean to discover entire life cycles thriving without any energy from the sun ever having come into contact with them. Suddenly every icy moon with the potential for geothermal energy is also a potential source of life, opening up a large chunk of our very own solar system as possibilities.

We could say that its actually quite likely that given what we know, life similar to what is on Earth probably does exist somewhere else, but we can't make such a statement regarding life of other types, regardless of the reality. Earth-like life might be really rare, and crazy non-carbon life forms far more common, but we just can't assume that going by what we know.
True, we can only look for what we know, but it is very dangerous to ever assume that what we don't know doesn't exist where we aren't looking. It is that thinking that once made people think that rancid food spawned lifeforms in the form of worms, or assume disease was the cause of curses or too much blood.
 
Life vs life as we know it is what Joey is pointing out. To think life must be life as we know it is very specist, and the fact that it is what we mostly look for leaves a large chance that we may miss other life.
Specist, lol. Implying we're looking at things in an emotional context. I'm simply laying out the data we have, statistically.

An example of this is that we once believed all life forms had to be part of a cycle that derived its initial energy from a source similar to the sun. Then we managed to be able to explore deep enough in the ocean to discover entire life cycles thriving without any energy from the sun ever having come into contact with them. Suddenly every icy moon with the potential for geothermal energy is also a potential source of life, opening up a large chunk of our very own solar system as possibilities.
This is still Earth-like life. But I know what you're saying. I'm not however, advocating not looking for many and varied types of life. I'm not even talking about whether we're trying to find other life. I've only covered what types of life might be more likely to exist, simply given the data we have - and in the same post acknowledging that data may not be indicative of overall trends. Of course its all unknowns, where nothing should be discounted.

But if we are trying to find other life - it still makes sense the first places worth looking are planets similar to our own.

True, we can only look for what we know, but it is very dangerous to ever assume that what we don't know doesn't exist where we aren't looking. It is that thinking that once made people think that rancid food spawned lifeforms in the form of worms, or assume disease was the cause of curses or too much blood.
This is just reading into things far too much - think I covered it above.
 
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discover entire life cycles thriving without any energy from the sun ever having come into contact with them

And yet, they're still oxygen-requiring, carbon-based lifeforms.

Besides, scientists have long known about lifeforms not requiring light, UVA or UVB rays (as well as those that can tolerate radiation in extremes).
 
Specist, lol. Implying we're looking at things in an emotional context. I'm simply laying out the data we have, statistically.
It is a reference to Arthur C Clarke's Rama Revealed (4th book in the Rama series), when the humans notice alien species that are living in the vacuum of space and their guide explains that humans have always been specist (or was it atmospherist? It's been a while) in their search for life.

Anyway, I am holding out for Cybertronians.
 
Of course I admire and approve of people who use science and logic as touchstones in the understanding and explanation of the unknown. I have always tried to use this approach myself, as I have found it helpful in dealing with the ultimate realities inherent in dangerous activities such as high altitude mountaineering and race car driving.

However, for me, the picture becomes murkier when confronted by direct first person experience which doesn't fit neatly with consensus reality and mainstream undergraduate science courses. For six decades, polls have consistently shown that only 10-15% of respondents admit to have personally witnessing a UFO. So it's not easy to reconcile this experience with either science or with the direct experience of many others.

My first and by far my most intense UFO experience involved 3 generations of my family witnessing a nearby large glowing ball of light which divided itself into numerous multi-colored balls of light which performed apparently intelligently guided geometric maneuvers for an extended period of time. This display was witnessed by unrelated parties over a wide area, and took place in a rural area of the State of Washington back in the 1960's. The feeling involved was overwhelmingly that of being in the presence of a being, or beings, of far greater power than humans. I hesitate to say that the experience was a religious one, but it was akin to that. I was not religious at the time, and am not today. I do admit to a cautious view of humanity and its foibles over history. I'm Libertarian, with a healthy suspicion of authority.

Since that time, I have assiduously researched this phenomenon. I've witnessed the phenomenon on a small additional number of occasions. I've read literally hundreds of books, most garbage, and thousands of articles, again mostly garbage. My favorite authors on this subject are Jacques Vallee and John Keel.

My tentative conclusion, as stated earlier, is that these are not aliens, but a natural, native-to-Earth life-form which is not yet properly understood by science. In Australia they may be known as Min min lights. In Norway they are known as Hessdalen lights. In Texas there is a phenomenon known as the Marfa lights. In North Carolina there are Brown Mountain lights. At the Yakima Indian Reservation straddling Washington's Cascade mountains, fire-watchers for decades have officially noted glowing orange balls rising from and running along ridge lines. When curious humans have approached these kinds of lights too closely, weird and disturbing psychological effects sometimes occur, including fear, paranoia, and poltergeist-type effects. Tests in University laboratory settings have shown that test subjects can experience similar hallucinogenic effects when subjected to strong magnetic fields.
 
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My first and by far my most intense UFO experience involved 3 generations of my family witnessing a nearby large glowing ball of light which divided itself into numerous multi-colored balls of light which performed apparently intelligently guided geometric maneuvers for an extended period of time. This display was witnessed by unrelated parties over a wide area, and took place in a rural area of the State of Washington back in the 60's. The feeling involved was overwhelmingly that of being in the presence of a being, or beings, of far greater power than humans. I hesitate to say that the experience was a religious one, but it was akin to that. I was not religious at the time, and am not today. I do admit to a cautious view humanity and its foibles over history. I'm Libertarian, with a healthy suspicion of authority.

