Area 51, Aliens, and Oddities.

[Famine]

A sat. can only pass over the same point on the earth every 3 days, which is pretty easy for anyone to find out, but I would guess they do most of there testing at night.

Huh?

ISS does a full orbit every 31 minutes - and a satellite doesn't need to be directly overhead to see something.

The key question - as I just noticed in JohnBM01's **** 51 thread - is that IF that place is so secret and conducts all of these ultra-secret military tests with aliens and dragons, why does everyone know its name, where it is, what it does there and what it looks like from any one of the hundreds of thousands of satellite images available on the internet?

What's more likely is that it's just a prototype aeroplane test facility and while the conspiracy nuts focus all of their attention on it, they'll miss the orc/Omicronian hybrids being shipped into warehouses in Chicago.


Let's face it, in order to build a facility anywhere, you need expert help in architectural design, fabrication, utilities (water, gas, electricity, sewage removal), electronics and ICT, you need someone to bring you all of the stuff to build the place AND you need supplies once it is up and running - imagine the local stationers getting an order for "Groom Lake" personalised stationary... How easy is THAT to get hold of in the Middle of Bloody Nowhere, Arizona? Plus, how do you get an alien spaceship, too big to fit in a Galaxy, into an obvious airbase slap-bang in the middle of the desert, without all the nutjobs on a stakeout of the perimeter fence seeing it?


No - much easier to let the irrationals think that the USAF are building bogeymen at Nellis and drop the real freaky alien relics into the middle of D.C.

 

[Joey D]

According to the show I watched on the Discovery Channel I watched the other night they said the sat. will pass over the same spot every 3 days.

The key question - as I just noticed in JohnBM01's **** 51 thread - is that IF that place is so secret and conducts all of these ultra-secret military tests with aliens and dragons, why does everyone know its name, where it is, what it does there and what it looks like from any one of the hundreds of thousands of satellite images available on the internet?

As I said, they suggested hugh underground buildings. And the reason so many people are intrigued with it is because it is so black. The government did it to themselves by tell people who saw it that it wasn't there. I know if I saw something and the government said it wasn't real I would question it.

Let's face it, in order to build a facility anywhere, you need expert help in architectural design, fabrication, utilities (water, gas, electricity, sewage removal), electronics and ICT, you need someone to bring you all of the stuff to build the place AND you need supplies once it is up and running - imagine the local stationers getting an order for "Groom Lake" personalised stationary... How easy is THAT to get hold of in the Middle of Bloody Nowhere, Arizona? Plus, how do you get an alien spaceship, too big to fit in a Galaxy, into an obvious airbase slap-bang in the middle of the desert, without all the nutjobs on a stakeout of the perimeter fence seeing it?

It's by the town of Racheal, NV, which has electricity, water, sewer, all that stuff.

Also who says an alien craft has to be huge? It doesn't have to be, it can be any size.

 

[Famine]

According to the show I watched on the Discovery Channel I watched the other night they said the sat. will pass over the same spot every 3 days.

That may be true of ONE satellite, but there's literally thousands of orbiting electronics up there, going from geostationary to "absolutely zipping along".

As I said, they suggested hugh underground buildings.

Which would need to be excavated and built. By whom?

And where did all the waste rock go? Wouldn't you notice huge aggregates lorries trundling out of somewhere that officially didn't exist?

And the reason so many people are intrigued with it is because it is so black. The government did it to themselves by tell people who saw it that it wasn't there. I know if I saw something and the government said it wasn't real I would question it.

I know WHY people are intrigued by it - I'm just saying that it's irrational.

It's also a classic piece of misdirection - get the people who WANT to believe in such things focussed on a particular site, by putting big dogs, chainlink fences, MPs and "This place doesn't really exist" signs up everywhere, and they'll be too busy snooping there to notice anything anywhere else.

It's by the town of Racheal, NV, which has electricity, water, sewer, all that stuff.

