Are Fictional Courses Good for the Gran Turismo Series?

[plate88]

I assume you both realize that it is far easier to make a good track yourself than it is to make a good track in real life, yes?
There is no contest between, say, El Capitan and Tsukuba, in regards to which one I would rather have in GT5. That Tsukuba is a real life track is about as close as can be to being meaningless in regards to which I actually enjoy driving on.

Being that GT games celebrate cars, why can't they celebrate tracks also with years of racing history? There are a few just not enough.

 

[Rico_S]

It's a driving simulator, not the real-life circuit simulator...
As long as the driving physics is applied to all the tracks, it's fine for us.

And as everyone said, it's better to bring ALL the fictional circuit from all previous GT series, since GT5 is only good at car variations, not tracks and events...

 

[Dazza-On-Toast]

I love both types and I'd rather drive 10 made up tracks than 1 real one (over and over) - Its good with the mix.

One other thought, Kaz has said he really loves Silverstone - I think it was going to be in, but they didn't due to it being remodelled for F1 racing, choosing to wait until the new track and pits complex were finished before either adding it as DLC for GT5 or as a new track for GT6. It'd work out cheaper than doing it twice. Just a thought.

 

[hamster1984]

The classics are great but I think GT5 dropped the ball on the new fantasy tracks. London, Madrid, and Eiger were a waste and just there for eyecandy. Even Indy and Daytona were kinda bad choices.

TOCA/Codemasters has shown a greater ability in giving better tracks. Spa, Montreal, and Bathurst are tracks that put 90% of GT's tracks to shame.

At this point, I just want to simulate driving on the same tracks I watch on tv.

 

[captaincrunch24]

I think a few fictional courses are okay but right now they oversaturate GT5's track roster. Also, PD needs to make better choices when in comes to which RW tracks to include. Indy, Daytona and Tsukuba are not that great in my opinion. They should be replaced w/Spa, Bathurst and Silverstone.

 

[Tornado]

I'll ask you the same question: What makes a real world track better than a fantasy track?

 

[Mynock005]

PD needs to create a track that has the following:

Daytona Road Course Turn 1
Corkscrew
Eau Rouge
Indianapolis Corners (from Le Sarthe)
Piscine
Becketts
Horseshoe (VIR)
Pflanzgarten
Infineon's Turns 1 and 2
Circuit of the America's Proposed Straight and Turn 12 Complex
Etc.

All in one track.

 

[Slurm]

I'm amazed I haven't seen anyone mention this yet, but GT1 was entirely fantasy tracks. For me they hold a place in my heart, and a big part of me will always see Gran Turismo as a fantasy game, based around real cars.

I actually wish the series would look back and draw much more inspiration from those first two games. I think it's all taken a rather boring turn getting caught up with hyper-true-to-life realism and involved with official race-series' licensing etc..

 

[shirakawaa]

The GT1 original track selection was small but had some kind of logic behind it. It progressed from courses having a hint of street racing to amateur club track racing to full "real[istic]" race tracks. In general the game clearly took inspiration from Best Motoring shows and Tokyo Expressway underground races.

Later GTs (starting from GT2) lost that touch, or better felt more like a random selection of courses from the entire world.
Recent GTs have become more "mature", but not in a way I'd consider that positive.

 

[jdc]

I prefer fantasy tracks. Why? Simple, I find real tracks to be incredibly boring. Over the years I've logged so many kilometers in so many racing games, that every time I crack open a new racing game that has a real world track in it, it's like I've been there before. There's nothing to learn. Nothing to memorize. How many times do you have to run Laguna Seca before the "challenge" of the "dreaded" corkscrew isn't there? Silverstone? One of THE most sleep-inducing tracks ever, and to have to run it multiple times in nearly every modern racing game is something that I don't look forward to, lol.

 

[shirakawaa]

Not to mention that most modern real FIA-spec race tracks that many people want to be included in GT5 are made with safety as a main priority, and are therefore boring in a simulator/racing game after the initial "wow! it's in the game!" factor.

 

[TURBOMATIZ]

Autumn ring totally awesome !!!!!!!!!!

 

[JTpwnface]

Fantasy tracks are great, they offer a needed variety. And a lot of which are very fun to drive too!

But I also agree, I'd like to see more real tracks too, like Mosport (yay! Canada!), Seabring, Spa, Imola, Dubai, etc...

I never had any of the previous GT games, so the real tracks aren't even close to being boring for me yet.

 

[hamster1984]

Whoever said Indy, Daytona, and Tsukuba were terrible choices is right on the money.