Has any of your research led you to a possible reason behind the behaviors of whatever is behind your experience?

I've always been curious about the illogical behavior of so called alien ships/UFO's. They're hardly ever aerodynamic, have clusters of seemingly useless lights, have odd sizes, etc. I'm sure that whatever you saw has an explanation, though I doubt it's a life form. If there was an advanced race on Earth, why would they hide? If their actions are an attempt at contact, why not call the UN? Or land in Central Park, on top of the Eiffel Tower, in the middle of Tokyo; someplace where some huge population of people would see them for extended periods of time.
 
People a lot smarter and more experienced than I have speculated about the strange, ephemeral, elusive and frankly absurd behavior of UFO's and UFO entities.

Both Vallee and Keel found that UFO's have been around for a long, long time. Before modern man, at least. Vallee concluded that they are some type of control mechanism, similar to a thermostat, manipulating Man's belief systems and mythological frame of reference over long time periods. Keel felt that they are essentially tricksters playing cosmic jokes on manipulable humans.
 
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I wonder if the flashes of light coming up from a lake mentioned earlier are the Loch Ness Monster's cousins simply lighting up a spliff? That'd solve two myths in one go.

Then we'd just have to find out how it rolled a joint without opposable thumbs.
 
I wonder if the flashes of light coming up from a lake mentioned earlier are the Loch Ness Monster's cousins simply lighting up a spliff? That'd solve two myths in one go.

Then we'd just have to find out how it rolled a joint without opposable thumbs.

I assume it did that underwater as well.... So that would be an unsolved mystery as well :sly:
 
Things like the pyramids baffle me, especially with the technology they didnt have at the time to build them. i stick with the alien theory!
 
If their actions are an attempt at contact, why not call the UN? Or land in Central Park, on top of the Eiffel Tower, in the middle of Tokyo; someplace where some huge population of people would see them for extended periods of time.

At Fatima, Portugal in 1917, approximately 70,000 people gathered under rainy skies in fields of mud to witness 3 illiterate children's claims of contact with the Virgin Mary. Among them were doctors, judges, policemen, church elders and government officials, many openly skeptical. Suddenly the clouds parted and a huge UFO whirled madly, throwing off every color of the rainbow in the view of all present. The sky cleared completely, the ground dried suddenly, and the air was suffused with the scent of roses. The apparition of "Mary" duly appeared to the children and vouchsafed certain secrets. The Vatican, the Pope and the bulk of Catholics today regard the supposed miracle as authentic. Thus are belief systems regulated and mythology created.

Last summer in China millions turned their gaze to the skies to witness the total eclipse of the sun. Many were astonished to see and photograph huge UFO's hovering above them. One, shaped like a walnut and of the "miles wide" variety hovered for an hour over a government astronomical observatory packed with top scientists and their best apparatus. Enough observations were made to require "more than a year" of analysis before the data could be released, according to Chinese government officials. Thus are belief systems regulated and mythology created anew.
 
Things like the pyramids baffle me, especially with the technology they didnt have at the time to build them. i stick with the alien theory!

If aliens built the pyramids wouldn't there be some archaeological data that supports it?
 
The pyramid/alien thing always makes me chuckle. Never underestimate the power of having hundreds of thousands of slaves to do your will...
 
The pyramid/alien thing always makes me chuckle. Never underestimate the power of having hundreds of thousands of slaves to do your will...

A large majority of the pyramid workers weren't slaves though, they were paid labourers. When the Nile was flooded thousands of farmers needed something to do so they built a big stone structure for their leader who claimed he was a god. This is not to say there weren't slaves though.

And this has only really been brought to the public's attention recently, so it is going to take a while to clear up the misconception that they were slaves. I think the Bible is to blame for that one.
 
Last summer in China millions turned their gaze to the skies to witness the total eclipse of the sun. Many were astonished to see and photograph huge UFO's hovering above them. One, shaped like a walnut and of the "miles wide" variety hovered for an hour over a government astronomical observatory packed with top scientists and their best apparatus. Enough observations were made to require "more than a year" of analysis before the data could be released, according to Chinese government officials. Thus are belief systems regulated and mythology created anew.

Sorry—where was BBC when this happened? And why isn't it all over the interwebz?

Enough observations were made to require "more than a year" of analysis before the data could be released
...as if "millions" of people around could be secured before their photos got uploaded. :rolleyes:
 
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/wor...e-study-footage-year-hopes-proving-alone.html

http://www.ufodigest.com/news/0909/UFO-development.php

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/new...ese-scientists-filmed-UFO-for-40-minutes.html

http://www.ufoevidence.org/topics/China.htm

http://www.allnewsweb.com/page8958954.php

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BTPTrOfaN0U

These are just a smattering of what's been posted on the internet regarding Chinese UFO's. It doesn't take much effort to find them, only the energy and willingness to try. A good daily source of such Forteana is the clippping service at www.anomalist.com
 
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