All of which must be routed to the facility. Ever tried getting cable in the UK? It takes 4 days and if you're over 500 yards away, forget it. Imagine getting utilities companies to route sewers, cables, gas mains etc. from this town, however far away it is, to the base, and then disseminating the drains, sockets, gas points to all points on-site. Then saying that the place doesn't actually exist.

To build and maintain a facility like Groom Lake would take thousands of civilian contractors, engineers and builders.

Also who says an alien craft has to be huge? It doesn't have to be, it can be any size.

I didn't say it did - but have you seen how big OUR spacecraft are, and they aren't capable of interstellar flight. It stands to reason that something capable of powered interstellar flight isn't going to fit into your pocket (though, obviously, it might do). The point was, not all technological extraterrestrial artefacts - if they even exist at all - are going to be able to be flown into Groom Lake. It's logical to assume that some must arrive by other means (like, by road/rail) and that with all the conspiracy theorists clustered around it at all hours, it won't remain secret for long.

UNLESS all the secret stuff goes elsewhere while their attention is on Groom Lake.

 

[Joey D]

That may be true of ONE satellite, but there's literally thousands of orbiting electronics up there, going from geostationary to "absolutely zipping along".

I believe they were talking about Ikonos imaging sat.

Which would need to be excavated and built. By whom?

And where did all the waste rock go? Wouldn't you notice huge aggregates lorries trundling out of somewhere that officially didn't exist?

I'm merely regurgitating information I've read in books and seen on the Discovery Channel. I'm suggesting they might exsist, and if they did I wouldn't be surprised. But what did they do with the rocks? Groom Lake is surrounded by mountians, just dump the rocks there.

It's also a classic piece of misdirection - get the people who WANT to believe in such things focussed on a particular site, by putting big dogs, chainlink fences, MPs and "This place doesn't really exist" signs up everywhere, and they'll be too busy snooping there to notice anything anywhere else.

That seems logical, misdesception. But I still think they do some pretty black stuff at Area 51, but I guess if they did have alien spacecrafts they wouldn't be there per say.

All of which must be routed to the facility. Ever tried getting cable in the UK? It takes 4 days and if you're over 500 yards away, forget it. Imagine getting utilities companies to route sewers, cables, gas mains etc. from this town, however far away it is, to the base, and then disseminating the drains, sockets, gas points to all points on-site. Then saying that the place doesn't actually exist.

If I live in Michigan how in the hell would I know how it is to get cable in the UK? Anyways the base was built in in the 40's or 50's so I'm sure it was easier back then then it was now.

UNLESS all the secret stuff goes elsewhere while their attention is on Groom Lake.

It more then likely does, but then again it might just go there. We will never know.

 

[Famine]

But what did they do with the rocks? Groom Lake is surrounded by mountians, just dump the rocks there.

And can you find any evidence of dumped rocks - enough to allow for "huge underground buildings" - anywhere within the confines of the facility on the satellite imagery? Try Google Earth too. Groom Lake and the area is imaged to 1 metre resolution.

I've looked. I can't. If it's not dumped within the facility then they need lots of lorries - not to mention the excavation equipment which the US military doesn't typically carry and would have to be leased from civilian contractors (and imagine leasing something that size and not telling them where you're taking it) - to move the stuff.

Logistically, it's a nightmare to even contemplate.

That seems logical, misdesception. But I still think they do some pretty black stuff at Area 51, but I guess if they did have alien spacecrafts they wouldn't be there per say.

They do stuff just as weird at Langley and JPL. Again, like Groom Lake, we know where they are though.

If I live in Michigan how in the hell would I know how it is to get cable in the UK?

Well, because I explained it in the next sentence. You must be within 500 yards of an existing cable line and even then, just for a quarter-inch thick cable, you're looking at four days if you're lucky... Racheal seems to be over 40 miles away and they need to dig lines for gas, water, waste water and electricity (I see no overhead cables) - none of which can be done by the USAF without external civilian contractors.

Anyways the base was built in in the 40's or 50's so I'm sure it was easier back then then it was now.

It's much easier now. For a start you've got nationwide utility coverage and sophisticated digging and surveying equipment.

But it's still a pain in the arse to do.

