Beauty Contest: Gran Turismo Sport vs Forza Motorsport 7

[CopperySinger]

What you said about having roughly 4x less cars but not justifying it with 4x the detail is an excellent point. The cars look fantastic in GTS, especially on the Pro, but FM7 isn't exactly potato quality by comparison. The cars in FM7 are absolutely stunning - especially when experienced in 4K on PC. Not only do the cars look amazing, but they sound incredible.

There's also the case of art direction and lighting. Forza Motorsport has been leaning more towards a 'blockbuster' feel by allowing the cars, and the tracks, seem larger than life. The game's art direction wants to take your breath away - and at tracks such as the Alps, it really does. Jump into a Pagani Cinque and roar down the mountain in stunning 4K with your choice of gaming headphones and rack up that volume slider - and tell me that's not an experience worthy of being jaw dropping in its own right. You don't get that sense of awe from GT games and GTS is no exception.

Where FM7 falls short in terms of art direction, GTS and the lads over at PD deliver in folds - and then some. Whereas FM7 makes me say "Wow, that looks gorgeous," GTS makes me say "Holy ****, that looks real." Of course one can use the term beautiful there, too, but I think you understand what I mean. It's not going for that 'larger than life' feel - it's going for photorealism, and that's something that hasn't changed since the game's very first installment back on the PS1.

GTS looks incredibly realistic, but to me this is more a testament of how the lighting works in the game and less so about whether or not the AC vents look real. GTS' lighting is insanely good and the fact that it handles it at 60fps (mostly) on the standard console is rather impressive. Art direction is a big deal, however, as it makes your game stand out. Games like Breath of the Wild and Cuphead look absolutely stunning - but nobody is going to mistake them for real life anytime soon. Forza walks that line really well, I think, and GTS just knocks the realism deal right out of the park.

But you're right about GTS' shortcomings. Fancy lighting and windshield washer fluid nozzles don't justify the lack of actual gameplay. I'm getting some really heavy 'Prologue' vibes from GTS...

This is true if you are new to this two games, I guess you can compare which game has less or more of this and that. But as a fan of both GT and forza, GTS has more gameplay value imo. I didn't see but one track and car added in forza7 since forza6. In addition to that, there were also no solution to the crashers and rammers that ruined races. Some say forza's got the better value because they can upgrade cars. but most I've seen are riding around in leaderboard tunes, claiming that they don't want to be bothered with upgrading and tuning. If most people are racing around with the same leaderboard tune, that just seems more like a spec race. This makes a very dull experience in forza lobbies imo. And in addition my garage in Gt Sport has some Toyota's lexus (no unrealistic body kits), and a hand full of VGT cars; also there is sport mode, lake Maggiore and others which I love. My forz6 game probably has about 99% of the cars in forza7; and I probably know the tracks like the back of my hand because forza hardly ever gives us many new tracks. This shows me little effort in the production of forza 7. Im sorry, but based on my experience more cars and tracks doesn't justify more valuable things to do in the game, but new content is more valuable to me. And these realistic graphics shows me that PD seriously worked on their game plan, I say the value is more than forza7.

 

[PzR Slim]

The constant need of some on here to defend GT from every single criticism is very tiring. You do realise what it makes you look like right? It just makes any opinion you express so utterly meaningless.

 

[Todo Em Lixo]

How Gran Turismo 6 car detail compare to Forza 7 quality? What is clear to see is that GT Sport "Super premium" is better, but what about GT6 "normal premium" cars?

 

[ImaRobot]

This is true if you are new to this two games, I guess you can compare which game has less or more of this and that. But as a fan of both GT and forza, GTS has more gameplay value imo. I didn't see but one track and car added in forza7 since forza6

Except for all these new cars that came in during Horizon 3, that weren't in Forza 6, right? There is also quite a few tracks that weren't in Fm6, or FM5 for that matter, that are now in Fm7. I agree that there was little new from Horizon 3 to Motorsport 7, but your claim that there is little new from Fm6 to Fm7 is just wrong. As far as gameplay value, it's fine that you prefer GTs for it's gameplay, but it is severely lacking in value with things like the Campaign mode being watered down. This is where abundance of content makes the most sense.

