Cockpit view = waste of time...?

[MatskiMonk]

Bumper-cam all the way, since GT, thru GT2, GT3, GTC, GT4P, GT4, TT, GTHD and GT5P. In fact, all the driving games I've ever played have been with bumper cam, with the exception of the original PS1 DRIVER games, which I played in chase cam.

Personally I like the increased sense of speed with bumper cam, I find I am thoroughly more precise using bumber cam and am seconds per lap faster than I am using chase cam or Interior view. It's almost like you feel more disconnected from the car when half your screen is static in interior view.

As I never use the interior, or am likely to anytime soon, I'd rather the time had been spent developing/modelling more cars. You have to assume it takes as long to model the detail of the interior as it does the relatively simple exterior shape.

I also wouldn't justify it as being more realistic, none of the hand movements are accurate, and if you want to start getting really pickey, shouldn't it model the inside/surround of your drivers compulsory helmet?

It does look good though, and if it came at no expense of anything else in the game I'd be more than happy.

 

[machscnel]

Cockpit view in it's current guise, is I'm afraid a waste of time. There are so many things wrong with it that it can not be considered realistic.

Your TV screen is your windscreen, then about a foot-foot and a half away you have your steering wheel. This setup is the closest you can get (barring 3 TVs etc) to sitting in an actual car. So when you use cockpit view in GT5P, it ruins this setup and it's not just my own setup either - there is no setup that can make cockpit view realistic. Unless you can somehow put your hands/half your arms through the TV and sit with your nose touching the screen..................

All you have to do is watch the GT5 Audi R8 Nurburgring video, or the Tanner Foust segment in Beyond The Apex. Guess what view their using? It's not cockpit - it's bumper. But why would race driver not use something Polyphony put so much time and effort into? Even when you watch the tester's in Beyond The Apex they use bumper.

What Polyphony need to do, as said previously in this thread is something akin to Simbin games - an adjustable view. That way everyone is happy. Now, I'm not sure how hard this is to implement, but surely it would be a great feature.

 

[BRracing_Rob_91]

I only use that cam, it´s great.
I hope Pd improve that view at GT5, I don´t like drift and the view don´t see trough side window same as a real drifter.

 

[Peter]

If you want to see through the side windows, press the button.

 

[Grant U. Rismo]

What Polyphony need to do, as said previously in this thread is something akin to Simbin games - an adjustable view. That way everyone is happy. Now, I'm not sure how hard this is to implement, but surely it would be a great feature.

PD wants to keep a consistent framerate and adjustability threatens that. A wider FOV could mean more objects drawn and less culling.

Also, being able to change your position in the car (like adjusting a seat) can introduce clipping issues that you'd have to test for in every single car...that would add a lot of testing time.

On the PC this can happen because hardware is scalable. If increasing the FOV affects framerate, you can always upgrade your PC. If you run into clipping issues, you'd be more understanding because you altered the settings yourself beyond the default settings. PC sim racers are used to driver/performance/conflict/OS issues and all that junk, but console users want a flawless experience once they put the disc in.

 

[machscnel]

PD wants to keep a consistent framerate and adjustability threatens that. A wider FOV could mean more objects drawn and less culling.

Also, being able to change your position in the car (like adjusting a seat) can introduce clipping issues that you'd have to test for in every single car...that would add a lot of testing time.

On the PC this can happen because hardware is scalable. If increasing the FOV affects framerate, you can always upgrade your PC. If you run into clipping issues, you'd be more understanding because you altered the settings yourself beyond the default settings. PC sim racers are used to driver/performance/conflict/OS issues and all that junk, but console users want a flawless experience once they put the disc in.

Thanks for that mate, I don't know that much about computers and after reading that will fully understand if Polyphony doesn't add adjustability. So maybe an extra view would be easy, something like in Supercar Challenge or Toca Race Driver 3 - an interior view where you can see your hood and the windscreen, that's it.

 

[EJRocky]

machscnel definitely gets what I mean in this thread 👍

I think he explained it better than I did, in fact, in his post just up there.

The current cockpit view would be good for pad racers. But with a steering wheel, it would be unrealistic.

I don't, however, agree on the adjustability. While it would be nice, it would possibly induce frame rate and/or clipping issues, as mentioned above.

In WRC4, you get the option of how far away you want the chase cam to be away from the car. If they can do this, then I'm sure PD could set, in the options menu, various settings for cockpit view. For example, "full cockpit", which is what we have now, or "windscreen", which is a view of the bonnet from behind the windscreen.

 

[ae86bamber]

You can't start a sentence using "because".
I actually like the idea of the new cockpit view, it makes the game look alot more real especialy if your using a full HD tv plugged in with an HDMI cable and a DFGT wheel like I'm using now.



