Civic 3000hp should be banned?

[porthillking]

Its simple enough....

For you maybe.

 

[Zona]

K20 insight hybrid would be awesome

But I agree, cars with stupid amounts of HP (2k+ in Civics for example) should be removed from the game. I don't mind 1k+ HP GTRs or Supras as that's something that can happen in real life.

 

[Kitten]

K20 insight hybrid would be awesome

But I agree, cars with stupid amounts of HP (2k+ in Civics for example) should be removed from the game. I don't mind 1k+ HP GTRs or Supras as that's something that can happen in real life.

Well you can downtune the 3k Civic to 1,000HP i think.... which is realistic?

 

[Bwootzabaa]

Have you even read the thread?

What good is a PP limit if the X1 has NEGATIVE PP??? It can enter ANY PP restriction there is.

Hp/weight, what you think they can only hack certain numbers? Like hacking is limited to certain files PD left insecure? Or that HP was the only number they could alter? Grow up, eventually the hacking will become more advanced and it won't simply be HP being altered.

Even so, HP limits go in increments. Do you know what an extra 5HP means in a NASCAR room? (897hp is the cap, vs 892 obtained legally)

Limit HP/Weight you say? What happens when they find a way to alter the weight of the car? Do you know what an 1100kg Takata Dome '03 would do to a GT500 room?

Even if none of the above mattered, people who have hacked into their PS3's are in direct violation of the Terms of Service Agreement that they digitally signed and agreed to (legally binding) by creating a PSN ID. So, you can play victim all you want, but people know exactly what these cars entail, and they knowingly take part in it. I hope all parties that partake in these actions are justly punished.

So then, the issue is just how seriously those Terms of Agreement are taken by PS3 and GT5. I imagine that it something like getting rid of performance enhancing drugs in sports like cycling, football, baseball, or even the Olympics. Is it cheating? Yes. Is it going to be literally eradicated from competition? No.

So, all we can really do is build communities of like minded racers and hope that these relationships are worth being honest for.

 

[TakumiFuji01]

If I were to hybrid few cars, I just edit the weight distribution, adjust gear ratios, do some suspension edits without actually using Full Suspension kit and make legit engine swaps(like AE86 w/ F20C, EG6 w/ B18C or K20A). I mainly would just want a 1000hp Supra if it were to be a Top Secret Replica.

 

[Kitten]

If I were to hybrid few cars, I just edit the weight distribution, adjust gear ratios, do some suspension edits without actually using Full Suspension kit and make legit engine swaps(like AE86 w/ F20C, EG6 w/ B18C or K20A). I mainly would just want a 1000hp Supra if it were to be a Top Secret Replica.

Already have a 1,000HP Supra.

 

[TakumiFuji01]

Already have a 1,000HP Supra.

I heard a bit of this since today

 

[Kitten]

I heard a bit of this since today

Its up in my Borrow if you want to use the Borrow glitch application
(:.

 

[1241Penguin]

Personally, I don't really care if people use it for offline use. It's only when they use it online when it becomes a problem, IF they are using it against the host's wishes.

To be honest, I wouldn't mind having one for the sake of getting to Level 40.

 

[shepzki]

Normally I wouldn't bother with hybrids & stuff, but GT5 has become so dull for me I decided to get some. Used for a few minutes and got bored again, doubt I will use them again as I don't race online and just prefer to race normally offline too. People have been hacking into games for years and will continue to do so for years to come, I personally don't think these cars should be used in an unsporting manner online but if people want to use the same ones against similar cars that's their choice. If PD do have a problem with that then I guess they are entitled to stop them, I doubt they will though as somebody will just figure something else out instead.

 

[Exorcet]

Anyone can now wait until there's 20 seconds in the countdown and jump in an X1 in any race. Soon enough it'll be other cars with negative PP...

What will they do?

Ram other people? Any car can do that.

Win the race? Then you're not likely to see them.

And the host can just tell everyone what's going on, have the mall back out, kick the offender(s) and restart.

Hosts kicking people that jump in in an X1 is not a solution. Who is going to want to host if they don't get to race because they are jumping out of races to kick guys in X1's?

I really doubt that there will be a line of these people waiting for every online lobby that communicate with each other and wait for one of the number to be kicked so the next can enter the room and do the same thing.

I don't care what you do offline, but if PD doesn't fix the ability of trolls to get into Open Lobbies with their hacked cars, online racing outside or private lounges is done. Period.

Only if you decide not to take any preventative measures.

Again PD needs to fix this, but it's most likely not the end of anything.

 

[watermelon punch]

It's not cheating if you're in a free run room, that is strictly a free run room, i would never use a hacked car in a actual real race. It's a big difference. Which is the point, Keep it in free run only if people do it, If they are in a real racing room, Kick them, .