In addition to that, there were also no solution to the crashers and rammers that ruined races

You're right in that regard while using in game features, the most you can do is report them. However, if you happen to record the replay and send it to the Devs at T10, they'll address it and ban the griefer from online play if it actually turns out to be that.

Some say forza's got the better value because they can upgrade cars. but most I've seen are riding around in leaderboard tunes, claiming that they don't want to be bothered with upgrading and tuning.

Who said that? You?

If most people are racing around with the same leaderboard tune, that just seems more like a spec race. This makes a very dull experience in forza lobbies imo. And in addition my garage in Gt Sport has some Toyota's lexus, and a hand full of VGT cars; also there is sport mode, lake Maggiore and others which I love.

And what is the issue with that? I can't even began to think how that's a bad thing, considering your playing a game that is very much focused around making the cars as even and balanced as possible, leaving the difference up to actual player skill. You seem to not have a problem with it for one game, but you do for the other?

 

[danh25]

The Tokyo expressway doesn't look THAT clean, on the road, buildings, flyovers etc. It's not about the lighting, its about the textures and assets. There is a distinct lack of grime and randomness in GT and it's always been this way back to the PS2 days. For more green locales you also see pristine grass, fences, no debris around etc. Everything is just too perfect when real life looks grotty or unkempt.

Also as I said in my original post I'm not comparing it specifically to Forza, I'm comparing it to other competition such as NFS 2015 which for me has/had the greatest environmental detail out there in a racing game. Driveclub was another good one in that respect.

Pick any track you want from GTS and compare it to a circuit from Driveclub and I think you'll begin to see what the user is trying to say - if I'm understanding their point correctly.

I'm not sure if you've ever been at a real race track, but 'lifeless' is a long ways down the list of words one would use to describe them. Back when I was an amateur racer with the SCCA in North America, and even now years later, there's always a great sense of excitement when you're approaching the track early in the morning because there's a sense that the track, in itself, is a living being. I especially remember this feeling at Laguna Seca, where you literally get swallowed by this huge bowl around you and you sink deeper into the abyss and find yourself at the mercy of the track, right in the belly of the beast.

Ambient sounds are a big part of it, too. The wind escaping through trees at high altitude in a place like the Nurburgring sounds entirely different than the more secluded, much warmer Yas Marina circuit. On race days, you have pit crews, people interacting with each other, cars being fired up, pre-checks of all the cars, crowds, announcers, and much, much more. FM7 actually does a pretty good job of giving players the illusion of this during the pre-race menu and it's a pretty cool effect.

Back to my comparison between GTS and Driveclub .- if you haven't tried DC, it's an awesome racer. Driving alongside the road in India, for example, and slowing down to park alongside the road, will treat you with all sorts of goodies. You might spot some wildlife down by the lake. You might notice that the sprinklers come on at a certain hour by the garden. You might notice the clouds are constantly changing and are never the same. You might notice the leaves on the nearby trees being cradled back and forth by the wind. You might notice how certain parts of the road were paved differently. You might notice how your skidmarks from the previous laps settle in to the different ground materials. All this and I haven't even touched upon the dynamic day/night cycles and the incredible, truly amazing weather effects. Things like that brings a track to life. GTS feels like the circuits are inside some clinically sealed laboratory and the environments feel dead and 'sterile.'

I think that's what the OP meant, but I could be wrong.

If you mean this, I understand the point.

It seems to me that a few years ago (at GT5 times it seems to me) yama had talked about how he would like to have trees moving with the wind or flock of birds to pass during races ... etc. etc

I think that's what they would like to put, but maybe they can not do it right now because of the 60fps lens.

