America - The Official Thread

  • Thread starter ///M-Spec
  • 40,452 comments
  • 1,847,394 views
sturk0167
Wrong
That's regret for getting a bachelor's degree in something stupid like philosophy, or eastern religion, which will never pay your bills.
Do you know how many people have to dig themselves out of a hole for making bad decisions?

Your position on student loan forgiveness is indefensible.
The rates are disclosed when they sign. The terms don't change just because you change your mind.

Try telling your bank you changed your mind on the loan for the Chevy Tahoe that you agreed to pay $85k for.
I'm talking about the real world. Gimme my free stuff doesn't work.
Click to expand...
I think the argument is that it's better - long term - for the US broadly to not have so many people functionally limited by debt they incurred when they were young (and possibly ill-advised) because those people could (not that most of them would) be able to...idk...invest in a new semiconductor plant or start a CRISPR lab in their garage or something. I've paid off nearly $100k in student loans, so I have some skin in this. The USA has such a strong economy partially because people are ambitious (verging on reckless) with spending their money on big ideas that sometimes work out and change the world.
 
One of the reasons I quit the car business is because as a finance manager, I was put under an obligation to sell people a certain add-on product that was worthless, and that they didn't need. Upper management used to joke about how ridiculous it was.
My conscience wouldn't allow me to continue with it. Oh, and the hours were awful.
 
lol

Screenshot-20240104-100205-Samsung-Internet.jpg
 
sturk0167
One of the reasons I quit the car business is because as a finance manager, I was put under an obligation to sell people a certain add-on product that was worthless, and that they didn't need. Upper management used to joke about how ridiculous it was.
My conscience wouldn't allow me to continue with it. Oh, and the hours were awful.
Click to expand...
Fairs....but could you answer my question?
 
I'll admit I don't know anything about student debt in the USA, but to me there's a massive difference in the premise of debt relief between a student and a new car purchase. One is a loan intended as an investment to generate wealth in future that can, ideally, cover the cost of the debt and generate wealth for the economy in the long term... The other is simply to allow a purchase that will normally never be anything other than a rapidly depreciating asset that probably can't cover it's own outstanding value at any point once it's rolled off the lot. The two just aren't analogous to me.

Having said that, I suppose it also depends on the availability of funding. If you've no viable choice but to accept inflated rates or otherwise unethical lending that's one thing... if the student loan market is anything like buying a car, then the loanee is the customer and should be able to drive a better deal from the loaner, but I assume being a student is more like being in debt with bad credit, you have no choice but to get ass ******* by lenders.
 
@sturk0167, I recall respecting your opinions on Sport Mode in GTS, but I also believe in a quote from the bible, as secular as I am:

“Even fools are thought wise if they keep silent, and discerning if they hold their tongues.”

-Proverbs 17:28
 
Boebert allegedly may have been using her hands on a man again.
On Sunday, Jayson Boebert told The Daily Beast that the details of the altercation on American Muckrakers was accurate and that his ex-wife had “punched” him in the face multiple times. Jayson Boebert also purported to have a witness to the events and said that he took back his claim that police were too aggressive with him: “I respect our officers and appreciate what they have to endure. I shouldn’t have said anything negative toward them. I was unhappy.”
....
Jayson Boebert “made a motion” towards his ex-wife, “to grab her.” It was “an aggressive move, not romantic,” the aide relayed.

As Lauren Boebert described it, the aide said, she tried again to keep him back and in the process “put her hand in his face, put her hand on his nose.” (The Muckrackers’ post describes a violent confrontation, with the congresswoman landing two punches on her ex’s nose. The aide said that Boebert maintains she didn’t punch him.)
Click to expand...
www.thedailybeast.com

Lauren Boebert’s Ex Called The Cops After Physical Fight in Public on Saturday Night

Police confirmed an “active investigation” into the incident, while a Boebert aide told The Daily Beast that the congresswoman was acting in self-defense.
www.thedailybeast.com
 