I have said the same before, but it seems nice now because you could now see the interior of the car. (I like it👍

yea i know what you mean, sometimes i swap around depending on the car. i like using the cockpit view for cars like the nomura's skyline just because its an awesome place to be!

one thing i like in games like race driver GRID for example is that you have a free view type thing at looking around the inside of the car using an analgue stick. that would be a nice feature to have in gt5 rather than just the left/right view in gt5p. pretty useless thing to do, but i like it!

 

[skywolf23]

always use the cockpit view in any game has the the option, gt4 i used the bumper cam but for a driving simulator cockpit is a must period, it is more real even wo the adjustable seat and head position since now it feels like you are actually in the car rather than strapped to the hood of the car like in the old gt games. while being able to pan your head is nice but how often are you looking around when you are speeding around a track? maybe in casual driving i am looking at my radio or changing cds but if i am blasting around a track on the edge of grip and handling i sure am going to hopefully be full focused on the track rather than looking at the interior of my car.

 

[frank-jaeger]

Bumper view for time attack

Cockpit for enjoyment.

 

[BRracing_Rob_91]

If you want to see through the side windows, press the button.

Yh , i use, but g25 got an digital buton , and it is not progressive, too strong. Although you can use the analogic stick of sixaxis, but its almost imposible while you do drift.

 

[rafnix]

Bumper view for time attack

Cockpit for enjoyment.

Bumper view for kids
Cockpit for matures

 

[mr_VOLCANO]

Bumper view for kids
Cockpit for matures

What a childish post

There is those who cant stand to see 2 wheels..

 

[Andrew C]

machscnel definitely gets what I mean in this thread 👍

I think he explained it better than I did, in fact, in his post just up there.

The current cockpit view would be good for pad racers. But with a steering wheel, it would be unrealistic.

I don't, however, agree on the adjustability. While it would be nice, it would possibly induce frame rate and/or clipping issues, as mentioned above.

In WRC4, you get the option of how far away you want the chase cam to be away from the car. If they can do this, then I'm sure PD could set, in the options menu, various settings for cockpit view. For example, "full cockpit", which is what we have now, or "windscreen", which is a view of the bonnet from behind the windscreen.

I see what you mean and it would be great to have, but personally, I like seeing the gauges. So maybe a view just without the wheel or somehow work the gauges into the windscreen view?💡

 

[Bogie 19th]

I really do like the cockpit view in GT5p. Granted, I wish we had the option to remove the steering wheel and hands like you can in some other titles. It's redundant when you are using a wheel. An option to have it off while using a wheel, and on while using a controller would be sweet.

I never bothered with the cockpit view in PGR4, but the cockpit view just adds more realism to my driving setup with GT5p.

 

[paulpg87]

I always use cockpit view and i like how great are made. Bumper view only on very difficult time attack

 

[Patrocles]

I really do like the cockpit view in GT5p. Granted, I wish we had the option to remove the steering wheel and hands like you can in some other titles. It's redundant when you are using a wheel. An option to have it off while using a wheel, and on while using a controller would be sweet.

+1
They could call this a "dashboard" view or sumfink.

 

[SimRaceDriver]

Seriously people...how many of you are so 'distracted' by the in game steering wheel and arms/hands that it draws your attention from the race itself?

And how many of you were the ones years ago calling for GT to HAVE 'cockpit view' but now find yourself screaming about how 'unrealistic' it is, or the fact that PD decided to use an illustrated wheel and a pair of arms/hands now that cockpit view has been implemented?

Discussions like this just perpetuate the fact that it's just a game and NOT EVERYONE is going to be happy about what new 'things', 'additions' or 'improvements' have been incorporated into GT.

For me, I'm glad to see a cockpit view, as I always used bumper cam in previous versions, because for me it gave me the best sense of 'speed' and after a day or so of racing/driving, I pretty much knew where my 'wheels' were at, so close racing and/or bumping wasn't really an issue. Now that there's a cockpit view, not only does it add to the overall realism/immersion of the game, but I'm pretty sure I'll have a better view of the cars around me during close racing.

 

[Bogie 19th]

I never clamored for cockpit view in GT. This is my first GT game (GT5p). I personally was just voicing a request to see this option added. If they never do, it aint no big thing. I still like it.

 

[Masi_23]

I think interior view is fine. Just needs a little improvement. Adjustability would be best as i think the default view is a bit far, although i understand that it is for a benefit of a wider view (Toca3 didnt have a steering wheel, it was close to the dashboard, but it worked well).

I was thinking maybe the head of the driver (in-game) shouldn't stay fix as you come around a corner. It should direct towards the apex as it is instinctively done in real life.

 

[machscnel]

Seriously people...how many of you are so 'distracted' by the in game steering wheel and arms/hands that it draws your attention from the race itself?

And how many of you were the ones years ago calling for GT to HAVE 'cockpit view' but now find yourself screaming about how 'unrealistic' it is, or the fact that PD decided to use an illustrated wheel and a pair of arms/hands now that cockpit view has been implemented?