Shows how little you understand your fellow humans' social etiquette in GT5 online racing.
Or at least that you're willing to build your argument on a house of cards there buddy.

I see public lobbies often that say "clean free run or kick", or things like that.
Obviously griefers bother them too.

And apparently you think it's okay to be a griefer so long as you're only harassing people who are not racing?

Think of it like this, it brings back the performance from Granturismo 2.

And then an argument that it returns us to an even older game.
Seems to work against the argument that these cheats come into existence because people get bored with a game.

You are missing the point entirely. Already you can't keep a 100K HP out of a PP limited room. Most racing rooms for the past two years have been PP limited rooms. Everyone that races in Open Lobbies has hundreds of cars tuned and set up around PP limits. Anyone can now wait until there's 20 seconds in the countdown and jump in an X1 in any race. Soon enough it'll be other cars with negative PP...

Hosts kicking people that jump in in an X1 is not a solution. Who is going to want to host if they don't get to race because they are jumping out of races to kick guys in X1's? By the time you realize there is one entered in the race, it's already begun and the carnage is already over. It's not a solution to dump this burden on hosts.

I don't care what you do offline, but if PD doesn't fix the ability of trolls to get into Open Lobbies with their hacked cars, online racing outside or private lounges is done. Period.

And no, I have no interest in driving or owning any hacked cars.

I don't think this argument is made in the best possible way. But I understand this argument.

It's an argument about the slippery slope possible with cheats, and how they are invariably used by griefers, and if allowed to continue unchecked, become the reason people who play by the rules, stop playing games.

Sounds like a reasonable concern.
In other words, I disagree that the worst is happening, and I doubt that the worst will happen.
However, I think the argument itself is a valid viewpoint, because this slippery slope HAS happened in other games.

He makes good points on the problems associated with cheats. Which many of the defenders of cheats are ignoring or dismissing as irrelevant. Obviously they're not irrelevant.

You act like you get a troll jumping into a modded X1 on every single race you do in an open lobby.

In each instance that it happens, that's 10-20 minutes minutes the host wastes of their leisure time, not getting to race. It doesn't have to happen in every single race to be really disruptive to the enjoyment.

Where do YOU put the threshold where people ought not complain about having their enjoyment ruined? 50% of their racing time? 25%? 80%?

People have been hacking into games for years and will continue to do so for years to come, I personally don't think these cars should be used in an unsporting manner online but if people want to use the same ones against similar cars that's their choice. If PD do have a problem with that then I guess they are entitled to stop them, I doubt they will though as somebody will just figure something else out instead.

💡

Yes, let's just forget having any rules or laws or bothering to stop anything detrimental, because people will just figure out another way to do bad things?
(EDIT: See "False Analogy")

Append:

I really doubt that there will be a line of these people waiting for every online lobby that communicate with each other and wait for one of the number to be kicked so the next can enter the room and do the same thing.

Sometimes it does seem that there are lines of griefers waiting to get into a pub lobby!

I have seen griefers working in tandem. It's not too common. Seems like most operate alone.
But I have, on several occasions, seen 2 people enter the room, clearly know each other by something they say to one another.
Then both turn out to be deliberately disruptive cooperating as partners in the shenaningans.

I have also suspected on many occasions, a griefer who I kicked and blocked, has re-entered the room on a different PSN acct.

One time a few months ago, I suspected it was the same griefer who re-entered the room under different accounts 4 times within just over an hour or so. It was so obvious by how they were behaving very similarly to the previous one, that 3 other people in the room also suspected it - sent me msgs on PSN, at the same time, without knowing anyone else had the idea too (and assuming I wouldn't have noticed, but I had).

So I do not underestimate the amount of disruption just one bizarrely determined bozo can create.

 

[Johnnypenso]

What will they do?

Ram other people? Any car can do that.

Win the race? Then you're not likely to see them.

And the host can just tell everyone what's going on, have the mall back out, kick the offender(s) and restart.

I really doubt that there will be a line of these people waiting for every online lobby that communicate with each other and wait for one of the number to be kicked so the next can enter the room and do the same thing.

Only if you decide not to take any preventative measures.

Again PD needs to fix this, but it's most likely not the end of anything.

Ram other people? Yes, I don't enjoy a 100k HP X1 starting at the back of a 12 car grid and taking every car out in the first 10 seconds. Do you?

Win the race? I want to win the race, that's why I'm there. Someone cheats to win that leaves a bad taste in your mouth.

Have the host tell everyone to back out, kick then restart? How much time do you have? I don't have all night to be messing with this stuff. The host shouldn't have to back out or do anything of the sort because of this, PD should fix it.