MatskiMonk
The two just aren't analogous to me.
Click to expand...
They're not analogous to anybody else with a brain either. But that doesn't register to somebody who believes in a punishment culture which is the foundation of decision making for American conservatives. They believe that achievement above and beyond what the previous generation has managed should be extremely difficult, nigh impossible. They believe a child or young adult's confidence should be torn down at every step of the way, scolded and belittled to the point of desiring achievement out of pure hatred for their elders rather than some sense of adventure or enjoyment or passion for learning. Not until the achievements are on paper should they get a pat on the back, but that's not a congratulatory smile on dad's face, that's a smirk, because dad know's he's saddled you with so much debt that you won't own a house until you inherit his, right after he finally admits you're smarter than him while laying in his deathbed. By that point, you've already accidentally been raising your child with this culture of punishment as well and it's so ingrained that it's not likely to change.

And that's how conservatives stay stupid generation after generation.
 
Keef
They're not analogous to anybody else with a brain either.
Click to expand...
That first sentence rendered the rest of your rant completely worthless.
If you can't see the similarity in repaying loans for different products, then nothing else you say makes any sense. :rolleyes:
 
sturk0167
If you can't see the similarity in repaying loans for different products, then nothing else you say makes any sense.
Click to expand...
There is of course a similarity to the structure of repaying debt, but the purpose is completely different - the value of the investment is completely different, to both the lender, and the the wider economy. Lending money to a smack head for his next hit is not the same as lending money to a cabbie to fix his taxi...

.. unless you think it is? ... I mean, do you?
 
Last edited:
MatskiMonk
There is of course a similarity to the structure of repaying debt, but the purpose is completely different - the value of the investment is completely different, to both the lender, and the the wider economy. Lending money to a smack head for his next hit is not the same as lending money to a cabbie to fix his taxi...

.. unless you think it is? ... I mean, do you?
Click to expand...
We're talking about the borrower. In any case, he's endeavored to repay.
 
sturk0167
We're talking about the borrower. In any case, he's endeavored to repay.
Click to expand...

Okay, so every debtor is equal in your eyes....

but really...

Which borrower would you lend your money to? A smack head after his next hit, or a cab driver that needed the money to generate his household income...

They're both equally required to pay back their debt.. but are they both equal?... and if they do who is benefitting?
 
Last edited:
MatskiMonk
Okay, so every debtor is equal in your eyes....

but really...

Which borrower would you lend your money to? A smack head after his next hit, or a cab driver that needed the money to generate his household income...

They're both equally required to pay back their debt.. but are they both equal?... and if they do who is benefitting?
Click to expand...
Cab driver
What point are you trying to make?
 
sturk0167
What point are you trying to make?
Click to expand...
That this...
sturk0167
Your position on student loan forgiveness is indefensible.
The rates are disclosed when they sign. The terms don't change just because you change your mind.

Try telling your bank you changed your mind on the loan for the Chevy Tahoe that you agreed to pay $85k for.
I'm talking about the real world. Gimme my free stuff doesn't work.
Click to expand...
.. is a **** analogy.

Not all debt is equal.

Saying loan forgiveness by the government (taking tax payer money and investing it in future skills, knowledge and development of the population of the nation) is the same as welching on a debt when trying to buy an SUV (creating debt in order to transfer individual wealth to a corporation)... it's not. And in the case of a car company needing government assistance to continue its contribution to the economy - that happened too, to the tune of fifty billion dollars for the makers of that Chevy Tahoe.
 
In the US, most (all?) student loan debt is held by the government. The government forgives this debt for military service, and potentially other forms of service. Government employees can also have their tuition paid while they're employees (not even in the military). This may be specific to certain government roles.

The idea that the government cannot waive this debt is silly. It can and does. In this case, the forgiveness was proposed in response to an emergency (the pandemic) and it makes fine sense as a means of assisting a group that was disproportionately harmed (graduates) by the emergency.

I don't understand the conservative soap box. I think it's mostly "I had it hard, so you should too", without considering how the situation of people who graduated during the pandemic might be different from others.
 