To say, they removed their beautiful GT5 / 6 volumetric smoke, which was really great to be seen but afflicted by big limits, to have solid 60 fps.

Although with GTS we are seeing some dynamic elements in circuits like airplanes, helicopter, birds, drones .... in this respect the next generation will be interesting for them since they will have much more powerful hardware they can do a little bit of everything with less compromises.

 

[ImaRobot]

in this respect the next generation will be interesting for them since they will have much more powerful hardware they can do a little bit of everything with less compromises.

Seems to be something that is said with each new generation.

 

[PzR Slim]

Seems to be something that is said with each new generation.

And once again the vast majority of people will only focus on what the game looks like and groundbreaking new features such as those introduced by SMS in PC 1&2 will be ignored.

 

[turk1993]

Well nobody talks about the unmatched engine details of Forza. The crazy amount of detail that you only can see when you zoom in closely. That takes a huge time and data to model, so stop saying that turn 10 doesn't care about car models as PD. They just choose a different way to use there grapichal budget.

 

[TheNuvolari]

Aren't GlassEgg making the car models from the Forza series?

 

[ImaRobot]

Aren't GlassEgg making the car models from the Forza series?

Yes, Forza outsources their vehicles.

 

[danh25]

Seems to be something that is said with each new generation.

This generation was a failure at the computational power level, so much to do the X1 and Pro versions .... the next generation must make a leap TRULY, type 10 / 12Tf

 

[Johnnypenso]

This generation was a failure at the computational power level, so much to do the X1 and Pro versions .... the next generation must make a leap TRULY, type 10 / 12Tf

When will people realize that all hardware is limited and trade offs must he made. When the 10-12Tf era rolls around one game might have dynamic grass and trees and one won't. One might have soft body physics and one won't. One might have full top to bottom and inside out car models and one won't. One might have dynamic raindrops and one won't. One will have full AI dynamic crowds and one won't.

Every generation is a giant leap in computational power by definition. Our expectations also take a giant leap. Tradeoffs will be made by everyone.

 

[CopperySinger]

Who said that? You?

more specifically, you talked about how upgrades and customizations made Forza7 more prominent.
(also refer back to text #617 in forza vs thread)

imarobot, do you think those upgrades and customizations bring more value to forza7?

I think prominently, people just prefer to use downloads from the select few who actually participate in upgrading/comstomizing in Forza.

And the issue is what, with that? When discussing a game and its car customization and collecting efforts, it makes sense to talk about how prominent it is, to itself and its competitors.

Also I think as far as a beauty contest goes, I don't think these car manufactures really appreciate all the unrealistic customizations, or do they?. It doesn't really represent the image of the car properly imo.

 

[ghostrider135]

Unless I am mistaken, Haven't played Forza since like Forza 3, But I believe that all engines are modelled on all cars as you can open the doors, bonnet and boot etc, I could be wrong, So in essence more effort and resorces are spread out over the WHOLE car unlike in GT where the engines are only modelled for cars where the engine is visible constantly (PD cutting corners) If PD needs to be respected then they should show off their skills and allow people to open bonnets etc and show people what is hiding in the engine bay (probably nothing)

 

[Johnnypenso]

Also I think as far as a beauty contest goes, I don't think these car manufactures really appreciate all the unrealistic customizations. It doesn't really represent the image of the car properly imo.

The fact that they have licensed their cars for the franchise for more than a dozen years would seem to indicate it's a mistake for you to assume how manufacturers feel abut their cars in Forza. You're really stretching to find shortcomings, to the point of just making things up.

 

[SlipZtrEm]

If most people are racing around with the same leaderboard tune, that just seems more like a spec race.

Ignoring that you're just using a personal anecdote — there's no stats on how many people are using leaderboard tunes in FM7 — one of the current Sport Mode races in GT Sport is literally a one-make race.