 

[Lewis_Hamilton_]

I understand people's perspective that everything from here on out is all going to be utter doom and gloom, but at the same time, I honestly haven't seen a single hybrid online anywhere, other than in dedicated hybrid car rooms (which are almost always SSRX, SSR7 or Top Gear).

I don't mind them until people start bringing them into proper racing rooms, but I have yet to see anyone do so.

 

[shepzki]

Yes, let's just forget having any rules or laws or bothering to stop anything detrimental, because people will just figure out another way to do bad things?

I never said they shouldn't, I said they wouldn't (in regards to hybrid cars in GT5) and I don't think they will.

 

[JeremiahTB]

Popular PC games get modded all of the time. FPS, RTS, etc. mods even make it into sections of very popular gaming magazines. Are these modded cars any different in the way the gaming industry sees them?

 

[Drevenger]

Popular PC games get modded all of the time. FPS, RTS, etc. mods even make it into sections of very popular gaming magazines. Are these modded cars any different in the way the gaming industry sees them?

You are comparing apples with oranges.
The cars in the game are branded to represent real life value in terms of performance.
Its not like creating a barn in skyrim or a spaceship in gta. In fact what is going on could be considered counterfeiting. I wouldn't be surprised if car makers forces PD and Sony to act upon this hybrid thing. Unless you guys are ok playing with look alike car design with lookalike car brand.
GT5 is totally not designed with the mod idea in mind. Never been and never will be and will most likely die this way. Sad but true.

And for those saying they are not playing in "race for real" room, its like saying "I have wall hack but I don't shoot trew wall, trust me." There will be doubt and next thing you know you are playing Wipeout (the videogame).

 

[Exorcet]

Ram other people? Yes, I don't enjoy a 100k HP X1 starting at the back of a 12 car grid and taking every car out in the first 10 seconds. Do you?

Only this does not require a special car. It's basically possible anywhere that isn't SSRX.

Win the race? I want to win the race, that's why I'm there. Someone cheats to win that leaves a bad taste in your mouth.

Well I suppose it's an opinion thing. If someone cheats, they're disqualified. Having #1 displayed on the screen doesn't mean much.

Have the host tell everyone to back out, kick then restart? How much time do you have? I don't have all night to be messing with this stuff. The host shouldn't have to back out or do anything of the sort because of this, PD should fix it.

How much time does it take?

I've said a million times that PD should fix it, but if they do we still need to wait for that to happen. In the mean time you can sulk about it or do something about the problem. We're not defenseless here.

You are comparing apples with oranges.
The cars in the game are branded to represent real life value in terms of performance.
Its not like creating a barn in skyrim or a spaceship in gta. In fact what is going on could be considered counterfeiting. I wouldn't be surprised if car makers forces PD and Sony to act upon this hybrid thing.

Manufactures don't care at all. And this is no different from those other games. It's not even terrible unrealistic in many cases.

 

[killerjimbag]

I used to play Nascar 2003 on PC for years. Yes there was modding in that game. The modding done was making different body types for cars.
1960's F1 car body's,1970's Nascar body's,leMans body's ect. Modding a car or cars to go 300 to 500 mph is not in my opinion doing justice to the game.Yes I know you could do it in previous versions of GT. Funny yesterday I went into a Nascar room thinking it was Nascar and all these Modded Civics were smoking their tires around the oval doing 32 second laps.So I brought out my non modded X1 prot and destroyed them with a 27 second lap.So much for turning left I guess with your Civics.

 

[Exorcet]

Modding a car or cars to go 300 to 500 mph is not in my opinion doing justice to the game.

300-500 mph cars aren't particularly remarkable.

(language warning at the end)



Now an engine modded Civic isn't going to do that, but attempting to recreate super fast or super powerful cars in the game isn't strange in anyway. You could just assume that the other issues, like stability, powertrain, etc, have been taken care of.

 

[Johnnypenso]

Only this does not require a special car. It's basically possible anywhere that isn't SSRX.

Well I suppose it's an opinion thing. If someone cheats, they're disqualified. Having #1 displayed on the screen doesn't mean much.

How much time does it take?

I've said a million times that PD should fix it, but if they do we still need to wait for that to happen. In the mean time you can sulk about it or do something about the problem. We're not defenseless here.

Manufactures don't care at all. And this is no different from those other games. It's not even terrible unrealistic in many cases.

So you think there's no difference between the carnage a 100K HP car at the back of a grid can do vs. a car that is basically the same speed as mine? Have you played this game?