It more then likely does, but then again it might just go there. We will never know.

As I said, with 24/7 conspiracy nut surveillance it'd be nigh-on impossible to take anything into or out of Groom Lake that didn't fit into a Galaxy.


The problems surrounding Area 51 as a viable base for alien-based technological advancement are myriad, but the greatest of these is that the place is ALWAYS watched. Which is why it's just so illogical to conduct it there - and why it's perfect to let people think you do, by denying it.

 

[Joey D]

And can you find any evidence of dumped rocks - enough to allow for "huge underground buildings" - anywhere within the confines of the facility on the satellite imagery? Try Google Earth too. Groom Lake and the area is imaged to 1 metre resolution.

I've looked. I can't. If it's not dumped within the facility then they need lots of lorries - not to mention the excavation equipment which the US military doesn't typically carry and would have to be leased from civilian contractors (and imagine leasing something that size and not telling them where you're taking it) - to move the stuff.

Logistically, it's a nightmare to even contemplate.

You can't assume they did it recently, hell they could have done it back in the 70's or 80's, and just dumped the rocks in differnt areas. I can't find anything, but then again we aren't thinking like these people would. Maybe these underground building aren't as massive as I think they are, maybe they are much smaller. I, you, no one but the people that work there know.

They do stuff just as weird at Langley and JPL. Again, like Groom Lake, we know where they are though.

They do weird stuff at a lot of places, but Area 51 just has more of an alure to people.

Well, because I explained it in the next sentence. You must be within 500 yards of an existing cable line and even then, just for a quarter-inch thick cable, you're looking at four days if you're lucky... Racheal seems to be over 40 miles away and they need to dig lines for gas, water, waste water and electricity (I see no overhead cables) - none of which can be done by the USAF without external civilian contractors.

Electricity is more then likely produced on the base, water may be supplied by a well, sewage could be dumped god knows where in the desert. But then again it could be supplied by others.

It's much easier now. For a start you've got nationwide utility coverage and sophisticated digging and surveying equipment.

But it's still a pain in the arse to do.

Oh I bet its a pain in the ass. But its not impossible.

 

[James2097]

I think the real area for super advanced research is central Australia. Americans have a big cooperation with Australia to do "weapons testing" here. NO one is even remotely around to see in the red centre... We also have an old rocket launching facility at Woomera, so we have a history of aerospacey kinda stuff occurring out of the public eye...

You could detonate a nuclear bomb in the middle of Australia and no ordinary Aussie in a populated area would notice. (It happened at Maralinga - many Aussies still don't know).

Central Australia would be the best place for this kind of advanced research. Australia is a VERY strong ally (perhaps the strongest?) to the US - operating much like America's 51st state at least militarily. The complete isolation from everyone (including crazy American conspiracy theorists) is also perfect. Also, Australians are too relaxed and preoccupied with surfing around the coast to notice. 👍

There are whole deserts in central Australia where no one goes cause we assume there is nothing there. It would risk your life too unnecessarily to go four wheel driving accross some areas... Some areas are so remote that there are no roads whatsoever...

We're told that the US is testing weapons systems etc in the center, but I haven't seen any pictures of what is actually going on - it seems even the media can't get there!

I don't think anything trippy is going on here, but hey it wouldn't be a bad idea if America is looking for Area 52!

 

[Zardoz]

...ISS does a full orbit every 31 minutes...

Actually, it's an hour and 32 minutes. I think the very shortest time for a full orbit, with the satellite's altitude just barely out of the atmosphere, is right at 90 minutes.

