- 12,018
- Indianapolis
- BrandonW77
Assetto Corsa or Project Cars
- Thread starter Cursed DICE
- 191 comments
- 21,836 views
Grippy
(Banned)
- 381
- Australia
1. do you own a copy of PCARS? The graphics are amazing, and the sound is pretty. Physics like I said, lively.
2. I know about the bugs/glitches for the most part game feel finished in the "gameplay" compared to AC
3. The weather cycle is miles better than AC
4. so is car roster
5. you name it etc etc
and do you know there is bugs in AC? yeah nice exaggeration
2. I know about the bugs/glitches for the most part game feel finished in the "gameplay" compared to AC
3. The weather cycle is miles better than AC
4. so is car roster
5. you name it etc etc
and do you know there is bugs in AC? yeah nice exaggeration
- 11,660
- GTP_Orido
Anyone who have tried AC and LFS can give some insight on how they compare ( tire, LSD and suspension physics wise ) ?
I only have LFS as thats the only sim that my crappy laptop can play at 30fps ( have it for years now ), it works well, camber and tire pressure tuning using temp across tire, ARB and damper that works, LSD that caters variety of types and perform pretty close to real life. A 30 minutes tuning session at the skidpad and Kyoto oval shows all these ( using Porsche GT3 Cup mod with asymmetrical setup for camber )
Can you dial camber using temp across tire reading in AC ? What I like from LFS is how I can fine tune FR and RR car balance at the skidpad using camber, tire pressure and ARB ( setup a baseline drift or grip car )
I only have LFS as thats the only sim that my crappy laptop can play at 30fps ( have it for years now ), it works well, camber and tire pressure tuning using temp across tire, ARB and damper that works, LSD that caters variety of types and perform pretty close to real life. A 30 minutes tuning session at the skidpad and Kyoto oval shows all these ( using Porsche GT3 Cup mod with asymmetrical setup for camber )
Can you dial camber using temp across tire reading in AC ? What I like from LFS is how I can fine tune FR and RR car balance at the skidpad using camber, tire pressure and ARB ( setup a baseline drift or grip car )
Grippy
(Banned)
- 381
- Australia
@Ridox2JZGTE you have tire pressure across all 4 tires. You also can change anti-roll and camber in steps, range is more limited than LFS depending on car. It does however have nice damper options fast/slow rebound bump stop the lot.
- 11,660
- GTP_Orido
- 12,018
- Indianapolis
- BrandonW77
I own it, uninstalled it because I thought the cars felt horrible to drive and the bugs and glitches made it all pretty useless. The feeling of the cars matter far more to me than graphics or weather. There's plenty of good mod cars in AC to fill any gaps in the car roster. And yes, any game has bugs and glitches, but other than some tires not keeping heat I can't remember the last time I encountered a bug or glitch in AC.
Grippy
(Banned)
- 381
- Australia
I use a Logitech G27 with the clutch and H shift, had it for 2 years, bought new. What settings do you use? I cannot get a FFB level that feels good to me, maybe you know?
- 12,018
- Indianapolis
- BrandonW77
Grippy
(Banned)
- 381
- Australia
@BrandonW77 So there is no chance I could at try what you use? I want to see what is so different.
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- 28,470
- Windsor, Ontario, Canada
- Johnnypenso
I use a G27 and other than the settings for road, kerb and the rear at 10/10/20 for the most part, all the cars require overall different levels of FFB which you tune using the FFB Clipping Meter. I also adjust the brake gamma on cars without ABS, usually between 1.75 and 2.25, higher numbers for cars that are more brake sensitive like the M3. I heel and toe in all stick shift cars. One thing the FFB meter quickly taught me was how limited the FFB on the G27 is. If you turn up the overall FFB to a level where there is some real weight to the wheel, you get a lot of clipping while cornering, running over curbs etc. and you lose valuable information. If you turn it down to a level where you get very little clipping, most cars feel very light. You also need to set the minimum force levels to help mitigate the deadzone in FFB for the G27 as it doesn't really reproduce forces below about 16% which is where I set mine.
LeGeNd-1
Premium
- 7,264
- Australia
- GTP_LeGeNd-1
I've driven both and I can say AC and LFS is probably on the same level as 2 of the most intuitive sims I've ever played, but they do it differently.
LFS to me excels in translating that "rubber meets tarmac" feel when you are on the limits of grip and countersteering behaviour is very natural.