How much time does it take? Any time is too much time. A host should not have to be policing people who are cheating outside of the boundaries of the game. Cheating within the boundaries of the game you can't control, it's human behaviour, but this kind of cheating involves being the same car as me and maybe affecting 2 or 3 cars in the game because you aren't fast enough to catch anyone else. It's understood it's the hosts job to do that. Not deal with that same guy basically being able to take out the entire field in a matter of seconds.

No we're not defenseless you do what you can. But the longer this goes on, the more credibility the game loses.

 

[JeremiahTB]

300-500 mph cars aren't particularly remarkable.

500 MPH isn't remarkable? Are you a spaceman? Haha.

 

[Kitten]

500 MPH isn't remarkable? Are you a spaceman? Haha.

Yes by now all of us should know he is a Spaceman.

 

[DA__dogg]

So there are hacked cars now in GT5? When did this start? I haven't been in the open lobbies in months and have rarely visited this place in the same time frame. I have no desire to hack any cars, just wondering when it started.

 

[porthillking]

So there are hacked cars now in GT5? When did this start? I haven't been in the open lobbies in months and have rarely visited this place in the same time frame. I have no desire to hack any cars, just wondering when it started.

I think this was when it started.

 

[Zuel]

The console and game hackers are seeing how much they can push the game buy changing code just to get the upper hand or just to announce “LOOK I’ve hacked the game and combined cars together or add extra amounts of power” It has happened in the previous versions, it was only a matter of time it happened within GT5. It’s the same thing with overly tuning the VR cars to get the upper hand. This is just another evolution of the mentality within the Gran Turismo community.

Hopefully there will be a update to rectify this problem, though doubtfully it will not happen.

 

[DA__dogg]

I haven't seen any mentions of this in the GT5 forums over at the Sony forums, where I hang out. I can't imagine PD not doing anything about it. There is a guy over there who is basically an ambassador to PD from the Sony forums. I should check with him and see if he has heard anything about this. As someone who runs a couple of leagues, this concerns me.

 

[Drevenger]

Only this does not require a special car. It's basically possible anywhere that isn't SSRX.


Well I suppose it's an opinion thing. If someone cheats, they're disqualified. Having #1 displayed on the screen doesn't mean much.


How much time does it take?

I've said a million times that PD should fix it, but if they do we still need to wait for that to happen. In the mean time you can sulk about it or do something about the problem. We're not defenseless here.



Manufactures don't care at all. And this is no different from those other games. It's not even terrible unrealistic in many cases.

Maybe not defenseless but pretty clueless.
The not terribly unrealistic is the worst part. So you can kiss goodbye every leaderboards for TT, DT, any seasonals, any online races, any academy legitimacy. The game is done dude, even if you say your using it offline your not the only one with an hybrid car. They will fix this mess in like after easter because PD is slow, it will delay anything they were doing, probably GT6.

If you guys wanted to play such an unrealistic game, maybe gt5 was not for you.

 

[Exorcet]

So you think there's no difference between the carnage a 100K HP car at the back of a grid can do vs. a car that is basically the same speed as mine? Have you played this game?

What exactly is the extra hp going to do?



Slower, as fast, faster. They'll all wreck a race just as easily.

How much time does it take? Any time is too much time. A host should not have to be policing people who are cheating outside of the boundaries of the game. Cheating within the boundaries of the game you can't control, it's human behaviour, but this kind of cheating involves being the same car as me and maybe affecting 2 or 3 cars in the game because you aren't fast enough to catch anyone else. It's understood it's the hosts job to do that. Not deal with that same guy basically being able to take out the entire field in a matter of seconds.

Taking out the entire field is nearly car independent.

Maybe not defenseless but pretty clueless.
The not terribly unrealistic is the worst part.

OK, then what's unrealistic? 1000 hp engines? Certainly not.

So you can kiss goodbye every leaderboards for TT, DT, any seasonals, any online races, any academy legitimacy.

If you're lazy and don't host a room with rules, yes. If you're not lazy PP and HP will keep things out.

The game is done dude, even if you say your using it offline your not the only one with an hybrid car. They will fix this mess in like after easter because PD is slow, it will delay anything they were doing, probably GT6.

If you want to quit I can't stop you. But I don't see what's "done".

I also have exactly 0 of these cars.

If you guys wanted to play such an unrealistic game, maybe gt5 was not for you.

That statement is completely empty. And ironically I stopped playing GT to focus on Forza because of the realism.

 

[Johnnypenso]

Slower, as fast, faster. They'll all wreck a race just as easily.

Taking out the entire field is nearly car independent.

OK, then what's unrealistic? 1000 hp engines? Certainly not.

If you're lazy and don't host a room with rules, yes. If you're not lazy PP and HP will keep things out.

Wrong, wrong, wrong and wrong on all counts. No point in discussing it though, as you seem to be the type to still believe in the Tooth Fairy and Santa Claus.