America - The Official Thread

[Dennisch]

I just saw that video.

That's attempted murder.

 

[Hayden]

It is when you work in South Central Los Angeles or in and around downtown. Plus we also do things like train, work on the station eat. etc. But 24 hours away from home, is 24 hours away from home any way you slice it

I would agree that things are harder now. Still obtainable though if you make good, well thought out decisions. You might not get a house exactly where you want it or close to work though.

I still paid rent wherever I was. Even at my parents house. I didn't have to work as much as I did. But I didn't want a house in Riverside, California either. I wanted to be able to ride my bike to the beach to go surf, which took additional sacrifice to come up with the $$ to buy a house that was practically delapitated. When I was 20, an old-timer said to me "hey kid, you think that what you did or didn't do in high school matters now? If I were you, I'd keep it up for a few more years....your early 20's don't really matter either. What you do now, will affect the rest of your life". Or something like that. My parents said the same thing, so I listened. Not saying the way I went about stuff is "THE WAY". But it is a way. Which is why originally commented that it was sage advice.

While I agree, everything is relative. My parents first house was at an 18.5% interest rate. My first house was at 6.7%. The 50 year historical interest rate values are ~7%. I have a feeling we'll start seeing market adjustments in the usual areas to reflect that in the next 18-24 months. Building materials and labor though? Nope. Right now is the new benchmark moving forward.

And a "boomer mentality" is just that.... a mentality. Not in any way trying to link the two time periods together from a financial POV

I’m sorry, but I hate the mortgage rates that boomers always mention because it does not even come close to counteracting the difference.

Average house price 1980= $76.5K
Average mortgage rate= 14%
Weekly mortgage payment= $210
Average wage= $311 per week
Mortgage % of income = 67.5%
1 loaf of bread = 54c

Average house price 2000= $312K
Average mortgage rate= 8.05%
Weekly mortgage payment= $531
Average wage= $668 per week
Mortgage % of income = 79.5%
1 Loaf of bread = $1.37

Average house price today= $1.1M
Average mortgage rate= $6%
Weekly mortgage payment= $1522
Average wage= $1344 per week
Mortgage % of income = 113.2 %
1 Loaf of bread = $3.06

Increase in wages 1980-2022 = 432%
Increase in housing 1980-2022 = 1438%
Increase in bread 1980-2022 = 566%

All figures are for Australia and found (very easily) on google.

In a modern world where even bread costs more of your wage than it used to, your supposed to be able to pay 13% more than you make every week to afford a house.

“Oh but you can choose a cheaper suburb.”
You always could, but the average wage could actually afford the average house “back in the day”.

The average wage now forces you to buy a below average house, in a below average suburb if (and this is a big if) you ever manage to save a 20% deposit ($220k) while genuinely renting without parental assistance. While the market continues to increase at an unbelievable rate. If you’re on a single income, you can pretty much give up on this dream right now.

There’s a lot more I could say on this topic, but the short version is “It’s considerably harder now than it used to be.”

 

[TexRex]

I'm surprised no one has posted this yet.

WARNING: GRAPHIC CONTENT

Spoiler

State trooper leaves suspect in car as it gets hit by train

A high-speed locomotive plowed into a parked police car with a handcuffed suspect in the back seat as at least one arresting officer ran for his life, a disturbing video released by Colorado police on Friday shows.

Yareni Rios-Gonzalez, 20, was locked in the cruiser, which was parked on tracks north of Platteville, Colorado, the evening of Sept. 16. She could see and hear the freight train coming and "tried frantically to get the officers' attention," personal injury lawyer Paul Wilkinson said. Rios-Gonzalez tried to escape from the car, but the doors were locked, Wilkinson said.

"She saw the whole thing coming and believed it to be the end," he said.

She sustained a head injury, broken arm, fractured sternum, nine broken ribs, broken teeth and injuries to her back and legs, Wilkinson said. She is conscious, able to speak and has been able to stand briefly. Her recovery will be long, Wilkinson said, but medical staff is hopeful she can leave the hospital sometime next week when she regains more mobility.