AC feels mushier and the sense of grip is a bit off, but you get excellent sense of weight transfer during braking and steady state cornering. Countersteering behaviour is a bit odd in my opinion (feels a bit laggy). But the road feel due to laser scanned tracks is the best I have ever felt.
As for setups, in AC road cars are limited things in things you can do. Race cars you can tune a lot more. I haven't been messing around with tuning that much though so I'm not that qualified to talk about it. Unfortunately, tyre temperatures are not yet working properly atm so it's behind LFS in that respect.
I use a Logitech G25, here are my settings:
- Profiler strength 100%, all others 0%, 900 degree rotation
- In game Gain variable (80-90 for Formulas, ~100 for GT cars, 110-120 for road cars)
- Minimum force 10%
- All other effects 0%
- Steering gamma 1.0
- Brake gamma 2.40 (stock value)
- Also don't forget to calibrate the wheel in game
If you download the FFB Clip app it gives more precise Gain numbers than the in-game pedals app, but those numbers I give are usually around the correct ballpark.
Initially AC also feels like driving on ice to me (even more so than Gran Turismo
). But then I understand that it's because the wheel FFB purely only translates steering forces in real life. Most other sims adds in damping and friction effects to make the steering "heavier" and substitute for the feeling of grip you get in real life from g-forces. If you don't believe me, next time you take a high speed corner in real life imagine the g-forces are not there. The steering feel actually communicates little of the feeling of grip (probably only around 25%).Once you get used to this and adjust your mind accordingly, you will see that cornering grip and speeds in AC are pretty accurate. I prefer a bit of damping in sims myself, but unfortunately that's how Kunos decides to program AC's FFB...
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- 11,660
- GTP_Orido
I've driven both and I can say AC and LFS is probably on the same level as 2 of the most intuitive sims I've ever played, but they do it differently.
LFS to me excels in translating that "rubber meets tarmac" feel when you are on the limits of grip and countersteering behaviour is very natural.
AC feels mushier and the sense of grip is a bit off, but you get excellent sense of weight transfer during braking and steady state cornering. Countersteering behaviour is a bit odd in my opinion (feels a bit laggy). But the road feel due to laser scanned tracks is the best I have ever felt.
As for setups, in AC road cars are limited things in things you can do. Race cars you can tune a lot more. I haven't been messing around with tuning that much though so I'm not that qualified to talk about it. Unfortunately, tyre temperatures are not yet working properly atm so it's behind LFS in that respect.
I use a Logitech G25, here are my settings:
- Profiler strength 107%, all others 0%, 900 degree rotation
- In game Gain variable (80-90 for Formulas, ~100 for GT cars, 110-120 for road cars)
- Minimum force 10%
- All other effects 0%
- Brake gamma 2.10 (can't remember exactly, but it's the stock value)
- Also don't forget to calibrate the wheel in game
If you download the FFB Clip app it gives more precise Gain numbers than the in-game pedals app, but those numbers I give are usually around the correct ballpark.
Initially AC also feels like driving on ice to me (even more so than Gran Turismo
Once you get used to this and adjust your mind accordingly, you will see that cornering grip and speeds in AC are pretty accurate. I prefer a bit of damping in sims myself, but unfortunately that's how Kunos decides to program AC's FFB...
Thanks for the insight on AC, I have been waiting for a more complete game than LFS ( cars, tracks from real life ), AC fits the bill on this, now I'm just waiting for it to have more refined physics ( tire temp ) How do you dial camber and tire pressure then in AC if tire temp ( inside,middle outside ) is not working properly ?
I'm getting a PS4 maybe this year
I'll keep an eye on the improvement on console ( patches ) and DLC.
LeGeNd-1
Premium
- 7,264
- Australia
- GTP_LeGeNd-1
Thanks for the insight on AC, I have been waiting for a more complete game than LFS ( cars, tracks from real life ), AC fits the bill on this, now I'm just waiting for it to have more refined physics ( tire temp ) How do you dial camber and tire pressure then in AC if tire temp ( inside,middle outside ) is not working properly ?
I'm getting a PS4 maybe this year
As I said above I haven't been tuning much, but I presume you just do it by feel and laptimes. There's also a g-force meter app and in built telemetry that you can use. I'm sure someone has made a skidpan as well if you want more accuracy. It certainly takes a bit more work than having tire temps, and it's one of my main gripes with AC right now.
mister dog
(Banned)
- 8,396
- Spain
- misterdog
- misterdog7
Excellent FFB is in there somewhere, when you are able to optimize the 4000 different sliders that is.
