Beauty Contest: Gran Turismo Sport vs Forza Motorsport 7

[gtracedriver1]

I'm not sure about "more detailed cars". Can you put up a shot of identical cars with their hoods up so I can see the engine bays for comparison?

I was not talking about photomode or whatever it is called in Forza where you can open the hood. If we talking about photomode then scapes and dynamic scape is visually a generation ahead.

 

[PzR Slim]

I was not talking about photomode or whatever it is called in Forza where you can open the hood. If we talking about photomode then scapes and dynamic scape is visually a generation ahead.

Ah, I see, I didn't realise that we could only use examples where GTS looks better....

 

[Johnnypenso]

I was not talking about photomode or whatever it is called in Forza where you can open the hood. If we talking about photomode then scapes and dynamic scape is visually a generation ahead.

So only the features that help you win your side of the discussion... You do love your cherries

 

[nib95]

Driveclub is three years old now and still one of the most technologically impressive games I've ever experienced - from the visual fidelity, to the incredibly detailed and living environments, to the beautifully captured audio and not to mention one of the most impressive handling models I've ever experienced in a racing title.

Damn, DC is a fabulous game. If you're a petrol head, you owe it to yourself to give it a go.

Absolutely agree. It's been my go to pick up and play racer since it released. Audiovisually no racer compares. And importantly, the sense of speed is the best I've ever experienced in a grounded racer (eg outside of Wipeout etc).

Whatever they did with the nuances vibrations, camera shake, motion blur implementation etc, other games need to copy. Forza 7, Project Cars 2 etc implementation of a sense of speed or visual G's just aren't as effective and look somewhat manufactured, exaggerated or overly juddery. GTS in comparison is far too subtle and lacks drama.

As much as I love GT Sport, I do hope they add in motion blur and more screen vibration and sense of speed cues.

 

[Robin]

^ I agree, the relatively fixed camera and the lack of motion blur is extremely archaic. In reality your head and vision would be all over the place! These simple additions add a huge amount to the realism and immersion. Also a fixed HUD is also kind of old fashioned, it should be floating and G sensitive like you see in many games.

 

[ImaRobot]

I was not talking about photomode or whatever it is called in Forza where you can open the hood. If we talking about photomode then scapes and dynamic scape is visually a generation ahead.

Good thing no one mentioned the photomode.

 

[dimassa19]

^ I agree, the relatively fixed camera and the lack of motion blur is extremely archaic. In reality your head and vision would be all over the place! These simple additions add a huge amount to the realism and immersion. Also a fixed HUD is also kind of old fashioned, it should be floating and G sensitive like you see in many games.

The camera shake it would be great as an fun option (as we have already in the Beta in a short period of time). But with the static camera on board I can focus more to improve my lap times.

 

[mikotoP]

From my experience in the demo, GT is clearly the best solution for serious, accessible online racing. I've almost never had any bad race, and when my SR and race pace got higher, I began racing with real, fast gentlemen.

It's just sad that the physics are still so basic. Just wish a game like AC or PC2 could spend more effort to introduce a similar matchmaking with at least equal penalty system.

The graphics of GT are clearly superior, but I couldn't really care less, racing with AC graphics is good enough for me.

About Forza, I was really interested in it until it came out and saw the gameplay and the online content. The physics look like NFS to me (I'd say +90% of youtube videos are about people drifting with controllers, and it looks like it requires no effort, once in a slide, the car will almost never over-oversteer, any acceleration will help stay on the drift rail like NFS unlike other games when it's the opposite effect and it's better to more often let go off the throttle and control the throttle very carefully to have a clean, nice drifting) and the online is really destruction derby.

It's true GT lacks content, but to be honest, it has plenty of GT3 and other race cars to race with, and actually VGT are mostly in another category which is a welcome addition. However, the true let-down, especially compared to GT6, are the tracks, and dynamic time and weather.

I have both FM7 and GTS, I got to say it's true that in FM7, I can easily drift with the stock setting in non-drift mode just turning steer and slightly brake by my controller with all assistants turning off. It's hilarious and convincing me FM7 an arcade game compared to GTS.