 

[JohnBM01]

I am still VERY surprised this topic is STILL being viewed on and commented on by people like you all! Something useful even into the future is what I try to accomplish in all things I post online, including message board posts. Having played this game for about a month, I can say that I actually like racing Cape Ring as well as Madrid. I see Madrid more like a touring car course. Madrid is one of my favorite cities in Spain, but the one problem- no pits! So this is probably a course not suited for a lot of laps. Though if you follow certain series, there are a number of series where pit stops are rather rare unless you have a serious problem. As for Cape Ring- racing that ring part of the Cape Ring circuit (the ones that feature the ring) is fun. Not sure whether it's more fun racing that part of the track clockwise or counterclockwise/anti-clockwise.

I still believe fantasy courses are great because you're providing experiences only YOU can provide. As long as the fantasy courses are of great quality or just as good as (or even better) real-world courses, you're winning in the fantasy course department. I probably wish more of the newer courses were more practical in GT5.

But once again, glad this discussion is still relevant even today. Thanks!

 

[OmniBreaker]

I know real world courses offer the better simulation because well, they're real. But c'mon, if the fantasy courses are well made (and this is GT, so expect nothing less), why prevent having variety? And it leaves a lot for the imagination.

 

[Crumpet]

You have a nice haircut.

 

[analog]

Madrid is one of my favorite cities in Spain, but the one problem- no pits! So this is probably a course not suited for a lot of laps. Though if you follow certain series, there are a number of series where pit stops are rather rare unless you have a serious problem.

Just to let you know, Madrid does have a pitlane (entry is before the final chicane on the regular version, on the main straight in the reverse version).
London however does not.

 

[andy63]

i would want a track from every country they have cars from same country.

 

[jv38]

I personally believe that the fantasy tracks in the GT series are not half bad. They have character and they are challenging without been impossible to drive. Most of them are more fun than some real tracks in the game.

 

[The Vanishing Boy]

-> ...

I never had any of the previous GT games, so the real tracks aren't even close to being boring for me yet.

^ Then you better check out this thread out. After taking a peek at it, your opinion might change a bit.

I know real world courses offer the better simulation because well, they're real. But c'mon, if the fantasy courses are well made (and this is GT, so expect nothing less), why prevent having variety? And it leaves a lot for the imagination.

^ I'd rather for PD to bring ALL their old creations back first. Then after that is done, PD can go back adding more tracks. I don't care if its Real Life or Original, just bring back all the missing tracks that I've mentioned on my other thread.

 

[JohnBM01]

Thanks for the haircut comment! ^_^

As for the "tracks from every country every car is from," I would CERTAINLY want to imagine tracks like Mantorp Park from Sweden, or (especially) Bathurst for Australia. You'd also have to take into account the Netherlands (Spyker), Belgium (Gillet), and Korea Republic (Hyundai, Oullim Motors (formerly Proto Motors)). Zandvoort or Assen would be nice for the Dutch car fans. Belgium would SURELY be represented by Spa-Francorchamps. As for the Korea Republic, I've only known two tracks before the Korean International Circuit came along- Everland Speedway and the Changwon Street Course that Formula 3 used to race. If you want to take it a step further, then imagine if Malaysia's Proton was featured in GT5 or in a future GT, I'd LOVE to take on Sepang in the GT realm.

 

[AlphaAndius]

Whoever said Indy, Daytona, and Tsukuba were terrible choices is right on the money.

I disagree with you on that matter, on the basis that for some of us, oval tracks offer a fun and thrill not found in regular circuit tracks; unadulterated speed and freedom that most circuits cannot possibly match. The idea of turns forcing me to slow down my car can be a bit of a killjoy for me sometimes.

In a nutshell, most regular circuit tracks are this; go, break, turn, go, break, turn, go, break, turn, go, break, turn, go, break, turn, go, break, turn,. There are times when this to me, translate to annoying interruptions (Especially when chicanes are present, the killjoy of racing).

Whilst oval tracks are this; GooooooooooooooOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO. Pure unadultarated speed, which is the whole point of building vehicles that are fast in the first place.

I for one am glad that oval tracks are included in this game, and that the two most famous and glorious ones, the Indianapolis and Daytona, were included in the roster of the Gran Turismo series. For a racing series that showcases a diverse universe of racing disciplines, it cannot exclude oval racing. I do pity those that have such a poor distaste on Indy and Dayto, unable to appreciate the great flavors out there. But oh well, I guess not all of us are born perfect....