I did nearly a week ago.

Train hits police car, seriously injures detained woman

The Colorado Bureau of Investigation is investigating an incident where a woman suffered serious injuries while in police custody after a train hit the patrol car she was detained in.

kdvr.com

What kind of ****ing moron willingly stops their vehicle on train tracks, leaving behind another incapable of escaping it and the train about to hit it?

Oh, right...

 

[Yard_Sale]

I’m sorry, but I hate the mortgage rates that boomers always mention because it does not even come close to counteracting the difference.

Average house price 1980= $76.5K
Average mortgage rate= 14%
Weekly mortgage payment= $210
Average wage= $311 per week
Mortgage % of income = 67.5%
1 loaf of bread = 54c

Average house price 2000= $312K
Average mortgage rate= 8.05%
Weekly mortgage payment= $531
Average wage= $668 per week
Mortgage % of income = 79.5%
1 Loaf of bread = $1.37

Average house price today= $1.1M
Average mortgage rate= $6%
Weekly mortgage payment= $1522
Average wage= $1344 per week
Mortgage % of income = 113.2 %
1 Loaf of bread = $3.06

Increase in wages 1980-2022 = 432%
Increase in housing 1980-2022 = 1438%
Increase in bread 1980-2022 = 566%

All figures are for Australia and found (very easily) on google.

In a modern world where even bread costs more of your wage than it used to, your supposed to be able to pay 13% more than you make every week to afford a house.

“Oh but you can choose a cheaper suburb.”
You always could, but the average wage could actually afford the average house “back in the day”.

The average wage now forces you to buy a below average house, in a below average suburb if (and this is a big if) you ever manage to save a 20% deposit ($220k) while genuinely renting without parental assistance. While the market continues to increase at an unbelievable rate. If you’re on a single income, you can pretty much give up on this dream right now.

There’s a lot more I could say on this topic, but the short version is “It’s considerably harder now than it used to be.”

I can’t really speak to Australia as I’m not familiar with their economics. You’re not going to get much argument from me that generally speaking, purchasing power is down right now, globally among first world countries due to global inflation

Out of curiosity, I googled Australia’s housing market and came up with this:

Australian property bubble - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org

For better or worse, all the contributing factors make sense in regards to the inflated housing market out your way.

On another note, a book I read in my 20’s was “The World Is Flat” by Thomas Friedman. Was pretty eye opening and put a lot of things into perspective in terms of how economics work. I’d recommend it to anyone who is curious about that kind of stuff. It still feels like the rules of economics are changing before our very eyes currently. The next 5 years will be interesting to see how the global markets dig themselves out of this recession

 

[Northstar]

...



[Just some playful ribbing.]

I don't see how the Halloween Capital of the WORLD can be called the middle of nowhere!*

On a serious note it's pretty much smack in the middle of suburbia (which I guess could be considered the middle of nowhere in other regards). Currently my commute averages around 1-1.5 hours total a day, if I were to move to where houses are in my price range I would be looking at about 3 hours minimum a day.

*I've never understood how a couple parades and a handful of decorations is enough to give "us" that distinction, but I guess there's worse self-proclaimed titles out there so I won't complain too much. Plus the local bars usually have stuff going on all month.

 

[Blitz24]

I did nearly a week ago.

How would the police know that trains could possibly travel on railroad tracks?! It snuck up on them!

 

[DG_Silva]

Sorry @TexRex, missed that.

 

[TexRex]

Sorry @TexRex, missed that.

No biggie.

 

[FPV MIC]

I’m sorry, but I hate the mortgage rates that boomers always mention because it does not even come close to counteracting the difference.