 

[vladimir]

Logistically, it's a nightmare to even contemplate.

a nightmare that was contemplated decades ago, before google earth, the internet or alienfans with strong binoculars came along...
so all the infrastructure isn't a problem since its already there.

area 51 is huge, its 16 kilometres from the facilities to the gates alone. you can't just walk up to a fence and look whats inside. and civilian contractors are flown in and out by plane to las vegas every day. they operate a bunch of 737s solely for that purpose.

i'm not saying that they have aliens and huge spaceships there, because if there are aliens and huge spaceships visiting us, they surely wouldn't let themselves be caught by some americans...they would rather get themselves some americans and examine them...or wait, i guess they would instead choose some more sophisticated europeans for that...

anyway, area 51 surely works as a good decoy as well and it is not the only or most secret facility in the states, but you shouldn't underestimate it. if you look to the left of it, there is a place as big as wales were they tested their nuclear wepaons. they don't even have to leave the place to get rid of excavation and however brilliant you are, you won't estimate the size of the underground facilities by examinging heaps of rubble via a crappy satellite image...

 

[Joey D]

i'm not saying that they have aliens and huge spaceships there, because if there are aliens and huge spaceships visiting us, they surely wouldn't let themselves be caught by some americans...they would rather get themselves some americans and examine them...or wait, i guess they would instead choose some more sophisticated europeans for that...

Why bring remarks like that into this thread? Just proving Europeans seems like they are better then everyone else.

Please leave out American bashing and what not, I'm sick of it.

 

[Plague.Ghost]

I heard the base is actually in plain view but is invisible so you see thru it and nobody ever knows its there and you cant prove it is cuz you cant see it and if you throw something over the fence to see if it hits something you get shot so you cant tell people about thats why there are no more stories about area 51 cuz nobody lives after seeing yup mmhmm.

 

[Joey D]

I heard the base is actually in plain view but is invisible so you see thru it and nobody ever knows its there and you cant prove it is cuz you cant see it and if you throw something over the fence to see if it hits something you get shot so you cant tell people about thats why there are no more stories about area 51 cuz nobody lives after seeing yup mmhmm.

Get out of my thread because you are just being an idiot. In fact get out of the opinion forum before you make yourself seem like a bigger jackass.

I try to have a serious discussion and it's people like you that make it pointless.

 

[Famine]

a crappy satellite image...

Not played about with GoogleEarth much, I guess?

Groom Lake, at 1 metre resolution:

 

[vladimir]

Why bring remarks like that into this thread? Just proving Europeans seems like they are better then everyone else.

Please leave out American bashing and what not, I'm sick of it.

it just proves that americans have no humour.



famine,

i've just found a pretty decent pile of rubble for you. its at:
37°41'31.47"N
115°56'32.18"W
about 500ft in height!

SW of it you can even find a small railway system...


and regarding your last post:
and from that you want to analyze heaps of earth in the desert?
anyway, if you want to move a little to the south from that point of view, you find all the earth moving equipment you want.

 

[Joey D]

Actually the new Ikonos sat. will be able to do it a half meter. So there will be better pictures of the base.

it just proves that americans have no humour.

I'm sick of American bashing and from now on I will be very blunt about the way I feel.

 

[Plague.Ghost]

Huh?

ISS does a full orbit every 31 minutes - and a satellite doesn't need to be directly overhead to see something.

The key question - as I just noticed in JohnBM01's **** 51 thread - is that IF that place is so secret and conducts all of these ultra-secret military tests with aliens and dragons, why does everyone know its name, where it is, what it does there and what it looks like from any one of the hundreds of thousands of satellite images available on the internet?

What's more likely is that it's just a prototype aeroplane test facility and while the conspiracy nuts focus all of their attention on it, they'll miss the orc/Omicronian hybrids being shipped into warehouses in Chicago.


Let's face it, in order to build a facility anywhere, you need expert help in architectural design, fabrication, utilities (water, gas, electricity, sewage removal), electronics and ICT, you need someone to bring you all of the stuff to build the place AND you need supplies once it is up and running - imagine the local stationers getting an order for "Groom Lake" personalised stationary... How easy is THAT to get hold of in the Middle of Bloody Nowhere, Arizona? Plus, how do you get an alien spaceship, too big to fit in a Galaxy, into an obvious airbase slap-bang in the middle of the desert, without all the nutjobs on a stakeout of the perimeter fence seeing it?


No - much easier to let the irrationals think that the USAF are building bogeymen at Nellis and drop the real freaky alien relics into the middle of D.C.

The world really is comming to an end. It's in Nevada.