 

[ImaRobot]

I have both FM7 and GTS, I got to say it's true that in FM7, I can easily drift with the stock setting in non-drift mode just turning steer and slightly brake by my controller with all assistants turning off. It's hilarious and convincing me FM7 an arcade game compared to GTS.

There is no such thing as non-drift mode in Forza. As for @Toysuprahot opinion about drifting in the game and how it makes the physics look, he literally couldn't be any farther from the truth.

 

[mikotoP]

There is no such thing as non-drift mode in Forza. As for @Toysuprahot opinion about drifting in the game and how it makes the physics look, he literally couldn't be any farther from the truth.

I mean there is drift mode in FM7, right? at least I once played it in split screen with my friend, so for non-drift mode I mean those game that are not drift mode in FM7.

 

[ImaRobot]

I mean there is drift mode in FM7, right? at least I once played it in split screen with my friend, so for non-drift mode I mean those game that are not drift mode in FM7.

There is a gameplay section that has drift settings, but there is no such thing as Non-drift mode, as if it affects the physics like you're implying. It doesn't matter what segment of the game you're in, the cars will drive the same regardless.

 

[mikotoP]

There is a gameplay section that has drift settings, but there is no such thing as Non-drift mode, as if it affects the physics like you're implying. It doesn't matter what segment of the game you're in, the cars will drive the same regardless.

Yeah, same easy drift, just like nfs.

 

[Coiler]

Why is the first loading screen in GTS an upscaled mess and not 4K?

 

[ImaRobot]

Yeah, same easy drift, just like nfs.

I'll chalk it down to you not knowing the differences in the things you're talking about.

 

[Toysuprahot]

So the unrealistic drifting I see has no relation with the physics @ImaRobot ?

 

[ImaRobot]

So the unrealistic drifting I see has no relation with the physics @ImaRobot ?

No, the explanation you gave, that obviously pointed out that you've done nothing other than watch a video, was wildly inaccurate.

 

[mikotoP]

No, the explanation you gave, that obviously pointed out that you've done nothing other than watch a video, was wildly inaccurate.

I did play it and have to say it's not that inaccurate lmao.

 

[Toysuprahot]

No, the explanation you gave, that obviously pointed out that you've done nothing other than watch a video, was wildly inaccurate.

Well I'm sorry to have the capacity to be able to slightly judge physics of a racing video game thanks to my many years interest in racing (real or sim racing).

 

[ImaRobot]

I did play it and have to say it's not that inaccurate lmao.

Ok, you're doing a pretty bad job at explaining why, though.

Well I'm sorry to have the capacity to be able to slightly judge physics of a racing video game thanks to my many years interest in racing (real or sim racing).

Than it makes it even all the more funny how inaccurate that was.

 

[GT6mebe]

Forza fans just can't take the truth that GT is graphically superior than Forza 7

Too bad its a reality. Better car models, better track models and better lighting system.

 

[TokoTurismo]

Yeah, same easy drift, just like nfs.

What? Like drifting at 180mph at every corner? LOL! You're trying way too hard dude.

 

[nib95]

The camera shake it would be great as an fun option (as we have already in the Beta in a short period of time). But with the static camera on board I can focus more to improve my lap times.

You kind of adjust after a while though. I posted many top 100, even top 20 times in the world in DRIVECLUB and I always had all the crazy camera shake etc on.

One other thing, I'd love love love a dash cam view like DRIVECLUB had. Honestly the best view I've ever used in any racing game.

 

[Todo Em Lixo]

I'm want more comparison photos, side to side for Forza 7 and GT sport, exact same car for the difference to be seen.

 

[Johnnypenso]

I'm want more comparison photos, side to side for Forza 7 and GT sport, exact same car for the difference to be seen.

Same car, same lighting conditions, comparable console versions, multiple cars etc. Just don't ask to open the hood.