I got it where i think it feels decent but i'm sure it could be much better still if i'd tweak sliders further, but i just don't feel like it anymore as it feels more like a chore than playing and enjoying an actual game.
I suspect that's the reason why i hear some people say the FFB is excellent, and others say it's total crap. With the amount of variables nobody really truly understands, thats the situation that presents itself.
On the other hand AC's isn't that extensive and you only need half the time to set things up to feel very good on any given wheel.
- 11,660
- GTP_Orido
Temp changes under different loads ? or tire temp spread across tire ?
Is the tire temp in AC shown in similar way like this in LFS ? If you can see difference in inside/middle/outside temp in real time while driving, and able to use that information to set tire pressure as well camber, it should be fine.
In LFS, you can see color coded temp on the tires, it's divided into several parts. As far as I know, Pcars do not have this feature working properly ( I/M/O temp for dialing camber & tire pressure )
LeGeNd-1
Premium
- 7,264
- Australia
- GTP_LeGeNd-1
I prefer AC's minimalist FFB settings than PCARS. It just makes it seems like the developers are lazy and can't be bothered to properly optimize the wheels themselves. I mean, basically we want the wheel to handle closest to real life, so 90% of those sliders and settings range are going to be unrealistic figures. Ideally the developers should optimize the general feel and the user only adjusts strength and extra effects (kerbs, vibration, etc).
Nope. Tyre temps don't change once you go out on track, that's the problem. I use tyre blankets so you start off at 80 C out of the pits. Then after a few corners (depending on car) it goes down to 50-70 C and stays there no matter how hard you drive (doing burnouts, locking brakes, drifting, etc doesn't help either).
There is outer/mid/inner readings in the pits garage page, but there is no display when you are out on track. Not sure if it's possible on consoles to install it. Probably Kunos will add an official app.
mister dog
(Banned)
- 8,396
- Spain
- misterdog
- misterdog7
- 2,801
- fatkrakr
Well actually laziness isn't far off the mark. Back in the very early stages of Pcars there was a bit of bickering over FFB (go figure) settings. The devs opened up the developer tool box to users and in the course of a few months it was decided to leave the mess to the end user to sort out. So maybe lack of effort is more appropriate.
- 28,470
- Windsor, Ontario, Canada
- Johnnypenso
A good summary but in my case, I can't run my G27 at 100/100 for FFB or I'd get lots of wheel weight but massive clipping. I run 100 in the main menu and most of my cars end up in the 60-80 range in game which provides for a slight amount of clipping and it's the range recommended by the FFB Clipping App. I also set my Min. Force at 16%.I've driven both and I can say AC and LFS is probably on the same level as 2 of the most intuitive sims I've ever played, but they do it differently.
LFS to me excels in translating that "rubber meets tarmac" feel when you are on the limits of grip and countersteering behaviour is very natural.
AC feels mushier and the sense of grip is a bit off, but you get excellent sense of weight transfer during braking and steady state cornering. Countersteering behaviour is a bit odd in my opinion (feels a bit laggy). But the road feel due to laser scanned tracks is the best I have ever felt.
As for setups, in AC road cars are limited things in things you can do. Race cars you can tune a lot more. I haven't been messing around with tuning that much though so I'm not that qualified to talk about it. Unfortunately, tyre temperatures are not yet working properly atm so it's behind LFS in that respect.
I use a Logitech G25, here are my settings:
- Profiler strength 100%, all others 0%, 900 degree rotation
- In game Gain variable (80-90 for Formulas, ~100 for GT cars, 110-120 for road cars)
- Minimum force 10%
- All other effects 0%
- Steering gamma 1.0
- Brake gamma 2.40 (stock value)
- Also don't forget to calibrate the wheel in game
If you download the FFB Clip app it gives more precise Gain numbers than the in-game pedals app, but those numbers I give are usually around the correct ballpark.
Initially AC also feels like driving on ice to me (even more so than Gran Turismo
Once you get used to this and adjust your mind accordingly, you will see that cornering grip and speeds in AC are pretty accurate. I prefer a bit of damping in sims myself, but unfortunately that's how Kunos decides to program AC's FFB...