And in addition my garage in Gt Sport has some Toyota's lexus (no unrealistic body kits)

Bentley. Cadillac. Holden. Lancia. Lotus. Maserati. Pagani. Pontiac. Rolls-Royce. Shelby. TVR. Volvo. I could go on...

a hand full of VGT cars

Not a handful: 38. Nearly a quarter of the entire game's car list is VGT.

My forz6 game probably has about 99% of the cars in forza7; and I probably know the tracks like the back of my hand because forza hardly ever gives us many new tracks. This shows me little effort in the production of forza 7.

FM6 topped out at a hair over 600 cars, so I'm not sure how that's 99% of 700+.

Saying there's no effort to FM7's development because a general lack of new content compared to FM6 is like saying there's no effort on PD's behalf because the general lack of content compared to the rest of the genre. It isn't true in either case — the studios had different priorities.

You're also comparing a third title on a generation to a first. If PD were to do a sequel to GT Sport on the PS4, do you really think it wouldn't also carry over a lot of content from the first game? What reasoning is there to drop any of it? These are racing games, not action/adventure games.

Both games have their strengths (and weaknesses). I will never understand why some people hold one to completely different standards than another, though.

Im sorry, but based on my experience more cars and tracks doesn't justify more valuable things to do in the game, but new content is more valuable to me. And these realistic graphics shows me that PD seriously worked on their game plan, I say the value is more than forza7.

Er, cars and tracks are content.

PD's visual wizardry is well-known — GT Sport is a seriously great-looking game. I'd argue that's more to do with PD's lighting engine magic than modelling ability, however. The modelling is by no means a weak point, but I think it has less head space over the genre than the lighting engine. Replays really show off PD's work, IMO: I find them more visually impressive than the racing itself, probably because I have the time to actually focus on that aspect!

But we should be wary of any claims of the assets being better-suited to the next generation of systems. The problem with future-proofing is it's a gamble: we heard how all of the PS3-era Premiums were better suited to PS4, and yet here we are. It remains to be seen if all the effort put into these models will result in a similar fate.

Also I think as far as a beauty contest goes, I don't think these car manufactures really appreciate all the unrealistic customizations. It doesn't really represent the image of the car properly imo.

If manufacturers didn't want bodykits in FM7 — and there's nothing unrealistic about any of them, not any more so than the Group conversions in GT Sport — then they wouldn't be in the game.

(PD cutting corners)

Nope. Making deliberate design decisions.

Tying this all back to the subject at hand — the visuals — PD has kept a remarkably consistent visual style throughout the game. It's the most level approach the team has had since GT5 Prologue, and that should be applauded.

The game's damage model is pretty light, and given a lot of the cars in the game don't exist in reality, it doesn't really make much sense for PD to spend additional time modelling under-hood.

 

[ImaRobot]

more specifically, you talked about how upgrades and customizations made Forza7 more prominent.
(also refer back to text #617 in forza vs thread)

Nowhere did I say people don't want to be bothered with upgrading and tuning.

imarobot, do you think those upgrades and customizations bring more value to forza7?

Yes, why wouldn't they? Having something the competition doesn't have doesn't bring down value.

I think prominently, people just prefer to use downloads from the select few who actually participate in upgrading/comstomizing in Forza.

Those that know how to tune are few and far inbetween, in any game. Everyone wants to download the fastest tune, otherwise we wouldn't have a whole section dedicated to that for the GTS forum as well.

Also I think as far as a beauty contest goes, I don't think these car manufactures really appreciate all the unrealistic customizations, or do they?. It doesn't really represent the image of the car properly imo.

Um.. unrealistic? What modification that is available in Forza, is unrealistic?

 

[McLaren]

Also I think as far as a beauty contest goes, I don't think these car manufactures really appreciate all the unrealistic customizations, or do they?. It doesn't really represent the image of the car properly imo.