Oh and on Tsukuba, I also disagree. It is an excellent track for a brief and quick race (And also drift race to!). It is understandable that it is an overused track, which naturally leads to a loathing of it. But then again, you would find any track annoying that is used like a bajillion times (Remember, GT5 is also the Tsukuba Simulator )

 

[Morgoth_666]

Actually, most ovals are in fact: go, brake, turn, go, brake, turn, go, brake, turn, go, brake, turn.

I don't have any problem with Indy and Daytona being there, although I hate the way they configured the chicane on the Daytona roval. I do wish that there were some shorter ovals as well though though, like a Milwaukee or Iowa or Bristol. Not sure why they got rid of Motegi, I don't mind the oval and quite like the road courses there. Some shorter ovals would help give much-needed variety to the NASCAR addition as well, most of the time they aren't just running flat out all day in the real world either.

 

[AlphaAndius]

Actually, most ovals are in fact: go, brake, turn, go, brake, turn, go, brake, turn, go, brake, turn.

I don't have any problem with Indy and Daytona being there, although I hate the way they configured the chicane on the Daytona roval. I do wish that there were some shorter ovals as well though though, like a Milwaukee or Iowa or Bristol. Not sure why they got rid of Motegi, I don't mind the oval and quite like the road courses there. Some shorter ovals would help give much-needed variety to the NASCAR addition as well, most of the time they aren't just running flat out all day in the real world either.

True true. However, it is a type of break and turn that insures a smooth and fast turn that does not kill the fast pace of the race. Its a break and turn that still insures a good ol GOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO in a race 👍 . It is only comparable to high speed turns like the ones found in Turn #1 in High Speed Ring. And it is dissapointing to me that whenever I look in the great racing leagues, such as F1, GT1 or WTCC, I have not seen any of their regular circuits feature such glorious turns that do not interrupt the pace of a race (When not on a roval that is).

Mmhh, yes, a half-mile oval circuit would be a cool addition, I would settle for a fictional one. And speaking of ovals, they soooo gotta add that Titan track that IS, the Test Course. XD

 

[Midnight Snacks]

I'd rather have Special Stage Route 11 than Indy Road Course.

 

[JohnBM01]

Ovals, whether you like them or not, are as much to tactically race as any road course or rally course. There's a reason why we have ovals in games like the Gran Turismo series. There's a reason why we have NASCAR stock cars in Gran Turismo 5. You may not like ovals (I am not saying I am an oval fanatic), but ovals and stock cars are every bit distinctive as, say... including the Nürburgring courses. I'm just speaking as an unbiased lover of racing. Sure, I love sportscar racing, but even I can appreciate the challenge and intrigue of oval racing.

Tsukuba is a challenge in itself. I appreciate the challenge of Tsukuba. It may be one of the most difficult short road courses in the world. Hell- pave a little more road, and you can turn Tsukuba into a tri-oval. I'm one to think that tracks don't have to be longer than eight miles and with 100,000 corners to be interesting. Certain tracks have certain levels of challenge to set themselves apart. Tsukuba is as different a challenge as Circuit de Monaco (Cote d'Azur), Spa-Francorchamps, Bathurst, and places like that. I'm not likening Tsukuba to Suzuka, but the track is there for a reason as far as challenge is concerned.

Of course, to each his/her own in regards to any track featured in the game...

 

[hamster1984]

Even though I don't like ovals, you still gotta admit the TOCA series had a better choice of ovals. They should have gone with either Indy or Daytona and then a picked a short track course. It allows people to understand that even stock car racing needs different skills for different tracks.

 

[shirakawaa]

Yes, one or two short ovals (say a 1-mile and a half-mile one, for example) would have been nice. They typically allow for closer, fast paced (not high-speed!) races. Also more cars would have been suitable for them than those for the included superspeedways (Daytona and Indianapolis).

 

[Paul2448]

Yes, one or two short ovals (say a 1-mile and a half-mile one, for example) would have been nice. They typically allow for closer, fast paced (not high-speed!) races. Also more cars would have been suitable for them than those for the included superspeedways (Daytona and Indianapolis).

The only problem with Half mile, 1 mile, and 1.5 mile cookie cutters is that they are limited. Where as Daytona has the famous 24 Hour course, and Indy has the F1 track, all other tracks are pretty much ovals, such as Bristol, Dover, Texas, and so on.

And even tracks with road courses, such as Pheonix, Homestead, Iowa, and Lowe's, the road course isn't that famous as other tracks in GT5, and wouldn't be desired by anyone, really.