- 177
- United States
- ex_stream_tuna
pCARS aimed to do weather and day/night cycles. AC did not. It's that simple. It isn't there because they didn't w ant to do it. They focussed on more important things... we would race in daylight 99% of the time anyways...
and pCARS does not have 3D positional surround sound, and AC does. That is one major plus for AC's sounds over pCARS'. For instance, when a car passes you in AC, it sounds like a car is passing you. In pCARS it does not, and will not in pCARS 1. Maybe in #2. (this was finally answered over at their forums)
pCARS has a higher stock track number, but almost no moddability (easily at least). So, actually AC might end up having more tracks once you download all of the FREE DLC in the form of community mods. And most of those mods are top notch, so I wouldn't scoff at that without experiencing them for one's self.
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mister dog
(Banned)
- 8,396
- Spain
- misterdog
- misterdog7
LeGeNd-1
Premium
- 7,264
- Australia
- GTP_LeGeNd-1
Really? Possibly my G25 has weaker motors then (being 8 years old doesn't help either). Also I've been testing most cars on Silverstone which is probably one of the smoothest tracks, hence the higher FFB gain numbers recommended.
- 2,801
- fatkrakr
From day 1.Well seems you were there for WMD1 so i guess you'd know better, i already heard rumors to that extend
Such high hopes back then. 
- 5,161
- Massachusetts
@LeGeNd-1 Hmm...I'm not calling you a liar - I swear to God, I'm not...but I've seen tire temps go up and down when I've used Tire Temp apps. I stopped having the tire temp app displayed weeks ago - I've been trying to de-clutter my screen. I don't know what to tell ya. Maybe when I get some free time I'll make a video for you. I would have to imagine that there are some already on YouTube showing a tire temp app with the three different tire temps. Again, I could swear that I've seen discussion on the official AC forums that Kunos uses "core" temp. But then I swear that I've also read some posts on the official forums that said something like: The kunos supplied app (you have to enable developer apps in a text file) and the tire temp apps that 3rd party people develop display different temps. Core vs surface. Perhaps someone slipped me LSD and I hallucinated that, but for some reason I have memories of reading a conversation along those lines.
One last thing...A big problem that I hope Kunos straightens out by console launch is getting all their cars on the same version of their tire model. Perhaps you were using cars with Version 4 tires when you saw the temps not changing at all? I'm grasping at straws here... However, having THREE different versions of tires in the game is not good, in my opinion.
I don't know what to tell ya. Maybe when I get some free time I'll make a video for you. I would have to imagine that there are some already on YouTube showing a tire temp app with the three different tire temps. Again, I could swear that I've seen discussion on the official AC forums that Kunos uses "core" temp. But then I swear that I've also read some posts on the official forums that said something like: The kunos supplied app (you have to enable developer apps in a text file) and the tire temp apps that 3rd party people develop display different temps. Core vs surface. Perhaps someone slipped me LSD and I hallucinated that, but for some reason I have memories of reading a conversation along those lines.One last thing...A big problem that I hope Kunos straightens out by console launch is getting all their cars on the same version of their tire model. Perhaps you were using cars with Version 4 tires when you saw the temps not changing at all? I'm grasping at straws here... However, having THREE different versions of tires in the game is not good, in my opinion.
- 28,470
- Windsor, Ontario, Canada
- Johnnypenso
I'm not a race engineer, but can someone tell me how you can leave the pits with tire warmers just removed, your tires at 80C, race hard for 5 km's on a tight track and have your core temps down in the 50's? Even as a layman I don't think that would be possible but maybe I'm wrong. And for the core temps to drop 30C in a lap or two, what must be happening to the surface temps in that time? They'd have to be below 50C for that to happen wouldn't they?
- 12,018
- Indianapolis
- BrandonW77
@LeGeNd-1 Hmm...I'm not calling you a liar - I swear to God, I'm not...but I've seen tire temps go up and down when I've used Tire Temp apps. I stopped having the tire temp app displayed weeks ago - I've been trying to de-clutter my screen.
One last thing...A big problem that I hope Kunos straightens out by console launch is getting all their cars on the same version of their tire model. Perhaps you were using cars with Version 4 tires when you saw the temps not changing at all? I'm grasping at straws here... However, having THREE different versions of tires in the game is not good, in my opinion.
My temps will go up briefly after a hard/fast turn but usually within a hundred meters they're back down in the 50-60º range. Usually they've dropped from 80º to 60º (or less) by the end of the first lap in most cars. In some cars it doesn't really seem to affect the feel, but in others it makes them very slippery and understeery.
I too hope all cars will be on the same tire model for the console release, perhaps that's one of the reasons for the delay.