Average house price 1980= $76.5K
Average mortgage rate= 14%
Weekly mortgage payment= $210
Average wage= $311 per week
Mortgage % of income = 67.5%
1 loaf of bread = 54c

Average house price 2000= $312K
Average mortgage rate= 8.05%
Weekly mortgage payment= $531
Average wage= $668 per week
Mortgage % of income = 79.5%
1 Loaf of bread = $1.37

Average house price today= $1.1M
Average mortgage rate= $6%
Weekly mortgage payment= $1522
Average wage= $1344 per week
Mortgage % of income = 113.2 %
1 Loaf of bread = $3.06

Increase in wages 1980-2022 = 432%
Increase in housing 1980-2022 = 1438%
Increase in bread 1980-2022 = 566%

All figures are for Australia and found (very easily) on google.

In a modern world where even bread costs more of your wage than it used to, your supposed to be able to pay 13% more than you make every week to afford a house.

“Oh but you can choose a cheaper suburb.”
You always could, but the average wage could actually afford the average house “back in the day”.

The average wage now forces you to buy a below average house, in a below average suburb if (and this is a big if) you ever manage to save a 20% deposit ($220k) while genuinely renting without parental assistance. While the market continues to increase at an unbelievable rate. If you’re on a single income, you can pretty much give up on this dream right now.

There’s a lot more I could say on this topic, but the short version is “It’s considerably harder now than it used to be.”

Where do you get you're bread? It's less than $2 for us.

Also, $1.1 million is more like Sydney and Melbourne prices not Australia as a whole ($920k https://www.abs.gov.au/statistics/e...nflation/total-value-dwellings/latest-release) from what I can see, and it's only about 700k - 750k here in SA.

I wouldn't be paying 6% interest either .

“Oh but you can choose a cheaper suburb.”
You always could, but the average wage could actually afford the average house “back in the day”.

From my anecdotal experience that's not true. Everyone I know bought where they could afford first, and then moved about 10 years later after a period of knuckling down and hammering out their payments... just like their kids are doing now.

 

[CodeRedR51]

Since we're talking pricing for things, and I am currently looking at apartments, I feel like mentioning that after a couple days of searching in the Chandler/Gilbert area (suburbs of Phoenix) the going rate for a typical apartment is now $1200-1800/mo for a studio or 1 bedroom. It's absurd.

There are A LOT of people moving here, houses are going up like weeds. I see more California plates every day than I can count on both hands. I feel like this is driving prices up a lot, and very quickly. Which makes me feel like I am in a sticky situation, having been at my current apartment (studio) since 2014 and am currently paying $945/mo. Definitely grandfathered in with that pricing because the asking price for the same apartment, as currently listed on their website, is $1440/mo. For a 588 sq/ft studio.

So I'm doing some heavy math (for me ) and some soul searching and trying to figure out how high I am willing to go for a new place. Bottom line, this sucks. Having your rent payment pretty much take a whole paycheck is not what I call ideal. Getting very hard these days to live on your own.

 

[UKMikey]

double post

 

[UKMikey]

Where do you get you're bread? It's less than $2 for us.

It's not @Hayden's bread. It's your national average.

Cost of Living in Australia

Average prices of more than 40 products and services in Australia. Prices of restaurants, food, transportation, utilities and housing are included.

www.numbeo.com

 

[Yard_Sale]

Since we're talking pricing for things, and I am currently looking at apartments, I feel like mentioning that after a couple days of searching in the Chandler/Gilbert area (suburbs of Phoenix) the going rate for a typical apartment is now $1200-1800/mo for a studio or 1 bedroom. It's absurd.

There are A LOT of people moving here, houses are going up like weeds. I see more California plates every day than I can count on both hands. I feel like this is driving prices up a lot, and very quickly. Which makes me feel like I am in a sticky situation, having been at my current apartment (studio) since 2014 and am currently paying $945/mo. Definitely grandfathered in with that pricing because the asking price for the same apartment, as currently listed on their website, is $1440/mo. For a 588 sq/ft studio.

So I'm doing some heavy math (for me ) and some soul searching and trying to figure out how high I am willing to go for a new place. Bottom line, this sucks. Having your rent payment pretty much take a while paycheck is not what I call ideal. Getting very hard these days to live on your own.