Discussions like this just perpetuate the fact that it's just a game and NOT EVERYONE is going to be happy about what new 'things', 'additions' or 'improvements' have been incorporated into GT.

For me, I'm glad to see a cockpit view, as I always used bumper cam in previous versions, because for me it gave me the best sense of 'speed' and after a day or so of racing/driving, I pretty much knew where my 'wheels' were at, so close racing and/or bumping wasn't really an issue. Now that there's a cockpit view, not only does it add to the overall realism/immersion of the game, but I'm pretty sure I'll have a better view of the cars around me during close racing.

To be honest I'm not distracted at all by the in-game wheel/hands and I'm going to go out on a limb here and say this - I don't think anyone is distracted by it. Your view of the road is that small in Cockpit view that 100% of your concentration is focused on trying to see the track.

But that's the real problem. Not all of us have large enough TV's that the "road space" on screen while in cockpit view is larger than my whole TV. So that's the first real problem.

Second is the perspective. As I said above it's not realistic at all and I know some people don't care that it is not realistic, to each their own. Even playing on a massive TV this is still an issue.

But as you said, everyone will have a different opinion and if you need evidence to prove that fact, just take a stroll through the Forza 3 thread

 

[C-ZETA]

Wow, some people have some strange opinions. Personally, I think the cockpit view is just plain awesome. I use it all the time in GT5, which makes it obvious what sort of opinion that I have of it.

 

[machscnel]

Wow, some people have some strange opinions. Personally, I think the cockpit view is just plain awesome. I use it all the time in GT5, which makes it obvious what sort of opinion that I have of it.

And this is the dilemma Polyphony face. I don't want to dramatise this, but driving views are very important, they can make a great game unplayable. But alas, you will never make everyone happy and as one of my fellow GTPers as told me, it pretty much takes top-end PC tech to allow adjustability in view.

So for all those out there that love their cockpit view, consider yourself very lucky. All others, pray:tup:

 

[murph_fan51]

GT1 and GT2 I used front bumper cam, now for GT5P I use cockpit view, which is awesome and maeks it even more of a simulator. I cant use trail view, never been a fan of it, hard to judge braking points and point to apexes.

Not only that, I think they are well done in GT5P. They should be as good in GT5.

 

[rafnix]

What a childish post

There is those who cant stand to see 2 wheels..

ooh yes, you're right, it sounds like i'm offending ppl using other than cockpit, but i meant that seriously. It's not blemish to be young, live n let live.
I'm into race sims (PC) for 10 years now and there're always guys using any advantage winning on any cost and others enjoying pure realism prefering a clean battle for P.10

 

[EJRocky]

I cant use trail view, never been a fan of it, hard to judge braking points and point to apexes.

I couldn't use the chase cam in GT either. In GT1 it's okay - I actually prefer it - but in GT4 it's just too stiff. Even with the DS2. I just have to use cockpit cam when I'm racing with my DFP.

But I'm fine with chase cam in other driving games... especially in the sublime WRC4 👍

 

[sejtur]

I dunno, with chase cams I always have the feeling that I'm not in the car, and that it is in my way, in my view... it looks really good though, superb graphics. Pro racing drivers also say they'd use that view... maybe I need to practice alot with it, by no means my 1st choice.

 

[mr_VOLCANO]

ooh yes, you're right, it sounds like i'm offending ppl using other than cockpit, but i meant that seriously. It's not blemish to be young, live n let live.
I'm into race sims (PC) for 10 years now and there're always guys using any advantage winning on any cost and others enjoying pure realism prefering a clean battle for P.10

Just try to respect that others have another opinion then you. I enjoy realism very much, i dont think seeing 2 wheels is realistic just distracting.

 

[Zathra5_]

ooh yes, you're right, it sounds like i'm offending ppl using other than cockpit, but i meant that seriously. It's not blemish to be young, live n let live.
I'm into race sims (PC) for 10 years now and there're always guys using any advantage winning on any cost and others enjoying pure realism prefering a clean battle for P.10

So what makes bumper cam for kids? Sorry just don't see it. I could go the other way and say that cockpit camera is for kids and bumper cam is for matures. Doesn't make it so.

Seriously, I really don't get how some people can believe so fervently that their preferred view is the best or the most realistic. I'm sure some people would go so far as to ban certain views from online racing if they could.

EVERY Single view is a compromise. NONE of the views can possibly represent real life. Each has its advantages and disadvantages. Each probably represents an aspect of reality better than the other views. Chase views for example, which most people would call unrealistic, allows you to see cars that you would see in your peripheral vision in real life that you can't see in either bumper or cockpit views without actually pushing buttons to look to the side. Obviously there are a bunch of things about chase cams that just are not realistic. What compromises people are willing to make is a personal decision and won't be the same for all people. With that in mind, I just don't get how some people can be so adamant that their opinion is right.

 

[mr_VOLCANO]

Well said zathra5_ 👍