 

[Todo Em Lixo]

Same car, same lighting conditions, comparable console versions, multiple cars etc. Just don't ask to open the hood.

You can't open the hood in GT sport, but maybe you can take a photo of for example Lamborghini with "glass" hood.

 

[marcvic]

The IGN review summed up the difference in a way I liked:

"The retort here is usually something about quality over quantity but, even though the level of detail in GT Sport’s vehicles is astonishing, it’s not as if the cars the competition is producing are sketched in crayon."

Even the poorest of the competition are far from poor, as such the quality gap, particularly once you take into account the whole environment is not the massive difference that many seem to believe.

So true. FM7, as well as PC2, looks great. Not ugly by any means.

And that has become extremely apparent, if people are having to extremely zoom into very specific sections of a vehicle, to try to find a fault.

While I don't think anyone should rest their argument solely on zoomed in photos, those zoomed in details matter when viewing the big picture. All those details, and the textures they're map with, interact with the the lighting model to create something that looks real authentic. It's the sum of the parts.

I'm not sure about "more detailed cars". Can you put up a shot of identical cars with their hoods up so I can see the engine bays for comparison?

GTS doesn't have engine bays modeled. But what they did model is more detailed than FM7.

 

[TheCrazySwede]

About Forza, I was really interested in it until it came out and saw the gameplay and the online content. The physics look like NFS to me (I'd say +90% of youtube videos are about people drifting with controllers, and it looks like it requires no effort, once in a slide, the car will almost never over-oversteer, any acceleration will help stay on the drift rail like NFS unlike other games when it's the opposite effect and it's better to more often let go off the throttle and control the throttle very carefully to have a clean, nice drifting) and the online is really destruction derby.

So the unrealistic drifting I see has no relation with the physics @ImaRobot ?

Actually, it's not about physics at all. I've worked with the lads at Turn 10 before as an advisor and the data from our car's telemetry around the same circuit was almost identical through the corners. There's a huge difference between physics and input/feedback, but I've noticed that many people tend to mistake the two.

The fact that you can drift the Hoonigan Mustang around Long Beach with an XBox One controller isn't a result of poor physics, but rather it's the result of great input integration. The guys over at Turn 10 spend a long time 'fine tuning' how cars handle with a controller. All those controller settings you see in titles like pCars 2 - yeah, there's a ton of elements in this equation. Even with all those choices, you're going to have a really hard time finding a setting that feels as smooth and natural like how it does in Forza Motorsport. It's much easier when the physics doesn't have that many numbers to crunch based on your input (steer left, car goes left); but when there are a ton of factors involved, such as weight, springs, shocks, brakes, engine, etc., things get really complicated. FM is just really good at taking all that complicated stuff and making it easy enough for a child to use. So you see, it's not a matter of physics after all.

In my opinion, this is a huge achievement.

 

[ImaRobot]

While I don't think anyone should rest their argument solely on zoomed in photos, those zoomed in details matter when viewing the big picture. All those details, and the textures they're map with, interact with the the lighting model to create something that looks real authentic. It's the sum of the parts

To you, but it's extremely obvious that is not what's going on here. The extreme close ups only serve to show a slight variation in polygons, and to blow the issue out of proportion. The people that use these to show why Forza is inferior is only coming on to show that as that is literally all that can happen with these extremely zoomed in photos.

GTS doesn't have engine bays modeled. But what they did model is more detailed than FM7

Not necessarily true, as that's a major detail as well. More doesn't fit, but better does it to an extent.

 

[cutmeamango]

Damn, GTS is really prettier, who would have known?

 

[nib95]

Those details exist because a lot of people view, examine, admire and take photos of these cars, often getting in super close, admiring all the details. You should know ImaRobot, since you literally have three thread galleries dedicated to Forza Photo mode shots in your signature. Funny that.

On a side note, as GT Sports menu is essentially a constant revolving cycle of randomised scape shots and photos, those details get put to very good use. Similarly if not more important than the details though, are the shaders and overall lighting, and that's another area GTS really excels.