What the **** do you think SEMA is? Not only are huge chunks of cars supplied from the manufacturer, but they take part as well. 99% of owners will never do this (22" wheels, giant roll cage), but Lexus supplied a $100,000 car to a shop to create this for them and its been touring with the manufacturer ever since. It's here in Texas right now at a Lexus booth.

The true irony in your statement is that manufacturers are creating completely unrealistic, physically impossible cars for GT: Sport.

 

[Toysuprahot]

What the **** do you think SEMA is? Not only are huge chunks of cars supplied from the manufacturer, but they take part as well. 99% of owners will never do this (22" wheels, giant roll cage), but Lexus supplied a $100,000 car to a shop to create this for them and its been touring with the manufacturer ever since. It's here in Texas right now at a Lexus booth.

The true irony in your statement is that manufacturers are creating completely unrealistic, physically impossible cars for GT: Sport.

Hi.

 

[Terronium-12]

But as a fan of both GT and forza, GTS has more gameplay value imo.

I respect that's your opinion, but how? How does GT Sport have more gameplay value than Forza 7? Online? I'm in no real position to comment on either as I don't care for online racing, but what I do know is Forza offers Rivals events and a multitude of other online-centric modes where single players such as myself can feel right at home. GT Sport doesn't offer that currently.

What else is there, Campaign? Again, for single players once that's completed the game loses any immediate appeal it has because you're done. Sure, there's Arcade races but that's going to lose its appeal very quickly for those looking for established racing series. You know, the thing every single Gran Turismo game has featured. Apart from this one, that is.

I didn't see but one track and car added in forza7 since forza6.

There are several, actually but you go right ahead and hold onto that notion.

In addition to that, there were also no solution to the crashers and rammers that ruined races.

Uh...https://www.gtplanet.net/forza-6-race-marshalls-keep-the-racing-clean/

Some say forza's got the better value because they can upgrade cars. but most I've seen are riding around in leaderboard tunes, claiming that they don't want to be bothered with upgrading and tuning.

Did...did you use a factor of convenience against the game as a negative? By that logic, GT Sport's value is lessened because I'd rather look through the Discovery tab searching for liveries than create my own. Elaborate further on that one, please.

If most people are racing around with the same leaderboard tune, that just seems more like a spec race. This makes a very dull experience in forza lobbies imo.

I'm confused again. By your previous admission you would find GT Sport to be duller than Forza 7 as there's even less freedom in what can be done with the car. Your criticisms are beginning to contradict one another.

And in addition my garage in Gt Sport has some Toyota's lexus (no unrealistic body kits)

I'm not even going to challenge the "unrealistic body kits" quip, but here: https://www.gtplanet.net/official-forza-motorsport-7-wont-production-toyota-cars/

While the article (at the time) acknowledges the uncertainty of it extending to sub brands, it since has which explains their absence.

My forz6 game probably has about 99% of the cars in forza7; and I probably know the tracks like the back of my hand because forza hardly ever gives us many new tracks.

And now you've just used the fact that Forza's car roster persists between two games as a...negative? I can't understand whether you're coming or going at this point. If you prefer GT Sport that's all well and good but you aren't laying down the best examples of that.

Where are all of GT5 and 6's premium cars that were evidently built beyond the spec of the PS3, only to be scrapped entirely? Where's the Sierra rally that released to GT6 near the end of its lifetime, or the Track Path Editor for that matter?

Im sorry, but based on my experience more cars and tracks doesn't justify more valuable things to do in the game, but new content is more valuable to me.

One of these things contradicts the other.

And these realistic graphics shows me that PD seriously worked on their game plan, I say the value is more than forza7.

So a simpler game that's primarily focused on competitive eSports is more your deal? Again, that's all well and good — you do what you need to do to get the most out of your money, but you could have simply said as I did from the beginning and avoided this confusing tussle of words here.

 

[CopperySinger]

Nowhere did I say people don't want to be bothered with upgrading and tuning.

You misunderstood. Im not quoting you about being bothered with upgrading and tuning. but the fact that you claim that upgrades is more prominent in forza7. refer# 94 "who said that? you?"