 

[Plague.Ghost]

Get out of my thread because you are just being an idiot. In fact get out of the opinion forum before you make yourself seem like a bigger jackass.

I try to have a serious discussion and it's people like you that make it pointless.

Do you think I'm kidding? I like how I'm an idiot, and ostracized from your thread for paraphrasing someone else's opinions. Nice.

 

[Famine]

famine,

i've just found a pretty decent pile of rubble for you. its at:
37°41'31.47"N
115°56'32.18"W
about 500ft in height!

SW of it you can even find a small railway system...


and regarding your last post:
and from that you want to analyze heaps of earth in the desert?
anyway, if you want to move a little to the south from that point of view, you find all the earth moving equipment you want.

No - the point was that you referred to satellite imagery as "crappy" when in fact it is quite detailed. And this is just the stuff WE have, never mind "them".

Can't see this railway system though.

 

[Joey D]

Do you think I'm kidding? I like how I'm an idiot, and ostracized from your thread for paraphrasing someone else's opinions. Nice.

Opinion forum = no joking around

Can't see this railway system though.

Railway system? I can't find it either.

 

[Evolution.]

Here is some enlightenment for those of you too lazy to click a link...

Area 19..."The Real Area 51"

This story backs up Famines theory on using Area 51 as a big multi-billion dollar distraction while doing the real stuff over at some little place nobody cares about (ergo: Area 19). There are many puzzling questions about this, and this is one of my favorites:

What made Area 19 partially famous in the first place is that here is a huge 34.5 kilovolt powerline, which terminates right in the middle of Area 19, in the middle of nowhere. There is nothing that is "supposed" to be there in any NTS documents.

Now why would there be a random 34.5 kilovolt powerline terminating in the middle of what could supposedly be "The Real Area 51"?

Oh and for the location...very isolated, but the airspace IS NOT restricted...

The location is farther from any curious people than anyplace in the whole complex, even farther than Area 51. However, there is an airspace, so planes can fly right over Area 19. Anyway, more suspiciously, Area 19 is for nuke testing, but there have been very few nuke blasts, but a whole lot of drilling. Also the NTS doesn't get any information about classified programs on their territory.

Lots of drilling, free airspace, isolated from ground view...does this somewhat tie loose ends on the rumor that the huge underground buildings are actually at Area 19? Supplies and these supposed (although very poposterous) claims of Alien Spacecraft could be delievered via plane (or in the Alien Spacecrafts case, deliver themselves).

And maybe this may sound like a nervous government cover up to you:

The press wanted to get a tour of Area 19. They can parade around everywhere in the whole complex, with cameras, and they can do anything they want: as long as they have a guide. Well, they couldn't go to Area 19. The first time they were told that it was too far, and the second time they were told that the roads weren't maintained(even though one is a paved road).

You may think "Hey, it'll be like Area 51, a big nervous excuse to cause comotion when nothing is there). I think the opposite.

Ponder about this, and reread the thread. Things WILL start to make sense.

 

[Joey D]

Wow thats a pretty good link there MachOne 👍. It seems very plausable to tell you the truth.

 

[194GVan]

Interesting discussion, any idea where this Area 19 can be found on Google Earth, perhaps in relation to Area 51?

 

[Evolution.]

Also guys, to summarize up what I really think:


I think that, when Area 51 was built, it actually had a purpose. Not the outrageous proposed purposes we think of today, but basic purposes. Missile construction, nuclear warhead testing, war plane manufacturing, etc.