Like you correctly stated, a lot of the nations housing bubble can be linked to Californian's cashing out and moving elsewhere. Same for New Yorker's too, but its not to the extent of California. We've effectively ruined the markets of Arizona, Texas, Idaho, Utah, Montana and Nevada. Tennessee is next on the list, as with a slew of other mid-western states. Was in Phoenix 2 weeks ago watching my nephew play football. Went to Scottsdale to visit my Cousin and his family (also California transplants). Scottsdale is crazy how Boujee its gotten. Its like all of Orange County picked up and moved..... and brought their plastic surgeons and Porsche dealers with them. Love the Chandler area. Have raced out there a few times.

 

[Danoff]

Like you correctly stated, a lot of the nations housing bubble can be linked to Californian's cashing out and moving elsewhere.

If you stop and think about it, no that's not really possible. Not only does it ignore the prices of houses in California, it also ignores housing prices around the world.

 

[Yard_Sale]

If you stop and think about it, no that's not really possible. Not only does it ignore the prices of houses in California, it also ignores housing prices around the world.

Was referring to the United States. Probably should have thrown in an “ ‘ “ between the ‘n’ and the ‘s’.

Regardless, Californian’s have been jacking up housing markets in the western United States long before Covid came about and put everything on its head.

 

[McLaren]

Like you correctly stated, a lot of the nations housing bubble can be linked to Californian's cashing out and moving elsewhere. Same for New Yorker's too, but its not to the extent of California. We've effectively ruined the markets of Arizona, Texas, Idaho, Utah, Montana and Nevada. Tennessee is next on the list, as with a slew of other mid-western states. Was in Phoenix 2 weeks ago watching my nephew play football. Went to Scottsdale to visit my Cousin and his family (also California transplants). Scottsdale is crazy how Boujee its gotten. Its like all of Orange County picked up and moved..... and brought their plastic surgeons and Porsche dealers with them. Love the Chandler area. Have raced out there a few times.

Texas can share the blame. Abbott has literally bragged about & continuously invited corporations to move their headquarters & employees here from California for years.

Abbott, 64, has long made bashing California an important part of his political agenda, and he’s taken credit for luring California companies like Tesla Inc., Hewlett Packard Enterprise Co. and Oracle Corp. to the Lone Star State. In November, he released a video urging California shipping companies to move to Texas ports. “Escape California, everyone is doing it,” the video declared.

This is the same moron who cries, "Don't California my Texas" which empowers Texans here to hate on Californians even more whilst wanting those same Californians to boost the Texas economy (& his pockets).

Since early 2021, when a re-election bid was already a given, Abbott collected about $1.6 million from California donors,

Bloomberg - Are you a robot?

www.bloomberg.com

 

[Yard_Sale]

Texas can share the blame. Abbott has literally bragged about & continuously invited corporations to move their headquarters & employees here from California for years.


This is the same moron who cries, "Don't California my Texas" which empowers Texans here to hate on Californians even more whilst wanting those same Californians to boost the Texas economy (& his pockets).

Bloomberg - Are you a robot?

www.bloomberg.com

There’s definitely truth in this.



From what I saw, the “California Migration” started around 2005-2007 during the last housing bubble. Coincidentally the baby boomers were starting to retire, so a lot took their money and went to more tax-friendly states and or bought their dream homes elsewhere. Baja got a large influx of expats. Hawaii saw an influx. As did northern Idaho and some of the more well-to-do areas of Colorado and Utah. As far as Arizona, they went to Prescott, Flagstaff and Scottsdale. The greater Phoenix area including Tucson went up in value by proximity as some of the aforementioned areas got expensive (by this time, it was probably 2013-2016 and the market had all but recovered and rates were going down). I haven’t been to too many places in Texas, but it looks like the influx was around the San Antonio and Austin area (the tech boom out that way had a lot to do with it from what I read….makes sense, because this is when neighborhoods adjacent to west Los Angeles started to gentrify for the same reasons). Then Covid happened, and Californians spread like cancer. It’s really sad to see how other states got affected from us

 

[Danoff]

Was referring to the United States.