If you feel that upgrades in Forza (you can even include past GT if you like) brings more value than GTS, whatever floats your boat. But to me, Scapes alone in GTS is something neither GT or Forza has ever had. Im Happy to see it here it elevates the beauty of the game and brings more value.

 

[ImaRobot]

You misunderstood. Im not quoting you about being bothered with upgrading and tuning. but the fact that you claim that upgrades is more prominent in forza7. refer# 94 "who said that? you?"

Whatever the case, it doesn't answer the question. How about addressing it? Who said that they don't want to be bothered by upgrading and tuning, and where can I read up on that?

If you feel that upgrades in Forza (you can even include past GT if you like) brings more value than GTS, whatever floats your boat. But to me, Scapes alone in GTS is something neither GT or Forza has ever had. Im Happy to see it here it elevates the beauty of the game and brings more value.

Yes, upgrades in Forza bring value, because GTS can not bring value to a something they do not have whatsoever. I didn't say that it brings value over the whole game, just that single aspect.

How about you stop conveniently ignoring all aspects of a post, and try actually responding to what was said, rather than sticking to one exact sentence. It's becoming quite apparent that you say things with little to no fact, and then disappear when someone challenges you, or you just outright pretend like nothing was said.

So I'll make a small bullet point list for you, to make it easy for you to address.

• Who is saying that they don't want to upgrade or tune?
• Why would having customization not add more value compared to a game that doesn't? How is it not a positive to have something?
• Why do you think that people only want to use other people's tunes in Forza, but not in GTS?(Considering there is literally a whole section set up in the GTS forum dedicated to that very reason)
• What is unrealistic about the modifications in Forza, and how are they misrepresenting the manufacturers when PD themselves get outrageous Sema builds, as well as make believe VGT cars?
• How does a game with less content and features actually have more gameplay value?
• What is the issue with balance and spec races, if GTS as a whole is set-up in a way that mimics that?

 

[PJTierney]

One thing Digital Foundry failed to mention regarding features: Forza Motorsport 7 also has split-screen.

However, that’s only available on the Xbox One version and since they ran their test on Windows 10 I can see how that would be overlooked.

I’m not diving into any fanboy-wars that this thread has as I greatly appreciate the look and feel of both titles, but I did want to put that fact out there.

 

[CopperySinger]

I respect that's your opinion, but how? How does GT Sport have more gameplay value than Forza 7? Online? I'm in no real position to comment on either as I don't care for online racing, but what I do know is Forza offers Rivals events and a multitude of other online-centric modes where single players such as myself can feel right at home. GT Sport doesn't offer that currently.

Remember you are challenging my personal Point of view; Answer: New Content in GTS appeals to me more

And now you've just used the fact that Forza's car roster persists between two games as a...negative? I can't understand whether you're coming or going at this point. If you prefer GT Sport that's all well and good but you aren't laying down the best examples of that.
Where are all of GT5 and 6's premium cars that were evidently built beyond the spec of the PS3, only to be scrapped entirely? Where's the Sierra rally that released to GT6 near the end of its lifetime, or the Track Path Editor for that matter?

listen: I have access to all cars in both forza 6 and Forza Horizon3. with the lack of much new content forza 7 just doesn't do it for me. and that is not contradicting

Did...did you use a factor of convenience against the game as a negative? By that logic, GT Sport's value is lessened because I'd rather look through the Discovery tab searching for liveries than create my own. Elaborate further on that one, please.

no; the factor is this feature is not widely used and I lost interest when it became difficult to find many others to play tuning/upgrade races with

 

[McLaren]

Ah, claim "my opinion" and then give completely vague responses.

For future note to @Terronium-12, you're discussing with a person who has said he has not played Forza 7.
https://www.gtplanet.net/forum/threads/fm7-vs-pcars-2-vs-gt-sport.357007/page-26#post-11993038

Why Bash the Game I Haven't Played Yet?