Today, after the whole "Roswell Incident", the government has been in a big mix up with Area 51. Rumors that alien spacecraft or bodies were taken there and contained are highly unlikely. Mainly because: How would we know what kind of conditions would support their life? I think that Area 51 was a cover-up after the Roswell incident. Something may have been recovered and transported to Area 19/51 that they don't want us to see. They decided to use their multi-billion dollar construct for a cover-up while they did their outrageous testings at Area 19. Why else would there be all of these conspiracy theories about Area 51 being completely empty, and it being a big hoax? There isn't anything at Area 51. No way, no how. Too much publicity to move anything in or out of the damn place. Area 19, however, is a much different story. Media is restricted, while airspace isn't. Anybody can fly above Area 19, but won't see anything out of the ordinary. Like I said before:

- Unrestricted airspace: Check
- Media is disallowed from the complex: Check
- Much more discreet and unknown: Check

This all adds up. The perfect place to transport these goodies in and out of at night. Nobody can see the compelx from the road, and at night, it's damn near impossible to see it from the air. Perfect cover for transporting goodies that you don't want your citizens knowing about.

 

[Plague.Ghost]

It doesn't add up at all. If it really was secret, noone would know about it. And that STILL doesn't explain why aliens would visit Earth (bajillion zillion miles away from another potential source of intelligent life), in a single un-armed craft, and then crash in the middle of nowhere where the military conveniently picked them up within minutes.

Sound reasonable? Would you fly to a random planet, alone, with no weapons, no safety systems on board, not study the planet or its' life forms, and then crash and die on it?

 

[ND4SPD]

Anyone know what that odd area is by Area 51, it seems to be a small forest like area with a lake inside of it surrounded by white buildings it sticks out because its a green forest like place in the middle of the desert.
37* 25'40.88N
115* 50'35.78

 

[Joey D]

Anyone know what that odd area is by Area 51, it seems to be a small forest like area with a lake inside of it surrounded by white buildings it sticks out because its a green forest like place in the middle of the desert.
37* 25'40.88N
115* 50'35.78

I can't find it for the life of me on Google Earth...can you take a screen shot?


But why is it so hard to believe that aliens came to our planet. They could have been studying us for thousands if not millions of year. Hell people on Earth could have came from another planet, you don't know, I don't know, no one on this planet knows.

And after exploring more of Area 19, all I can see on it is a bunch of water wells.

 

[Plague.Ghost]

But why is it so hard to believe that aliens came to our planet. They could have been studying us for thousands if not millions of year. Hell people on Earth could have came from another planet, you don't know, I don't know, no one on this planet knows.

Because it makes NO sense. Do you really think they'd land here and take off within the past 50 years and have noone notice? Do you REALLY think one would crash near a military installation with no support or backup, safety systems or anything like that? Do you really, really think that a small craft could fly across multiple galaxies just to get to Earth, which is still a relatively resourcefull planet only to have some inexperienced pilot die in it on entry? It makes no sense at all, logically or technically.

 

[Joey D]

You have such a narrow mind. Technology of the human race can't do that, but who's to say it can't happen. Just because of what we know in the human realem of physics doesn't mean it can't happen.

And yes I think space crafts have come to our planet many times, in fact I honestly believe a lot of ancient stuff is from another world. Egyptian things, Mayanian things, Aztec things, a lot of them suggest out of this world technology. So yes I think they have come here, and have been coming here for thousands of years. Maybe they just figured we aren't a threat to them.

 

[a6m5]

When I was a little boy, I was telling my uncle about this classified military facility they were reporting in the magazine. He told me that if magazines were reporting them, they probably were old news. I agree with Famine, I think it is a decoy. I'm sure they still get a lot done there, but I'd assume the military already moved the good stuff out of there.

Blazin: Your take on the ancient civilization's pretty interesting. While I currently don't belive in any aliens visiting our planet(unless you count angels as aliens), I couldn't figure out about some of the ancient artifacts that seemed to show humans operating machinery, or wearing some sort of spacesuits. It'd be interesting if it was just like in the movie, "Matrix". Maybe we are just going in circles.

 

[Joey D]

Blazin: Your take on the ancient civilization's pretty interesting. While I currently don't belive in any aliens visiting our planet(unless you count angels as aliens), I couldn't figure out about some of the ancient artifacts that seemed to show humans operating machinery, or wearing some sort of spacesuits. It'd be interesting if it was just like in the movie, "Matrix". Maybe we are just going in circles.

As soon as I dig up some more information I will create a spin off type thread, ha won't that just confuse the Creationism vs. Evolutionism thread.