...when discussing something that is happening in Australia, the UK, Canada, and many other countries as well at the same time and for a lot of the same reasons. Again, price have not dropped in California (or Texas) in relation to the rest of the country due to some kind of exodus.

 

[Populuxe]

 

[UKMikey]

Iamjack'slackofsurprise.gif

 

[FPV MIC]

It's not @Hayden's bread. It's your national average.

Cost of Living in Australia

Average prices of more than 40 products and services in Australia. Prices of restaurants, food, transportation, utilities and housing are included.

www.numbeo.com

Other sites have it closer to 1.70 now which is what it is for me in my very average type situation. Housing prices in this search are much closer to what I would think is closer to the actual values as well. https://www.savings.com.au/savings-accounts/guide-to-the-cost-of-everyday-items-in-australia

2022 is also one of those years that is out of the ordinary so far. The whole Covid period has actually. I've seen the value of my property rise $200k in the last financial year (supposedly, which is a rise of 34.5% via my local councils valuation, although I'm extremely skeptical that it's really the case) but since then it's dropped $50k. Right now we're in a period of correction, which has been estimated that it could go as high as a 30% drop so there's no telling what the value will be by years end.

 

[UKMikey]

Guess it's okay provided everyone buys their bread from Woolworths.

 

[Yard_Sale]

...when discussing something that is happening in Australia, the UK, Canada, and many other countries as well at the same time and for a lot of the same reasons. Again, price have not dropped in California (or Texas) in relation to the rest of the country due to some kind of exodus.

Prices have not dropped in many places because it’s still a supply and demand problem. In California’s case, there’s still many more potential buyers than there are homes. And that’s new, first time buyers. Not buyers who are looking to move up, down, in, out, or sideways within the market. And once again, foreign and domestic investors who are buying up inventory (I have a couple stories about that). What we're seeing is houses staying on market for longer than a week, and bidding wars are becoming rarer. Prices will drop across the board once you start seeing houses staying on the market longer than 30 days across the board with a few exceptions of course. Then you’ll see price reductions on old inventory, followed by price “corrections” for new inventory. But then of course the rest will depend on what the banks do with interest rates. A 10% market Correction won't mean a whole lot if the interest rates keep ticking up. As the case with Texas, Idaho and Arizona; its still the same basic problem but a little more complicated. Supply and demand of course, but also costs of labor and materials to build new houses. The costs of labor is directly related to the shortage of skilled and basic labor. I don't think we're going to see a 2009-2011 ever again. I don't think the banks will be stupid enough to put themselves in that position again.

It doesn't take but a handful of Californians moving into a specific zip code to affect the price per square foot moving forward for future listings. Then that price will slowly creep up in a cycle.

The renters market will get affected as more and more people get priced out of homes, the renting market becomes more competitive. Nothing ground breaking there. In fact, if I was looking to move out of California, I'd leverage my house for a massive down payment then rent it out for 175% of what my current mortgage is.

As far as the issues in UK and abroad, without looking into the intricacies of their economies, my only logical guess would be inflation, credit rates, labor and regulations.

Idk.... maybe I'm not understanding your observation

 

[FPV MIC]

Guess it's okay provided everyone buys their bread from Woolworths.

80% shop at either Coles (35%) or Woolworths (45%) alone according to the information below, and that's not counting the other retail chains which when added brings it up to 95%. These are all similarly priced here. So yeah, most people do.

Supermarket statistics 2024

Finder collected statistics on supermarket spending in 2023 and found that 4 in 5 Australians are signed up to a supermarket rewards program.

www.finder.com.au

Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying things aren't hard now, I'm just balancing it out with it's always been hard. Edit: Anyone else remember 17% home loan interest rates in 1989?

 

[McLaren]

Speaking of DeSantis above, it might be gettin' spicey with infighting soon.

Sources familiar with the pair's interactions told The Washington Post the two haven't spoken in months, despite Trump once saying DeSantis would make a good Vice President if he changed up his ticket in 2024.