Last edited:
MatskiMonk
.. is a **** analogy
Click to expand...
I don't see why we should have a disconnect on this issue.
If you borrow money, you are obligated to pay it back. How could one argue otherwise? :confused:

I don't care if you get a loan to buy a farm, or to get a tattoo.
Either way, you should have the integrity to fulfill your debt.
 
Liquid
You are either deliberately being dishonest by ignoring how misselling, intimidation and extortion can potentially work or you were the most naive salesman ever.
Click to expand...
Fine. Default on your loans. See how that works out for you. Good luck 👍
 
sturk0167
I don't see why we should have a disconnect on this issue.
If you borrow money, you are obligated to pay it back. How could one argue otherwise? :confused:

I don't care if you get a loan to buy a farm, or to get a tattoo.
Either way, you should have the integrity to fulfill your debt.
Click to expand...

I suppose you'd say the same thing to someone who joined the army and got loan forgiveness - or some other kind of government work that qualifies for this?

Your creditor can decide not to require you to pay back your debt. In this case, the creditor did that because of the pandemic. This is not hard to follow.
 
Last edited:
Danoff
I suppose you'd say the same thing to someone who joined the army and got loan forgiveness - or some other kind of government work that qualifies for this?

Your creditor can decide not to require you to pay back your debt. In this case, the creditor did that because of the pandemic. This is not hard to follow.
Click to expand...
In this case, the creditor did that because of the pandemic. Biden did it to get votes.

Fixed it for ya. :)
 
Last edited:
Complex economic situation, my ass. Fake pandemic. You just have to look at it from the perspective of this guy...

IMG_20240118_182349.png


STOP ERASING OUR LOAN HISTORY !!1!!1!!!!
 
Last edited:
Liquid
You are either deliberately being dishonest by ignoring how misselling, intimidation and extortion can potentially work or you were the most naive salesman ever.
Click to expand...
Of course it’s naivety. He thinks all contracts are black & white yet for someone with as much time in our industry as he claimed, he quickly noped back to the GT forum once he was reminded dealerships can be sued for misleading people into contracts. He talks out his ass and tries to be cute when the discussion catches him for a loop before he leaves again. Same old song & dance.
 
McLaren
Of course it’s naivety. He thinks all contracts are black & white yet for someone with as much time in our industry as he claimed, he quickly noped back to the GT forum once he was reminded dealerships can be sued for misleading people into contracts. He talks out his ass and tries to be cute when the discussion catches him for a loop before he leaves again. Same old song & dance.
Click to expand...
Wrong. It's because I realized there weren't gonna be any legitimate counterpoints.
Tired Good Night GIF by MLB
 
He should've hired an actor instead.

From what I understand he was a fiscal conservative who balanced the books in his state while supporting same sex marriage and land conservation while expanding access to health care.
 
We're talking about student debt? My outstanding debt is half my salary. That in itself might not mean anything but what does mean something is this: My outstanding student debt is about how much money my company charges for one flight from LA to NYC. And I've flown a single person on that flight multiple times. That's how much revenue my education generates for the economy. In a single week at work I facilitate upwards of $500,000 exchanging hands and that's just the direct cost of the service to the customers. I wouldn't mind seeing a few more bucks of that, but alas.

I can afford to pay it back in time, but honestly I think my education has more than paid for itself and deserves to be written off. That's the opposite end of the spectrum from people who thought they were investing in their futures but have been unable to capitalize and are saddled with student debt. Point is, there are a lot of reasons why student debt is an unnecessary burden on individuals.
 
Last edited:

Similar threads

Ross
  • Poll
Britain - The Official Thread
444 445 446
Replies
13K
Views
625K
sirjim73
sirjim73
Harley45
What did you do in GT7 today?
452 453 454
Replies
14K
Views
766K
smoothbore12
smoothbore12
The_Greaser
Forza Motorsport (2023): The Bugfest Thread
2 3 4
Replies
96
Views
19K
UKMikey
UKMikey
Dotini
Trump's Legacy: the US Space Force and conservative judges
Replies
1
Views
838
Dotini
Dotini
Joey D
High Altitude Objects Over North America
2 3
Replies
77
Views
7K
TB
TB

Latest Posts

Back