 

[Unknown?]

The constant need of some on here to defend GT from every single criticism is very tiring. You do realise what it makes you look like right? It just makes any opinion you express so utterly meaningless.

What’s worse is I come in here to see opinions on graphics and the thread has derailed by people arguing like schoolchildren about content.

Both games look beautiful to me but GTS has that touch that makes it look better even though it’s lower res.

 

[CopperySinger]

Whatever the case, it doesn't answer the question. How about addressing it? Who said that they don't want to be bothered by upgrading and tuning, and where can I read up on that?

how about you go back and look and at the question you asked. you quickly pivoted to a different question when i answered it. so no, I don't feel obligated to a question differently from the question you initially asked. Imarobot, you haven't answered many questions that I had for you.


Generally you will find some forza players hesitant to race with their own tuning and upgrades setups.
https://forums.forzamotorsport.net/...ive-for-racing-online-with-your-own-tune.aspx

and this:

https://forums.forzamotorsport.net/...-you-from-making-your-own-tunes-liveries.aspx

Imarobot what makes this exceptional in forza7? does it help forza in the beauty contest?

 

[Terronium-12]

Ah, claim "my opinion" and then give completely vague responses.

For future note to @Terronium-12, you're discussing with a person who has said he has not played Forza 7.
https://www.gtplanet.net/forum/threads/fm7-vs-pcars-2-vs-gt-sport.357007/page-26#post-11993038

Well that about seals the deal then, doesn't it?

What’s worse is I come in here to see opinions on graphics and the thread has derailed by people arguing like schoolchildren about content.

Both games look beautiful to me but GTS has that touch that makes it look better even though it’s lower res.

I believe the two are equal (in terms of resolution) on base console models. As both articles state, both games excel in something over the other when it comes to visuals. Forza has Forzavista and GT Sport has Scapes, but a criticism I've always levied towards Forza is its lighting. It's much better now than it used to be, but dynamic shadows would make a world of difference.

I'm sick to death of the baked vehicle shadows not properly interacting with track surfaces resulting in it looking like the car is floating.

 

[MisterOne77]

I didn't think that

What the **** do you think SEMA is? Not only are huge chunks of cars supplied from the manufacturer, but they take part as well. 99% of owners will never do this (22" wheels, giant roll cage), but Lexus supplied a $100,000 car to a shop to create this for them and its been touring with the manufacturer ever since. It's here in Texas right now at a Lexus booth.

The true irony in your statement is that manufacturers are creating completely unrealistic, physically impossible cars for GT: Sport.

the LC500 could look any better. But then, I came across this...

 

[ImaRobot]

how about you go back and look and at the question you asked. you quickly pivoted to a different question when i answered it. so no, I don't feel obligated to a question differently from the question you initially asked. Imarobot, you haven't answered many questions that I had for you.

My question from then, and now, has not changed. That you didn't understand it doesn't mean it changed. So how about addressing it instead of, again, jumping around it. You not feeling obligated is apparently your whole demeanor when it comes to making made up claims.

Generally you will find some forza players hesitant to race with their own tuning and upgrades setups.
https://forums.forzamotorsport.net/...ive-for-racing-online-with-your-own-tune.aspx

Are you trying to say that your single opinion is somehow fact for the whole player base? How does that correlate to anything other than your own personal issue? That says absolutely nothing about the claim you made, where you said people don't want to tune/upgrade anymore. That is literally not relevant at all.

What's funny is that almost everyone on that thread disagrees with you. What you're purposely trying to misconstrue here is that people aren't knowledgeable enough to tune their vehicles. However, every single multiplayer lobby on the game, as well as the vast majority of rivals events require modding a car to a certain class, that you can tune if you want to. Are you trying to say it's not a positive because some people don't know, or want tune?

Imarobot what makes this exceptional in forza7?

What makes what exceptional?