Privately, Trump now lambasts the man he once referred to as his "great friend," calling the Florida governor "ungrateful" for his earlier endorsement, The Washington Post reported.

"I made him," The Washington Post reported Trump told his aides while monitoring DeSantis' public appearances and polling numbers.

"I don't understand what happened here," The Washington Post reported Trump said of DeSantis' diminishing support. "I don't understand why he doesn't appreciate me more."

Trump has made similar comments before, criticizing DeSantis for his "dull personality."

Trump — who once endorsed DeSantis as his 'great friend' — slams the 'ungrateful' Florida governor, saying 'I made him,' report says

Donald Trump and Ron DeSantis, once allies, haven't spoken to each other in months as a potential 2024 presidential campaign rivalry brews.

www.businessinsider.com

 

[Yard_Sale]

Speaking of DeSantis above, it might be gettin' spicey with infighting soon.

Trump — who once endorsed DeSantis as his 'great friend' — slams the 'ungrateful' Florida governor, saying 'I made him,' report says

Donald Trump and Ron DeSantis, once allies, haven't spoken to each other in months as a potential 2024 presidential campaign rivalry brews.

www.businessinsider.com

If Trump is even able to run, I think you'll either see Tim Scott or Nikki Haley by his side. Tim Scott would be the better choice, but that will probably depend on how easy it will be to replace his seat in the Senate. A Trump-Desantis ticket would be the stupidest idea ever.

 

[McLaren]

If Trump is even able to run, I think you'll either see Tim Scott or Nikki Haley by his side. Tim Scott would be the better choice, but that will probably depend on how easy it will be to replace his seat in the Senate. A Trump-Desantis ticket would be the stupidest idea ever.

Doubtful. Scott doesn't play well with Trump's current standing voter base as the moderates & others leave him behind.

I give Scott credit for actually being able to convince Trump to delete/walk back his stance on areas regarding race which benefit the rest of us, but Trump as a whole being back in the White House is giant net-negative regardless.

 

[Yard_Sale]

Doubtful. Scott doesn't play well with Trump's current standing voter base as the moderates & others leave him behind.

I give Scott credit for actually being able to convince Trump to delete/walk back his stance on areas regarding race which benefit the rest of us, but Trump as a whole being back in the White House is giant net-negative regardless.

Agreed. Trump served his purpose in American politics. Its time for him to move aside. While I agree that Scott's moderate stance doesn't bode well with Trump's base, it would be Trumps only saving grace. Besides, you'll see people get behind their respective camps come game time (even if its begrudgingly). Despite what Gavin Newsom says, that dude is gonna run for president. The Dem's have to find a better candidate than him. His progressive agenda may play well in California, but it's not going to win national elections.

 

[McLaren]

Agreed. Trump served his purpose in American politics. Its time for him to move aside. While I agree that Scott's moderate stance doesn't bode well with Trump's base, it would be Trumps only saving grace. Besides, you'll see people get behind their respective camps come game time (even if its begrudgingly). Despite what Gavin Newsom says, that dude is gonna run for president. The Dem's have to find a better candidate than him. His progressive agenda may play well in California, but it's not going to win national elections.

Depends on Biden. Newsom won't run against a sitting President & Biden seems to lean more into running again than stepping aside.

Thing is, a bunch of Dems are open about not wanting Biden to be back, but he's on a streak right now w/ a rising approval rating & if he starts accomplishing more goals and stopping Conservative over-reach (abortion rights), I could see him running again if momentum is behind him. 2 years is a while away though, so obviously so much could change on both sides.

 

[UKMikey]

It seems weird to me that Californians are supposed to be solely to blame for rising inflation, but only in America while everyone else seems to be facing similar problems without their input.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying things aren't hard now, I'm just balancing it out with it's always been hard. Edit: Anyone else remember 17% home loan interest rates in 1989?

I remember them from a few posts before yours. Wages and spending power were higher in real terms then according to the figures in the post. Man does not live by bread alone.

I’m sorry, but I hate the mortgage rates that boomers always mention because it does not even come close to counteracting the difference.